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NHLPA appeals Wideman suspension (UPD: Suspension reduced)

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Old
02-03-2016, 11:05 PM
  #1
LadyStanley
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NHLPA appeals Wideman suspension (UPD: Suspension reduced)


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02-03-2016, 11:29 PM
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Is this really a business topic? It's straight hockey ops.

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02-03-2016, 11:32 PM
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LadyStanley
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Is this really a business topic? It's straight hockey ops.
CBA, interaction between league and unions.

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02-04-2016, 09:58 AM
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You can argue every suspension is then.

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02-04-2016, 10:47 AM
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powerstuck
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Do Flames get something for not properly handling Widemans concussion when it happened as stated per rules ? (read : quiet room mandatory exam).

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02-04-2016, 10:50 AM
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That seems to be the more pressing issue to me, actually. The idea that a player could overrule a coaching or monitor's request to get checked out seems like the very thing that should absolutely be out of the player's (and team's) hands.

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02-04-2016, 11:01 AM
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LadyStanley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IU Hawks fan View Post
You can argue every suspension is then.
Not every suspension is appealed, nor involve on ice official.

Quote:
Originally Posted by powerstuck View Post
Do Flames get something for not properly handling Widemans concussion when it happened as stated per rules ? (read : quiet room mandatory exam).
Should be a fine (at minimum).

But might not be made public.

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02-04-2016, 04:07 PM
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Confucius
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Not every suspension is appealed, nor involve on ice official.



Should be a fine (at minimum).

But might not be made public.
I would think the Trainer or bench coaches get disciplined as well. Amazingly nobody tapped him on the shoulder and sent him to the dressing room.

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02-04-2016, 04:16 PM
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I would think the Trainer or bench coaches get disciplined as well. Amazingly nobody tapped him on the shoulder and sent him to the dressing room.
This. Not defending what he did, but the fact he was allowed to continue to play without so much as a quick check is a bad look for the flames

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02-04-2016, 04:39 PM
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dechire
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I thought he looked wobbly as he got up so I'm not surprised he was concussed nor is it surprising that he'd appeal based on that. I've only had one concussion before and it was from a car accident so I don't know how typical my experience is especially relating to hockey but I remember very little of what happened afterward. Can't remember leaving the car, walking to where I ended up sitting or any of my conversations until the ambulance got there. So I think that could be a very interesting argument for Wideman. Not saying that he shouldn't be suspended but how much of what he did was clear-minded and how much was from the concussion ?

Also like other have said there's a player safety aspect to it as well. If Wideman is going to use the concussion as an argument then the obvious question becomes why the Flames didn't get him checked out. I think we've all seen players returning to the ice with what are later revealed as concussions. Yes there are systems in place now but they aren't always used. Just two nights ago I saw a player's head get boarded into the glass in the 2nd, he played two more shifts and then went to the room 5 minutes after the initial hit. Unfortunately that's not that uncommon to see.

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02-04-2016, 05:06 PM
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I think the concussion issue is just an excuse in my opinion and should be treated as a whole separate issue. He knew what he was doing when he intentionally body checked a linesman.

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02-04-2016, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by gstommylee View Post
I think the concussion issue is just an excuse in my opinion and should be treated as a whole separate issue. He knew what he was doing when he intentionally body checked a linesman.
Spoken like someone who has never had the misfortune of suffering a concussion...

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02-04-2016, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by gstommylee View Post
I think the concussion issue is just an excuse in my opinion and should be treated as a whole separate issue. He knew what he was doing when he intentionally body checked a linesman.
I can see it more as mitigation not to excuse what he did.
Right now it seems as if they went with the highest level and game him the min in that level. So I guess on appeal they could deem it the second level and give him something between the 10-20 games.

But I do agree it seems as if he's trying to have it both ways. I was concussed so I didn't know what I was doing. But I stayed in the game. So which is it?

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02-04-2016, 05:50 PM
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Spoken like someone who has never had the misfortune of suffering a concussion...
I've had a few.. not once did I then proceed to take it out on an official. It was a deliberate act of frustration because he was pissed off and nothing more. You can even read his lips on the bench when he said "I'm fine, I'm fine."

It's just a ploy by the Flames. I don't blame them for defending their player, but there is absolutely no excuse for Wideman's actions in this case.

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02-05-2016, 12:19 AM
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This is a CBA issue, and its pretty straightforward, the penalty is no less than 20 games. I am assuming the league did its due diligence and investigated. Assuming the NHL followed just cause and the fact that there are no comparable cases the arbitrator can rule that the NHL didn't prove conclusively that the contact was incidental, and made the wrong call (which I don't think it will happen) or they uphold the 20 game suspension. This is not an objective suspension like Torre's but a clear and defined rule its either 10 or 20. If you are the NHLPA its a no brainer you have nothing to lose and have to file the grievance. Having said that it may be their play to make the NHL look bad on concussions and put pressure on the NHL to settle. Happens all the time, if I were running this case I would depose everyone at the office that I could and make it about the way Wideman was pressured to play through a concussion. If it were my case its what I would do. (and for the record that's what I do as an officer enforcing a labor contract) Sometimes you are more successful leveraging pressure or embarrassing the other side, especially if the facts are not on your side. If you lose you tell your membership that we tried. the NHLPA doesn't care what you think, they only care about what their members think. People have blamed the greedy players for the strike when the last two work stoppages were lockouts from the owners. (I am not taking a side here on players vs owners, just saying that people don't really make the distinction between greedy players going on strike and greedy owners staging a lockout) again the cost of the arbitration os nothing for the Union and they have nothing to lose by trying.

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02-05-2016, 01:43 AM
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He assaulted an official in the course of a game. That's a big deal.

If he had a concussion that rendered him senseless and he was allowed to continue to play, that's an even bigger issue.

Either way, something went seriously wrong with the player and/or the Calgary bench and there's some seriously explaining to do.

Someone needs to be seriously punished for something, one way or another. You can't run officials, and you can't allow concussed players to continue to play.


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02-05-2016, 02:43 AM
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They should tack on a few more games

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02-05-2016, 03:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gstommylee View Post
I think the concussion issue is just an excuse in my opinion and should be treated as a whole separate issue. He knew what he was doing when he intentionally body checked a linesman.
I watched this yesterday (someone sent me the link), and his action was obviously the result of a concussion. Why would a professional hockey player intentionally body check a linesman in front of 18,000 people and 12 different cameras? He would have to be 1) a psychopath and 2) an imbecile. Clearly he had just had his bell rung and didn't have the slightest idea what he was doing at the time.

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02-05-2016, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Ugmo View Post
I watched this yesterday (someone sent me the link), and his action was obviously the result of a concussion. Why would a professional hockey player intentionally body check a linesman in front of 18,000 people and 12 different cameras? He would have to be 1) a psychopath and 2) an imbecile. Clearly he had just had his bell rung and didn't have the slightest idea what he was doing at the time.
That debate is held in NHL Talk forums tho. But I will just tell you I disagree with you because of this :

- Wideman gets hit, his head ends up hitting the board, lets assume he's concussed.
- Wideman gets up, heads in the bench direction, still concussed, wobbly, but not any major effects.
- Wideman goes nuts and nails the ref...major concussion effect (lasts 0.5 seconds)
- Wideman continues toward bench, makes sure he avoids incoming Predators player to not cause too many man on ice penalty or an obstruction on the play.
- Wideman sits on bench and tells the trainer he's fine.
- Wideman proceeds to finish the game not missing a single shift.
- Wideman states after game he was not concussed and feels fine.
- Few days later...
- Wideman gets the hammer with 20 games.
- Wideman appeals because doctors discovered he was concussed after the game.

Sorry for going ''OT'' on the business debate.
We should restrict to what impact, if any, this has on Flames/trainers/medical personnel.

I personally feel like that concussed or not...Wideman didn't get enough attention when he reached the bench. And if he was that concussed, he should have stayed on ice like many other players chose to do instead of going nuts on everything around him.

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02-05-2016, 10:27 AM
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Waste of time. Wideman knew what he was doing here. If you ask me 20 games is to lenient for this sort of thing.

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02-05-2016, 11:16 AM
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Even if he did have a concussion - which seems pretty convenient now - that does not absolve him from his actions. He did not state that he blacked out or did not remember cross checking the linesman.

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02-05-2016, 02:22 PM
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to be cold and brutally honest, i think he was pissed there was no call on the guy who hit him, and just needed an outlet on the way back to the bench and the linesman was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

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02-05-2016, 02:35 PM
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I agree that he deserves the full punishment, because the ref and linesmen should be absolutely off-limits no matter what the excuse. I just don't understand the logic of why a player would intentionally cross-check a linesman. It makes no sense whatsoever.

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02-05-2016, 08:34 PM
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I agree that he deserves the full punishment, because the ref and linesmen should be absolutely off-limits no matter what the excuse. I just don't understand the logic of why a player would intentionally cross-check a linesman. It makes no sense whatsoever.
Easy to understand Ugmo.... doesnt make it right... but c'mon, human nature.... anger mgmnt issues ja?.... weve all seen it.

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02-05-2016, 11:48 PM
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UnrefinedCrude
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I agree that he deserves the full punishment, because the ref and linesmen should be absolutely off-limits no matter what the excuse. I just don't understand the logic of why a player would intentionally cross-check a linesman. It makes no sense whatsoever.
why would someone swing a stick at another player's head?
why would a player try throwing the puck into the net with his hands?
why would a player not make sure the treatment he is using to recover from injury isn't banned by the drug policy?

all things that carry a warped logic, yet have all happened?

an action being stupid doesn't prevent it from happening/ people do illogical things all the time.

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