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Proposal: Bos-Was

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Old
11-08-2005, 04:25 PM
  #1
borro
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Proposal: Bos-Was

First off, I am not trying to trade this guy. He is just blowing up.

Chris Bourque for Mark Stuart. Might be interesting to expand the deal to include Ben Walter to the Caps. Bourque looks like a future Top6 guy and if he grows to 5'10 maybe a perennil All-Star. Am I close here?

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11-08-2005, 04:46 PM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borro
First off, I am not trying to trade this guy. He is just blowing up.

Chris Bourque for Mark Stuart. Might be interesting to expand the deal to include Ben Walter to the Caps. Bourque looks like a future Top6 guy and if he grows to 5'10 maybe a perennil All-Star. Am I close here?
Maybe I'm alone in this, but I just don't see all star when I look at Chris Bourque. That being said, that could easily change. But at this point in time, there is no way Boston gives up Stuart for Bourque, regardless of the name he carries. Stuart is just too good.

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11-08-2005, 04:50 PM
  #3
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Boston needs their depth on their blueline more than they do Bourque(no matter how happy it might make Ray and fans)

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Old
11-08-2005, 04:53 PM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borro
First off, I am not trying to trade this guy. He is just blowing up.

Chris Bourque for Mark Stuart. Might be interesting to expand the deal to include Ben Walter to the Caps. Bourque looks like a future Top6 guy and if he grows to 5'10 maybe a perennil All-Star. Am I close here?



Possibly add Walter? No chance.

I wouldn't even do the one-for-one swap. No way.

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Old
11-08-2005, 05:00 PM
  #5
borro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 19bruins19


Possibly add Walter? No chance.

I wouldn't even do the one-for-one swap. No way.
I meant add Walter and maybe say Witt. Bourque by himself is a push in a way.

Witt& Bourque for Walter and Stuart. That skews the deal in Bos favor imho.

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Old
11-08-2005, 05:04 PM
  #6
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I'd rather the Bruins keep Stuart....we don't need a "potential top six" guy, when Stuart is a potential top 4 or higher guy.

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11-08-2005, 09:13 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borro
First off, I am not trying to trade this guy. He is just blowing up.

Chris Bourque for Mark Stuart. Might be interesting to expand the deal to include Ben Walter to the Caps. Bourque looks like a future Top6 guy and if he grows to 5'10 maybe a perennil All-Star. Am I close here?
The B's can't afford to deal off any defensemen or d prospects.

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Old
11-09-2005, 12:37 AM
  #8
Michael Karlstrom II
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I think it would be unfair to Bourque to bring him to Boston... but it would be interesting as a Bruin fan to see it happen.

The cost of Stuart is too high. I can't approve any deal of Stuart that wouldnt be bringing back a proven top 3 type established young NHL dman.

Bruins do have other young dmen who look to be able to play. Maybe none of them are as highly regarded as Stuart but if one of them were replaced into this proposal and then the B's evened things out with some flip of picks then maybe as a Bruin fan I could go along with this type of a basic idea.

On a side note, Bruins could not add Witt's salary without shedding something close, So Caps would have to eat a contract to make this deal work.

I liked Walter a lot at camp but playing just fantasy here to put the two sons onto the teams where their fathers played call my counter proposal to be...

Witt/Bourque/Caps fourth round 2007 for Jurcina/Walter/Bruins second round 2006/future considerations [the future considerations becomes a salary dump if and when it becomes necessary after the B's get healthy this year]

Caps would get a slightly better pick one year earlier to compensate for subbing Jurcina into the equation instead of Stuart. I have to admit I like all four guys in this proposal. I would hate to give up on the futures of Jurcina and Walter but I like the future of Bourque and I think Witt could help the B's now. The pick switch wouldn't bother me much if Witt can help.

 
Old
11-09-2005, 06:59 AM
  #9
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I don't think Boston can afford to trade another top defense prospect.

On defense, the Caps have legitimate young NHLers/developing prospects in Eminger, Morrisonn, Green, Schultz, Pokulok, Finley, Lepisto, perhaps Oduya if they can convince him to come over from Sweden... and so I am not convinced that this is an area of need for Washington.

Putting aside respective team needs, I think Stuart has far greater value than Bourque.

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Old
11-09-2005, 09:09 AM
  #10
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Originally Posted by Drake1588
I don't think Boston can afford to trade another top defense prospect.

On defense, the Caps have legitimate young NHLers/developing prospects in Eminger, Morrisonn, Green, Schultz, Pokulok, Finley, Lepisto, perhaps Oduya if they can convince him to come over from Sweden... and so I am not convinced that this is an area of need for Washington.

Putting aside respective team needs, I think Stuart has far greater value than Bourque.
Stuart may have more value right now. In a year, Bourque may eclipse him. Stuart has greater value but I would not use the term "far." It would not be a need deal, but anytime you could get a Stuart you have to try. With Eminger set as a top2 guy and seemingly getting better, with Stuart we would get better quicker. I am guessing Schultz plays a year or at least starts in Hershey. The immediate help i see coming would possibly be Oduya & Lepisto. No guarantees there though. Pokulok will probably play 1-2 more years in College starting next year. Finley maybe 3 more. I could see us adding Werner. No idea on Hedman.

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11-09-2005, 09:14 AM
  #11
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Originally Posted by Michael Karlstrom II
I think it would be unfair to Bourque to bring him to Boston... but it would be interesting as a Bruin fan to see it happen.

The cost of Stuart is too high. I can't approve any deal of Stuart that wouldnt be bringing back a proven top 3 type established young NHL dman.

Bruins do have other young dmen who look to be able to play. Maybe none of them are as highly regarded as Stuart but if one of them were replaced into this proposal and then the B's evened things out with some flip of picks then maybe as a Bruin fan I could go along with this type of a basic idea.

On a side note, Bruins could not add Witt's salary without shedding something close, So Caps would have to eat a contract to make this deal work.

I liked Walter a lot at camp but playing just fantasy here to put the two sons onto the teams where their fathers played call my counter proposal to be...

Witt/Bourque/Caps fourth round 2007 for Jurcina/Walter/Bruins second round 2006/future considerations [the future considerations becomes a salary dump if and when it becomes necessary after the B's get healthy this year]

Caps would get a slightly better pick one year earlier to compensate for subbing Jurcina into the equation instead of Stuart. I have to admit I like all four guys in this proposal. I would hate to give up on the futures of Jurcina and Walter but I like the future of Bourque and I think Witt could help the B's now. The pick switch wouldn't bother me much if Witt can help.
I'm definitely not a Bruins expert. can you tell me about Jurcina? We already own your second round in 2006. In my mind a 2007 devalues a 2nd to a 3rd(the extra time you wait) but I'd be surprised if we let Bourque go. How about a different deal...

Jeff Friesen for Walter and Boston's third in 2006?

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Old
11-09-2005, 12:46 PM
  #12
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Stop! This is nuts. This is not going to happen. Bourque is the only guy in the Caps organEYEzation that is a skilled power play point man. Eminger is scoring points, but the lack of pp point skills is a major reason why the Caps pp is so ineffective. It happens to be one of Bourque's agreed to better skills.

Long term Bourque is either going to be the next Dino Ciccarelli or is going to be a 3rd line character player with intangibles. Which of those it ends up being, I have no idea. But, I doubt seriously that the Caps would give any thought to trading him.

The Caps may trade some of their young players that they feel are being played off the roster by other young players....Sutherby or Gordon up front or Yonkman or Cutta on defense, but Bourque isn't in that situation. Far from it. He earned a longer look in camp and is just about a point per game in the AHL.

Team's just don't trade prospects for prospects like that unless they are giving up on someone. None of the players talked about in this thread are there.

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Old
11-09-2005, 12:50 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borro
Stuart may have more value right now. In a year, Bourque may eclipse him. Stuart has greater value but I would not use the term "far." It would not be a need deal, but anytime you could get a Stuart you have to try. .
maybe you should try harder

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Old
11-09-2005, 12:51 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by borro

Jeff Friesen for Walter and Boston's third in 2006?
maybe you can explain to me how friesen should command a really good prospect on top of the 3rd rounder. last i checked, he was hardly worth the pick let alone throwing in a kid with pretty good upside.

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Old
11-09-2005, 03:23 PM
  #15
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As for Jurcina he excites us Bruin fans because of his fast track improvement and the fact he has come out of nowhere the last few years to now project as a solid 5-6 prospect with great size and better puck skills than most guys his size have.

His downside has been that he doesnt have a mean streak in him. If the new rules stay in effect long term, than the lack of a mean streak wont be any problem at all.

He is up in Boston now for a couple games and has looked as good as any of our dmen have looked the last couple games but that is sort of damned praise all things considered. Still, I don't have a problem staking my reputation to the fact that Jurcina will play decent 5-6 hockey at the NHL level before everything is said and done and if his fast track improvement continues, he sort of reminds me a bit of how CHara came out of nowhere to become much better than anyone ever thought he would be.

It is well known that big forwards usually take longer to reach their potential. Maybe the same is to be said about big dmen now?

As for Lars Jonsson... I think this guy will be a good NHL dman. The trouble with him is his contract demand right now. If a team wanted to meet it and could wait to get him to next year I think they could make a big time steal dealing with the B's.

I may be wrong. Maybe Boston does plan to meet the salary demand themselves next year. If not though he goes back to the draft and we do pick 2006 second round at slot 7 according to the NHL new CBA rules. So at worst Jonsson is worth a second round pick even if you dont think he shows enough this year to be back to the top level prospect he was when drafted in 2000.

 
Old
11-09-2005, 03:34 PM
  #16
Drake1588
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It would not be a need deal, but anytime you could get a Stuart you have to try.
Borro, the Caps don't have the opportunity to pick up Stuart. A Boston team need at present is to hoard as much quality defense as possible, at all levels, and to replenish their stocks to boot. The best of the bunch is just not going to be traded under those conditions, and not for a guy all of 5' 7", standing on skates (and a crate).

You might at least have concocted this trade proposal when Bourque was on something of a streak... and not languishing on the shelf with a concussion.

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11-09-2005, 03:37 PM
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i dont see it. Boston lacks defensemen right now, like top notch guys, stuart may solidify himself next year as potential top4 guy, the B's got a ton of solid guys for 3 lines right now, why would they need chris bourque?

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Old
11-09-2005, 04:31 PM
  #18
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Why'd borro come back?

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Old
11-09-2005, 05:24 PM
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Why'd borro come back?

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11-09-2005, 05:35 PM
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Ladies and Gentlemen, I am serious when I say this...

This is the worst trade proposal in HF history

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Old
11-09-2005, 10:12 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by txpd
Bourque is the only guy in the Caps organEYEzation that is a skilled power play point man. Eminger is scoring points, but the lack of pp point skills is a major reason why the Caps pp is so ineffective. It happens to be one of Bourque's agreed to better skills

Team's just don't trade prospects for prospects like that unless they are giving up on someone. None of the players talked about in this thread are there.
I will tell you now Bourque will never be a PP point regular. That job will go to someone like Lepisto, MacNeill, or Mike Green. What Bourque has is that fesityness that Ray Sr had and that winning attitude. If he grows to 5'10 he could be a star. Yes that is just potential. in a year or two, he may be untouchable.

Just a thought...

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Old
11-09-2005, 10:16 PM
  #22
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Originally Posted by Michael Karlstrom II
As for Jurcina he excites us Bruin fans because of his fast track improvement and the fact he has come out of nowhere the last few years to now project as a solid 5-6 prospect with great size and better puck skills than most guys his size have.

His downside has been that he doesnt have a mean streak in him. If the new rules stay in effect long term, than the lack of a mean streak wont be any problem at all.

He is up in Boston now for a couple games and has looked as good as any of our dmen have looked the last couple games but that is sort of damned praise all things considered. Still, I don't have a problem staking my reputation to the fact that Jurcina will play decent 5-6 hockey at the NHL level before everything is said and done and if his fast track improvement continues, he sort of reminds me a bit of how CHara came out of nowhere to become much better than anyone ever thought he would be.

It is well known that big forwards usually take longer to reach their potential. Maybe the same is to be said about big dmen now?

As for Lars Jonsson... I think this guy will be a good NHL dman. The trouble with him is his contract demand right now. If a team wanted to meet it and could wait to get him to next year I think they could make a big time steal dealing with the B's.

I may be wrong. Maybe Boston does plan to meet the salary demand themselves next year. If not though he goes back to the draft and we do pick 2006 second round at slot 7 according to the NHL new CBA rules. So at worst Jonsson is worth a second round pick even if you dont think he shows enough this year to be back to the top level prospect he was when drafted in 2000.
Great comment Micheal! Very nice evaluation. Appreciate the information.

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Old
11-09-2005, 10:20 PM
  #23
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Originally Posted by neelynugs
maybe you can explain to me how friesen should command a really good prospect on top of the 3rd rounder. last i checked, he was hardly worth the pick let alone throwing in a kid with pretty good upside.
Ever heard of that song by Brad Paisley called "Alchohol"?:]

I could see Friesen netting as much as a 2nd near the deadline. Admittedly it would have to be when the moon is in the seventh house, and Jupiter aligns with Mars.

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11-09-2005, 10:27 PM
  #24
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Originally Posted by neelynugs
maybe you can explain to me how friesen should command a really good prospect on top of the 3rd rounder. last i checked, he was hardly worth the pick let alone throwing in a kid with pretty good upside.
In checking out your own threads, he is rated ~your 8th best prospect. All prospect narcisissm aside, very good is prob 1-4; good may be 5-8. That was my thinking. Friesen has shown he can be a force. Boston has drawn talent out of other guys like Murray that didnt seem to have it coming. They could probably do it with Friesen.

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11-09-2005, 11:18 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by borro
In checking out your own threads, he is rated ~your 8th best prospect. All prospect narcisissm aside, very good is prob 1-4; good may be 5-8. That was my thinking. Friesen has shown he can be a force. Boston has drawn talent out of other guys like Murray that didnt seem to have it coming. They could probably do it with Friesen.
yeah, but the last thing boston needs to more forwards.... they need defense!!!

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