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Somebody convince Pittsburgh to let Fleury go back to the Q

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Old
10-10-2003, 06:55 PM
  #26
Doghouse
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokeyClause
The problem with letting Fleury stay up is he has a few kinks in his game (as all young goalies do). It's easy and more effective for him to work out those flaws in the minors or in juniors. You can work on things in those leagues and not get toasted because your talent will keep in you in it. But in the NHL, if you want to win games, it's a lot harder to work on your game as an 18 year old. Of course, that is if Pittsburgh even cares about winning RIGHT now. I'm not so sure they do.
You might be right about there being kinks. ALTHOUGH, I didn't see any kinks in his game at all tonight. Think about it.

First goal allowed on the first shot was perfect. Hit the very corner where the post and crossbar meet. Not many goalies could stop that. 2nd goal was a deflection. And the 3rd he was pulled.

So, let's recap: saved 49 of 51 shots he faced, was the Penguin's best penalty killer (half the shots the Kings took were probably PP shots), stopped a penalty shot, won the #1 star of the game, and was emaculated by the fans over the performance he gave tonight.

I see your point. Lotta kinks.

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Old
10-10-2003, 06:56 PM
  #27
Don'tcry4mejanhrdina
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He definately showed tonight that he can hold his own. GREAT GAME Fleury!

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10-10-2003, 07:04 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reign Nateo
This kid is looking at nearly 50 shots against tonight. This is anything bu good for a 18 year old kid. Play him for 30 games and have him get shelled for a 4.00 gaa and a .750 sv %?? Why? Why no leave hiin junior, the Pens won't do anything better with Caron and Fleury than they would with Caron and Aubin, why risk causing harm to your 18 year old future?
How can you in your right mind say that he isn't ready? Playing in juniors at this point might stunt his development of sheer lack of real competition.

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10-10-2003, 07:06 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiki
Agree with that. The kid was great all night.
Blackburn was great for a few nights too...

The point of this is: DO NOT SCREW THIS UP. DEVELOP HIM PROPERLY.

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10-10-2003, 07:08 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironchef Chris Wok
Blackburn was great for a few nights too...

The point of this is: DO NOT SCREW THIS UP. DEVELOP HIM PROPERLY.
Now that is a good point I can see. The other ones people are developing not to keep him hold no water what so ever.

I could see that happening unfortunately. Fleury is more talented, but I'm hoping he plays a maximum of 41 games this season, half. Blackburn was kept in for prolonged periods of time and was allowed to get eaten alive out there. I saw Blackburn's first game and I don't think he is as mentally strong or physically gifted as Fleury.

But once again, very very good point.

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10-10-2003, 07:12 PM
  #31
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49 shots against the injury-riddled Kings?? How many shots would the Avalanche put on this team??

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10-10-2003, 07:16 PM
  #32
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I'm in the middle of the road here.

I don't agree with 'send Fleury to juniors or he'll die from exhaustion', and I'm not in agreement with the 'anyone who thinks Fleury isn't ready for the pros is an idiot' idea.

I like Fleury as much as the next Penguins fan, but let's be realistic. It was only one game, and sure he played great. But let's wait 7-8 games and see how he has done.

And then we can talk.

 
Old
10-10-2003, 07:24 PM
  #33
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That play where Buchberger "pulled" down the Kings forward that was such a dive!

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Old
10-10-2003, 07:24 PM
  #34
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Hehe, just saw the game stats. He had to play shorthanded 17+ minutes of his first NHL game.

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10-10-2003, 07:30 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leafssuck
last year.
Exactly, last year.

My comment is on the QHJML in general. It's always been a forwards league with lots of skating and lots of shots on goal.

He averaged almost 39 shots against last year, it's how he maintained a .910 save % while giving up a 3.36 gaa.

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10-10-2003, 07:39 PM
  #36
Winston Wolf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koltsov47
I'm in the middle of the road here.

I don't agree with 'send Fleury to juniors or he'll die from exhaustion', and I'm not in agreement with the 'anyone who thinks Fleury isn't ready for the pros is an idiot' idea.

I like Fleury as much as the next Penguins fan, but let's be realistic. It was only one game, and sure he played great. But let's wait 7-8 games and see how he has done.

And then we can talk.
I agree with this. You can't judge him on one night. This is how he did on an excellent night and if he stays up the whole season I'm sure he'll have his share of bad nights. The only thing is, a bad night on this team and he'll be letting in 5+ goals and getting pulled. We all know that he has the physical ability to play in the NHL, but we have to see how he reacts after having a bad game.

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Old
10-10-2003, 07:52 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad The Impaler
It would be best to decide what to do with Fleury (for his good and for the good of the team) after 5-6 more games at the very least.
I'd keep him up until he shows he doesn't belong. It could be 5-6 games or it could be 30-40. I wouldn't even worry about the 10 game limit where it costs a year on the contract. Fleury would still be signed for 2 more seasons and they'll be a new CBA when he comes up for a new deal. The last goalie to win a cup for the Pens started 42 games as an 18 year old and won the Calder and Vezina in the process. There doesn't need to be any guess work. Just play the guy until it's clear he is or isn't ready for the NHL.

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Old
10-10-2003, 08:03 PM
  #38
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After camp and this game, he's clearly demonstrated that he can compete on a professional level at this age. Unless he suffers the unlikely fate of totally collapsing over the next five or six, then his junior career is over. There'd just nothing to be gained from going back to Cape Breton.

I mean he could give up five or six goals a game, but most would probably be the result of the Pens' sad blueline and not his own ineptitude. It's not like another goalie on the Pens roster would be showing him up, and hurting his confidence in the process. If Fleury starts to give up a lot of goals, chances are Caron is too. And if that's the case, then let him stay.

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10-10-2003, 08:13 PM
  #39
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I saw the game tonight, Fleury was AWESOME facing those many shots but he still need to stop giving huge rebound, I know their defense is awesome but you learn at some point to diminish the quality of rebounds.

Also on the 49 shots received , close to half of them was not really dangerous, but the other half was quite impressive the way Fleury made those save.

I gotta agree that if Fleury was facing a better team tonight, I really think he would have be creamed of 6-7 maybe 8-9 goals. Not Fleury's fault but the Pens was the most awful thing since the Nordiques even when they had Sakic from 1989 to 1991.

I said that with really no offense to the pens fans, after all it's only 1 game but they really some big adjustment right now.

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10-10-2003, 11:09 PM
  #40
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They do need adjustments... Big time.
If they keep playing like this, then I'm all for sending Fleury down.
But for all the guys saying Fleury's performance was just one game, let me remind you all that it was also the Pens' one game. Meaning that they should not be as bad defensively (and offensively too) all year long.
Let's wait and see. So far so good for Fleury, so bad for the Pens.

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Old
10-10-2003, 11:26 PM
  #41
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Old
10-10-2003, 11:53 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffaloed
The last goalie to win a cup for the Pens started 42 games as an 18 year old and won the Calder and Vezina in the process.
...while playing on one of the best teams in the league. You can't compare Barrasso's situation to Fleury's. In fact, can anybody cite a goalie who played his rookie season as an 18-year-old on a lousy team, and went on to be an elite player?

Yeah, Fleury's demonstrated that he's physically capable of performing at the NHL level. But what's his mental state going to be like after a season of getting hit with 40+ shots every game and losing three-quarters of the time?

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Old
10-11-2003, 12:05 AM
  #43
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Rick DiPietro's mindset + Fleury's talent ='s supergodgoalie

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Old
10-11-2003, 12:10 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien
='s supergodgoalie
Patrick Roy?

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Old
10-11-2003, 02:35 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lard_Lad
...while playing on one of the best teams in the league. You can't compare Barrasso's situation to Fleury's. In fact, can anybody cite a goalie who played his rookie season as an 18-year-old on a lousy team, and went on to be an elite player?

Yeah, Fleury's demonstrated that he's physically capable of performing at the NHL level. But what's his mental state going to be like after a season of getting hit with 40+ shots every game and losing three-quarters of the time?
How many goalies beaten on their first shot in the first minute would have followed by stopping 46 out of 48 shots?
Not many dude.
Don't compare to others. See what THIS guy can do before deciding.

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Old
10-11-2003, 04:12 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffaloed
I'd keep him up until he shows he doesn't belong. It could be 5-6 games or it could be 30-40. I wouldn't even worry about the 10 game limit where it costs a year on the contract. Fleury would still be signed for 2 more seasons and they'll be a new CBA when he comes up for a new deal. The last goalie to win a cup for the Pens started 42 games as an 18 year old and won the Calder and Vezina in the process. There doesn't need to be any guess work. Just play the guy until it's clear he is or isn't ready for the NHL.
Thiws is the exact way I feel. Fleury is going to get a chance to show what he can do.If his play levels off or falter he can be sent down at any time. No reason (besides $$ which are always a factor in pittsburgh) to worry about the ten game limit.

Another difference with MAF and Blackburn is the atmosphere in which they are playing. NYC is not exactly the type of place to bring a rookie along slowly. With the payroll and star status of the Rangers Dan had much larger expectations on him. Plus he found little playing time behind vetren goalies in Richter and later Dunham.

In Fleury's case he has only Carron to compete with playing time wise. I would not be at all supprised to see the Pens split the games between the two unless one gets very hot.

Tiki

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Old
10-11-2003, 04:14 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reign Nateo
This kid is looking at nearly 50 shots against tonight. This is anything bu good for a 18 year old kid. Play him for 30 games and have him get shelled for a 4.00 gaa and a .750 sv %?? Why? Why no leave hiin junior, the Pens won't do anything better with Caron and Fleury than they would with Caron and Aubin, why risk causing harm to your 18 year old future?
1. of course you exaggerating on the stats. a .750 sv% would have been 24 goals against last night. ok?

2. last night is not a fair example of what the standard Pens game will be like, even if hey do suck. Last night may be the only time all season
that two stand alone major penalties overlap for nearly nine straight minutes of pp time with a 2man advantage in the middle. use your head a little.

3. last not was a confidence builder for the rookie not a confidence breaker. he gave up 2 goals in near 50 shots including a penalty shot.
just think what he feels like he could do against 27 shots?

4. there is no stress to win in pittsburgh. just a chance for him to learn the nhl game.

unless he is giving up 4 goals in 10 shots there is no reason to send him back to junior hockey.

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10-11-2003, 04:54 AM
  #48
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...............47 saves! Holy ****! You know he is ready physically. However, how will trying to hold your team in the game night after night after night after night on a very weak team like the Pens affect Fleury? I think they should give him a few games then send him back down, and ofcourse let him play for Canada in the WJC.

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Old
10-11-2003, 06:58 AM
  #49
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I'm not saying that Fleury isn't good enough for the NHL yet, he proved he is with his camp and 1st regular season game.

I'm saying if your going to start him out on an AHL team. make it in the AHL. No 18 year old can gain from being shell shocked like this all year, send him to juniors until you have a decent team.

I think the Pens managment will realize this at some point this season.

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Old
10-11-2003, 07:02 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd
1. of course you exaggerating on the stats. a .750 sv% would have been 24 goals against last night. ok?

2. last night is not a fair example of what the standard Pens game will be like, even if hey do suck. Last night may be the only time all season
that two stand alone major penalties overlap for nearly nine straight minutes of pp time with a 2man advantage in the middle. use your head a little.

4. there is no stress to win in pittsburgh. just a chance for him to learn the nhl game.

unless he is giving up 4 goals in 10 shots there is no reason to send him back to junior hockey.
No $h!t I was exaggerating a little.

Last night was not a fair example of what the Kings can do either, give them a healthy squad or have the Pens face Colorado or Ottawa and Fleury will be torn apart.

#4 I agree with to some extent, no pressure is a good thing, but far more harm than good will be done from facing 50 shots a night and losing 85% of your games.

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