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10-14-2003, 11:20 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by MVP
So by finding favorable matchup for Cloutier even against a non-playoff team such as Columbus, are we babysitting Clouteri again? i thought we are pass that by now, i mean he is 27 years old afterall.
you can look at it that way certainly. I'm not a Cloutier fan at all and have bashed him on more than one occasion... but the fact of that matter is, he's still part of the team, and in which case, I think he should be utilized in the best way he possibly could. Make the best of it somehow. I'm not suggesting playing Cloutier against weaker teams, certainly not... I remember he had really good records against some teams and even strong teams but weaker against even some like Columbus, Philly, and Boston. I'm just suggesting to play Cloutier to his strengths. I think this is what a lot of teams do at times.

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10-14-2003, 11:29 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by cc
you can look at it that way certainly. I'm not a Cloutier fan at all and have bashed him on more than one occasion... but the fact of that matter is, he's still part of the team, and in which case, I think he should be utilized in the best way he possibly could. Make the best of it somehow. I'm not suggesting playing Cloutier against weaker teams, certainly not... I remember he had really good records against some teams and even strong teams but weaker against even some like Columbus, Philly, and Boston. I'm just suggesting to play Cloutier to his strengths. I think this is what a lot of teams do at times.

In part i agree with you, especailly in the case of a young goalie such as Rick Dipietro. In the case of Cloutier, it is a little different this season, the expectation for this team is very high this season. The management knows that, the players know that and the fan knows that. The bottom line is the Canucks are preparing for the playoff right now, that is how it is for Cup contentor. The Avs did it with the year they won it with Bourque and Red Wings did it with the year they won it with Hasek. That just the approach the team has to take in order to be successful. i am looking at treating Cloutier as a true #1 starter in the playoff, which is an environment that Cloutier has to preform regardless of the matchup or scenario. i think it is critical for Crawford to test Cloutier against some difficult circumstance, i mean if Cloutier had tough time against Columbus, good play him against Columbus and see if he can pass that challenege. And if Cloutier had a tough time against Detriot, again good, play him against the Red Wings and see how Cloutier plays. I much rather have Cloutier all tested out in beginning of the season, than to babysit him and find out in the playoff that he cannot handle the pressure.

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10-14-2003, 11:44 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by MVP
In part i agree with you, especailly in the case of a young goalie such as Rick Dipietro. In the case of Cloutier, it is a little different this season, the expectation for this team is very high this season. The management knows that, the players know that and the fan knows that. The bottom line is the Canucks are preparing for the playoff right now, that is how it is for Cup contentor. The Avs did it with the year they won it with Bourque and Red Wings did it with the year they won it with Hasek. That just the approach the team has to take in order to be successful. i am looking at treating Cloutier as a true #1 starter in the playoff, which is an environment that Cloutier has to preform regardless of the matchup or scenario. i think it is critical for Crawford to test Cloutier against some difficult circumstance, i mean if Cloutier had tough time against Columbus, good play him against Columbus and see if he can pass that challenege. And if Cloutier had a tough time against Detriot, again good, play him against the Red Wings and see how Cloutier plays. I much rather have Cloutier all tested out in beginning of the season, than to babysit him and find out in the playoff that he cannot handle the pressure.
I will go on the record right now and proclaim that Cloutier isn't a good enough starter for this team, especially relative to the abilities of everyone else on the team. To me, he isn't a true number one so the duties between Hedberg and him should be split more evenly but he's here, and at worst, you could boost up his stats and make him look more marketable for a trade.
Considering his decent regular season record, I would say that there were more than a few teams that he had a good time against and I don't see any problem starting him against those teams... not exclusively mind you... but the Canucks shouldn't feel a reluctance to play him against teams that he's good against.

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10-14-2003, 03:59 PM
  #54
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This time no...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Impossibles
This thread is the reason why i hate being a canuck fan sometimes.
Sometimes, we Nuck fans do go a bit over board, but in this instance, I think Cloutier brought this upon himself.

Nucks now have a goalie who is more than capable of playing in 3 or more straight games, no problem. There is no more Brochu, thank goodness, no Skudra and Essensa (played great for us, but was ideally suited to play 1 out of every 3 games, not 3 straight.)

Cloutier is now 27 years old, time for him to be a leader on this team and keep himself in check to instill confidence in his teammates.

Before this trip, I'd say Dan was scheduled to play 2 of the 3 games, but after that undisciplined penalty, that should cost him 1 of his starts. To send a strong message, Crow to sit Cloutier for the next 3, barring of course a complete meltdown against any of the opponents.

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10-14-2003, 04:37 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Street Hawk
Sometimes, we Nuck fans do go a bit over board, but in this instance, I think Cloutier brought this upon himself.

Nucks now have a goalie who is more than capable of playing in 3 or more straight games, no problem. There is no more Brochu, thank goodness, no Skudra and Essensa (played great for us, but was ideally suited to play 1 out of every 3 games, not 3 straight.)

Cloutier is now 27 years old, time for him to be a leader on this team and keep himself in check to instill confidence in his teammates.

Before this trip, I'd say Dan was scheduled to play 2 of the 3 games, but after that undisciplined penalty, that should cost him 1 of his starts. To send a strong message, Crow to sit Cloutier for the next 3, barring of course a complete meltdown against any of the opponents.
So because we lost a game by 1 goal, cloutier should be benched for 3 straight?

In case you guys haven't noticed, no team has ever gone 82-0-0, and no goalie has never let in a soft goal. Cloutier still kept the team in the game when CBJ was controlling the play in the second period.

Soft goals and mistakes happen, even to the best goalies. Its how goalies respond after those goals/mistakes is what makes a goalie good or bad. Wait a few games before the next "blame cloutier" thread.

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10-14-2003, 05:08 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MVP
So by finding favorable matchup for Cloutier even against a non-playoff team such as Columbus, are we babysitting Clouteri again? i thought we are pass that by now, i mean he is 27 years old afterall.
It's not really a favourable matchup though in the sense that it's an obvious "backup" game, against one of the bottom dwellers. So when Dan gets given the game, it doesn't really help his confidence. In an genuine starter/backup situation like most teams around the league, Dan would get the opener, Edmonton, and Detroit games, while the backup would get the Columbus game.

As a guy with confidence issues in his career, getting a start against Columbus hurts it, rather than babysits him.

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Old
10-14-2003, 06:19 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Impossibles
So because we lost a game by 1 goal, cloutier should be benched for 3 straight?

In case you guys haven't noticed, no team has ever gone 82-0-0, and no goalie has never let in a soft goal. Cloutier still kept the team in the game when CBJ was controlling the play in the second period.

Soft goals and mistakes happen, even to the best goalies. Its how goalies respond after those goals/mistakes is what makes a goalie good or bad. Wait a few games before the next "blame cloutier" thread.
Wow, don't blame the thread. I've offered pretty reasonable statements here, it seems like you haven't even read the thread based on your comments. 1) I've said Clouts should start against Detroit. 2) 1 goal, 100 goals, a loss is a loss, the part that has me riled up is that this loss easily could have been avoided. We had the game in control, then Cloutier takes a dumb penalty followed by letting in a soft, this killed the teams momentum and probably didn't help the teams confidence in him. He gave CBJ the momentum, plain and simple.

Finally, if Cloutier doesn't go and give reason for a "blame Cloutier" thread there will never be one again, if he happens to shoot the puck directly into his own net 4 times during his next start and we lose 4-3, there might be another blame Cloutier thread after his next start. I hate to break it to you, but this thread was started based on performance, not a hatred for Cloutier, or because I'm sad because we won't go 82-0. So next time you go and crap on a thread why don't you actually try to figure out what it's about.

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