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Old
10-15-2003, 12:23 AM
  #1
FacelessButcher
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Montreal-Edmonton proposal

forgive me if the trades are a little off I don't get to watch Montreal as often since there East and Edm is West coast team. Apparently Lowe has been at your games scouting and I heard Montreal was looking to acquire talent(Primeau rumour), Lowe is reportedly holding discussions with several teams over Comrie figured u might be one of them

To Montreal-
Comrie(most people say he can't sign for more than Hossa but 2mill is a fair estimate)
Rita(1million only if he plays 10 games I believe a lot less if he doesn't)

To Edmonton-
Perrault(2.8million)
Hainsey(1.075million)

I think Edmonton can chew down some salary we lost Marchant and have more money from dollar improving so we should be able to take on Perrault. I don't like this trade but my crytal ball says it has a fairly high probability of occurence Edmonton could use a good face-off man, and a good power-play guy.

trade I would prefer...

To Montreal-
Comrie
Rita
4th pick 2004

To Edm-
Bulis(1.15million)
Hainsey(1.075million)
Garon(1million)

don't know who u would shift to the wing. Yes I am well aware u want size but Comrie is a proven scorer so I thought I would bounce the idea off u, oh Perrault has 2inches on Comrie but the weight is the same and Rita is pretty big probably ready next year or half way through this season I'm sure u've seen a lot of him since we shared the farm affiliation.

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Old
10-15-2003, 12:35 AM
  #2
Mike8
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I would say the first trade is slanted terribly for Montreal. Perreault would not be of interest to the Oilers in my opinion due to his price tag. It's not a question of whether Edmonton could afford Perreault, but more of whether they would want to. He doesn't fit into the Oil's style of run and gun, physical hockey, giving 100% effort on every shift.

If the Oilers were looking to move that package, the second deal would be closer to the value to expect given Comrie's situation. Bulis and Hainsey are both cheap and could fit in very nicely in Edmonton.

With that said, I'm not sure if Montreal does this deal. Right now there's Koivu, Ribeiro, Perreault, Juneau, Begin, and Higgins (who is looking NHL ready) at center. Every single one of those players is best suited down the middle. Now, Comrie is a head and shoulders ahead of everyone there except Koivu, but why deal two assets from relatively weak positions (Hainsey - LD; Bulis - LW) to strengthen an already deep position? Granted, Comrie brings the quality that Montreal needs, but there's also a need for puck moving defensemen which Hainsey provides.

Overall, tough deal for Montreal to pull the trigger on. I would likely do it, because I think Comrie would thrive in a second line center role behind Koivu. But I'd cringe at the thought of Koivu, Comrie, and Ribeiro being the top three centers here.

From Edmonton's perspective, I'm not sure how it addresses needs either. Hainsey fits into the puck moving, fast-skating team the Oil strives to be, but the team's biggest weakness I'd think would be size and strength down the middle, as well as top 6 scoring forwards.

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Old
10-15-2003, 12:49 AM
  #3
FacelessButcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8

From Edmonton's perspective, I'm not sure how it addresses needs either. Hainsey fits into the puck moving, fast-skating team the Oil strives to be, but the team's biggest weakness I'd think would be size and strength down the middle, as well as top 6 scoring forwards.
Ya I said I did not like the first trade just got a gut feeling u know? Second trade fills all Edmontons needs puck moving d-man fills out our top 6 defense a big second line center that can probably click pretty well with Dvorak and Garon a potential no.1 goalie who can fill in after Salo leaves he should be a good buffer between Salo and Deslauriers. I like Bergeron but if we get Hainsey we might not need him or Cross would u be interested in Bergeron (don't worry I won't try to dump Cross on u)?

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Old
10-15-2003, 01:32 AM
  #4
Mike8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FacelessButcher
Ya I said I did not like the first trade just got a gut feeling u know? Second trade fills all Edmontons needs puck moving d-man fills out our top 6 defense a big second line center that can probably click pretty well with Dvorak and Garon a potential no.1 goalie who can fill in after Salo leaves he should be a good buffer between Salo and Deslauriers. I like Bergeron but if we get Hainsey we might not need him or Cross would u be interested in Bergeron (don't worry I won't try to dump Cross on u)?
Just to let you know, Bulis plays LW now. He can be moved to center, but he is pitiful in the faceoff circle, and has said he prefers playing on the wing.

I also wouldn't count on Bulis to be all that productive in a top 6 role, by the way. He fills in fine in a top 6 role if he's needed, and is versatile enough to develop chemistry with most players, but he's still got a ways to develop before he can be called a top 6 forward.

That second deal is fine value wise, as I said. But it's a bit early for a rebuilding club to deal off one of its bluechippers for a holdout (albeit a young one), I would think though.

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Old
10-15-2003, 03:03 AM
  #5
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I see two problems with the trade. Montreal needs Hainsey just as bad - he was getting just under 17 minute ice time last night. If Habs make trades for another smallish center (not what they are looking for at all) they have to send one the other way. As for the Primeau rumor - I have a feeling whoever made that up wasnt only thinking of his talent.

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Old
10-15-2003, 03:12 AM
  #6
Team_Spirit
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Ribeiro(OR Bulis) + Markov + Pick

for

Ryan Smyth
------

From a Habs POV i like it ... hard to move Markov but... Quital move to RD and Komisarek enter in the line-up with Bouillon as the 7th....

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10-15-2003, 03:29 AM
  #7
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Well ... i'll put it on the proposal board ... wait and see .

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Old
10-15-2003, 03:33 AM
  #8
Mike8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Komisarek
Are you insane??????????????????????????

That's such a horrible trade!!!!!!!

And Ryan Smyth is overrated.
How is Ryan Smyth overrated exactly?

I wouldn't say it's a horrible trade either. It's a lateral one. It fills one hole while creating another. In other words, it'd be pointless from Montreal's perspective and counter productive in the process of building a team.... but value wise, it is fair.

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Old
10-15-2003, 03:43 AM
  #9
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yeah moving Markov didn't song good...maybe Hainsey + Bulis and 2nd could get it done .

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Old
10-15-2003, 07:31 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Komisarek
Honestly, even that i wouldn't do.. not for Smyth, we don't really need Smyth at all, why give up youth for a player in his prime at this stage? AND a draft pick, 2nd rounder??
Well there would be good reasons to give up youth for a player in his prime in our case (not talking about this exact trade cause I think it sucks). If we acquired another player in his prime we would have a better supporting cast for our young players. Hainsey and Komisarek have a good supporting cast as far as Dmen goes. Between Markov, Brisebois, Souray we can always find a decent partner.

In front it is another storry. Smith is not the guy I would trade for though. If somehow we could pry guys like Cook or/and Carter it would really help our team down the road. But somehow I really doubt this could happen without ripping us out of the remaining youth in our team. ( I would love to see a third line of Cook, Higgins and Carter!)

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Old
10-15-2003, 08:51 AM
  #11
FacelessButcher
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Smyth signed for less than his market value and he is the heart of the team we'll be trading him when u trade Jose, Saku, or Komisarek

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Old
10-15-2003, 09:28 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jozeph_Balej
yeah moving Markov didn't song good...maybe Hainsey + Bulis and 2nd could get it done .
Not to be a prude, but it was these type of "two for one" or "three for one" throw in trades that killed us under Houle.

Smith has some talent, but how would he play in Montreal, or in the Eastern Conference for that matter?? It would also make several holes in the depth chart where we are already weak.

This is the type of trade a contender would do at the deadline, which ain't us. We're in rebuilding mode, and this proposed move is contrary to that.

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Old
10-15-2003, 11:05 AM
  #13
FacelessButcher
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Hows Hossa at center?

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Old
10-15-2003, 11:12 AM
  #14
Démon Blond
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One answer... NO!

we don't need Comrie as he is another small center where we are already overflowing with bodies at that position... and as I say in every trade proposition involving our young, especialy Hainsey, they will learn to win in Montreal, nowhere else!

I prefer to keep our youngs and let them develop as a team here... Julien seems to be the right guy to be able to do just that .. it's too soon to celebrate but I liked the 2 last games.

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Old
10-15-2003, 11:44 AM
  #15
Habruti!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Démon Blond
One answer... NO!

we don't need Comrie as he is another small center where we are already overflowing with bodies at that position... and as I say in every trade proposition involving our young, especialy Hainsey, they will learn to win in Montreal, nowhere else!

I prefer to keep our youngs and let them develop as a team here... Julien seems to be the right guy to be able to do just that .. it's too soon to celebrate but I liked the 2 last games.
I totally agree with this post. However I would still like to see some sort of roster cleanup by the end of the year. Perhaps taking the opportunity to trade guys like Perreault and Audette while there value might be somewhat higher towards the trade deadline. If Perreault and Audette's value climb up I would not be in disagreement to move one of them along with a prospect for a more talented guy who is closer to his prime. It will be mportant to bring these guys to the next level next year.

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Old
10-15-2003, 11:51 AM
  #16
FacelessButcher
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How much is left on Perraults current contract?

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Old
10-15-2003, 12:39 PM
  #17
Démon Blond
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FacelessButcher
How much is left on Perraults current contract?
UFA next summer

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Old
10-15-2003, 12:44 PM
  #18
Démon Blond
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habruti!
I totally agree with this post. However I would still like to see some sort of roster cleanup by the end of the year. Perhaps taking the opportunity to trade guys like Perreault and Audette while there value might be somewhat higher towards the trade deadline. If Perreault and Audette's value climb up I would not be in disagreement to move one of them along with a prospect for a more talented guy who is closer to his prime. It will be mportant to bring these guys to the next level next year.
And I almost totally agree with yours , except the part with the prospect traded... unless it's a minor one, or a guy like Chouinard that did not fit our plans.

I sure hope that BG will trade a few older bodies to let our youngs play... not now but at the trade deadline would be good.

Anyway I have confidence in BG to do the right thing for the Habs

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Old
10-15-2003, 03:13 PM
  #19
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I honestly think that the habs and oilers were good trading partners, but there is no way Comrie would be welcome in a habs jersey. His defensive game is down right awful (a la Perrault last year, who obviously has picked up his defensive presence since Bob came in). and there is no way we trade any of our youth on Defence. We are building from the back out... Comrie, Rita solve a bit of problems... But in Hainsey, there is potential for top 2 defensive pairing (with a chance of being the TOP d-man)... Comrie, and Rita to me at least are not anywhere near what we need.
If Edm wants Hainsey/Markov... They would have to START at Hemsky... and I don't see why they would considering they already have Semenov.

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Old
10-15-2003, 05:25 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost # 1
I honestly think that the habs and oilers were good trading partners
So what are the habs problems big centers and physical/gritty wingers? In fairness to Comrie I would say his defense is average NHL level it's just he goes up against fellow stars who r offensive and defensive stars, and their star offense makes his average defense look awful if that makes any sense. I don't really see what deal would be good for these two teams unless we swap youths to fill holes in others.

To Mtl:
Rita
Pouliot
Bergeron

To Edm:
Hainsey
Perzhogin
5th pick 2004

Well Rita is a gritty winger(can play Lw+Rw) who plays the boards well with good size and Pouliot is size down center and Bergeron is a small feisty offensive d-man to even it out. Hainsey we need someone to help out our d, Smith will more than likely be traded soon(age+money) and Staios is old as well that pretty much leaves our d's future in Brewer and Semenovs hands until more prospects step up. Perzhogin is scoring on the right wing were fine now but will need it in the future. I don't think this deal is quite right but it would have to be of this style. I know how much u love ur d-prospects but that is where the majority of Edmontons interest lies which kind of makes us incompatable since were trying to trade a small center(which u have plenty) for your d(which u covet for your future).

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Old
10-15-2003, 06:09 PM
  #21
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To Mtl:
Rita
Pouliot
Bergeron

To Edm:
Hainsey
Perzhogin
5th pick 2004
---------------

Horrible deal
1st we don't need Bergeron we have Bouillon , Komisarek and Bauchemin waiting .

2nd Oils and Habs won't trade recent 1st pick ( Pouliot , Perez )

3rd Rita is a winger and with the new faces ( Ward , Ryder ) we don't have any room for him .
----------------------
Gimme a break with yours Rita things he's young , cheap and he's a prefect fit for the Oilers organisation so he won't be traded ....

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Old
10-15-2003, 06:37 PM
  #22
FacelessButcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jozeph_Balej
To Mtl:
Rita
Pouliot
Bergeron

To Edm:
Hainsey
Perzhogin
5th pick 2004
---------------

Horrible deal
1st we don't need Bergeron we have Bouillon , Komisarek and Bauchemin waiting .

2nd Oils and Habs won't trade recent 1st pick ( Pouliot , Perez )

3rd Rita is a winger and with the new faces ( Ward , Ryder ) we don't have any room for him .
----------------------
Gimme a break with yours Rita things he's young , cheap and he's a prefect fit for the Oilers organisation so he won't be traded ....
um I said I did not like just a base for possible fixes secondly they are all rookies everyone is cheap and young and Rita can play Rw and Lw and Perzhogin is a winger last time I checked so its really swapping those two a winger for a winger I don't get how it makes u any fuller. Perzhogin is more of a goal scoring Rw then Rita(Rita has more balanced goals and assists) and is a better sniper than Rita which is what we want we can sacrifice his grit+boardwork we have plenty(though he does fit in our mold well, I feel we would have an easier time working Perzhogin into our lines 2 years from now opposed to Rita who is about ready now and we have no room for him, apparently u don't either). Not trading recent first picks and not trading for Bergeron are both reasonable complaints but I don't know why ur coming with such vehement distaste just state how u feel calmly and cooly. Never said my trade was perfect and last time I checked your original proposal did not go over so well in the big boards, so as they say.. back to the drawing board

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Old
10-15-2003, 10:49 PM
  #23
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What would u want for just Garon players and/or picks

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Old
10-16-2003, 05:36 AM
  #24
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For a team that is rebuilding I do not want to get rid of Hainsey.

We have to stick to a plan. I hope that Gainey et al don't panic and stick to their guns.

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Old
10-16-2003, 06:05 AM
  #25
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The only deal I could see Gainey making with any team would be to open up space for young players. The only 2 that I think that they would like to have in the lineup right now are Higgins and Komisarek. Moving veterans right now is diificult and probably not timely. With Koivu's health uncertain, the team needs a guy like Perreault who can usually give you a good month or two. The players BG would like to move , we've all named them endlessly, have negative value and can't be moved. No one will spend the money on roster filler type players. Higgins won't be hurt spending time in Hamilton. Darz mentionned at one point that these things take care of themselves, whether injuries or another team's injuries later in the season. when you look at the season after 80 games, I don't think Komi will be hurt by not playing much in the first 10.

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