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12-27-2005, 11:27 AM
  #51
eco's bones
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Originally Posted by Colt.45Orr
I didn't see all of the game last night.. but the Sens sure took it to you guys physically...

Senators: 33hits
Rangers: 16 hits...

You guys looked like a bunch of wilting daisies out there at times. Neil (6) hits was going out there running guys with nobody to come over and say "Hey Neilsie... next hit you throw on one of our guys I'm coming looking for you"

It is amusing how some of you view Orr as such a liability and hinderance to winning -while the top-ranked Senators dress McGrattan every night. They are the same level/quality of player... though I personally think Orr is a better bodychecker-- they are the same speed, and both have the same strenghts and weaknesses.

IMO you guys could have used Orr last night to go chat with some of the Sens (namely McGrattan, Neil) while they were out there throwing the body to no end last night. Just my opinion though.
While it might seem strange--and you would know more about Colton than we would having seen him more often--the Rangers find themselves these days in a very unfamiliar position of being a contender for a playoff spot. Not a lock for it (at least IMO) but looking like maybe a serious contender for the postseason. Keeping this in mind what kind of lineup should you dress for possibly the best team in the league--at least the best in the east? Most would play the best lineup possible. Now it's obvious that Renney screwed up royally by starting Weekes. In any case it's too late to rectify a flat tire of a performance with the insertion or Mr. Orr in yesterday's lineup but even if we had do you really think it would have made a real difference in who won or lost? It's not likely although as you say he might have kept the McGrattan's and Neil's occupied with other things to do. And to be honest with you what the Ranger's squad needs in the toughness dept. is not actually Orr but the aforementioned Neil who is a pretty good player too.

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12-28-2005, 11:24 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by eco's bones
While it might seem strange--and you would know more about Colton than we would having seen him more often--the Rangers find themselves these days in a very unfamiliar position of being a contender for a playoff spot. Not a lock for it (at least IMO) but looking like maybe a serious contender for the postseason. Keeping this in mind what kind of lineup should you dress for possibly the best team in the league--at least the best in the east? Most would play the best lineup possible. Now it's obvious that Renney screwed up royally by starting Weekes. In any case it's too late to rectify a flat tire of a performance with the insertion or Mr. Orr in yesterday's lineup but even if we had do you really think it would have made a real difference in who won or lost? It's not likely although as you say he might have kept the McGrattan's and Neil's occupied with other things to do. And to be honest with you what the Ranger's squad needs in the toughness dept. is not actually Orr but the aforementioned Neil who is a pretty good player too.
Some good points - I do know that a team establishing physical dominance over another can directly effect the outcome of the game. IMO -Orr could have helped the Rangers out while the Sens physically dominated the game. I know that most every team in the league would kill to have the Neil of 05...he is a HUGE physical presence out there most every game that I have seen him. Against Boston (with Orr in the lineup) he was invisible... happy to fight sissy-girl-Gill... but just as happy to duck Orr.

To answer your question more directly... I don't think dressing the best player and dressing the best line-up are neccesarily the same thing.
The Sens have a handful of guys who are better players then McGrattan -yet they are in the minors and McGratt's plays every game for them. Why? They believe he brings more of an impact and intangibles then some guy who could skate circles around him. How is the best team in the East able to do this -yet the new-found-contender Rangers are not?

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12-28-2005, 11:33 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Colt.45Orr
I didn't see all of the game last night.. but the Sens sure took it to you guys physically...

Senators: 33hits
Rangers: 16 hits...

You guys looked like a bunch of wilting daisies out there at times. Neil (6) hits was going out there running guys with nobody to come over and say "Hey Neilsie... next hit you throw on one of our guys I'm coming looking for you"

It is amusing how some of you view Orr as such a liability and hinderance to winning -while the top-ranked Senators dress McGrattan every night. They are the same level/quality of player... though I personally think Orr is a better bodychecker-- they are the same speed, and both have the same strenghts and weaknesses.

IMO you guys could have used Orr last night to go chat with some of the Sens (namely McGrattan, Neil) while they were out there throwing the body to no end last night. Just my opinion though.
Wow your taking the words right out of my mouth. If only my fellow Ranger fans listened or ever agreed with me. I believe I say this every game. McGrattan plays every game, Fedoruk does, Boogard does, Ott does, Laraque does, Janssen now does, Godard does, Lacoutre does. I think Orr brings alot more to the table for this hockey team than Rucchin, and than Hossa. Hence, he should be in there every night like all these other teams.

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Old
12-28-2005, 11:38 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Colt.45Orr
Against Boston (with Orr in the lineup) he was invisible... happy to fight sissy-girl-Gill... but just as happy to duck Orr.
In case anyone thinks I am making this up... in the only game that Boston had Orr vs. Ottawa --McGrattan and Neil combined for 0 hits.

Vs. the Sissified Rangers last game they combined for 10 hits.

You do the math.

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12-28-2005, 11:43 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Colt.45Orr
In case anyone thinks I am making this up... in the only game that Boston had Orr vs. Ottawa --McGrattan and Neil combined for 0 hits.

Vs. the Sissified Rangers last game they combined for 10 hits.

You do the math.
Hope Ranger fans start listening to me. No Orr won't change the scoresheet, but he'll change this team. He won't let other teams face us and freely come and intimidate us, bang us around, and have their way with us. Sure we were losing these past 7 years, but no one messed with NYR. They had Sandy, Simon, Barnaby, Purinton (eww...but he worked), Langdon. The reason they lost was because they stacked a bunch of veterans who all thought they were Gretzky. The Rangers have to get that attitude back around here. They gotta be confident, tough, and mean every game. Can't let teams come into a game not nervous and all ready to eat you apart

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12-28-2005, 12:37 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by True Blue Bleed Blue
Hope Ranger fans start listening to me. No Orr won't change the scoresheet, but he'll change this team. He won't let other teams face us and freely come and intimidate us, bang us around, and have their way with us. Sure we were losing these past 7 years, but no one messed with NYR. They had Sandy, Simon, Barnaby, Purinton (eww...but he worked), Langdon. The reason they lost was because they stacked a bunch of veterans who all thought they were Gretzky. The Rangers have to get that attitude back around here. They gotta be confident, tough, and mean every game. Can't let teams come into a game not nervous and all ready to eat you apart
Ranger fans don't have to listen to you--we don't run the team or make out the lineups. Tom Renney is the one who does that and he has not been interested in dressing Orr regularly to this point.

Also, I doubt there are many Ranger fans who would agree with your argument that "no one messed with" the Rangers in the past because of tough players. Yes, the players you mention were willing, but--with the exception of last season when Barnaby and Simon played together--rarely were effective in "protecting" anyone, much less changing the course of the game. Teams need toughness--players willing to take the body and work in the corners--throughout the lineup to be effective. Having one or two players who play at best marginal roles is not going to have a major effect you seem to think they would have.

In the end, it all comes back to the Powers That Be. Sather and Renney have put together a team that relies on finesse. You may not like it, but that's the philosophy the organization has and I doubt that it will change in the near future. Regardless of whether Orr is regularly in the lineup or not.

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12-28-2005, 12:55 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Brooklyn Ranger
Ranger fans don't have to listen to you--we don't run the team or make out the lineups. Tom Renney is the one who does that and he has not been interested in dressing Orr regularly to this point.

Also, I doubt there are many Ranger fans who would agree with your argument that "no one messed with" the Rangers in the past because of tough players. Yes, the players you mention were willing, but--with the exception of last season when Barnaby and Simon played together--rarely were effective in "protecting" anyone, much less changing the course of the game. Teams need toughness--players willing to take the body and work in the corners--throughout the lineup to be effective. Having one or two players who play at best marginal roles is not going to have a major effect you seem to think they would have.

In the end, it all comes back to the Powers That Be. Sather and Renney have put together a team that relies on finesse. You may not like it, but that's the philosophy the organization has and I doubt that it will change in the near future. Regardless of whether Orr is regularly in the lineup or not.
Well, I hope you enjoy this "finesse" team that doesn't protect its players, doesn't play physical, let's the opposition injure it's star player in Jagr. I know were in the era of the "NEW" NHL, but hockey will always be a physical and tough game and with no one in your lineup to defend your guys and intimidate the other team your usually not gonna get anywhere. You don't have many teams out there that don't dress a big, tough, intimidating enforcer nightly. The Rangers may be the only team.

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Old
12-28-2005, 01:00 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue Bleed Blue
Well, I hope you enjoy this "finesse" team that doesn't protect its players, doesn't play physical, let's the opposition injure it's star player in Jagr. I know were in the era of the "NEW" NHL, but hockey will always be a physical and tough game and with no one in your lineup to defend your guys and intimidate the other team your usually not gonna get anywhere. You don't have many teams out there that don't dress a big, tough, intimidating enforcer nightly. The Rangers may be the only team.

All right, lets move on. You've made this same point ad nauseum.

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12-28-2005, 01:06 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway
All right, lets move on. You've made this same point ad nauseum.
People keep giving me reasons why it's false, I'm just trying to make it as clear as possible

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Old
12-28-2005, 01:14 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by True Blue Bleed Blue
People keep giving me reasons why it's false, I'm just trying to make it as clear as possible
People have the right to disagree with your opinion. And you have the right to disagree with other people's opinion.

But I am not going to let every thread have posts by you that say:

1) Orr should play.

2) The Rangers are too soft.

3) Everyone should listen to me.

Stop hijacking threads.

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