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The refs in the Panthers/Coyotes game

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Old
10-17-2003, 10:03 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by aylib
None of you know how to operate the volume button?
Tough to do when you're listening to the game on the radio...

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10-17-2003, 10:57 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by SmokeyClause
NHL officiating is just poor. I won't go so far as to say they favor one team over another, but the level of inconsistency I have seen this year is appalling. The NHL needs to step in and do something. The NHL rulebook needs to be more than a guidebook.

In 1.5 week I have already seen some "Amazing" officiating, that can only be described as plain bad officials. Numerous wrong calls IOTW calling penalties that are not there ( interference on a puckcarrier) etc etc

Something is wrong when you get the same 2 min for a vicious act that gave a 1game suspension after review from the league and the same 2 min that someone got for tying up a stick downlow and getting it called slashing

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10-18-2003, 06:59 AM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by islandnucker
I don't really know what you're talking about as far as me giving you evidence of something. Is it the comment that ANOTHER poster made about it leading to goalies getting run? ANOTHER poster made that comment, not me. Leave it to the OTHER poster to back-up his argument, I don't believe that it leads to goalies getting run.
No, I'm not talking about the goalies getting run; I think everyone knows that it doesn't work that way in the pro game. I put it to you in that manner because you made a snide remark about me and didn't actually add anything pro or con to the argument.

Quote:
Originally Posted by islandnucker
I, IN MY VERY OWN OPINION, believe that it's unsportsmanlike and worthy of a penalty. If you have never seen a scrum around a goalie after an opposing player snowed him then I don't know what to say, I have though (yes in the NHL).
A scrum is it? What I want to hear is why a snowing in the pro game (which doesn't lead to anything in terms of the refs losing control of an NHL game) is ever deserving of a minor penalty? Is it so unsportsmanlike (knowing that it doesn't lead to anything in terms of the refs losing control of an NHL game) that a team should run the risk of losing a game on such a call? Should fans be punished by watching such a silly call made when it's known that it doesn't lead to anything in terms of the refs losing control of an NHL game? The refs struggle making obvious calls as it is; they don't need to worry about calling a play that makes no impact in an NHL game.

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10-18-2003, 12:55 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Laperriere22
A scrum is it? What I want to hear is why a snowing in the pro game (which doesn't lead to anything in terms of the refs losing control of an NHL game) is ever deserving of a minor penalty?
1. Snowing the goaltender with ice chips is dangerous to the goaltender's eyes.

2. With the way that teams protect their goaltenders these days, it is sure to lead to a gathering at the net with Roughing After The Whistle calls bound to happen.

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10-18-2003, 01:48 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Van
1. Snowing the goaltender with ice chips is dangerous to the goaltender's eyes.

2. With the way that teams protect their goaltenders these days, it is sure to lead to a gathering at the net with Roughing After The Whistle calls bound to happen.
1. Hypothetical dangers are not of concern to me. If you could cite the last goalie injured by chips to his eyes, then you would have me convinced.

2. We must watch different teams then because I rarely see a scrum develop over a snowing. It may happen on occasion, but for the most part, NHL goaltenders deal with it by not letting it affect their games. Because it's a tactic for getting a goalie off his game, if it doesn't work, then pros aren't going to keep doing it unless you're talking a 7 game playoff series where a goalie is as hot as Giguere was last season. Even then, screening him and bumping him worked better than snowing him ever did. You're many times more likely to see a scrum develop over a player taking a late shot at a covered puck than a snowing. It's a nothing play in the pro game. Most defensemen are disciplined enough not to waste their time getting in scrums over a snowing as well. Professionals don't get affected by it like amateur players do.

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10-18-2003, 02:27 PM
  #56
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You need to get away from your "it's the NHL" bull**** excuse. Hockey is hockey when it comes to things like this. Showering a goaltender's face with ice is equivalent to giving him a light bump after the whistle.

NHL or beer league...you are going to get thumped if you go after a goaltender, and snowing a goaltender is going after him.

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10-18-2003, 04:24 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laperriere22
No, I'm not talking about the goalies getting run; I think everyone knows that it doesn't work that way in the pro game. I put it to you in that manner because you made a snide remark about me and didn't actually add anything pro or con to the argument.
I made a rude comment because after I stated my opinion on it you implied that I was lacking common sense. One stupid little shot deserves another. As far as this evidence that you were looking for I'm still waiting what you want evidence on. Refer to one of your posts, #45 I think and if I was the one that should provide this imaginary evidence I'll do my best.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Laperriere22
A scrum is it? What I want to hear is why a snowing in the pro game (which doesn't lead to anything in terms of the refs losing control of an NHL game) is ever deserving of a minor penalty? Is it so unsportsmanlike (knowing that it doesn't lead to anything in terms of the refs losing control of an NHL game) that a team should run the risk of losing a game on such a call? Should fans be punished by watching such a silly call made when it's known that it doesn't lead to anything in terms of the refs losing control of an NHL game? The refs struggle making obvious calls as it is; they don't need to worry about calling a play that makes no impact in an NHL game.
Again, as I stated earlier, if you've never seen a game where a teams players push around an opposing player after he snowed the goalie then I guess you would have that view point. I have seen it done in the NHL and calling that penalty would discourage other players from snowing, thus creating less pushing around after the whistle, thus allowing the refs to keep better control of the game.

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10-18-2003, 05:06 PM
  #58
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Koho did the same thing against the Hawks tonight. It was pathetic!

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10-18-2003, 08:50 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Van
You need to get away from your "it's the NHL" bull**** excuse. Hockey is hockey when it comes to things like this. Showering a goaltender's face with ice is equivalent to giving him a light bump after the whistle.

NHL or beer league...you are going to get thumped if you go after a goaltender, and snowing a goaltender is going after him.
You're quite funny. Hockey isn't hockey when it comes to this. Name the last fight you saw break out over a goaltender getting snowed. You can't can you? Hell, scrums don't even break out that often any more in the games I've seen. NHL players are clearly not as susceptible to it and it's you that fails to realize that difference. It's not an excuse and it's not BS because all you can point to are hypotheticals and examples of it in lower levels of hockey. I have nothing more to add on this. It's quite clear that there is no real evidence you can point to that pro players are just like amateurs in this situation and there's no need for anything more to be said about it unless you have some real examples.

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10-18-2003, 09:06 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by islandnucker
I made a rude comment because after I stated my opinion on it you implied that I was lacking common sense. One stupid little shot deserves another. As far as this evidence that you were looking for I'm still waiting what you want evidence on. Refer to one of your posts, #45 I think and if I was the one that should provide this imaginary evidence I'll do my best.
Clearly a hyperbole that you took to heart. Oh well. These things happen.

I stated what I want evidence on a few times. If the occasional scrum is the best example there is of why that penalty should be called, then I have nothing more to add to it. It's not a matter of whether a scrum has happened before over it, it's a matter of how often it happens and how important that play is. It's done for a single reason and that reason just doesn't work on NHL goaltenders. If they could be moved off their games that easily, they wouldn't be in the NHL in the first place.

And it's rather rare to see a snowing at the NHL level and it's even more rare to see a scrum develop from it. Yeah, I've seen it, but it's hardly a problem in the league. That's what I want some evidence on; the actual gravity of the snowing (ie its impact on the game). How often does it lead to anything at all? The occasional scrum just isn't enough to warrant putting a team in the box for it. It's a ridiculous call at this level of hockey and I say that because snowing has zero impact on the NHL game these days. The only evidence I would require is some actual instances where snowing leads to something of substance. I've never seen a team lose its focus and discipline over snowing. It doesn't endanger anybody (except the goalie's eyes which somehow have survived it over the years) and it doesn't lead to fights either.

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Old
10-18-2003, 09:11 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laperriere22
You're quite funny. Hockey isn't hockey when it comes to this. Name the last fight you saw break out over a goaltender getting snowed. You can't can you? Hell, scrums don't even break out that often any more in the games I've seen. NHL players are clearly not as susceptible to it and it's you that fails to realize that difference. It's not an excuse and it's not BS because all you can point to are hypotheticals and examples of it in lower levels of hockey. I have nothing more to add on this. It's quite clear that there is no real evidence you can point to that pro players are just like amateurs in this situation and there's no need for anything more to be said about it unless you have some real examples.
I think it is hilarious that you think unsportsmanlike acts should only be called if it risks a fight breaking out.

I don't need specific examples of scrums and fights resulting from this. All I need is my opinion as a player, coach and referee. And that opinion is that snowing the goaltender should be 2 minutes for unsportsmanlike conduct...NHL or not.

My only beef with hockey rules in general, is that there is a different rulebook for so many federations and leagues. There should be one uniform rulebook for the game of hockey at all levels, including the NHL. This way, officials won't have to learn an entire new set of rules every time they sign with a new league...and it will avoid useless debates like this one.

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Old
10-19-2003, 09:35 AM
  #62
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For the sake of clarity, I will add one last thing to this. You said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Van
NHL or beer league...you are going to get thumped if you go after a goaltender, and snowing a goaltender is going after him.
Now, I don't know about you, but where I come from, saying someone is going to get thumped suggest fights stem from it. You then present a complete strawman argument by saying:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Van
I think it is hilarious that you think unsportsmanlike acts should only be called if it risks a fight breaking out.
Just wanted to point that out.

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