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Staal Voted Defenseman of the Tournament!

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01-06-2006, 04:00 PM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
is always hit or miss. Seeing the guy play in an NHL camp, watching him progress at the junior level, and watching him play well in the WJCs are stepping stones and takes out a bit of risk. There's no guarantee he's going to be an NHL superstar, but one should feel better at how he's progressing, and there is no reason to get excited over progressing.

This is not much different than your statement 'Rangers are a good team, a playoff team'...they haven't made the playoffs yet - so by your logic, how can you really make that statement? Just as you project that, others will project Staal to be something... And of course in life (or business) without projection, most of the companies traded on exchanges would be valued at zero.
I'll be honest, I've read your post a few times and I dont really understand it. the "one should feel better at how he's progressing, and there is no reason to get excited over progressing." was particularly confusing. Most of my last few posts were in jest. I dont know if you understand my stance, so I'll clarify.

I enjoy making projections. Thats part of the fun. Last I checked I have no say over what happens in the Rangers organization, regardless of whether I'm optimistic, pessimistic or realistic. The draft has always been one of my favorite parts of anything sports related, fantasy or in real life. I enjoy following young guys progress, and projecting how they will turn out. This goes for the Rangers, and a few other organizations that I've followed either through rebuilds or from expansion. Sometimes I'm right, sometimes I'm wrong. Since it doesnt effect the Rangers one way or the other what I think, and since I dont try to force my opinions on anyone, I dont really see the harm.

Now if you are the Rangers Organization shouldnt get excited, thats fine. Their decisions are the ones that count, and if they F up, well, it certainly makes watching games less fun.

As for the Rangers making the playoffs, yeah I think they will. Am I being optimistic? Maybe. But I've had to sit through the same torturous seven years as everyone here, and this is finally a team I enjoy watching. I think they can do it, and I'm not going to sit here, watching game and expecting them to fall apart, just so I wont be dissapointed if they dont make it.

In the end, we are all here because we enjoy hockey and love the Rangers. And if someone wants to get excited over our first rounder getting named top defender in the WJC, who the **** am I to tell him he shouldnt? This is, afterall only a game for us. Unless my cut of the Rangers profits have been lost in the mail all these years, in that case, Staal better turn out to be the next Brian Leetch.

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01-06-2006, 04:03 PM
  #52
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Dedakus, I think you misunderstand until the end. I do think they're better, and clearly better. However saying the difference between the two teams are clear after talking about the game made it sound like you meant based on yesterday. I think you're putting too much emphasis on their 1 goal win, because the Rangers aren't the Rangers without Lundqvist and we would've beaten them with him in their most likely (if he had a typical Lundqvist game, or at least if it went into OT he wouldn't have lost the game in 7 seconds), so I still go by what I say yesterday didn't prove the superiority of Flyers. I always thought that the Flyers were superior but that's just a sports fact. Look at the 2 rosters. I just felt like using a good game against them to prove that, was pessimistic.

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01-06-2006, 04:19 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balej's Dance
Don't forget about Jan Go, he's been instrumental in getting us some players as well.
Absolutely. Marek and Prucha especially.

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01-06-2006, 04:25 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRGoalieGlut
Dedakus, I think ......



Sorry, that name is too funny to pass up....

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01-06-2006, 04:28 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13


Sorry, that name is too funny to pass up....

Is Dedakus some sexual term I'm not aware of? Anyway, the "k" is near the "L" on the keyboard so not a tough mistake to make.

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01-06-2006, 04:36 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRGoalieGlut
Is Dedakus some sexual term I'm not aware of? Anyway, the "k" is near the "L" on the keyboard so not a tough mistake to make.

Dedakus is just funny to me, thought you called Dedalus Jim Backus

I'm just havin' fun, it's Friday and i've got a bit of a fever as well

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01-06-2006, 04:45 PM
  #57
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I find it hard to believe that anyone actually watching the WJC didn't come away with a higher opinion of Marc Staal than they originally had. Unless you see this kid on a daily basis, you're going to be pleasantly surprised. His reputation was exceeded by his play.

Now, this is by no means a guarantee, and that isn't what "get excited" means. Why is it that fans, coaches and staff can't get excited about a non-superstar? This guy isn't the next Bobby Orr, not even the next Leetch - but - he looks to be a solid eraser back on the blueline. A defenseman that we can play against the opponents big line who will shut them down physically and psychologically. He's not just a one-dimensional player, either. He's known for the defense, but he's perfectly capable of jumping into the play, finding an open man for the long-bomb pass, or just playing it smartly out of his zone. To me, that is worth being - at the very least optimistic about.


Last edited by BigE: 01-06-2006 at 04:51 PM.
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01-06-2006, 05:02 PM
  #58
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Now, this is by no means a guarantee, and that isn't what "get excited" means. Why is it that fans, coaches and staff can't get excited about a non-superstar? This guy isn't the next Bobby Orr, not even the next Leetch - but - he looks to be a solid eraser back on the blueline. A defenseman that we can play against the opponents big line who will shut them down physically and psychologically. He's not just a one-dimensional player, either. He's known for the defense, but he's perfectly capable of jumping into the play, finding an open man for the long-bomb pass, or just playing it smartly out of his zone. To me, that is worth being - at the very least optimistic about.


He will probably be what DEFENCE what OFFENCE is to his older brother. He will never be a high scoring dman, but a shut your #1 line down dman. Probably about a +5 and a hell pf a defender.

Best ever points:

2014 - 11 goals - 27 assists

Possible Norris trophy winner (Altough Pitkanen might have something to say abought that)

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01-06-2006, 05:40 PM
  #59
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Are you one of those fans that go by

Quote:
Originally Posted by dakose
Other than Lundqvist and Staal the Rangers do not have any legit players for the future. Staal impressed me so much in training camp this year I think it is almost certain he will make the club next year, and make an impact at that. I think he will be able to win a couple of more games with someone legit at defense.

EDIT: What does HF have to say about Staal? I am sure if they did current rankings, Staal would definitley be near top of the list. I mean, he was ranked by some teams to go 3rd in the draft, no?
what HF, TSN or the holy grail THN says? Is that how you judge talent? Tyutin, is he bad? Montoya? You know both Prucha and Lundqvist were even on the radar when they were drafted. I hear NJ is hard up for fans.

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01-06-2006, 05:51 PM
  #60
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How are they different issues?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus
Actually I said it doesn't guarantee an NHL career. Is your whining here claiming that it does?

In any case, why wouldn't we be excited? I am. But being excited about Staal doesn't prove that Sather is a competent GM because he drafted four players who made it to this year's WJC. Two different issues but if you'd like to discuss Sather again, feel free to start a thread. I'll be happy to contribute.
If that dope sather didn't draft them we couldn't be excited about them because they wouldn't be ours they would be some other team's!

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01-06-2006, 06:33 PM
  #61
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Actually I

Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
Do you just make up this crap as you go along?
read it in THN!

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01-06-2006, 06:35 PM
  #62
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I would be interested in hearing from any fans in canada

Quote:
Originally Posted by aqsw
Now, this is by no means a guarantee, and that isn't what "get excited" means. Why is it that fans, coaches and staff can't get excited about a non-superstar? This guy isn't the next Bobby Orr, not even the next Leetch - but - he looks to be a solid eraser back on the blueline. A defenseman that we can play against the opponents big line who will shut them down physically and psychologically. He's not just a one-dimensional player, either. He's known for the defense, but he's perfectly capable of jumping into the play, finding an open man for the long-bomb pass, or just playing it smartly out of his zone. To me, that is worth being - at the very least optimistic about.


He will probably be what DEFENCE what OFFENCE is to his older brother. He will never be a high scoring dman, but a shut your #1 line down dman. Probably about a +5 and a hell pf a defender.

Best ever points:

2014 - 11 goals - 27 assists

Possible Norris trophy winner (Altough Pitkanen might have something to say abought that)
that had seen Larry Robinson play Jrs at this age. I did and Staal reminds me of a young Larry Robinson. Robinson types are OK with me. You build championship teams with them.

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01-06-2006, 06:43 PM
  #63
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How dare you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthSather99
I agree that Clarke is one of the best GM's or has the best scouts. Probably a combination of both. One thing that Clarke has been doing lately is trading away players for high draft picks. He then uses those picks to trade up or select talent they believe will make the NHL. Of those players mentioned, most have been drafted within the last few years. That could be us soon. I believe Montoya, Korpikoski, Staal, Sauer, Dubinsky and eventually Jessiman will make a great core of solid young players. Another good draft will make our future even brighter. I think Maloney and others within our organization know which young players to target. I think Scout Tim Murray will be a great addition to the upcoming draft.
That would mean that Sather knows what he is doing and the great Deadlus would be wrong! selecting the proper personnel plays no role, none what so ever. Players doing well in the minors or Jrs means nothing, zero. Whether they are League, Conference AllStars, MVPs, or just plain outstanding players has no bearing on their development and their path to the NHL. They just magically appear one day on your roster.

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01-06-2006, 06:50 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
what HF, TSN or the holy grail THN says? Is that how you judge talent? Tyutin, is he bad? Montoya? You know both Prucha and Lundqvist were even on the radar when they were drafted. I hear NJ is hard up for fans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
read it in THN!
You can't have it both ways. If you're gonna run around with a stick up your ***, don't make this type of contradiction. You don't look too bright...

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Old
01-06-2006, 06:51 PM
  #65
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The Korpedo had 1G & 5A

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skroob
sounds like Korpikoski did well, too.
he had 2 primary assist in the win over the USA in the Bronze game. But I would get excited about him, none of the guys he played against are in the NHL and few who played in the most Prestigious U20 Tournament will play in the NHL. Just because a player gets selected to play on a National Team or even does well is nothing to go crazy over. It is not an indication of how that player will project in the NHL as these are only his peers that he is playing against and its not like these guys that play in this tournament will ever play in the NHL, let alone be good players or stars even. We all know that these things are all political.

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01-06-2006, 07:13 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
If that dope sather didn't draft them we couldn't be excited about them because they wouldn't be ours they would be some other team's!
One is an assessment of Staal. The other is an assessment of Sather. I didn't think it should be that tough to figure out, unless your claim is that a single player makes the reputation of a GM. We can be excited about Staal and Sather can still be a failure.

And while I'm pleased you took the time to respond to part of my post, I'm wondering why you've ignored the question I posed. If you don't like the way I phrased it, you might consider answering Melrose's version.

Or you may keep running from it. I think many of us have come to expect that from you anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
If that dope sather didn't draft them we couldn't be excited about them because they wouldn't be ours they would be some other team's!
Of course but being excited about a WJC performance does not reflect on Sather's ability as a GM. You commented on Sather's ability as GM of the Rangers, I responded to that. If you can answer my or Melrose's question you will begin to connect the two issues.

Care to give it a shot?

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01-06-2006, 07:15 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRGoalieGlut
I just felt like using a good game against them to prove that, was pessimistic.
Fair enough. I would call it realistic; you would call it pessimistic.

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01-06-2006, 07:25 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
But I would get excited about him, none of the guys he played against are in the NHL and few who played in the most Prestigious U20 Tournament will play in the NHL. Just because a player gets selected to play on a National Team or even does well is nothing to go crazy over.
Wheeeeeeew! Did I ever get YOUR panties in a twist!

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01-06-2006, 07:30 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balej's Dance
I hate to say it but this team is one of the most poorly constructed, or maybe most unlikeable, team I've ever seen. If we didn't have our 3rd-4th lines, Prucha, Jagr and Lundqvist, I shudder to think of what we'd see.

IMO there's just something about the team still that I hate.
I think that would be the defense, given the fact that you seem to like 8/12 of the forwards and the goalie. Can't say I blame you too much, but outside of Roszival and (to a lesser extent, recently atleast) Poti, the defense is very likeable in my opinion.

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01-06-2006, 08:03 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balej's Dance
I hate to say it but this team is one of the most poorly constructed, or maybe most unlikeable, team I've ever seen. If we didn't have our 3rd-4th lines, Prucha, Jagr and Lundqvist, I shudder to think of what we'd see.

IMO there's just something about the team still that I hate.
It's probably because this team, win or lose, just doesn't seem overly passionate out there.

The skill from some guys is immense but something about the team seems to be lacking and it feels like heart and soul.

At times everything felt so mechanical and like it was coming almost too easy.

Despite the success, I've never really felt connected with this team. I think part of it is a lot of new faces or faces that don't really feel like the Rangers. Some of these guys aren't here for the long haul and so it's hard to get behind a Straka or Nylander or Rucinsky.

I think people have fallen in love with Prucha, Lundqvist, etc. But a lot of these team seems almost like it doesn't care.

There are a lot of guys who float out there.

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01-06-2006, 08:06 PM
  #71
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Not really surprised by the performance. My opinion of Staal is that he still projects as a very solid-two way defender.

I think he could play a very long time in the NHL, though I personally still don't think he'll be a star.

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01-06-2006, 08:32 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge
It's probably because this team, win or lose, just doesn't seem overly passionate out there.

The skill from some guys is immense but something about the team seems to be lacking and it feels like heart and soul.

At times everything felt so mechanical and like it was coming almost too easy.

Despite the success, I've never really felt connected with this team. I think part of it is a lot of new faces or faces that don't really feel like the Rangers. Some of these guys aren't here for the long haul and so it's hard to get behind a Straka or Nylander or Rucinsky.

I think people have fallen in love with Prucha, Lundqvist, etc. But a lot of these team seems almost like it doesn't care.

There are a lot of guys who float out there.
Agreed. Thats why its so easy to fall in love with Hollweg, Ortmeyer, Prucha. They're passionate and seem like they'll have longevity.

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Old
01-07-2006, 05:57 AM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Leetch_94
Well, Staal either plays in the NHL or OHL next season. He's only 18, you have to be 20 to play in the AHL.
I never understud that rule. Is there realy any reason for that rule that makes sence?

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01-07-2006, 09:33 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RANGER#11
I never understud that rule. Is there realy any reason for that rule that makes sence?
It's to protect junior hockey. The feeling is that teams would pull many of their prospects (not just the obvious ones who have outgrown the CHL) and send them to the AHL if given a chance. It's frustrating when it comes to players like Staal who can step up a level in competition, but IMO the rule works pretty well overall.

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