HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie
Notices

The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, NHL revenues, relocation and expansion.

OT: NBA Jersey Ads Coming in 2017-18 (UPD: 76'ers sign deal w/ StubHub)

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-03-2015, 08:10 AM
  #26
King_Stannis
Registered User
 
King_Stannis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Erie PA, USA
Country: United States
Posts: 2,071
vCash: 500
I wonder how many of the “ads are okay with me” people are the same ones that have, in the past, uttered sentiments like “owners never lose money, it’s all accounting chicanery” or “even if the owners do lose money they get it all back plus a lot more when they sell the team”. I guess what I’m saying is that why are you people so supportive of multi-millionaires and billionaires squeezing every last cent out of a sport by sacrificing, in a small way, the remaining bit of integrity left to it. Don’t compare it to soccer, soccer doesn’t have commercials so even though I don’t like it I can see why they’re walking billboards. But owners get a ton of money from companies already indirectly through the cable contracts and the commercial time that is sold through them and the courtside/board ads.

Really, the whole “I trust owners, they need to eat too!” attitude is quite bizarre.


Last edited by King_Stannis: 11-04-2015 at 07:49 AM.
King_Stannis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-03-2015, 10:58 AM
  #27
Scandale du Jour
JordanStaal#1Fan
 
Scandale du Jour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Asbestos, Qc
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,148
vCash: 2066
Quote:
Originally Posted by King_Stannis View Post
I wonder how many of the “ads are okay with me” people are the same ones that have, in the past, uttered sentiments like “owners never lose money, it’s all accounting chicanery” or “even if the owners do lose money they get it all back plus a lot more when they sell the team”. I guess what I’m saying is that why are you people so supportive of multi-millionaires and billionaires squeezing every last cent out of a sport by sacrificing, in a small way, the remaining bit of integrity left to it. Don’t compare it to soccer, soccer doesn’t have commercials so even though I don’t like it I can see why they’re walking billboards. But owners get a ton of money from companies already indirectly through the cable contracts and the commercial time that is sold through them and the courtside/board ads.

Really, the whole “I trust owners they need to eat too!” attitude is quite bizarre.
Well, I would have a great answer for you, but it would be more fitting for the political board

Let us just say that this attitude is widespread, especially in the USA. I am going to leave it at that.

Scandale du Jour is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-03-2015, 09:08 PM
  #28
cutchemist42
Registered User
 
cutchemist42's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,105
vCash: 500
This is actually interesting, as its Turner who bought the space from the NBA, and got to sell the ad. Ads on jerseys got scuttled because the NBA's tv relationship is more than the few millions from a local ad and TV broadcasters were worried about dealing with ads they didnt like. NHL still does not have this type of tv money though so we'll see what still develops there.

cutchemist42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2015, 07:40 AM
  #29
Car2014
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Country: Germany
Posts: 153
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by King_Stannis View Post
I wonder how many of the “ads are okay with me” people are the same ones that have, in the past, uttered sentiments like “owners never lose money, it’s all accounting chicanery” or “even if the owners do lose money they get it all back plus a lot more when they sell the team”. I guess what I’m saying is that why are you people so supportive of multi-millionaires and billionaires squeezing every last cent out of a sport by sacrificing, in a small way, the remaining bit of integrity left to it. Don’t compare it to soccer, soccer doesn’t have commercials so even though I don’t like it I can see why they’re walking billboards. But owners get a ton of money from companies already indirectly through the cable contracts and the commercial time that is sold through them and the courtside/board ads.

Really, the whole “I trust owners, they need to eat too!” attitude is quite bizarre.
Except that in European ice hockey or basketball, you get both commercials and ads on the shirts. Lots of them even, more so than in soccer.

Car2014 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2015, 01:27 PM
  #30
Jussi
Registered User
 
Jussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: The List Of Jericho
Country: Finland
Posts: 57,885
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Car2014 View Post
Except that in European ice hockey or basketball, you get both commercials and ads on the shirts. Lots of them even, more so than in soccer.
Tv contracts are also worth considerably less than in NA.

Jussi is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-08-2015, 07:19 AM
  #31
Car2014
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Country: Germany
Posts: 153
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
Tv contracts are also worth considerably less than in NA.
I know. They'd probably still have both, though, if they made more through TV deals, but probably not ads all over the shirt. Just compare bigger soccer leagues to some of the smaller ones (e.g. the German to the Austrian Bundesliga).

Car2014 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-09-2015, 02:38 PM
  #32
hercules130
Registered User
 
hercules130's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Country: Indonesia
Posts: 71
vCash: 500
Quote:
The NBA will be the first North American professional sports league to place corporate logos on player jerseys, reaching an agreement with Kia Motors for the company to place its ads on jerseys during this year’s All-Star game in Toronto.
The MLS is not a 'professional sports league'?

hercules130 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 10:28 AM
  #33
cutchemist42
Registered User
 
cutchemist42's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,105
vCash: 500
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/15...2017-18-season

They're coming.

Interesting because I really believed the stance that the tv contract made the extra money not worth the effort, as a big part of that thinking was the ads would anger the tv company who sold their own ads. Wonder if they resolved that issue, or if they are simply telling the cable company to "deal with it"

cutchemist42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 11:24 AM
  #34
No Fun Shogun
Global Moderator
34-38-61-10-13-15
 
No Fun Shogun's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: ŃřƑůń
Country: Fiji
Posts: 43,315
vCash: 50
I've been saying for a while now that the order we should expect ads on jerseys is essentially the same as the proportion of traditionalists amongst their fanbase, but that the first one to do it will open an inevitable pandora's box of leagues likewise doing it.

So, as expected, NBA will be doing it first, I'm then expecting the always cash ravenous NFL to follow suit, the NHL will be the third league to join the party, and MLB will be the last one to jump in.

As a reminder though, I don't believe ads on jerseys in North American sports are at all comparable to soccer leagues and other European leagues. I don't believe that ads will actually appear on jerseys that fans actually buy (at least not in the NHL, maybe for the NBA and NFL, who knows?), aside from game worn jerseys, and that they'll follow the AHL/ECHL route where ads are not on fan gear. If they go against this, all it'll do is vastly increase the demand for counterfeit gear, and the NHL has to know this. They'll have their cake (advertising revenue for player worn gear) and eat it, too (no ads on fan jerseys).

__________________

2010 - 2013 - 2015 Chicago Blackhawks | 2016 Chicago Cubs - EAMUS CATULI! AC0000000
No Fun Shogun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 11:31 AM
  #35
Soundwave
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 36,974
vCash: 500
They can do it, I just won't ever buy a jersey again.

Soundwave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 12:09 PM
  #36
cutchemist42
Registered User
 
cutchemist42's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,105
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by No Fun Shogun View Post
I've been saying for a while now that the order we should expect ads on jerseys is essentially the same as the proportion of traditionalists amongst their fanbase, but that the first one to do it will open an inevitable pandora's box of leagues likewise doing it.

So, as expected, NBA will be doing it first, I'm then expecting the always cash ravenous NFL to follow suit, the NHL will be the third league to join the party, and MLB will be the last one to jump in.

As a reminder though, I don't believe ads on jerseys in North American sports are at all comparable to soccer leagues and other European leagues. I don't believe that ads will actually appear on jerseys that fans actually buy (at least not in the NHL, maybe for the NBA and NFL, who knows?), aside from game worn jerseys, and that they'll follow the AHL/ECHL route where ads are not on fan gear. If they go against this, all it'll do is vastly increase the demand for counterfeit gear, and the NHL has to know this. They'll have their cake (advertising revenue for player worn gear) and eat it, too (no ads on fan jerseys).
I agree with the order too, as to me the jersey itself in the NBA/NFL does not feel AS important than it does in hockey and baseball so it's easier to do it there. I just am really curious now how the deal works with their tv partner.

Also remember, Bettman has really maintained they didnt want to be the first to do it.

Just to add to what MLB might look like when it happens, as they allow them in the WBC. I've never minded as well when the ads were on batting helmets.


cutchemist42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 12:25 PM
  #37
cbcwpg
Registered User
 
cbcwpg's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Between the Pipes
Country: United Nations
Posts: 10,025
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck Aki Berg View Post
That door has always been open, it's not like there's some law against it that was just repealed.

If the NHL wanted to put ads on their jerseys, they'd've done it by now. They were pioneers in ads on the playing surface, so there's no reason for them to be shy about going for the jerseys too.
IIRC, Bettman said at one time they were thinking about it, but they just didn't want to be the first league to do it.

cbcwpg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 01:47 PM
  #38
varsaku
Registered User
 
varsaku's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United States
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,613
vCash: 480
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbcwpg View Post
IIRC, Bettman said at one time they were thinking about it, but they just didn't want to be the first league to do it.
Who ever does it first will face a lot of backlash. If the NHL chooses to go this route, they should wait till things die down before going in.

varsaku is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 01:50 PM
  #39
GordonGraham
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,519
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbcwpg View Post
IIRC, Bettman said at one time they were thinking about it, but they just didn't want to be the first league to do it.

They will let the NBA do it for a year, watch the impact it has, debate about it for a short time and have it in place for the 2019-2020 season

GordonGraham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 02:17 PM
  #40
Finlandia WOAT
Bench Turdbisky
 
Finlandia WOAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 16,907
vCash: 500
No one wanted to be the first league to do it.

As long as fans don't literally riot expect NFL and NHL to follow suit.

Personally I've long been a fan of the Premier League/La Liga style....just one single ad over top the specific color scheme of the jersey, with a small patch with the logo over the left breast.

Do not want walking billboards that are hockey in Europe, those are offensive to the eyes.

Here is an article with some of the problems that Major League Soccer has run into with their sponsorship model:

Quote:
The most famous multi-level marketing company in MLS is the jersey sponsor of the LA Galaxy: Herbalife. Herbalife sells nutritional supplements, energy drinks, and other weight-loss and sporting products. Bill Ackman, a billionaire hedge fund manager, placed a $1 billion hedge against the company, alleging that it is an illegal pyramid scheme. In his analysis, he found that 83% of Herbalife's contractors earn less than $303 a year, and a full 49% earn less than $1 per year; all of this is after purchasing thousands of dollars of start-up supplies and products. He also alleges that Herbalife contractors earn 10 times as much for recruiting new people into becoming Herbalife contractors than they do for selling Herbalife's products.

Advocare, the presenting sponsor of FC Dallas and an MLS sponsor as well, is another multi-level marketing company that produces nutritional products primarily aimed at athletes and the athletically inclined. Lifevantage, yet another multi-level marketing company, is the jersey sponsor of Real Salt Lake (as was Xango, the previous jersey sponsor of RSL). Both of them follow the same business model as Herbalife, but have gained less notoriety: upfront initial investment, and then profits only going to the minuscule top tier.
http://www.blackandredunited.com/opi...re-draft-kings

For the Hurricanes, with probably the weakest corporate presence besides Winnipeg and Ottawa, the best they could do is get a middle tier engineering company like Red Hat (which would be great IMO) or one of the fast food chains based in the state such as Cook Out, Bojangles or Krispy Kreme. Long shot would be Glaxosmithkline (GSK), which has a large office in the Research Triangle Park. That's the best of both worlds, a worldwide pharmaceutical company investing in the hockey team, and just three letters to make a tasteful jersey.

Finlandia WOAT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 03:40 PM
  #41
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 67,777
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
They can do it, I just won't ever buy a jersey again.
Don't worry. The NBA will be selling (retail) jerseys only with no ads.

(So it'll only be the "game worn" jerseys with the ads.)

LadyStanley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 03:43 PM
  #42
tsanuri
Moderator
 
tsanuri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Lompoc CA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,347
vCash: 500
Important to note they are talking about a 2.5 inch square to have the ads in. So it's not a large ad and not taking over the jersey. It's going where the NBA logo use to be.

tsanuri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 04:03 PM
  #43
cutchemist42
Registered User
 
cutchemist42's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,105
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsanuri View Post
Important to note they are talking about a 2.5 inch square to have the ads in. So it's not a large ad and not taking over the jersey. It's going where the NBA logo use to be.
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...033&highlight=

http://deadspin.com/the-nbas-new-tv-...eys-1645725263

http://deadspin.com/nba-logo-moved-t...ads-1593687007

cutchemist42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 04:09 PM
  #44
tarheelhockey
Global Moderator
 
tarheelhockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: The Triangle
Country: United States
Posts: 52,955
vCash: 1020
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
Don't worry. The NBA will be selling (retail) jerseys only with no ads.

(So it'll only be the "game worn" jerseys with the ads.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsanuri View Post
Important to note they are talking about a 2.5 inch square to have the ads in. So it's not a large ad and not taking over the jersey. It's going where the NBA logo use to be.
Expect both of these to change gradually. Once the ad creep starts, there's no turning back.

tarheelhockey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 04:17 PM
  #45
Avs_19
Peter the Great
 
Avs_19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 59,039
vCash: 500
They're still going to sell jerseys without ads so it shouldn't affect the people who want to buy them.

This is going to be so small that I doubt people will even notice them after a month or so. The NBA already had them on their ASG jerseys this year and it didn't really change much.......


Avs_19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 04:17 PM
  #46
cutchemist42
Registered User
 
cutchemist42's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,105
vCash: 500
I think in the end, what bugs me is the ads are just more money for teams that likely dont need the spare change that badly.

I think you can make the case that Euro teams in contrast need the money much more. The facilities they play in are older and the continent as a whole doesn't have the public-money situation as often as teams here. The competition environment is just more cutthroat as well. I honestly think on average Euro sport team budgets are much more tighter than NA counterparts.

Its why this deep down, bugs me more in NA than it does when I watch foreign sports. Not sure if that line of thinking is wrong or not, but the balance of taste-vs-need is how I'm basing my decision.

cutchemist42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 04:47 PM
  #47
tsanuri
Moderator
 
tsanuri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Lompoc CA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,347
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by cutchemist42 View Post
I think in the end, what bugs me is the ads are just more money for teams that likely dont need the spare change that badly.

I think you can make the case that Euro teams in contrast need the money much more. The facilities they play in are older and the continent as a whole doesn't have the public-money situation as often as teams here. The competition environment is just more cutthroat as well. I honestly think on average Euro sport team budgets are much more tighter than NA counterparts.

Its why this deep down, bugs me more in NA than it does when I watch foreign sports. Not sure if that line of thinking is wrong or not, but the balance of taste-vs-need is how I'm basing my decision.
Still 50% is going to go to revenue sharing.
So for those teams that can sell those ads for a lot there will still be a lot going into the pot for those lower revenue teams.

tsanuri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 05:10 PM
  #48
Finlandia WOAT
Bench Turdbisky
 
Finlandia WOAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 16,907
vCash: 500
Here's a thought: Mike Illitch owns the Red Wings and Little Ceasars.

In theory, instead of selling the ad space on the Detroit Red Wings jersey to someone (and given the Red Wings, probably one of the more lucrative deals in the League), he could just plug in Little Ceasar's into the ad space.

Problem: if 50% of the advertisement money goes to revenue sharing, I can't imagine that the NHL would be happy with losing that deal.

The question becomes: who is selling the ad space? Is it the NHL (in which case they can force Mike Illitch to pay a competitive deal to put the logo from the company he owns onto the sweaters of the team he also owns)? Or is it Illitch, in which case he can do what he wants with it? And if it's Illitch's to sell, does that ad space deal become part of HRR?

Finlandia WOAT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 05:25 PM
  #49
tsanuri
Moderator
 
tsanuri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Lompoc CA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,347
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finlandia WOAT View Post
Here's a thought: Mike Illitch owns the Red Wings and Little Ceasars.

In theory, instead of selling the ad space on the Detroit Red Wings jersey to someone (and given the Red Wings, probably one of the more lucrative deals in the League), he could just plug in Little Ceasar's into the ad space.

Problem: if 50% of the advertisement money goes to revenue sharing, I can't imagine that the NHL would be happy with losing that deal.

The question becomes: who is selling the ad space? Is it the NHL (in which case they can force Mike Illitch to pay a competitive deal to put the logo from the company he owns onto the sweaters of the team he also owns)? Or is it Illitch, in which case he can do what he wants with it? And if it's Illitch's to sell, does that ad space deal become part of HRR?
We have no idea how it will exactly work in the NHL. But I can almost guarantee that the league won't allow a team to give away the space to themselves. And from the business side why would you. Advertising is a partial write off anyway.
As it stands now yes it would go into HHR.

tsanuri is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2016, 05:43 PM
  #50
Gnashville
One and Done
 
Gnashville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Crossville TN
Country: United States
Posts: 9,313
vCash: 500
So who has the advantage in the next match
Fly Emirates


or Fly Emirates


Or the other match which pits Fly Emirates

taking on Fly Emirates

Gnashville is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:59 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. @2017 All Rights Reserved.