HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The History of Hockey
The History of Hockey Relive great moments in hockey history and discuss how the game has changed over time.

Phil Esposito vs. Peter Forsberg

View Poll Results: Phil Esposito vs. Peter Forsberg
Phil Esposito 57 61.96%
Peter Forsberg 33 35.87%
Too close to pick one 2 2.17%
Voters: 92. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-09-2005, 11:21 AM
  #1
Quiet Robert
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,262
vCash: 500
Phil Esposito vs. Peter Forsberg

We were having a debate on the NHL board and I just wanted to get a consensus on who you think was/is the greater player.

Simple question: who was/is the greater hockey player, Espo or Forsberg?

Quiet Robert is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 11:31 AM
  #2
ACC1224
Burke was right.
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 27,910
vCash: 500
Two totally different players from two different era's.

ACC1224 is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 11:47 AM
  #3
Little Wing
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Desert-ed
Country: United States
Posts: 2,877
vCash: 500
Send a message via Yahoo to Little Wing
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACC1224
Two totally different players from two different era's.
I agree, however i'll bite and say Forsberg

Little Wing is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 12:14 PM
  #4
norrisnick
Registered User
 
norrisnick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 16,243
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACC1224
Two totally different players from two different era's.
While that is true one has 5 Art Ross's, 2 Harts, and 2 Pearsons while the other only has the one Hart and one Art Ross.

norrisnick is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 12:28 PM
  #5
arrbez
bad chi
 
arrbez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,611
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to arrbez
Quote:
Originally Posted by norrisnick
While that is true one has 5 Art Ross's, 2 Harts, and 2 Pearsons while the other only has the one Hart and one Art Ross.
yeah...I don't see how this is really close

I find Esposito gets unfairly underrated around here. He's got a ton of awards, he obliterated the single-season scoring record untill Gretzky showed up, and he was clutch (over 1ppg playoffs, lead Summit Series in scoring)

arrbez is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 12:53 PM
  #6
norrisnick
Registered User
 
norrisnick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 16,243
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by arrbez
yeah...I don't see how this is really close

I find Esposito gets unfairly underrated around here. He's got a ton of awards, he obliterated the single-season scoring record untill Gretzky showed up, and he was clutch (over 1ppg playoffs, lead Summit Series in scoring)
The debate in reference is locked in the ever so clever stance of "The athletes now would have OWNED the 60's 70's and 80's, therefore they are far superior."

norrisnick is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 12:55 PM
  #7
RorschachWJK
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Kuusamo
Country: Finland
Posts: 3,377
vCash: 500
Esposito now, but might well be Forsberg in 5 years or so.

RorschachWJK is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 12:57 PM
  #8
wilka91*
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 4,251
vCash: 500
When are we going to compare players from the 21st century to those from the 19th?

wilka91* is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 01:16 PM
  #9
God Bless Canada
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Bentley reunion
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,787
vCash: 500
Espo, and it's not even close. He may be the best pure goal scoring centre ever. His nose for the net and offensive instincts are off the charts. Not only that, but he's the best leader since Jean Beliveau.

This is not to diminish Forsberg's accomplishments. He's a sure-fire future HHOFer. But I'd say Espo is the fourth-best centre ever (after Gretzky, Lemieux and Beliveau) and one of the top 10 players ever.

God Bless Canada is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 01:21 PM
  #10
canucksfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 23,551
vCash: 990
This isn't even close Esposito.

canucksfan is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 01:25 PM
  #11
reckoning
Registered User
 
reckoning's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,194
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by norrisnick
The debate in reference is locked in the ever so clever stance of "The athletes now would have OWNED the 60's 70's and 80's, therefore they are far superior."
I know that argument, they never seem to take into account the fact that if yesterdays players were playing today that they`d have access to all of todays traing/conditioning/coaching methods so that whole argument of todays athletes being in superior condition would be negated.

I bet those same people think Ruiz or Klitschko are better boxers than Muhammad Ali was.

Back on topic; I`d give Esposito the edge.

reckoning is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 01:54 PM
  #12
chooch*
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 946
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by reckoning
I know that argument, they never seem to take into account the fact that if yesterdays players were playing today that they`d have access to all of todays traing/conditioning/coaching methods so that whole argument of todays athletes being in superior condition would be negated.

I bet those same people think Ruiz or Klitschko are better boxers than Muhammad Ali was.

Back on topic; I`d give Esposito the edge.
Espo with his outsize personality and scoring feats was as much a star as Orr in the late 60's and early 70's. His play in Summit 72 showed how dominant he was as a leader and as a player. Having said that, Forsberg might be the best 2 way player in history.

I'd say its like asking if Orr was better than Lemieux. Apples and oranges.

Slight edge to Espo.

chooch* is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 02:54 PM
  #13
norrisnick
Registered User
 
norrisnick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 16,243
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chooch
Espo with his outsize personality and scoring feats was as much a star as Orr in the late 60's and early 70's. His play in Summit 72 showed how dominant he was as a leader and as a player. Having said that, Forsberg might be the best 2 way player in history.
I'd say its like asking if Orr was better than Lemieux. Apples and oranges.

Slight edge to Espo.
He doesn't even come CLOSE to the two-way play of Fedorov let alone all of NHL history.

norrisnick is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 03:00 PM
  #14
Big Phil
Registered User
 
Big Phil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,139
vCash: 500
Yeah it isnt even close Esposito no question. 5 Art Ross Trophies, 2 Hart Trophies, 7 first team all-stars, two Cups. Throw in his efforts in the '72 Summit Series and you see what kind of leader he is. Give Forsberg a few years see if he wins a scoring title again and leads Philly to the Cup then we'll talk. Forsberg was never the best player on his team in '96 or '01 his two Cup wins.

Big Phil is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 03:29 PM
  #15
Goldark
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Ann Arbor
Country: United States
Posts: 2,552
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by chooch
Having said that, Forsberg might be the best 2 way player in history.
He might, if guys like Bobby Orr and Gordie Howe weren't ahead of him.

Goldark is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 03:32 PM
  #16
Goldark
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Ann Arbor
Country: United States
Posts: 2,552
vCash: 500
By the way, I voted Esposito, and it's really not that close.

Goldark is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 03:51 PM
  #17
pei fan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,536
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by norrisnick
While that is true one has 5 Art Ross's, 2 Harts, and 2 Pearsons while the other only has the one Hart and one Art Ross.
...............and one had Bobby Orr.

pei fan is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 04:04 PM
  #18
Seph
Registered User
 
Seph's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Oregon
Country: South Korea
Posts: 15,537
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Seph
Quote:
Originally Posted by chooch
Forsberg might be the best 2 way player in history.
For the majority of his career, you could make the argument Forsberg wasn't even the best 2way player on his team.

Don't get me wrong, Forsberg's a great player, but it kills me how overrated his defensive game is when I see comments like this.

Seph is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 04:06 PM
  #19
norrisnick
Registered User
 
norrisnick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 16,243
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pei fan
...............and one had Bobby Orr.
Pete has been on a stacked contender his entire career.

norrisnick is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 05:03 PM
  #20
Habsfan 32
Registered User
 
Habsfan 32's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Way up north...
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,319
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Habsfan 32 Send a message via MSN to Habsfan 32
Esposito for me. I've only seen him play in the Summit Series on DVD but he's amazing.

Habsfan 32 is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 05:14 PM
  #21
sunb
Registered User
 
sunb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Yale University
Country: China
Posts: 3,232
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pei fan
...............and one had Bobby Orr.
Forsberg's had Sakic, Bourque, Roy, Blake, Sundin, Nolan, Foote, Hejduk, Tanguay, Drury and Ozolinch.

sunb is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 05:44 PM
  #22
VanIslander
17/07/2014 ATD RIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,923
vCash: 500
As a Forsberg fan I'm upset at this comparison!! It makes him look bad.

They are two totally different kinds of player but Esposito is clearly better from all I've ever seen and known. I'd take Messier over him, but barely, and Yzerman isn't far behind. They are the highest echelon of hockey perfection, below the hockey gods of course. (If it even needs saying: Among forwards, Gretzky and Lemieux are the hockey gods. It's unfair to every other forward to even try and compare them to those two.)

Forsberg, Jagr and Fedorov are all on par, in my opinion, as among those on the third tier of greatness, with super skills in some areas of their game.

Imagine one player combining Forsberg's passing, vision and strength on his skates, with Jagr's size, shot and nose for the net and with Fedorov's skating, movement and defensive ability. Then you'd be justified in putting him in the class of Esposito, Messier and Howe.

I take nothing away from any of them. These are all the heroes of my life.

VanIslander is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 07:57 PM
  #23
chooch*
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 946
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander
As a Forsberg fan I'm upset at this comparison!! It makes him look bad.

They are two totally different kinds of player but Esposito is clearly better from all I've ever seen and known. I'd take Messier over him, but barely, and Yzerman isn't far behind. They are the highest echelon of hockey perfection, below the hockey gods of course. (If it even needs saying: Among forwards, Gretzky and Lemieux are the hockey gods. It's unfair to every other forward to even try and compare them to those two.)

Forsberg, Jagr and Fedorov are all on par, in my opinion, as among those on the third tier of greatness, with super skills in some areas of their game.

Imagine one player combining Forsberg's passing, vision and strength on his skates, with Jagr's size, shot and nose for the net and with Fedorov's skating, movement and defensive ability. Then you'd be justified in putting him in the class of Esposito, Messier and Howe.

I take nothing away from any of them. These are all the heroes of my life.
Not even big mouth Phil would say he skated like Fedorov. And Phil's defensive play was a joke. What about his "team" play consisting of refusing to come off the ice even with coaches hollering at him.

His signature "move" was to park himself in front of the net and use his size to jam the puck in. His slapper didnt exist. He couldnt skate. He didnt like to pass (see 76 goals 76 assists). He was too slow/tired to come back.

I wouldnt put him in the class of Howe.
Nor Messier in either Howe or Espo's class.

chooch* is offline  
Old
11-09-2005, 08:42 PM
  #24
arrbez
bad chi
 
arrbez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,611
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to arrbez
oh yeah, totally. Esposito's career goals scored were the result of 717 shots that Bobby Orr bounced off him

People put WAY to much emphasis on being a "complete" player I think. He couldn't skate, he didn't backcheck...so what? He was the most prolific goal scorer of his generation. And remember, a goal is a goal is a goal, whether it's an end to end rush or a garbage goal at the side of the net. They're all worth the same.

arrbez is offline  
Old
11-10-2005, 02:15 AM
  #25
Marcus-74
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 165
vCash: 500
Peter Forsberg without a question... and not just because Esposito is a ******* redneck IMO.

On which aspect of hockey is Esposito actually better, except scoring? And since this comparison is slightly unfair to Forsberg (He is not a finished article yet), the choise is even easier to make.

Marcus-74 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:14 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.