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The KHL Discuss the Continental Hockey League (Kontinentalnaya Hokkeynaya Liga).

KHL Expansion Part VII

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Old
04-25-2016, 09:21 AM
  #76
kabidjan18
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Originally Posted by Urbanskog View Post
I don't think that attendance would be a problem, hockey is the sport in Belarus in the end. I'd like the second Belarusian team to be based in another city (maybe Gomel?) but I don't think that they have adequate facilities outside Minsk.
Well the Belarus NT no doubt needs a second KHL team, because having only one KHL team and no reputable domestic league has stunted their growth.

The money would need to come from somewhere...more KHL teams means more competition for free agents which results in a raise of import salaries. It's way too late to start next year, maybe looking into the future, but I don't think Belarus is a country Russia is eager to expand into either.

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04-25-2016, 09:22 AM
  #77
Arlus
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Originally Posted by Urbanskog View Post
I don't think that attendance would be a problem, hockey is the sport in Belarus in the end. I'd like the second Belarusian team to be based in another city (maybe Gomel?) but I don't think that they have adequate facilities outside Minsk.
This is what I said. Gomel could be a solid option outside Minsk, being their second city in terms of population; they have a team in their top division, but but from what I know their current arena can't host 5.000 spectators (and this is just one of the aspects).

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04-25-2016, 09:40 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by kabidjan18 View Post
Well the Belarus NT no doubt needs a second KHL team, because having only one KHL team and no reputable domestic league has stunted their growth.

The money would need to come from somewhere...more KHL teams means more competition for free agents which results in a raise of import salaries. It's way too late to start next year, maybe looking into the future, but I don't think Belarus is a country Russia is eager to expand into either.
Since Dinamo is state-funded, I would imagine the second Belarusian KHL team to be the same way.

But if Lukashenko does want this to happen, he can just order the construction of a new arena.

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04-25-2016, 11:54 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Urbanskog View Post
Since Dinamo is state-funded, I would imagine the second Belarusian KHL team to be the same way.

But if Lukashenko does want this to happen, he can just order the construction of a new arena.
Lol, I'm not very fond of that. I'm not sure that player salaries are a very popular choice for taxpayer money destinations in Belarus.

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04-25-2016, 02:18 PM
  #80
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I have followed this KHL expansion thread for years, and I finally felt that had to create an account, and tell all non-Swedes that there are people in Sweden who follows KHL, and really would like to see a Swedish team in KHL.

I followed what happened with the Crowns, and was so disappointed when I was watching the press conference and understood that they were not team I'm waiting for.

To me, a game between the Crowns and Vladivostok would be a lot more exiting than a game between Rögle and Karlskrona.

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04-25-2016, 03:35 PM
  #81
Urbanskog
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Do all Swedish KHL fans reside in Västerås? Maybe that should be the hometown of a potential Swedish KHL team.

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04-26-2016, 12:12 AM
  #82
Salavat Yulaev
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Originally Posted by Swedish KHL fan View Post
I have followed this KHL expansion thread for years, and I finally felt that had to create an account, and tell all non-Swedes that there are people in Sweden who follows KHL, and really would like to see a Swedish team in KHL.

I followed what happened with the Crowns, and was so disappointed when I was watching the press conference and understood that they were not team I'm waiting for.

To me, a game between the Crowns and Vladivostok would be a lot more exiting than a game between Rögle and Karlskrona.
Could you tell us what did Sweden KHL fans like you expect from the Crowns?

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04-26-2016, 02:03 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Urbanskog View Post
Do all Swedish KHL fans reside in Västerås? Maybe that should be the hometown of a potential Swedish KHL team.
Perhaps that's why the board has made the team bankrupt and are about to fold/move down one league

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Old
04-26-2016, 05:50 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Swedish KHL fan View Post
I have followed this KHL expansion thread for years, and I finally felt that had to create an account, and tell all non-Swedes that there are people in Sweden who follows KHL, and really would like to see a Swedish team in KHL.

I followed what happened with the Crowns, and was so disappointed when I was watching the press conference and understood that they were not team I'm waiting for.

To me, a game between the Crowns and Vladivostok would be a lot more exiting than a game between Rögle and Karlskrona.
Welcome on board!

In this matter I fully agree. Worse is that they are not playing only once, or twice, but 4 times!!!
At the end, maybe for these two clubs is alright, but if I'll be a Skelleftea fan, I would say that 4 matches against these is too much, and I would rather watch them against other teams.


Last edited by Arlus: 04-26-2016 at 06:00 AM.
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Old
04-26-2016, 07:22 AM
  #85
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Welcome on board!

In this matter I fully agree. Worse is that they are not playing only once, or twice, but 4 times!!!
At the end, maybe for these two clubs is alright, but if I'll be a Skelleftea fan, I would say that 4 matches against these is too much, and I would rather watch them against other teams.
Well, I bet Malmö supporters are happy to have Rögle in the series.

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04-26-2016, 08:18 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Slimmy View Post
Well, I bet Malmö supporters are happy to have Rögle in the series.
I could say that I'll bet on Skelleftea fans not being happy to play them 4 times, but this is not the point. Anytime, a Skelleftea vs Lulea will generate more interest, than Skelleftea vs Rogle... and the past season they've played 4 matches against Rogle and 4 against Lulea.

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04-26-2016, 08:37 AM
  #87
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Just like Skellfteå vs Rögle will generate more interest than Skellefteå vs HC Sochi

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04-26-2016, 09:07 AM
  #88
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Just like Skellfteå vs Rögle will generate more interest than Skellefteå vs HC Sochi
I wasn't speculating in my post about this. It's very easy for me to say the contrary.

Skelleftea vs Rogle, total attendance: 8277
Skelleftea vs Lulea, total attendance: 11438

Official numbers combining two home matches in the past regular season for Skelleftea.

Of course, the number of spectators is just one aspect and not the full picture.

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04-26-2016, 09:26 AM
  #89
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I will quote basketball officer but the following words apply to euro hockey (federations and domestic leagues) too.

I see "a mentality from 70s" in euro hockey (domestic leagues/federations/CHL)

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04-26-2016, 09:32 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by vorky View Post
I will quote basketball officer but the following words apply to euro hockey (federations and domestic leagues) too.


I see "a mentality from 70s" in euro hockey (domestic leagues/federations/CHL)
While the current sheetstorm going on between FIBA and Euroleague is similar to what we in hockey, there is an important distinction: While the said foundations & organizations are international competitions, KHL is supposed to be a one-league. I don't know how to say that... For example, when you play in Euroleague, you don't have to leave anywhere. You can also compete in your domestic league. On the other hand, you can't keep playing in Sweden if you are to join KHL. So while the basketball part has "alternative leagues", KHL does not. This is a big problem. I am sure some Swedish teams would be eager to join KHL if this was the case, but it's not. Joining KHL means losing local market. In Euroleague, it means increasing revenues. Totally different directions.

Things are really tough when it comes to expansion. I sincerely believe KHL should stop pushing so aggressively and just keep being a Eurasian league. Post-USSR states, China, maybe one or two teams from Scandinavia and eastern Europe and that's it. Central Europe and Asian steppes are two different worlds and obviously, hockey fans are not interested in each other. Just be happy with Minsk, Astana, Omsk etc.

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04-26-2016, 09:40 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Arlus View Post
I wasn't speculating in my post about this. It's very easy for me to say the contrary.

Skelleftea vs Rogle, total attendance: 8277
Skelleftea vs Lulea, total attendance: 11438

Official numbers combining two home matches in the past regular season for Skelleftea.

Of course, the number of spectators is just one aspect and not the full picture.
It's a lot father to travel from Rögle (Skåne) to Skellefteå than from Luleå to Skellefteå. Not a whole lot of away supporters willing to make that trip. Add to that Luleå and Skellefteå has a natural rivalry as they are both situated in Norrland.
It's 131 km drive to Skellefteå from Luleå. Compare that to 1311 km drive from Ängelholm. That's not really something that speaks in the KHL's favour. It was a poor example if you ask me.

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04-26-2016, 09:44 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by hansomreiste View Post
While the current sheetstorm going on between FIBA and Euroleague is similar to what we in hockey, there is an important distinction: While the said foundations & organizations are international competitions, KHL is supposed to be a one-league. I don't know how to say that... For example, when you play in Euroleague, you don't have to leave anywhere. You can also compete in your domestic league. On the other hand, you can't keep playing in Sweden if you are to join KHL. So while the basketball part has "alternative leagues", KHL does not. This is a big problem. I am sure some Swedish teams would be eager to join KHL if this was the case, but it's not. Joining KHL means losing local market. In Euroleague, it means increasing revenues. Totally different directions.

Things are really tough when it comes to expansion. I sincerely believe KHL should stop pushing so aggressively and just keep being a Eurasian league. Post-USSR states, China, maybe one or two teams from Scandinavia and eastern Europe and that's it. Central Europe and Asian steppes are two different worlds and obviously, hockey fans are not interested in each other. Just be happy with Minsk, Astana, Omsk etc.
I am talking about MENTALITY. Hockey federations/FIBA think that there is nothing else than domestic leagues and NT has priority. KHL/Euroleague say that there should be competitions for elite clubs and clubs are more than NT.

De facto (and maybe de iure too, but I would wait for EU courts decision), national hockey/basket federation forbid clubs to participate in other league (Euroleague/KHL) and force them to play in a competition which federations prefer (Basket Champions League/CHL).

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04-26-2016, 09:54 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by vorky View Post
I am talking about MENTALITY. Hockey federations/FIBA think that there is nothing else than domestic leagues and NT has priority. KHL/Euroleague say that there should be competitions for elite clubs and clubs are more than NT.

De facto (and maybe de iure too, but I would wait for EU courts decision), national hockey/basket federation forbid clubs to participate in other league (Euroleague/KHL) and force them to play in a competition which federations prefer (Basket Champions League/CHL).
You got it all wrong. Clubs in Europe are looking to expand outwards and see it as a necessity for growth. That is also why Frölunda along with other clubs created the CHL. That's the road they chose to grow as hockey clubs. You might not agree with that choice but to say that they are stuck in their ways and have no ambitions is simply false.

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04-26-2016, 10:02 AM
  #94
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You got it all wrong. Clubs in Europe are looking to expand outwards and see it as a necessity for growth. That is also why Frölunda along with other clubs created the CHL. That's the road they chose to grow as hockey clubs. You might not agree with that choice but to say that they are stuck in their ways and have no ambitions is simply false.
CHL is dead project from the beginning - look at people who are behind, look at mentality ("everyone" idea), are not able to attract best clubs from Europe (KHL). etc etc

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04-26-2016, 10:08 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by vorky View Post
CHL is dead project from the beginning - look at people who are behind, look at mentality ("everyone" idea), are not able to attract best clubs from Europe (KHL). etc etc
Whatever criticism you have of the CHL is another matter. Point is, though, they have ambitions and they are looking to grow and that's the road they chose.

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04-26-2016, 10:16 AM
  #96
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Whatever criticism you have of the CHL is another matter. Point is, though, they have ambitions and they are looking to grow and that's the road they chose.
Ok, maybe I am harsh on you, sorry, I thought you are another CHL lover.

I consider CHL as counter project to KHL, nothing more. I give you another example from basketball to compare hockey/basket.

Euro hockey federations did the same.

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04-26-2016, 10:22 AM
  #97
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It's a lot father to travel from Rögle (Skåne) to Skellefteå than from Luleå to Skellefteå. Not a whole lot of away supporters willing to make that trip. Add to that Luleå and Skellefteå has a natural rivalry as they are both situated in Norrland.
It's 131 km drive to Skellefteå from Luleå. Compare that to 1311 km drive from Ängelholm. That's not really something that speaks in the KHL's favour. It was a poor example if you ask me.
It was an example based on the comparison with Malmo - Angelholm (Rogle)... with a distance between two cities even shorter.

Where have you seen any mention of KHL in my post about this?!?

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04-26-2016, 10:29 AM
  #98
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It was an example based on the comparison with Malmo - Angelholm (Rogle)... with a distance between two cities even shorter.

Where have you seen any mention of KHL in my post about this?!?
I'm sorry. What was your initial post regarding? I assumed that it was in agreement that KHL would offer more interesting games for Swedish teams. Maybe your point was to have a closed league where teams such as Rögle and Karlskrona would be prohibited from competing?

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04-26-2016, 10:39 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by vorky View Post
Ok, maybe I am harsh on you, sorry, I thought you are another CHL lover.

I consider CHL as counter project to KHL, nothing more. I give you another example from basketball to compare hockey/basket.

Euro hockey federations did the same.
It is a poor tentative, but in this format is hard for the clubs to gain something from it.

I think 'the battle' is between clubs and federations. Even in KHL, they need to comply with what's the federation interest (developing players and NT), see the season schedule, the rule for foreign players, while the clubs will want more matches, bigger revenues. The thing is that as long as most of the KHL clubs are funded with money from the state, it is hard to act as an independent.

In Europe, could be different, as you don't have the state funding the teams and it's surprising for me that the clubs with an interest for higher revenues aren't doing something concrete to create such a competition.

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04-26-2016, 10:49 AM
  #100
Urbanskog
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Perhaps that's why the board has made the team bankrupt and are about to fold/move down one league
Oh well, I didn't know that they went bankrupt as well.

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