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What are players worth and should we resign them?

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01-15-2006, 01:40 PM
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TOPGUN
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What are players worth and shoul we resign them?

Are the players worth there money!?

With the cap system this season every team is looking value for there money. The Red Wings had to deal with by bringing back there payroll form $80 million to $39 million, so far this season Ken Holland did a terrific job in making a good and balanced team. Sarcastro made a thread with the midseason grades.

http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=208453

That gave me an idea to make a thread like this one.

Are the players worth there money?

The guys that are worth there money!

Zetterberg ($2.400.000)
Hank is our best player every night. He plays Left Wing/Centre and does an amazing job! I am glad that the Wings signed him with a 4 year deal. So far this season he is worth every $ of it.

Datsyuk ($3.900.000)
Leads the team in scoring! He doesn’t make his awesome plays like he did in the last NHL season. Then again he leads the Wings in points. Is he worth his $3.900.000, difficult to say…is a guy that leads your team in scoring (18G35A) worth that much? I say yes!

Crhis Chelios ($850.000)
Chris is playing really solid and brings a ton of experience in the line-up. Yes he is worth the money. Will he play another season (he is playing great)?

Daniel Cleary ($450.000)
Brings a lot of energy to the rink and plays a good game for a guy that makes the league minimum. On top of that he plays on the PK.

Jiri Fisher ($1.330.000)
Everybody knows the story. Till his seizure he was our best defenseman. Jiri was/is worth the $1.330.000.

Johan Franzen ($600.000)
The rookie Franzen is showing that he belongs in the line-up. Only make $600.000 a year and already kills penalty’s

Brett Lebda ($507.000)
Another rookie on the rooster, Lebda is playing because Kronwall and Fisher went down with injury’s. So far this season he doing a good job, making smart decision in his own end. For $507.000 he is a good signing

Manny Legace ($1.162.800)
Legace is showing that he can handle the number #1 job! In the beginning I read some post that he made to much for a “backup” goalie. Now I am saying that he is worth the money!

Mikeal Samuelsson ($537.500)
Who would have thought at the beginning of the season that Samuelsson already has 16 goals and 13 assist! Not me! A great signing from Ken Holland and that for $537.500, a barging if you ask me! I don’t know how long his contract is? I would love to see him back next year.

Mathieu Schneider ($3.300.000)
Schneider comes with a price tag of $3.300.000, that is a lot. He was our leading scoring defenseman last NHL season. This year he already has 32 points (10G22A) and is playing solid hockey. For that the season started I thought it was a little to much for him. We have to face it that he is not Nick Lidstrom, he makes mistakes because he wants to join the rush. Look around the league and see what other players make! Now I think that it was a good signing form Holland.

Brendan Shanahan ($2.280.000)
The biggest surprise this season on the Red Wings roster IMO. I didn’t thought he had it in him at this point of his career. With 22 goals he is still showing that he can put the puck in the net (25 goals last season). On top of that he brings a lot of experience in the dressing room. Shanahan is worth the $2.280.000 and I would love to have him back next season.

Jason Williams ($450.000)
Jason, what can you say about this guy! Makes the league minimum and has 37 points (5 on the team). Great player and I hope that he will stay with the Red Wings for many year to come.

Jason Woolley ($507.000)
Detroit signed Jason after what? 22 games into the season? He is not a top 4 defenseman, true. He still can produce points (14 points in 26 games). I have a soft spot for Jason, I don’t know why…but for $507.000 it is a good signing!

Questionable?

Krik Maltby ($1.444.000)
Maltby is having a off season this year, in the offensive department. So far he has 4 goals and 4 assist (Lebda has 1 point more). On the other hand Maltby is on this team to shutdown the opponent best lines. Defensively he is still solid, but is $1.444.000 not to much for him?

Kris Draper ($2.128.000)
Always been a fan of Draper! Selke Trophy winner last NHL season and had 24 goals WOW. Like everybody else I expected more offense from him, so far this season it is very disappointed. Like Maltby he is on the team to shutdown the opponent best lines, but his salary off $2.128.000 is to much IMO

Chris Osgood ($900.000)
A lot of things are said about the guy. I really like the person Osgood, the goalie not so much…but we have other threads on this board were we are discussing that! Chris is only making $900.000 a year, that is not too much. The question is: “should Detroit resign him next year” ?

Thomas Holmstrom ($1.368.000)
Thomas as been a Red Wing his entire life! He is doing actually a good job this season with 30 points. His salary is ok! Don’t know what his contract status is?

Steve Yzerman ($1.250.000)
The “Captain”. Steve is 40 years old and is “empty”. He only makes $1.250.000 and that is ok IMO. He will retire after this year and I wish him the best of luck in his private life! He only can skate for 10 min a game! Why questionable! If Steve didn’t play this season we would have more breathing room under the cap and we could make a move at the trading deadline! But in the end he deserves this and he said at the beginning of the season that he would love to play another one. I respect that! Steve

Nicklas Lidstrom ($7.600.000)
What is a Norris Trophy defenseman worth? Scot Niedermayer is making $6.750.000 and almost nobody in the NHL sees him as a contender this year for the Norris. This is his last contract year, should we resign him for less money? Yes off course! The question is how much? 4,5,6 million a year? I think that it depends on his play for the rest of the season! A lot of people see Nick as a candidate for the Norris this year and why not! He is scoring points and still playing that great defensive game. The only thing is that he lost some speed. But then again Nick was never a fast skater. Like I said the big question is: what is he worth next season and should we resign him?

Bad signings!

Robert Lang ($3.800.000)
In every trade talk on this boards, Lang is in it. He almost a PPG player. I expect more from Lang that he is doing now, he doesn’t skate and has to many turnovers. We have 3 better centers then Lang. The $3.800.000 is to much and I don’t expect him here anymore next season.


What do you guys think? Who should we resign and who should we cut lose at the end off the season?

Thouhts?

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01-15-2006, 02:21 PM
  #2
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I just did a quick look at the Top 15 point leaders in the NHL, and put their salaries for this year next to their names. In all fairness, the rookie salaries (and guys up to their first 3 years in the league) are artificially restrained, so it is not fair to compare their salary to what older RFA's and UFA's got.

I would say we are getting a pretty good deal with Datsyuk, not as awesome a price as we are getting with Zetterberg right now, but compared to what other teams are paying their top scorers, we are definitely NOT overpaying. There are only two guys on this list making over $5 million per year that had to re-sign as RFA's after the lockout [Thornton, Kovalchuk]. I'm not 100% certain of Hossa's status with regard to that last statement.

Jagr $7.8
Kovalchuk $6.5
Savard $2.3
Thornton $6.6
Alfredsson $4.6
Forsberg $5.7
Heatley $3.5
Ovechkin $900K
Staal $900K

Gagne $2.0
Hossa $5.0
Dats $3.8
Tanguay $3.23
Demitra $4.5
Naslund $6.0

I'll have to come back to the other guys later when I have time, but wanted to get this out first for others to use and comment on further.

 
Old
01-15-2006, 02:51 PM
  #3
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i personally think we're overpaying Schneids at $3.3mil... $2-2.5 maybe. even for as many points as he's scored, he gives up way too many.

nick there's not a lot we could do, either pay him the max or buy him out and let someone else scoop him (not an option.) holland has built around his contract masterfully and if/when nick re-signs for cheaper, kenny has all the more room to work with to add to the core he's built.

franzen's on a rookie contract, so i wouldn't necessarily call him a deal or anything... just a good pick.

with the cap going up and us getting room from smaller/retired contracts, i think we should seriously consider extension talks with pavel this offseason. pay the man! he's still not worth thornton/max money like he wanted last summer but $5mil or so isn't unreasonable.

you're right, drapes is overpaid... he and malts and homer should stick around for around $1mil, anything more and we'd be overpaying again.

other than that i pretty much agree w/ the rest of your thoughts. i'd like to see us try to get fernandez if he's still available this summer, but i'll gladly hang on to legace if we need to.

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01-15-2006, 03:22 PM
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Guys with contracts expiring. Lidstrom, Yzerman, Shanahan, Chelios, Cleary, Samuelsson, Williams, Mowers, Rivers, Woolley, Franzen, Lilja. And both goalies.

Stevie I think will retire. I don't think he wants to go through an injury-riddled season again, even though he's played well when in game shape and on the ice.

Chelios... I have no idea. I think he'll want to play. He's playing well so I don't really see why we shouldn't bring him back if he can keep it up through the rest of the season/playoffs. Similar contract.

Shanahan should be brought back, unless his season tails off considerably. He had back issues for a couple games there but seemingly has bounced back. Similar contract or a little less for multiple years.

Lidstrom has to be brought back. I don't think it will be $7M+ but he's not a guy we can afford to lose. I'd like to see $5M or lower the longer it gets.

Samuelsson should be brought back. Period. $1-2M

Franzen should be brought back. $.75M - $1M

Cleary should be brought back. $.75M - $1M

Mowers, bye.

Woolley, bye.

Rivers, bye.

Lilja... decent 3rd pairing guy, but if Kenny brings someone in for the stretch run he may become expendable depending on who it is and how long we have them. Similar money if we keep him.

Williams... he's the most complicated situation IMO. He had a hot stretch on a hot line and PP unit but has tailed off a bit and fairly sizeable defensive holes appeared. He's put up nice numbers, but I don't think he's good enough to lock up a top6 spot. I'd move him for a better piece to the puzzle. $1-2M but I don't think he's what we need.

I'm not touching the goalies. Either we bring in an elite guy and keep one (likely Legace as he's the better backup), or we keep them both. Howard isn't ready.

I hope I didn't forget anyone.

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01-15-2006, 05:36 PM
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.

Chelios... I have no idea. I think he'll want to play. He's playing well so I don't really see why we shouldn't bring him back if he can keep it up through the rest of the season/playoffs. Similar contract. Count Him In

Shanahan should be brought back, unless his season tails off considerably. He had back issues for a couple games there but seemingly has bounced back. Similar contract or a little less for multiple years. In (with a raise!)

Cleary should be brought back. $.75M - $1M Watch out here! a smart GM could seduce him away.

Lilja... decent 3rd pairing guy, but if Kenny brings someone in for the stretch run he may become expendable depending on who it is and how long we have them. Similar money if we keep him. See Cleary.

Williams... he's the most complicated situation IMO. He had a hot stretch on a hot line and PP unit but has tailed off a bit and fairly sizeable defensive holes appeared. He's put up nice numbers, but I don't think he's good enough to lock up a top6 spot. I'd move him for a better piece to the puzzle. $1-2M but I don't think he's what we need. His D problems mainly occur when he's playing point on the PP.
For the money, he's the best bargain on the team.


I'm not touching the goalies. Either we bring in an elite guy and keep one (likely Legace as he's the better backup), or we keep them both. Howard isn't ready.
I'm shocked that I agree

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01-15-2006, 07:42 PM
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Draper and Maltby are really the only guys I don't think are earning their paychecks. still great defensively but not performing up to their norms in other areas. They can still turn it around, but for what they bring, I think they are the most clearly overpaid. Regardless, I think they'll be back next year.

Samuelsson - I think someone will overpay for him and, hopefully, it won't be us. He's been productive for us, but so was LaPointe before he left. If he keeps it up this season and does it again next season, I'd be more willing to step up to the plate with a bigger contract but, as it is, I'd offer around $1 million.

Cleary - Will be back. He's done just about what was expected of him, imo, and I don't think his contract will change much.

Chelios - will also be back. One of the best values in the league and is continually stepping up big. The guy will play til he's 50.

Yzerman - will retire.

Rivers - gone

Lilja - gone

Mowers - gone

Osgood/Legace - I think one will be back and MacDonald will be the backup. I think Joey will find his form again in the secondhalf at GR and show's he's ready, leaving Howard to be the starter next year with Liv/Mac as the backup in GR.

Bootland and/or Kopecky will be in Detroit.

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01-15-2006, 09:41 PM
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Dats and Z are signed and should be kept no matter what. Dats is a great deal, imo, right now and if he can get "can't score in the playoffs" thingy off his rap sheet, we're golden.

No reason not to bring Shanny back for another year if he continues and is okay with the money he's getting now.

Refer to the mess the Devils are in with multi-year contracts to vets signed at age 35+. I don't think Holland will offer any vet anything longer than 2 years. Lidstrom may be the only one who can get anything longer than a year under this CBA. Definitely bring him back, but at around $5.5 mil for Year 1 and $4.5 mil for Year 2.

Cheli? League minimum if he seems like he can play to fill in the gaps...if we need it. Kronwall should be back, and if Fisch looks like he can't come back, then I'm fairly certain Kenny goes and finds a $2-4 million/year D-man somewhere. We'll get extra cap space because it goes up next year and we shed some of the vets (or sign them to lesser deals). Also, will Kindl be ready to pick up some time next year in the bigs?

Samy
Franzen
Cleary

I'm with NN. Pretty good guys to have for under $1 million. If the older guys want too much money, remember we have Grigorenko coming up next year (hopefully) and Filppula may get another shot too.

Mowers, Woolley and Rivers-- not needed.

Lilja is okay for the money. I'd rather have him around as the #5 or 6 guy than any of the other expendables.

Williams? The roster may get too cluttered to keep him. Winger98 wants to see Kopecky and Bootland up. I'm thinking Grigs comes up too, and Filppula may get some time up as well....and we want to keep Samy, Cleary, and Franzen. Oh oh. [Seems like Hudler gets thrown into some trade then...eventually.]

And then there's Lang. Seemed like a good signing at the time, and I like him for his size and potential to be a PPG guy- he just has to use his size and really be a PPG guy. I don't really want to get rid of him, but for the right deal-- I might do it especially if the youngsters are performing.

Yzerman. I'm assuming he retires (and he should).

Goalies. I can't see Kenny keeping Ozzie and Manny for another year. In fact, I see him trying to sign Nabokov or Luongo or Fernandez....and if not, he keeps Manny and makes Howard the number two. If Ken does sign a big name goalie, does anyone expect Manny to want to stay as the backup?

 
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01-15-2006, 11:32 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu
Goalies. I can't see Kenny keeping Ozzie and Manny for another year. In fact, I see him trying to sign Nabokov or Luongo or Fernandez....and if not, he keeps Manny and makes Howard the number two. If Ken does sign a big name goalie, does anyone expect Manny to want to stay as the backup?
strangely enough, I can see Legace being willing to stay as the backup. He just seems to have the right demeanor for it and, if Holland did make that move, I think it would be because Manny/Ozzy fell way short and either would just be happy for the job.

My haphazard guess at the forwards next year:

Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Shanny
Franzen-Zetterberg-Williams
Kopecky-Lang-Hudler
Maltby-Draper-Cleary
Bootland

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01-16-2006, 01:14 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu
Goalies. I can't see Kenny keeping Ozzie and Manny for another year. In fact, I see him trying to sign Nabokov or Luongo or Fernandez....and if not, he keeps Manny and makes Howard the number two. If Ken does sign a big name goalie, does anyone expect Manny to want to stay as the backup?
Apparently he not that popular anymore in San Jose. Turco is already gone, that makes Nabokov the only decent goaltender. If Ken Holland goes after him I would say between $3 - $4 million a year...then again I think other teams will overpay him!

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01-16-2006, 01:49 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger98
Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Shanny
Franzen-Zetterberg-Williams
Kopecky-Lang-Hudler
Maltby-Draper-Cleary
Bootland
i'm almost certain it won't be, but good god i hope that's not going to be the case...

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01-16-2006, 07:59 AM
  #11
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I'd like to see lines something like this next season:

Franzen---Datsyuk---Grigorenko
Shanahan-Zetterberg-Samuelsson
Williams---Filppula----Holmstrom
Maltby----Draper-----Cleary

Lidstrom----Kronwall
Schneider--Quincey
Lebda----Lilja

Legace

I expect Yzerman to retire, and possibly Chelios. Lang is too expensive to keep. I don't think either Hudler or Kopecky are ever going to make it in the NHL--at least not in Detroit.

With the money freed up by trading Lang, perhaps a better goaltender could be acquired. Also a big defenseman might be added, such as Komisarek (as mentioned in a recent rumor).


Last edited by Murmansk16: 01-16-2006 at 08:30 AM.
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01-16-2006, 08:33 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CuJo#31
Apparently he not that popular anymore in San Jose. Turco is already gone, that makes Nabokov the only decent goaltender. If Ken Holland goes after him I would say between $3 - $4 million a year...then again I think other teams will overpay him!

It seems really easy to overpay goalies these days, eh? Turco gets his deal, then goes into a huge slump! Khabibulin signs his big deal and becomes the worst goalie out there. Meanwhile Cujo and Hasek sign puny deals, and are on top. Man oh man, what a crapshoot.

Well if Ken wants to overpay someone, then he should deal for Luongo. I think Roberto's statement to the press saying he does not want to spin his wheels for another 5 years if mgt is not serious about building a contender...says it all. He doesn't trust them, and at least I don't think it is just the money. Taking him to arbitration did not help build trust either.

But yeah, I hope we do not overpay someone. I think a Nabokov with a Wings' defensive core in front of him would be great. Either of the Wilds' goalies too, and they'd be a bit cheaper. What about all the Theodore rumors (almost as bad as the Luongo ones...)?

 
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01-16-2006, 08:34 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger98
strangely enough, I can see Legace being willing to stay as the backup. He just seems to have the right demeanor for it and, if Holland did make that move, I think it would be because Manny/Ozzy fell way short and either would just be happy for the job.

My haphazard guess at the forwards next year:

Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Shanny
Franzen-Zetterberg-Williams
Kopecky-Lang-Hudler
Maltby-Draper-Cleary
Bootland

No Grigorenko? Ever? Next Year?

 
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01-16-2006, 08:54 AM
  #14
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I would prefer something like this:

Shanahan-Zetterberg-Grigorenko
XXXXXXX-Datsyuk-Williams
Holmstrom-Filppula-Samuelsson
Maltby-Franzen-Cleary
Bootland Kopecky

Lidstrom-YYYYYYY
Schneider-Kronwall
Quincey-Lebda
Lilja/Fisch?

XXXXXXX=Samsonov, JP Dumont, Elias, Parrish, or someone similar - a winger that can shoot the puck but won't cost a fortune. Elias would probably cost a lot, and Samsonov would cost more than Dumont or Parrish. I like the Dumont idea, he always seems to score vs the Wings and he always ends up with about 25 goals a year. If they can unload Lang then these would be possible scenarios.

YYYYYYY=Chara if the Wings unload Lang and sign a cheaper winger like Dumont. I would suggest someone like Kubina if they either can't unload Lang or if they unload Lang and sign Samsonov or Elias.

I think the Wings will have to try and deal either Maltby or Draper. Given their lack of productivity they are simply too expensive a luxury to keep around IMO. Especially when Franzen, Cleary and Zetterberg are all playing well on the PK and can also contribute offensively.

These lines are balanced and have punch all the way through the 4th line. If Grigs can't hack it yet, they know they can slide Williams or Samuelsson into his spot and survive ok, plus Kopecky and Hudler will both get a look for that spot if Grigs isn't ready. And the D would be vastly improved also, with either Chara (longshot) or Kubina (more likely) taking Lilja's place with Lidstrom, or paired with Schneider and with Kronwall paired with Lidstrom. If Lilja looks like a capable defenseman (and is even getting articles of praise from the newspapers) paired with Lidstrom, imagine what a good defenseman could do. I also think that Quincey will at least compete for a job at camp next year, based on the season he's having in GR. He looks like he might be the real deal - not a #1 or anything but possibly a very good #3 or maybe even a 2 somewhere down the line. I just hope Lebda doesn't pull a Bootland and fall off the map when they send him back to GR in a few weeks.

All this is contingent on the Wings not throwing money at a UFA goalie or giving Lidstrom a max deal or Shanny holding out for big bucks . And of course none of this would ever happen, but that's not really the point, is it?

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01-16-2006, 11:40 AM
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I'd be curious to see what the cap is next year if it is supposed to go up by a few million. That'll only give the Wings more money to work with and only $19.2 million on the books for next year for 9 players (inlcuding Fischer).

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01-16-2006, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu
No Grigorenko? Ever? Next Year?
At RWC, he was highlighted in their updated prospect rankings and they had a quote from Nill saying that Grigorenko was around 85% back, and earlier they ran a correction that the Wings have his rights until 2007, not 2006. While they apparently want to bring him over next season, I also get the impression they plan on being very careful with the guy. If there are any doubts he isn't 100% ready, I don't think they'll hesitate to move him to GR, and let him and Filppula be *the* guys down there.

I also think the Wings will try to save cash by going young up front so they can patch their blueline back together. Losing Fischer leaves a hole back there that's comparable to when they lost Vladdy, and we saw how long and hard it was filling that gap.

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01-16-2006, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoalzie
I'd be curious to see what the cap is next year if it is supposed to go up by a few million. That'll only give the Wings more money to work with and only $19.2 million on the books for next year for 9 players (inlcuding Fischer).
I've seen figures saying anywhere between $42 - 45 million. The $45 million may be closer to what the CBA would dictate it should be, but the NHLPA apparently may be the group that does not want it to go higher, thanks to escrow. If too many teams end up with payrolls above the median cap value (assuming the new cap is $45 million, then the median is $8 mil under that).... it would mean that the escrow number gets higher and higher. The NHLPA does not want to see that number go much above 4-5 %. Weird stuff.

But yeah, the Wings would be in much better shape to help with the re-building seeing how many geezers we have (I know we love our geezers...but....).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger98
I also think the Wings will try to save cash by going young up front so they can patch their blueline back together. Losing Fischer leaves a hole back there that's comparable to when they lost Vladdy, and we saw how long and hard it was filling that gap.


It really sucks though that we've had to deal with the loss of key guys like this in such a short timeframe. It's like we should get a draft pick for the guy we lost just to make up for it.

 
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01-16-2006, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu
It really sucks though that we've had to deal with the loss of key guys like this in such a short timeframe. It's like we should get a draft pick for the guy we lost just to make up for it.
It astounds me to see how cursed the Wings are with blueliners. Fetisov was also seriously injured in that accident and got damn lucky he didn't walk away with anything more life damaging. Chiasson, though he was with Carolina, had been drafted by the Wings and played for us for quite awhile, I think Wallin had a car accident that messed up his development, Fischer has this heart problem and Kronwall has had some injury issues of his own. All of it within a ten year span.

I really think losing Vladdy is what cost us a dynasty, though. If Vladdy was still playing, I doubt we sign Krupp or make half the trades we made to shore up our blueline. Not to mention what that must have done to the lockerroom. It could even be argued that it was the beginning of a shift towards a softer team, as we never got a guy who could be the physical sparkplug that Vladdy was.

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01-16-2006, 09:18 PM
  #19
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It astounds me to see how cursed the Wings are with blueliners. Fetisov was also seriously injured in that accident and got damn lucky he didn't walk away with anything more life damaging. Chiasson, though he was with Carolina, had been drafted by the Wings and played for us for quite awhile, I think Wallin had a car accident that messed up his development, Fischer has this heart problem and Kronwall has had some injury issues of his own. All of it within a ten year span.

I really think losing Vladdy is what cost us a dynasty, though. If Vladdy was still playing, I doubt we sign Krupp or make half the trades we made to shore up our blueline. Not to mention what that must have done to the lockerroom. It could even be argued that it was the beginning of a shift towards a softer team, as we never got a guy who could be the physical sparkplug that Vladdy was.
Yeah, we never would have signed Krupp... although we probably wouldn't have made the Chelios trade either and that paid off in spades.

Speaking of Cheli, if he keeps playing like he has been then not only should we bring him back, but he should also get a modest raise. Cheli has been one of our best 3 defenders all season and has stepped up his play even another notch since the Fischer episode.

I pretty much agree with a lot of what was said earlier in this thread. Shanny, Cheli, Nick and one of the goalies (prefer Legace) should be brought back. Some of the other FAs should also be signed but only if the price is right (note: I think Cleary is a RFA so he will almost certainly return). Mowers, Rivers & Woolley will not return, and I would only want Lilja back if nobody better can be obtained and it doesn't look like Quincey is ready.

The roster for next year I hope looks something like this:

Shanahan - Datsyuk - Williams
Zetterberg - Lang - Samuelsson
Maltby - Draper - Franzen
UFA/Filppula? - Cleary - Homer

Lidstrom - Kronwall
Schneider - Big Time (Chara/Redden/????)
Lebda - Chelios

Legace
Howard

My 2c on Grigs - I think there's a very slim chance he's with the Wings next year. If he comes to NA (maybe 40% chance of that) it will be to play with the Griffins. I haven't seen him play, but his stats are trailing off badly and everything I read or hear that comes from Wings management highlights the option of leaving him in Russia for another year. I think that's what will happen.

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01-16-2006, 09:52 PM
  #20
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Howard isn't ready yet.

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01-16-2006, 11:36 PM
  #21
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Howard isn't ready yet.
agreed, why are people so eager to rush him to the big league to play once every week or so when (insert starter here) needs a rest when he could/should be getting valuable p.t. in the AHL...? it makes no sense to have him on the big club just to be the back-up.

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01-17-2006, 06:10 AM
  #22
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I can understand the notion that Howard isn't ready, since he's having an up-and-down year in GR. But I don't understand why doublejack would say that Quincey doesn't look ready. He is having an all-star caliber rookie season in GR. I would compare his season to Kronwall's season last year - Quincey hasn't put up those kinds of points but that's not his game. By all accounts he has been their best defenseman all year. I'd say he's worth a look. If he can step in and play 15 minutes a night next year it would take a lot of pressure off to sign another stay-at-home guy if Fisch can't come back.

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01-17-2006, 08:13 AM
  #23
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I can understand the notion that Howard isn't ready, since he's having an up-and-down year in GR. But I don't understand why doublejack would say that Quincey doesn't look ready. He is having an all-star caliber rookie season in GR. I would compare his season to Kronwall's season last year - Quincey hasn't put up those kinds of points but that's not his game. By all accounts he has been their best defenseman all year. I'd say he's worth a look. If he can step in and play 15 minutes a night next year it would take a lot of pressure off to sign another stay-at-home guy if Fisch can't come back.
Fisch is done... however, if Quincey is really ready then maybe we don't need to acquire anyone to be Schneider's partner. Alternately, Cheli could fit into the 7th (depth) spot that Rivers is holding down right now if we did land a big name UFA.


As far as Howard, I agree that he's not ready to be a starter in the NHL, but he could be a backup ready by next year. The AHL season is barely half over and Jimmy spent a huge chunck of the first half with the Wings. So he's got a lot of time to work on consistency. And I do not see both Osgood and Legace returning, and imo Howard is just as ready to be a backup as MacDonald is.

Further, I disagree that it's better for him to start in the AHL than backup in the NHL. Just practicing every day with the Wings and getting a start every week or so will allow him to learn a lot and see better shooters than he would in the AHL. Of course all of this depends on how Legace handles this seasons playoffs. If Manny flops then Holland is going to pursue Nabby or whoever, and Manny may return as the backup. (I think Ozzie is history because Babs doesn't seem to trust him).

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01-17-2006, 08:44 AM
  #24
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I just went through that post, actually not having any idea of the Wings roster...but what about Hudler for next season? He is playing great in the AHL, why not give him some ice time in the NHL? not 2 mins like he got this season....give him 10 mins a game and see what this kid can do...

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01-17-2006, 08:56 AM
  #25
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Originally Posted by bleuer
I just went through that post, actually not having any idea of the Wings roster...but what about Hudler for next season? He is playing great in the AHL, why not give him some ice time in the NHL? not 2 mins like he got this season....give him 10 mins a game and see what this kid can do...
I can only speak for myself, but I don't include him in the plans because I don't think he'll make it in the NHL. At least not with the Wings.

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