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Kondratiev going back to Russia

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Old
01-14-2006, 03:03 PM
  #26
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There is NHL precedence

Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus
That would suck. I don't know what the league's action would be (voiding? compensation?), but I don't imagine Bettman would just shrug and say "caveat emptor, Ducks."
NYRs traded Bill Gadsby to the RedWings for Red Kelly and red Kelley refused to report and there was some quirky rule and bingo, Kelly signs with the Leafs and goes on to win 3 straight Stanly Cups. The NYRs got zero, nothing and Gadsby goes on to help the RedWings for years.

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01-14-2006, 03:47 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
NYRs traded Bill Gadsby to the RedWings for Red Kelly and red Kelley refused to report and there was some quirky rule and bingo, Kelly signs with the Leafs and goes on to win 3 straight Stanly Cups. The NYRs got zero, nothing and Gadsby goes on to help the RedWings for years.
You think that "quirk" wasn't corrected after all this time?

And in any case, Kondratiev did report--he played for Portland the same night he was traded.

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Old
01-14-2006, 03:53 PM
  #28
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Guys it says after the season and contract is over

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01-14-2006, 03:59 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
Keep making excuses for why sather shouldn't be given credit for moves.
Since I responded to one of your own posts in the trade thread, we both know perfectly well I gave Sather credit for this trade, so I don't quite know what you're whining about here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
How could Sather and the staff not know that he wanted to leave?
Right. As I wrote, you'll need to prove Sather knew Kondratiev was going to leave for Russia (if Kondratiev is actually leaving for Russia). Asking a question doesn't do that. Get back to me when you have actual proof.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
Even if they didn't they still got a player in Sykora that looks like a perfect fit (small sample size) for this team.
Two things:
1. If this is your reason for saying it's a great trade, fine. That's valid WITH the caveat that it's a small sample size and that things work out in the offseason re: Sykora.

BUT

2. You're being dishonest in suggesting that it is Sykora's play that inspired you to write that this was a great trade by Sather. The thread is about the Ducks losing Kondratiev. It had nothing to do with Sykora's play; in fact Sykora's play wasn't even mentioned in the thread prior to your response. It's your feeling that Sather robbed the Ducks because he knew something they didn't (which is why you defend that proposition above), and thus that Sather made a great trade.

I've backed you into a corner by demanding proof that you cannot give, so you're backpedaling now and saying it was a great trade because of the way Sykora is playing. That's not why you wrote it. Admit it and try to defend your original position.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
I'm sorry this team is winning and sather has something to do with it.
Really? I find that sad. I'm not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
Has he done a great job since the deadline nearly TWO years ago?

Yes
The current Ranger team certainly looks good. Whether or not he's done a great job rebuilding remains to be seen, and that is, after all, what he claims he is doing.

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Old
01-14-2006, 04:03 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoon44
Guys it says after the season and contract is over
Right but I'm not sure those things address the issue of "good faith."

If Ranger management had been told in secret by Kondratiev or his agent that the kid fully intended to return home next summer, the Ducks can argue that the Rangers didn't operate in good faith. I'm not sure any of us can say with certainty how the league would respond to that scenario. If someone DOES know for certain, please pipe up.

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01-14-2006, 04:11 PM
  #31
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Possibly another case of a non NA player wanting to return home. Oh well.

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Old
01-14-2006, 04:14 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus
Right but I'm not sure those things address the issue of "good faith."

If Ranger management had been told in secret by Kondratiev or his agent that the kid fully intended to return home next summer, the Ducks can argue that the Rangers didn't operate in good faith. I'm not sure any of us can say with certainty how the league would respond to that scenario. If someone DOES know for certain, please pipe up.
We're never going to know and in any case I strongly suspect that the Rangers had/have no idea what his intention at the end of the season will be. Regardless, the trade makes sense as long as the organization is not just talking up players like Pck, Stall and Baranka (sp?) as being close to ready to play in the NHL and the intention is to re-sign Sykora (assuming he continues to justify it with his play). Kondratiev had shown signs in the past of not being comfortable in North America and I'm sure that was part of the reasoning too.

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Old
01-14-2006, 04:17 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoothepuck
Possibly another case of a non NA player wanting to return home. Oh well.
I know a number of North Americans who could not handle living in Europe (and Japan) too.

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Old
01-14-2006, 04:48 PM
  #34
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I'd bet anything Anaheim knew this was happening

NYR ruin credability if not

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Old
01-14-2006, 04:52 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in the hall
I'd bet anything Anaheim knew this was happening

NYR ruin credability if not
But if Anaheim knew, why would they make the trade?

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01-14-2006, 04:57 PM
  #36
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I feel bad for the Ducks, but I doubt there's anything the NHL can really do about this. Hey, there's a chance Sykora won't stay with the Rangers, either. Sykora's trade value was seriously low because of his lack of production in Anaheim and the fact that he's a free agent at the end of the year. Ultimately, Anaheim has a kid who can play defence for them for the rest of the season.

Still, it does feel like the Rangers have now gotten Rucchin and Sykora out of the Ducks (thinking big picture, as the 4th we got was ours to begin with) for nothing.

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Old
01-14-2006, 05:16 PM
  #37
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People are saying that this was such a good trade for the Rangers but maybe part of the reason he wants to leave is because he now has to move across the country and if he stayed he wouldn't leave to Russia.

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Old
01-14-2006, 05:20 PM
  #38
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A player like Kondratiev can make more money playing in Russia rather than make less than $100,000 in the AHL

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Old
01-14-2006, 05:59 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRGoalieGlut
People are saying that this was such a good trade for the Rangers but maybe part of the reason he wants to leave is because he now has to move across the country and if he stayed he wouldn't leave to Russia.
I can't imagine the timing of his announcement was mere coincidence. Being shipped across an entire continent could not help what was apparently an already stressed out kid.

And I, too, can't see Anaheim making this deal (especially sending the draft pick) if they thought Kondratiev would be leaving.

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01-14-2006, 06:57 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus
I can't imagine the timing of his announcement was mere coincidence. Being shipped across an entire continent could not help what was apparently an already stressed out kid.

And I, too, can't see Anaheim making this deal (especially sending the draft pick) if they thought Kondratiev would be leaving.
But, considering his contract is up and the end of the year, and he'd already done the same thing, given the opportunity, while with the Leafs, the Ducks had to realize such a risk existed. If not, then they didn't do their homework.

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Old
01-14-2006, 07:38 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jas
But, considering his contract is up and the end of the year, and he'd already done the same thing, given the opportunity, while with the Leafs, the Ducks had to realize such a risk existed. If not, then they didn't do their homework.
Sure but you can equally argue that because he returned the risk was minimal. If Burke did his homework the conclusion he might very reasonably come to is that, while the kid may complain, he stays in the NHL. (And there's no saying he won't. Again, it's foolish to treat this thing as though it's already done.)

It all comes down to the question of whether or not Kondratiev knew before the trade whether he was returning or not. The timing of his announcement suggests to me that it was the trade itself that triggered this decision. I don't claim to know this by any means, but as I said, the timing seems more than coincidental.

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Old
01-14-2006, 07:46 PM
  #42
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i am a bit confused, where was it reported that he is going back, and how do we know it is for sure?

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01-14-2006, 08:05 PM
  #43
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If he goes bacl he goes back.

The ducks took a shot on him and knew the risks as did the Rangers.

It's possible both teams end up with nothing after this season.

My biggest thing was the dramatics associated with the deal. You'd think we traded Staal in the deal.

Outside of that, I just don't think it's a huge deal.

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Old
01-15-2006, 07:54 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge
If he goes bacl he goes back.

The ducks took a shot on him and knew the risks as did the Rangers.

It's possible both teams end up with nothing after this season.
You're right. What Kondratiev decides doesn't change the value of the deal from the Ranger perspective. Kondratiev hurting the Ducks by departing doesn't make Sykora any more helpful to the Rangers.

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Old
01-15-2006, 09:57 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KasparKrunch
i am a bit confused, where was it reported that he is going back, and how do we know it is for sure?
All due respect to Dagoon, he reported what he heard from Sam. Who knows if Sam was reporting it as fact or as his opinion. Remember the days of the link police?

Seems strange to me for a player who has his mind made up to go back home to Russia, doesnt like it in NA, stays to play and start in both Friday's and Saturday's games for Portland.

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Old
01-15-2006, 10:09 AM
  #46
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Once again I will state what i said in the original post
Drats will honor the rest of the year and then leave for Russia, He will be a fre agent at the end of the year and leave not sooner

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Old
01-15-2006, 10:15 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoon44
Once again I will state what i said in the original post
Drats will honor the rest of the year and then leave for Russia, He will be a fre agent at the end of the year and leave not sooner
1000 apologies to Dagoon! I read the title then skimmed the details. Bad abev.

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Old
01-15-2006, 11:45 AM
  #48
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Maybe my comments were harsh, but I believe deservedly so. It really irks me when you see a kid with all this talent and just doesn't seem to want it bad enough. To me, being an NHL player would be the end all be all, best case scenario, dream job of a lifetime. I was never blessed enough to be in that group. It physically hurts me to see a guy who is there and throwing it away for what? Because he's HOMESICK? It just makes me think of all the times in my life that I could look back on and know I was making a mistake, and just wish for a minute that I could go back in time as me now and have a 5 minute conversation with me back then. But hey, it's his life. Don't get me wrong either, I'm not jealous or bitter, I just realize that SO few people ever get to live that sort of dream, and I truly hate to see a young man get that close and just let it slip away without even fighting for it.

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01-15-2006, 11:56 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SML
Maybe my comments were harsh, but I believe deservedly so. ... It physically hurts me to see a guy who is there and throwing it away for what? Because he's HOMESICK?
Kahlil Gibran once wrote: "Work is love made visible. And if you cannot work with love but only with distaste, it is better that you should leave your work and sit at the gate of the temple and take alms of those who work with joy."

It doesn't matter why the kid is unhappy. He hurts himself and those around him if he's chaining himself to a joyless job. It seems unfair to condemn him because his dream job isn't your dream job.

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01-15-2006, 12:05 PM
  #50
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Maybe he just wants to play home in Russia....My buddy had a great paying$$ job that he enjoyed in Japan, but he recently came back for a less $ and not as fullfilling job because he missed home (family, friends, and so on) and decided it was more important to him in the long run

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