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Grebs sent down

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Old
01-18-2006, 03:50 PM
  #1
Game Misconduct
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Grebs sent down

from lakings.com:

LOS ANGELES The Los Angeles Kings have assigned defenseman Denis Grebeshkov to the Manchester Monarchs of the American Hockey League (AHL), Kings President, Hockey Operations/General Manager Dave Taylor announced today.

Grebeshkov, 22, has played in eight games with the Kings this season, recording two points (both assists) and 12 penalty minutes, and was recently selected to represent Planet USA at the AHL All-Star Game on February 1. He was most recently recalled by the Kings on December 26, and at the time of the recall, he was leading all Monarchs defensemen with 16 points (0-16=16) this season, while also accumulating 41 penalty minutes and a plus-4 rating in 28 games with the Monarchs.

A 6-1, 195-pound native of Yaroslavl, Russia, Grebeshkov was originally selected by the Kings in the first-round (18th overall) in the 2002 NHL Entry Draft. In 12 career NHL games, all with the Kings, he has three points (all assists) and 12 penalty minutes.

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01-18-2006, 03:55 PM
  #2
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No - No - No

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Old
01-18-2006, 03:58 PM
  #3
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thank the maker!

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Old
01-18-2006, 04:11 PM
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I leave the board for a half-hour to drive home and this happens.

Fortunately, the Monarchs are on the road for the next little bit and we'll have time to prepare ourselves for his return to Manchester...

On an up note, the Monarchs are heading out for a mid-west road trip tomorrow and maybe Grebs can benifit from some team bonding...

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Old
01-18-2006, 05:35 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Blazer
I leave the board for a half-hour to drive home and this happens.

Fortunately, the Monarchs are on the road for the next little bit and we'll have time to prepare ourselves for his return to Manchester...

On an up note, the Monarchs are heading out for a mid-west road trip tomorrow and maybe Grebs can benifit from some team bonding...
or, even better, someone could throw him off of or under the team bus.

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01-18-2006, 08:14 PM
  #6
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This infuriates me. We could all see how green Denis was, yet he was thrown out there with Corvo, one of the least defensively-capable blueliners on the team, and was allowed to sink. Instead of giving him the best chance to succeed (ex. by pairing him with Norstrom), Andy gave him the best chance to fail. He was a rookie. Who do you see other coaches pair rookies with? Yes, with solid, experienced defensemen. Do you ever see good coaches pair together two suspect defensemen like Grebeshkov and Corvo and hand them 20 minutes? Of course not.

Gleason was allowed to work through his growing pains by being paired with Miller and look how he's grown into the role of an NHL defenseman. Not surprisingly, Tim hasn't looked quite as good since Miller went out with an injury. Miller means a lot to his development. Grebeshkov could've greatly benefited from the same sort of tutelage, but was given no such equal opportunity. Instead of the situation being corrected, the coaching blunder has been covered up by getting rid of the victim.

I know that many of you will think that I'm over-reacting and that Grebeshkov doomed himself, but I'm tired of AM's games and unaccountability. Denis didn't help his case out any, but the coaches didn't help it either, and that's where I expect it. You should know from years of following hockey that it's rarely as cut and dry as being only the rookie's fault. Coaches do make major blunders and AM's handling of this rookie is one of them, IMO.


Last edited by Osprey: 01-18-2006 at 08:25 PM.
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01-18-2006, 08:23 PM
  #7
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I have to agree that the pairing of Grebs and corvo was just plain idiotic. His downfall began with this pairing. One of my biggest knocks against corvo is his complete inability to make his linemates better. Grebs would have been better off out there by himself

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01-18-2006, 08:30 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KING ELVI
I have to agree that the pairing of Grebs and corvo was just plain idiotic. His downfall began with this pairing.
Right. Remember how Grebeshkov looked in his first half-dozen games? Aside from a few rookie mistakes, he looked pretty good. That changed as soon as Visnovsky went out with injury two games ago and the Grebeshkov-Corvo pairing disaster was born. You can pretty much trace his sudden suckiness to that.

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01-18-2006, 08:38 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
Right. Remember how Grebeshkov looked in his first half-dozen games? Aside from a few rookie mistakes, he looked pretty good. That changed as soon as Visnovsky went out with injury two games ago and the Grebeshkov-Corvo pairing disaster was born. You can pretty much trace his sudden suckiness to that.
Ummm...yeah...I'm gonna have to sort of disagree with you there...

He's just not ready...

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Old
01-18-2006, 08:53 PM
  #10
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I think we're just trying to find that elusive #6 defenseman. Grebeshkov was given the first chance. He has a history in the pros. But listen, he is supposed to be responsible for his game. Andy Murray or Joe Corvo or Pete Demers are not responsible for his game. His game was lacking in several areas. Grebs needs more seasoning whether he or we like it. Petiot is the next best shot.

Pure speculation: Find a Dman or forward in the system before the the deadline and shop for 1 established player. It is more efficient than having to find the money for both a forward and a Dman. From what we've heard through the grapevine I think Taylor wanted Kopitar to be the forward and shop for D. But Anze wants to stay Euro. So, now, Taylor is hoping that Petiot fills the bill. This also saves the resources that have been built up in the minors and our pix. Taylor really likes to sheppard resources. Panic button? We don't need no steekeen panic button. Not yet at least.

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01-18-2006, 09:01 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Blazer
He's just not ready...
Not ready to be paired with just anyone and in any situation, no; how many rookies are? He sure looked ready in his first 4 or 5 games, but we just won't know for sure now. AM seemed interested more in labeling Grebeshkov as the problem than anything that he or his staff may be responsible for.

guz, Grebeshkov certainly is lacking in several areas, I agree, but many players in recent years have been lacking and have been coddled by the Kings. If Grebeshkov had been experimented with Norstrom or at least moved back to playing with someone other than Corvo (as he started the season, rather well, I might add) and he continued to stink, I'd agree that he's not ready and approve of him being sent down. What bugs me is AM made no effort to work with his deficiencies and find a place on the team that suited him. It was two straight poor games playing with Corvo and yer outta here. Forwards are tried in many positions on many lines before they're given up on, but AM seems to have these rigid defensive pairings that you need to fit into or you're gone.


Last edited by Osprey: 01-18-2006 at 09:14 PM.
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Old
01-18-2006, 09:21 PM
  #12
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Originally Posted by Osprey
Forwards are tried in many positions on many lines before they're given up on,
Unless your name is Cammalleri.

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Old
01-18-2006, 09:50 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
Not ready to be paired with just anyone and in any situation, no; how many rookies are? He sure looked ready in his first 4 or 5 games, but we just won't know for sure now. AM seemed interested more in labeling Grebeshkov as the problem than anything that he or his staff may be responsible for.

guz, Grebeshkov certainly is lacking in several areas, I agree, but many players in recent years have been lacking and have been coddled by the Kings. If Grebeshkov had been experimented with Norstrom or at least moved back to playing with someone other than Corvo (as he started the season, rather well, I might add) and he continued to stink, I'd agree that he's not ready and approve of him being sent down. What bugs me is AM made no effort to work with his deficiencies and find a place on the team that suited him. It was two straight poor games playing with Corvo and yer outta here. Forwards are tried in many positions on many lines before they're given up on, but AM seems to have these rigid defensive pairings that you need to fit into or you're gone.
Quit making excuses for Grebeshkov. He started playing with Gleason, and when Visnovsky went down, they moved him with Corvo. All the Monarchs fans have been hard on his lapses since last season, when he posted all-star numbers in the AHL.

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01-18-2006, 09:57 PM
  #14
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Originally Posted by MrKen48
Unless your name is Cammalleri.
Good thing AM couldn't send him away like he could Grebeshkov, because look how Mike is doing. For those who choose to credit AM with turning Cammalleri around, why couldn't he do it with Grebeshkov?

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01-18-2006, 10:01 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
Good thing AM couldn't send him down like he could Grebeshkov, because look how Mike is doing. For those who choose to credit AM with turning Cammalleri around, why couldn't he do it with Grebeshkov?
Because he hasn't reached Roster Player status yet.

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01-18-2006, 10:04 PM
  #16
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Originally Posted by kingsfan25
Because he hasn't reached Roster Player status yet.
I think that you missed my sarcasm

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01-18-2006, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guzmania
I think we're just trying to find that elusive #6 defenseman. Grebeshkov was given the first chance. He has a history in the pros. But listen, he is supposed to be responsible for his game. Andy Murray or Joe Corvo or Pete Demers are not responsible for his game. His game was lacking in several areas. Grebs needs more seasoning whether he or we like it. Petiot is the next best shot.

Pure speculation: Find a Dman or forward in the system before the the deadline and shop for 1 established player. It is more efficient than having to find the money for both a forward and a Dman. From what we've heard through the grapevine I think Taylor wanted Kopitar to be the forward and shop for D. But Anze wants to stay Euro. So, now, Taylor is hoping that Petiot fills the bill. This also saves the resources that have been built up in the minors and our pix. Taylor really likes to sheppard resources. Panic button? We don't need no steekeen panic button. Not yet at least.
McSorley said almost the same thing about it not being panic time on the SCSR last night. Hmmmm.. We definitely need defensive help, especially while so many of our forwards are incapacitated. I just don't see DT going out and getting some help.

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01-18-2006, 10:13 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust
Quit making excuses for Grebeshkov. He started playing with Gleason, and when Visnovsky went down, they moved him with Corvo.
You're telling me to quit making excuses for him, but you just detailed the pairing change that coincided with his drop in play. Why did you mention who he played with before and after if you weren't agreeing with my point?

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Old
01-18-2006, 10:18 PM
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Ziggy Stardust
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
You're telling me to quit making excuses for him, but you just detailed the pairing change that coincided with his drop in play. Why did you mention who he played with before and after if you weren't agreeing with my point?
It doesn't matter who his defensive partner was, Grebeshkov's mistakes weren't caused due to miscues from his defense partner. What is Grebeshkov's excuse for making the same mistakes in Manchester?

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01-18-2006, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust
It doesn't matter who his defensive partner was...
It doesn't? He was pretty good in his first half-dozen games, remember? He only really stunk the first and only two games that he was paired with Corvo. That's a mighty large coincidence if that's what you're suggesting.
Quote:
What is Grebeshkov's excuse for making the same mistakes in Manchester?
I'm not excusing his mistakes. I'm saying that they might've been minimized and tolerated if he had been paired with someone who is defensively responsible. It worked for Gleason (who hasn't been as solid without Miller as he was with him). At the very least, I would've liked such a pairing to be given a chance before throwing the fish back. That's often how players are given up on and go on to have good careers for other teams: the coach tries to fit the player into a role of his choosing instead of being flexible and patient enough to find the role that fits the player.

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01-18-2006, 10:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
It doesn't? He was pretty good in his first half-dozen games, remember? He only really stunk the first and only two games that he was paired with Corvo. That's a mighty large coincidence if that's what you're suggesting.
Grebeshkov's worst game was against Anaheim. He gave the puck away twice. That wasn't his defense partner's fault, and he was paired with Gleason in that game. Quit blaming the coaching staff for Grebeshkov's ineptness. If he isn't ready, as you stated, then perhaps he should go back and learn how to play defense in Manchester, where he continues to struggle in his own end.

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01-19-2006, 12:48 AM
  #22
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust
Quit blaming the coaching staff for Grebeshkov's ineptness.
C'mon, Ziggy, you can argue your position without playing the "Quit it" game. I almost expect a "" each time you do

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01-19-2006, 12:56 AM
  #23
Ziggy Stardust
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You are using an easy cop out by excusing Grebeshkov's on-ice brain farts and blaming it on his defense pairing partner or the coaching staff. He gave the Ducks two breakaways due to his inability to get rid of the puck when he should have. And those aren't his only mistakes, and they still stuck with him even after that brutal game.

He hangs on to the puck too long and makes terrible passes that put his linemates in a bad position. Ask Monarchs fans who have watched him for over two seasons what they think of him and his all-star numbers in the AHL. It isn't the coaching staff's fault that Grebeshkov is inept in his own end.

The coaching staff doesn't instruct players to pass the puck to the opposition. I don't think they are too fond of a player when he coughs the puck up, and he just happens to be the last man back. He looks nervous and unprepared out there, so I guess you can blame management for making the mistake of calling up a player who clearly isn't ready to step up and play in the big leagues.

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01-19-2006, 01:21 AM
  #24
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust
You are using an easy cop out by excusing Grebeshkov's on-ice brain farts and blaming it on his defense pairing partner or the coaching staff.
I've already said that I'm not excusing his mistakes or blaming them on others, but I'm not going to repeat myself. I refer you to my earlier posts in this thread.

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01-19-2006, 01:30 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
I've already said that I'm not excusing his mistakes or blaming them on others, but I'm not going to repeat myself. I refer you to my earlier posts in this thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
I'm saying that they might've been minimized and tolerated if he had been paired with someone who is defensively responsible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osprey
Andy gave him the best chance to fail. He was a rookie. Who do you see other coaches pair rookies with? Yes, with solid, experienced defensemen.

Coaches do make major blunders and AM's handling of this rookie is one of them, IMO.
From what you are saying, it is everyone's fault, except for Grebeshkov. Doesn't sound like you hold Grebeshkov accountable. Look at other first year NHL rookies, Phaneuf, Meszaros (both of whom went straight to the NHL after juniors). Look at all the other rookies enjoying success in their first pro seasons. Seabrook, Campoli, Ballard, Tyutin, Keith, etc. They all look like seasoned vets compared to Grebeshkov.

I'm sorry but I prefer to hold a player accountable for his actions on the ice. I can't fault Andy Murray or Bruce Boudreau or Jim Hughes or Mark Hardy over Grebeshkov's mental breakdowns on the ice.

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