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Old
12-07-2005, 02:20 PM
  #26
TheRedressor
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Exactly we have nobody in the depth chart who is ready to step up and replace Rucchin (Immonen) and Poti (Pock)

and for the love of God the only way this team trades Hugh Jessiman is to trade up in this years draft to grab Kessel, Toews, Frolik or Staal.

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Old
12-07-2005, 02:29 PM
  #27
Anthony Mauro
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Originally Posted by Nich
trade away innomen and montoya? did you learn nothing over the last 7 years of "win now"

i am starting to think half of our fans are retards....
I'd think you could atleast spell his name if he's that important to you.

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Old
12-07-2005, 02:48 PM
  #28
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nice comeback....your still retarded if you want to "win now".

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Old
12-07-2005, 02:50 PM
  #29
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So when Montoya is gone and say Weekes gets hurt or even Lundqvist we'll have Holt up as the backup and Gherson and Bruckler (both unsigned) in Hartford. Maybe we should draft 2 or 3 goalies in June because we don't have a lot of depth in this position. Really though I'm not ready to get rid of Montoya yet and I think he is a better prospect than either Jessiman or Korpikoski and maybe as good as Staal. In any case I don't see San Jose dumping Marleau when they might have the best one-two punch at center in the league.

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Old
12-07-2005, 02:50 PM
  #30
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and yes plz stop saying that nylander and straka should get traded ,just plz
as long as jagr is happy we see whats up ,hes just beeing the super star he was 2 years (and the hole 90's) again

guys if this goes on we make the playoffs and then everything is possible cards are new drawn, in the playoffs there is no best no worse ,we Know miracles can happen (DUCKS ,WILD 2003 ; Carolina 2002)

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Old
12-07-2005, 02:51 PM
  #31
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Everyone take a deep breath and relax.

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Old
12-07-2005, 03:19 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by TexMurphy
Getting greedy are we???

For the first time in almost 10 years we are building a long term team. Not one which flops in this years playoffs after having traded away all of its prospects but one that wins cups down the road.

If this team aint a contender in about 2-3 years then we can start to panic.

This year playoffs is a bonus.

Next year playoffs is a must and conference finals a bonus.

Year after that conference finals is a must and cup victory a bonus.

Id say that is realistic view of the teams future.

Tex
Isn't that exactly why you'd want Marleau or Morrow on your team? I'm not saying the original deals that were proposed are going to get it done, I don't even know if these guys are available. If you don't want to trade Immonen because you think he'll be better than Marleau than that's fine. If you think Pock is the next Leetch than I can understand you don't want to trade him.

But for people to say they don't want Morrow/Marleau because they want to build for the future makes no sense. Those guys would BE the future. They are young, they are just entering their prime and they are exactly what we don't have out of our prospects. A #1 scoring center and a 2 way physical forward who can score. If you don't want them because on this team because we are "rebuilding" than you're lost.

And by the way, how old are Immonen and Pock? Immonen is 23 and Pock is 24. These guys aren't 18. They aren't going to get THAT much better. 2 top line 27 year olds like Marleau and Morrow would be just as much a part of the Rangers future as these guys.

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Old
12-07-2005, 03:34 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
nice comeback....your still retarded if you want to "win now".
um.. dude. i want to win now too

he suggested trading for brendan morrow and patrick marleau, why do people obsess over preNHL "kids"

those two are young enough to be good and effective here for a long time and minus the inexperience headaches

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Old
12-07-2005, 04:04 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balej's Dance
I always hear people complain Prucha shouldn't or can't play LW.
You must have heard wrong, because those people who have followed him for ages say that he is best at LW and less effective at C, and I don't even know if he can play RW at all.

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Old
12-07-2005, 04:58 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Khelvan
You must have heard wrong, because those people who have followed him for ages say that he is best at LW and less effective at C, and I don't even know if he can play RW at all.
He's by far his best on the left wing.

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Old
12-07-2005, 05:10 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
trade away innomen and montoya? did you learn nothing over the last 7 years of "win now"

i am starting to think half of our fans are retards....
1st of all those teams would never trade for prospects.

But, saying they did...I completely agree, innomen, montaya, pock - these guys are awesome prospects. I still believe that Pock should be playing instead of drats. But thats not the point, the past 7 years have been devastating, all due to the enormous expectations (with all those "great" players). Thats what makes this year so special, the fact that we're actually playing as a team.

I think we made a mistake not pickin up Huselius. Would have been a great replacement over Marian.. I mean Marcel Hossa. Switch the guy with Ward, who IMO has been playin great and deserves a shot on the 2nd line.

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Old
12-08-2005, 08:45 AM
  #37
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trading away 2 1st round picks and 2 other high end prospects is dumb. look at ottawa...just think of the steal of spezza and chara for yashin.

have some patience, and stop being the fan that has to win now that msg used as the reason why they couldn't rebuild.

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Old
12-08-2005, 09:23 AM
  #38
Anthony Mauro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
trading away 2 1st round picks and 2 other high end prospects is dumb. look at ottawa...just think of the steal of spezza and chara for yashin.

have some patience, and stop being the fan that has to win now that msg used as the reason why they couldn't rebuild.
I'm glad you do such a good job of hyping our prospects. Tell me would you have passed up moving Brendl and Lundmark at the right time because they were first round picks? Pock is not high end. Immonen was gotten thru trade, and while he's gonna be a good one, it wouldn't be earth shattering to move him.

Of course its alot to move those 4 guys, but its not about who has the most sexy, best looking prospect pool or minors. Its about the Rangers.

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Old
12-08-2005, 09:27 AM
  #39
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and the rangers are not a deep enough organization to ship out 4 of it's top 10 prospects. so thanks for proving my point.

oh and it isn't hyping. jarko will be a 2nd line center. pock a 3-4 and great pp d-man (which we don't currently have) and montoya a #1 goalie. jury is still out on jessiman, i personally don't believe he will ever be a #1 winger, but still wouldn't trade him this early.

so as you said, it is about the rangers. and the rangers right now are winniong, so i don't understand mortgaging our future (AGAIN) to win now, when you don't know how those trades will affect the team......

i mean i bet you thought the roster of 2003 would have broken the 7 year streak...how did that turn out? so why risk today and tomorrow for a possability of a little better today....


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Old
12-08-2005, 10:17 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
pock a 3-4 and great pp d-man (which we don't currently have) and montoya a #1 goalie.
Sorry, but how much have we seen these two play in the NHL to decide already that they will both be above average NHLers? Don't you think you are overrating Pock a bit here?

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Old
12-08-2005, 10:24 AM
  #41
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nope, not at all. i think he will be a pleseant surprise.

and not with al either....and i didn't say tomorrow...i just said he would be...which i fimrly believe...just not on this team because of king henrik.

but give him 3 years when he actually has some trade value.

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Old
12-08-2005, 10:39 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Nich
so as you said, it is about the rangers. and the rangers right now are winniong, so i don't understand mortgaging our future (AGAIN) to win now, when you don't know how those trades will affect the team......
How are we mortgaging our future if the player we get back in a trade is in his mid 20's? If you trade for a guy like Morrow or Marleau it makes your team better now as well as in the future. Those are the kinds of players who we should be willing to trade a prospect or two for.

Pock is 24, Morrow is 27. There's not a big difference there. How come you think Pock is such a huge part of our teams future but Morrow wouldn't be, especially considering Morrow has proven what he can do in the NHL?

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Old
12-08-2005, 10:44 AM
  #43
Nich
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trading a propect or two is a lot different than trading away two of our top prospects at their position...also known as the guys to come up when someone gets injured.

and why would san jose get rid of him if he is so good?

pretty much, you are the same fans that supported, and allowed management to gut this team in 97 for players to "win now" with.

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Old
12-08-2005, 11:45 AM
  #44
Anthony Mauro
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Originally Posted by Nich
trading a propect or two is a lot different than trading away two of our top prospects at their position...also known as the guys to come up when someone gets injured.

and why would san jose get rid of him if he is so good?

pretty much, you are the same fans that supported, and allowed management to gut this team in 97 for players to "win now" with.
Blanket statements like that, just thrown to see if they stick wont sway anyone's opinionsof "us".

"We" do not want to go back to the way things were. Teams where we stacked the Holik's, Nedved's and Lindros's on lines 1-3, with a useless fourth line are over.

Maybe San Jose wont want to lock up 10-12 million in two centers? Times have changes, there's a salary cap you know? The only player I'd regret is Immonen and even then we do have some guys with potential.

For Montoya, its been said before.

Wait just a second, why do you like Immonen so much? Its pretty ironic, he's the most NHL ready prospect we've got. Which means you're probably the impatient one that wont give up on a prospect who is ready soon. And one that we can say well we waited for him, See what happens when you're patient? When we didnt. If it was Dubinsky, would you be so against a trade? Because obviously he's not as good as Immonen according to you, and for you're underlying reasoning, he's not ready.


Last edited by Anthony Mauro: 12-08-2005 at 12:00 PM.
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Old
12-08-2005, 12:32 PM
  #45
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i am against trading any prospect for the win now attitude..esppecially since we are winning now!!

and the reason why i want to keep jarkop is because i don't see ruchin here next year and i fully expect jarko to get his spot as a second line center. but i know, next year is to far down the road to look for you. even though by all accounts he would have had that spot out of camp if we had we not got ruchin.

you don't want to go back to the way things were, but you want to trade away our promising prospects for people who have established themselves on other teams.....yeah flash back to 97 once again...

you must have loved to kovalev and zubov deal for ulf and luc....i mean ulf and luc were so established.....i'm sure you'll have a GREAT disagreeing arguement, but i really don't care.

and there is a salary cap, thats why teams that develop their OWN prospects will be the best teams in the league, and those depending on free agents won't be as sucessful....you know like pretty much every gm out there realizes now........

oh and for a case study, look at ottawa...they have the system teams need to follow regarding development. and please, don't waste our times by bringing up the hossa for heatly trade.

instead look at the spezza and chara for yashin trade. get rid of the old for two young prospects that don't cost 10-12 million....whish is funny btw considering no player can make more than 7.3. so i don't know how you figure these are two guys who will be getting paid that range....but i am not surprised.

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Old
12-08-2005, 12:48 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
i am against trading any prospect for the win now attitude..esppecially since we are winning now!!

and the reason why i want to keep jarkop is because i don't see ruchin here next year and i fully expect jarko to get his spot as a second line center. but i know, next year is to far down the road to look for you. even though by all accounts he would have had that spot out of camp if we had we not got ruchin.

you don't want to go back to the way things were, but you want to trade away our promising prospects for people who have established themselves on other teams.....yeah flash back to 97 once again...

you must have loved to kovalev and zubov deal for ulf and luc....i mean ulf and luc were so established.....i'm sure you'll have a GREAT disagreeing arguement, but i really don't care.

and there is a salary cap, thats why teams that develop their OWN prospects will be the best teams in the league, and those depending on free agents won't be as sucessful....you know like pretty much every gm out there realizes now........

oh and for a case study, look at ottawa...they have the system teams need to follow regarding development. and please, don't waste our times by bringing up the hossa for heatly trade.

instead look at the spezza and chara for yashin trade. get rid of the old for two young prospects that don't cost 10-12 million....whish is funny btw considering no player can make more than 7.3. so i don't know how you figure these are two guys who will be getting paid that range....but i am not surprised.
First of all, it wasn'st Kovalev and Zubov for Luc and Ulf. It was Nedved and Zubov.

Targetting someone like Marleau or Morrow is not the same thing as what has happened in the past. These are guys who are in the prime or entering the prime of their careers. Marleau is 26 and Morrow will be 27 next month. So if you're talking about trading two maybes for an established NHL player who has a lot of hockey left, you need to look into it. That said, you aren't going to get those guys for a couple of prospects.

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Old
12-08-2005, 01:18 PM
  #47
nyr7andcounting
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
trading a propect or two is a lot different than trading away two of our top prospects at their position...also known as the guys to come up when someone gets injured.

and why would san jose get rid of him if he is so good?

pretty much, you are the same fans that supported, and allowed management to gut this team in 97 for players to "win now" with.
I never said SJ/DAL would want to trade him and I said we don't even know if they are available. I didn't start the thread with those proposals. All I've said is that if you wouldn't trade for Morrow or Marleau because you don't want to risk a guy like Pock than that's ridiculous.

I've been wanting them to rebuild for years, I'm happy they are finally doing it and they should continue for a couple more years. That doesn't mean we have to fall in love with every one of our prospects. They aren't all going to be NHL players. If you can trade a guy like Pock or Immonen in a deal for a mid 20's established NHL player who plays a position/style that we need than it's a good move. Marleau and Morrow would both give this team something that we don't have now OR in our prospects.

and I'll point out again that Pock is 24 and Immonen is 23. Morrow is 27 and Marleau is 26. All of these guys are "young". So why are Pock and Immonen such a huge part of our future but Morrow and Marleay can't be?


Last edited by nyr7andcounting: 12-08-2005 at 01:27 PM.
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