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Hurricanes vs Penguins (10.22.03)

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Old
10-23-2003, 04:08 AM
  #51
kutdacheez
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This is what I see as one of the biggest downsides to the Pens game right now . . . it's the (what appears to be) very deliberate passes thru the neutral zone. By that, I mean they appear to think too carefully about their decision to pass. Too carefully. But, maybe that's what Edzo wants them to do.
The passer gets the puck, turns, scans the ice, then sends the pass forward . . . and the time for them to do that is about as long as it takes for the other team to get into position to stop any forward movement. It isn't the trap that stops us moving forward it's the cautiousness IMHO.

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10-23-2003, 04:21 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by kutdacheez
I must be the only one who didn't think MAF screwed up. He came out and played the puck and Francis made a good play pinching in. Covering the puck or firing over the glass would have resulted in a penalty, right? Possibly Focht, Bradley and Holzinger should make the final decision as to whether it really was a rookie mistake, or not. They certainly had a front row seat while they watched the play.
The way I saw it was he tried to make "the right" play . . . and for that reason I find it hard to call it a "rookie" mistake . . . or a "bad-idea" by MAF.
Given the scouting reports that quote the knocks against him as being his puck handling, I simply think he whiffed on the puck. Rookie or 12-year veteran - if your weakness is puck handling, you obviously stand a better chance of whiffing it. The only sembelance of a mistake, IMO, is perhaps he shouldn't have gone for it. But that is real, real, real tough to pin on him. "IF" he did in fact have a brain fart or learning experience, wow...big surprise for an 18-year old.

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10-23-2003, 04:36 AM
  #53
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Well, I'm glad someone else brought this one up first. Before I jump on the Lupaschuk should be up here and Berehowsky's play I first want to ask . . . what does ANYONE see in Dan Focht other than his size?
Focht doesn't stand out as horrible given what he is compared against the median. Is he playing vastly worse than the killer B's? (Bergevin, Baumgartner, and Berehowsky) I certainly don't think so. But of course, that is not a good thing. Hence, that is my opinion of why Focht is being let off the hook somewhat.

I will go one step further and say that we only have one defenseman playing right now that would earn a spot on the 20 of the 30 teams in the NHL. That's Tarnstrom - who, despite my summertime worries, has been absolutely a pleasure to watch. Orpik and Melichar I am ambvialent about - but generally positive about their progress. I really, really, really look forward to Rosy's return.

At this point, to cap off my rambling - bring up Lupaschuk, send down Focht. I can live with Lupaschuk given I believe he would be in the "generally positive about their progress" category, not to mention adding a real PP dimension that we sorely lack.

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10-23-2003, 06:04 AM
  #54
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it seems to me that everyone is treating focht like he is a veteran that has been in the league for years. the guy played what, 35 nhl games before we got him? i understand he's no rookie, but i think too much criticism is being directed towards him. its only games into the season, give him time. if he's like this 10 games from now and showing no improvement,than i think it may be time to worry.

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10-23-2003, 10:11 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Raider Zero
it seems to me that everyone is treating focht like he is a veteran that has been in the league for years. the guy played what, 35 nhl games before we got him? i understand he's no rookie, but i think too much criticism is being directed towards him. its only games into the season, give him time. if he's like this 10 games from now and showing no improvement,than i think it may be time to worry.
Okay, fair enough . . . I'll see you in 10 more games!

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10-23-2003, 10:18 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Der Schweinehund
Focht doesn't stand out as horrible given what he is compared against the median. Is he playing vastly worse than the killer B's? (Bergevin, Baumgartner, and Berehowsky) I certainly don't think so. But of course, that is not a good thing. Hence, that is my opinion of why Focht is being let off the hook somewhat.
Maybe they are just minding their mentoring too much!
Whada ya think?

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10-23-2003, 10:25 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by kutdacheez
Maybe they are just minding their mentoring too much!
Whada ya think?
I admit, I certainly have suggested (and hoped) of Bergevin as a mentor. But I also desired someone else too. Berehowsky and Baumgartner would never have entered my mind in that respect. Volunteer, retired Canadian businesspeople - yes. Berehowsky - no.

Unfortunately, some of the player personnel decisions work out to be warm-body-to-fill-the-uniform decisions. But - let's give them time. Coach Hillier will help 'shape' them.

(Okay - now I am depressed.)

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Old
10-23-2003, 10:38 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Der Schweinehund
I admit, I certainly have suggested (and hoped) of Bergevin as a mentor. But I also desired someone else too. Berehowsky and Baumgartner would never have entered my mind in that respect. Volunteer, retired Canadian businesspeople - yes. Berehowsky - no.

Unfortunately, some of the player personnel decisions work out to be warm-body-to-fill-the-uniform decisions. But - let's give them time. Coach Hillier will help 'shape' them.

(Okay - now I am depressed.)
I just coundn't pass that opportunity up!

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10-23-2003, 11:28 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by kutdacheez
I must be the only one who didn't think MAF screwed up.
I'm with you on that one.

 
Old
10-23-2003, 11:42 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Crystal(M)eth
I would of said to send down Focht, but the Pens org. has a hard on for him, so why bother to even suggest it.

It is just getting to the point where I am getting disgusted with how they are developing Lupy. I have watched him play more than probably anyone on this board, and he is a hell of a player.

He is my fav. prospect by a mile...he has so much talent, and has unfairly been labeled as being poor in his own end. From December until the end of the season he had the best plus-minus on the Baby Pens last season....but he is poor in his own end....right...

He made some mistakes when he was called up last yr. in his first game, because he was nervous. He was not the same player that night....he wasn't sure where to be on the ice..he was trying to move the puck too quickly...stuff he doesnt do when he is playing his game.

He made the one mistake behind his net that lead to the goal and never got to play another game. Yet scrubs like Kraft keep getting chances to prove themselves.

I am tired of watching Lupy get shafted...they need to let him play and live with his mistakes..because his offense will more than make up for any "rookie" mistakes...unlike other D -men on this team who make "veteran" mistakes and don't have the offensive abilities to change a game around.

Lupy is a difference maker...pure and simple. Pens have zero difference makers on the blueline....Tarnstroms offensive game in comparison to Lupy's is a joke..not even close.

I guess it is more important to have Berehowsky, Focht and Bergevin on the team...they are such outstanding talents and have such huge upside...nevermind that 2 of them are over 30...

They are on the team to bring veteran leadership..right right....what was I thinking? Not like Berehowsky gets pissed on every shift and Bergevin almost put a goal in his own net last night...but those are "veteran" mistakes...they don't count as much as "rookie" mistakes.
I'm with you on Lupaschuk. He's guy that should play instead of the Berehowkys and Bergevins.
However, I also say : play Focht and Kraft. Let them show what they can do, through their mistakes. Give them icetime, like Lupaschuk to show their stuff.
It's not like we're contenders. We can afford costly mistakes.
Play them and after 25 games, you'll know what to make of them (trade them, dump them or keep them).
I've been saying all along that young guys should have the priorities over veterans this year. Because we're not going to win that many games, and because we CAN afford to lose because of rookie mistakes.
The reward can also be great when a young guy gets his confidence at the NHL level.
These guys are real talent. Let them show their stuff.

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Old
10-23-2003, 12:29 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Crystal(M)eth
On a side note, anyone see the Fluery interview after the game?

He is still learning English..and was asked about the play where he came out...and he said..."I got uh..what is it.. screwed?" lmao..
I noticed that, and wondered "Did he say that?" That's our Fleury!!!

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10-23-2003, 01:44 PM
  #62
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I watched last night's game, and have to say there are a few worrying points in our play. Going by the age-old saying 'you have to shoot to score', I was getting so frustrated at the lack of shots fired on goal, especially on the PP. Tarnstrom, Straka and Lemieux seemed more content to pass the shooting responsibilities to each other, and I think between them they passed up 7-10 shooting opportunities.

I understand it would be nice to pass and create a clear cut opportunity, but sometimes just shooting the damn puck should be the option to take. In theory, a shot on goal has a chance of either going straight in, getting deflected in, or generating a good rebound or two. A passing triangle of Lemiuex, Tarnstrom and Straka does not do that. Our powerplay is not an elite unit made up of 5 all stars, but they certainly can be an effective powerplay if they varied their approaches and shot more.

Shooting more brings me to the defensemen we use. I agree with the previous posters that it makes much more sense to have Lupaschuk up in Pittsburgh learning his trade. Noone likes mistakes being made, but when they are currently being made by our supposed experienced veterans, it gets frustrating. I know it wont happen, but I'd rather see Lupaschuk and perhaps even Patrick Boileau up here. Lupaschuk would obviously add a great weapon to the PP. Am not sure if Boileau can play PP, but he might play defense better than some of the present bunch.

On defense, I feel the best two are Tarnstrom and Orpik, with Melichar getting better with each game as his confidence in his shoulder improves. Focht hasnt had the best impact yet, and the dreaded killer B's of Baumgartner, Bergevin and Berehowsky have been more dangerous to us. One thing I am a little baffled in aside from the personnel choice. If we are having Bergevin and I think its Focht playing as leftie defensemen (which can cause problems), why are we playing Bergevin over Baumgartner. Granted, neither has played great, but isnt Baumgartner a leftie? Why not play the defenseman who is comfortable playing on the left.

All in all, we got a point. Fleury's performance was again good (he needs to improve puck handling and to cut down on the juicy rebounds he is sometimes leaving). Fata skated with purpose and was perhaps our most hungry forward along with Koltsov and Bradley. However, I do feel that last night's game was one point lost. Perhaps the most disappointing was the quiet crowd and the lack of effort shown by the Pens on their two timely penalties - both at the end of the third.

Here's hoping for a better showing, and perhaps for Lupaschuk to get a call from Pittsburgh

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Old
10-23-2003, 02:48 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by GoPenguins

but isnt Baumgartner a leftie? Why not play the defenseman who is comfortable playing on the left.



Here's hoping for a better showing, and perhaps for Lupaschuk to get a call from Pittsburgh
no, Baumer is a rightie, which i think is why they picked him, to replace Roszival while he is gone. also, i dont see Lupo being brought up unless Tarnstrom and Roszival/Baumer are out too. it seemed he was still too much of a liability on D in rpeseason, so i think they will wait, at least for 1/3 of the season.

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