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Andreychuk HHOF worthy?

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Old
01-12-2006, 07:33 PM
  #26
Birko19
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I honestly think he's a borderline,

He has the numbers to be in the HOF, I mean 600+ goals is a great thing, but at the same time he played a long career, but then again playing a long career is't exactly easy, so I'm going to say yes, Dave barely makes it.

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01-12-2006, 07:48 PM
  #27
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If Neely makes it, so does Dave IMO.

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01-12-2006, 08:17 PM
  #28
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He won't be a first ballot guy, but he'll make it eventually.

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01-12-2006, 08:35 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by missK
Andy = #2 All time LW scorer
No offence to Andreychuk, but it says a lot more about the talent coming from the left wing position than his stature among the game's greats. Same with Luc Robitaille.

It's Bobby Hull, and then a huge drop off to find the next best LW.

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01-12-2006, 09:14 PM
  #30
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Andreychuk is in. Period. His second home was in front of the net shoveling in the garbage, and everyone in the league knew that when he set up there it was harder than hell to move him - and that was true for much of his career.

Mike Gartner had one (count 'em, 1) 50-goal season, one 100-point season (102 points in '84-85 when he was 25), and didn't win a Cup in 19 years. Andreychuk's best season came at the age of 30. Gartner was a 7-time All-Star; Andreychuk went only twice. From 1983-94 (the first 11 years that both played full years in the league together), Gartner (who already had 4 seasons under his belt) had 460 goals and 393 assists for 853 points in 860 games, Andreychuk (who played all of 43 games in '82-83) in the same period: 412 goals, 459 assists, 871 points. In 834 games.

So if you're going to penalize Andreychuk for not making the All-Star game more than twice while ignoring the fact that he has more PP goals than anyone else in NHL history - that's a mighty high bar you're setting, and I can probably use that bar to shoot down several players some of you are sure will be locks for the HHOF.

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01-13-2006, 02:20 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada
Dino Ciccarelli has over 600 career goals, but isn't the HHOF. Ciccarelli was a better player than Andreychuk in their respective primes, IMO. I don't think Dino will get in for at least a few more years.

Andreychuk has the career PP goals record, but not all records are created equally. I'm the biggest Esposito fan you'll ever meet, but until Andreychuk set the record, I had no idea Espo had it. This isn't one of the endearing records that we're going to talk about in 20 years. (Not like Mike Gartner's run of consistency with at least 30 goals in his first 17 non-lockout seasons).

If you would have asked me this question four years ago, I would have unequivocally said "no," from my perspective and HHOF voter perspectives. I still say no, but not as emphatically. To me, the HHOF should be reserved for the truly elite, the truly special or the truly distinctive. I don't equate Andreychuk as any of those, and the 2004 Cup win notwithstanding, his playoff track record isn't exactly spell-binding.

But his tenure in Tampa is going to change a lot of opinions. No player did more as a leader than Andreychuk from 2002-2004. Tampa Bay was a fractured, cliquish locker room until Andreychuk (and to a lesser extent, Tim Taylor) arrived. They worked hard to build a close, cohesive locker room, and it paid off with a Stanley Cup. Tampa Bay does not win the Cup without them. Period. When Tortorella and Lecavalier were ready to kill each other in January of 2004, Andreychuk played peacemaker. He went from a PP specialist for much of his career to a solid defensive player, a faceoff expert, a gifted leader and a guy who could still contribute on the PP. Our last memories of him are going to be very good, and that will get him a lot of support.

I liked dino as a player, but in there prime, i would take andreychuk, he was better imo

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01-13-2006, 02:24 AM
  #32
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Not in a million years.


But then again, if Neely got in you might aswell acceptWade Belak aswell when he retires.

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01-13-2006, 04:54 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Blues
Andreychuk is in. Period. His second home was in front of the net shoveling in the garbage, and everyone in the league knew that when he set up there it was harder than hell to move him - and that was true for much of his career.

Mike Gartner had one (count 'em, 1) 50-goal season, one 100-point season (102 points in '84-85 when he was 25), and didn't win a Cup in 19 years. Andreychuk's best season came at the age of 30. Gartner was a 7-time All-Star; Andreychuk went only twice. From 1983-94 (the first 11 years that both played full years in the league together), Gartner (who already had 4 seasons under his belt) had 460 goals and 393 assists for 853 points in 860 games, Andreychuk (who played all of 43 games in '82-83) in the same period: 412 goals, 459 assists, 871 points. In 834 games.

So if you're going to penalize Andreychuk for not making the All-Star game more than twice while ignoring the fact that he has more PP goals than anyone else in NHL history - that's a mighty high bar you're setting, and I can probably use that bar to shoot down several players some of you are sure will be locks for the HHOF.
Well put... He's in... He played for like 23 years, longevity counts for a lot in voters minds + he won the cup as a captain... I wonder how many cup-winning captains are NOT in? (not that that alone should qualify you, but i bet there ain't many...)

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Old
01-13-2006, 05:26 AM
  #34
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Allright as per usual your profile is flawed



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr BLUEandWHITE
Drafted by: Buffalo 1/16 in 1982

GP - 1639
G - 640
A - 698
PTS - 1338
Pts per game - 0.82

50 goals once with toronto in 1993-1994 No he had a 50 Goal Season in 92-93 with the Sabres and The Leafs as well
never had a 100 point year - 99 in 93/94
274 power play goals (1st all-time)
1 stanley cup
23 NHL season if he is done playing
played with.....

Buffalo 1982-1993, 2000-2001
Toronto 1993-1995
New Jersey 1995-1999
Boston 1999-2000
Tampa Bay 2001-2006

also an interesting stat when i was looking at his profile he didnt get a power play assist until 8th NHL seasonMaybe because they never kept track of that stat before then?

so is he Hockey Hall of Fame material?
Nope, not even close and I like old David but if he is HOF material why in the hell is Glenn Anderson not?

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01-13-2006, 09:25 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NataSatan666
Nope, not even close and I like old David but if he is HOF material why in the hell is Glenn Anderson not?
Probably because Anderson is in the Caribbean skipping out on child support. Until he comes back and pays up, he's got a *very* small chance of getting in. If he got elected in the next vote, it's extremely doubtful he'd show up b/c he's wanted by the authorities. It has little to do with his on-ice accomplishments, and much more to do with how he's been on the lam for several years now.

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01-13-2006, 10:33 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Blues
Probably because Anderson is in the Caribbean skipping out on child support. Until he comes back and pays up, he's got a *very* small chance of getting in. If he got elected in the next vote, it's extremely doubtful he'd show up b/c he's wanted by the authorities. It has little to do with his on-ice accomplishments, and much more to do with how he's been on the lam for several years now.
You realize he lives in New York... and was at the Messier ceremony last night... and was at the Heritage Classic in Edmonton... and isn't on the run from the law, right? The child support issue was settled in November of 2002 ["Ex-Leaf and Oiler Glenn Anderson has settled his nasty child support case out of court. It includes a lump sum of $80,000 Cdn to a woman and her son, now 13."] He deserves to be in to the HHOF [check the playoff numbers] and even if your fantastic story were true, what does that have to do with his hockey career? His contentious relationship with sports media people is most likely what is keeping him out.

Anyway, back on topic - Andreychuk is a tough call. It's hard to argue against 600 goals and that he gets in on numbers rather than a spectacular or dominating career. That being said, I really don't see him making it.


Last edited by coliseum74: 01-13-2006 at 10:40 AM.
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Old
01-13-2006, 10:45 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by coliseum74
You realize he lives in New York... and was at the Messier ceremony last night... and was at the Heritage Classic in Edmonton... and isn't on the run from the law, right? He deserves to be in to the HHOF and even if your fantastic story were true, what does that have to do with his hockey career? His contentious relationship with sports media people is most likely what is keeping him out.
A fantastic story? Wow, then explain this away. Because the last I heard, Anderson had still yet to pay anything on what a court found he owed; he had been hiding out at a house he owned in the Caribbean on Turks and Caicos. Mike Ulmer's column on Anderson not making it to the HHOF (which does mention his contentious relationship with the media that you pointed out) pretty much lays out the reasons why Anderson won't be in anytime soon.

I never said his stats and on-ice performance didn't make him HHOF worthy; it was his off-ice antics that were keeping him out.

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01-13-2006, 10:47 AM
  #38
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He's a definite Hall of Famer in my books.

Not many people hold scoring records who aren't named Wayne Gretzky.

He's #1 all time in PP goals. That's a "Best of the Best" type of stat.

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01-13-2006, 10:51 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Blues
Probably because Anderson is in the Caribbean skipping out on child support. Until he comes back and pays up, he's got a *very* small chance of getting in. If he got elected in the next vote, it's extremely doubtful he'd show up b/c he's wanted by the authorities. It has little to do with his on-ice accomplishments, and much more to do with how he's been on the lam for several years now.
What should things like that matter?

Sporting Hall of Fames are for players who played the best, not players who were the best in life. Tie Domi does an outstanding job supporting the community, and is a great family man, but you won't hear his name talked about for the hockey hall of fame now will you?

As far as I'm concerned, no matter what you do outside of the sport, it's what you've done during the games that wins you the trip to the Hall. Meaning a guy like Pete Rose, in my oppinion, should be in Baseballs hall of fame.

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01-13-2006, 10:51 AM
  #40
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The Stanley Cup last season probably clinched it for him...rounds out his resume nicely. He's never been a great player but he's just posted strong number a long time...he should get in at some point.

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01-13-2006, 11:00 AM
  #41
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Andreychuk isn't hall of fame worthy. He's only lead his team in scoring 3 times in a 22 year career and never lead them in scoring in the playoffs.

1982-83: 10th most points
1983-84: 2nd most points
1984-85: 3rd most points
1985-86: most points by only 7 points (mike foligno with more goals!)
1986-87: most points by only 6 points (mike foligno with more goals!)
1987-88: most points by only 7 points because Ruutu missed 7 games (christian ruuttu with more goals!)
1988-89: 4th most points
1989-90: 2nd most points
1990-91: 3rd most points
1991-92: 3rd most points
1992-93: 4th most points
1993-94: 2nd most points
1994-95: 2nd most points
1995-96: 5th most points
1996-97: 2nd most points
1997-98: 4th most points
1998-99: 10th most points
1999-00: 5th most points
2000-01: 8th most points
2001-02: 3rd most points
2002-03: 7th most points
2003-04: 5th most points

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01-13-2006, 11:09 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregStack
What should things like that matter?

Sporting Hall of Fames are for players who played the best, not players who were the best in life. Tie Domi does an outstanding job supporting the community, and is a great family man, but you won't hear his name talked about for the hockey hall of fame now will you?

As far as I'm concerned, no matter what you do outside of the sport, it's what you've done during the games that wins you the trip to the Hall. Meaning a guy like Pete Rose, in my oppinion, should be in Baseballs hall of fame.
Fuhr has coke nose.

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01-13-2006, 11:33 AM
  #43
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If Clark Gillies managed to get in, there's a spot for Andy.

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01-13-2006, 12:36 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Psycho Papa Joe
He was as good as Johny Bucyk.
Not even close.

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01-13-2006, 12:48 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockeyfan02
If Clark Gillies managed to get in, there's a spot for Andy.
But 14 of the 18 people who voted Gillies into the Hall will be off the selection committee by the time Andreychuk is eligible in 2009. Thus, that argument is moot. The new 14 people will come in with new standards, and new definitions of whom they think should be in the Hall.

Dino Ciccerelli was a better all-round player than Andreychuk. Had a physical dimension that Big Dave lacked. (And make no mistake about it, Andreychuk has never been a physical player, especially for his size). Dino also has a better playoff record. Dino is going to be on his fifth attempt to get into the Hall this year, going up against Roy, Gilmour (who are locks), Barasso, Bure, Housley and Richter (all of whom will garner support).

The PP Goals record is not the big deal that some make it out to be. It's hardly an endearing one, and not one that'll be the big difference between admission and rejection.

Andreychuk is nowhere near the all-round player Neely was. Neely is the second-best combination of goals and physical play in the last 30 years (after Messier). He's fourth all-time in career playoff goals per game. It was a shame (and a sham) that Neely didn't get inducted until 2005.

Anderson will get in this year, along with Gilmour and Roy. Anderson was a money player in the playoffs. The outcry for his omission last year was the largest since Dale Hawerchuk was left out in 2000.

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01-13-2006, 12:53 PM
  #46
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i hope he doesn't get in. in my years of watching hockey(13), i've never once thought of him as even a top 20 player in the league.

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Old
01-13-2006, 01:12 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOVALEV10
Andreychuk isn't hall of fame worthy. He's only lead his team in scoring 3 times in a 22 year career and never lead them in scoring in the playoffs
I wonder how Jari Kurri or Glenn Anderson rate with that standard.

Seriously - if that is the bar, I'm curious how many people in the HOF don't clear it.

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01-13-2006, 01:19 PM
  #48
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I don't think he should get in. Only the best of the best should get in or the HHOF will loose it's credability. Sure, he had a good career but he will never be remembered as one of the greats in hockey and that is the purpose of the HHOF?

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Old
01-13-2006, 01:23 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Blues
I wonder how Jari Kurri or Glenn Anderson rate with that standard.

Seriously - if that is the bar, I'm curious how many people in the HOF don't clear it.
That's not really fair as both these guys had Gretzky on most of their teams.

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01-13-2006, 01:32 PM
  #50
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I'd be happy to throwdown a $20K bet with the first person who doesn't think he'll get into the HOF.

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