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Old
10-19-2003, 09:00 PM
  #26
choppystride
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I also agree that Weiss is too big of quesition mark. I find it disturbing that after playing 77 games last year, he gets farmed out when other kids are sticking with the big club. I know Keenan is known to mess around with his players but he's always had pretty good read on kids.

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10-19-2003, 09:11 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
I think the popular sentiment is that Fla just got Van Ryn last season and they're not likely to give him up just yet.

I'd take Van Ryn over Mezei in a heartbeat.

I also prefer for the trade to be done without Rita being involved. Add whomever else you want from the farm, but keep Jani out of it.
I prefer the later too but I think Van Ryn is probably a little jerk and won't stay long(Florida is his third team and played in 74NHL games) while Mezei is probably longer term and better team player/well liked. U know how Comrie extorted all that money on his first signing from us because of that loop-hole who do u think that was named after?

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Old
10-19-2003, 09:22 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FacelessButcher
U know how Comrie extorted all that money on his first signing from us because of that loop-hole who do u think that was named after?
Busted! I totally forgot about that.

I think V-R will be a very good player in this league though, he was all-world in the wjc's the year he was captain.

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Old
10-19-2003, 09:36 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FacelessButcher
I prefer the later too but I think Van Ryn is probably a little jerk and won't stay long(Florida is his third team and played in 74NHL games) while Mezei is probably longer term and better team player/well liked. U know how Comrie extorted all that money on his first signing from us because of that loop-hole who do u think that was named after?
Oh just gimme a break.....

From your logic I guess the biggest jerk of them all is Joe Thornton who started this rookie bonus extortion thing...

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Old
10-19-2003, 09:47 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by choppystride
Oh just gimme a break.....

From your logic I guess the biggest jerk of them all is Joe Thornton who started this rookie bonus extortion thing...
That's totally seperate.

The loop hole was for drafted players who switched from American college to major junior. Instead of re-entering the draft like a chl player would they became unrestricted free agents which made it much more attractive for them to not sign with the team that drafted them.

Bonus clauses for non-ufa players aren't nearly as lethal because they're not negotiated on the open market.

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10-19-2003, 09:48 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
I think the popular sentiment is that Fla just got Van Ryn last season and they're not likely to give him up just yet.

I'd take Van Ryn over Mezei in a heartbeat.

I also prefer for the trade to be done without Rita being involved. Add whomever else you want from the farm, but keep Jani out of it.
The only way you include Rita with Comrie is if you are going after a young player who is has real potential to be a top pair dman or a bigger top line center. Somebody like Ruutu, Pitkanen or Legwand fit the bill for me - but you need patience and a desperate GM to pull this kind of trade off though and even then its unlikely.

Most of the guys mentioned in Comrie trades are pretty uninteresting as they won't make the team dramatically better - Van Ryn, Merzei, Weiss, Savard etc etc etc yawn yawn yawn. Maybe Stefan could be useful - but that's the best of the "realistic" trades rumored recently.

I don't know though - Blackburn for Comrie straight up still sounds like a fair deal for me. We get a potential top 5 goalie and NYR get a young center to play with Holik next year (Lindros, Mess and maybe even Nedved are all probably gone next year).

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Old
10-19-2003, 10:10 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
That's totally seperate.

The loop hole was for drafted players who switched from American college to major junior. Instead of re-entering the draft like a chl player would they became unrestricted free agents which made it much more attractive for them to not sign with the team that drafted them.

Bonus clauses for non-ufa players aren't nearly as lethal because they're not negotiated on the open market.
The technicalities are different. The spirit is pretty much the same.

The owners mistakenly thought they had rookie salaries under control. Apparently they didn't. Thornton's agent was smart enough realize it and made the most of it for his client.

The owners were also not very sharp by letting in this college-to-junior loophole into the CBA. Again, Van Ryn's agent was smart enough to recognize it and made the most of it for his client.

It has nothing to do with being a jerk or not. Just a sharp business decision.

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Old
10-19-2003, 10:17 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by choppystride
Oh just gimme a break.....

From your logic I guess the biggest jerk of them all is Joe Thornton who started this rookie bonus extortion thing...
Drafting someone is a huge investment for any team and can make or break ur team, if a highly touted player u take just decides not to sign with u it can be utterly devestating especially to a young franchise. If all players can just use this loophole and defeats the entire purpose of the draft it just becomes one big free agency bonanza and defeats the counter-balancing measures the league has put in place to make things fairer for all. I've had enough friends who have tried to make it and didn't(no none of them really deserved it) but to actually get the opportunity to play after so many years of hard work and just turn it down in the pursuit of money kind of burns me. I hope the new CBA fixes it because the amount of money they are signing for(Comrie, Fleury) is ridiculous especially when they have proved nothing in the NHL.

P.S. If I was a player and my agent tried to do that to the team that had enough faith in me to draft me I would fire him on the spot. I'd rather play the game I love then get rich.

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Old
10-19-2003, 10:28 PM
  #34
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Speeds, I don't know alot about Krajicek. Wouldn't Edm be giving too much? Just asking. Seems a bit much.
I would do the deal as it sits we move a great prsopect in rita, but get a top end d-prospect and a center to replace comrie i think it works all teh way around

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Old
10-19-2003, 10:47 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FacelessButcher
Drafting someone is a huge investment for any team and can make or break ur team, if a highly touted player u take just decides not to sign with u it can be utterly devestating especially to a young franchise. If all players can just use this loophole and defeats the entire purpose of the draft it just becomes one big free agency bonanza and defeats the counter-balancing measures the league has put in place to make things fairer for all. I've had enough friends who have tried to make it and didn't(no none of them really deserved it) but to actually get the opportunity to play after so many years of hard work and just turn it down in the pursuit of money kind of burns me. I hope the new CBA fixes it because the amount of money they are signing for(Comrie, Fleury) is ridiculous especially when they have proved nothing in the NHL.

P.S. If I was a player and my agent tried to do that to the team that had enough faith in me to draft me I would fire him on the spot. I'd rather play the game I love then get rich.
I would respect you (and any other players) immensely for putting your love of the game ahead of money. At the same time, I wouldn't hold a grudge against someone who tries to make the most for himself financially by playing within the rules.

I guess I'm just a capitalistic pig.

Look, I love the Oilers and I'm frustrated by the salary escalation as anyone. Some of it are the players' fault; some of it are the owners' fault. However, when it comes to the Van Ryn rule, the owners have no one to blame but their own utter their lack of foresight.

I think Comrie has already been unfairly slagged regarding his apparent rookie contract *extortion*. I just hope that if ever Van Ryn (or some other player who also benefited from this loophole) ends up here, he won't get the same treatment.

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Old
10-20-2003, 02:28 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by choppystride
I would respect you (and any other players) immensely for putting your love of the game ahead of money. At the same time, I wouldn't hold a grudge against someone who tries to make the most for himself financially by playing within the rules.

I guess I'm just a capitalistic pig.

Look, I love the Oilers and I'm frustrated by the salary escalation as anyone. Some of it are the players' fault; some of it are the owners' fault. However, when it comes to the Van Ryn rule, the owners have no one to blame but their own utter their lack of foresight.

I think Comrie has already been unfairly slagged regarding his apparent rookie contract *extortion*. I just hope that if ever Van Ryn (or some other player who also benefited from this loophole) ends up here, he won't get the same treatment.
I never made a judgement call on whether or not MVR was right to use the loophole to full advantage, but as a fan of the Oilers I have every right to not like what Mike Comrie did when he signed his contract here.

He's a good Oiler or some good trade bait, I'm 100% behind KLo's judgement on this one whichever one he chooses.

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Old
10-20-2003, 02:41 PM
  #37
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i'd rather see boumeester be pulled out from there

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Old
10-20-2003, 02:52 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by WFHACommish
i'd rather see boumeester be pulled out from there
So you would like to see the oilers without comrie, rita, and hemsky, because that is what it would take to get boumeester from florida

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Old
10-20-2003, 02:56 PM
  #39
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I doubt Comrie could play for Keenan...especially considering his ego and size

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