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GDT: Philadelphia Flyers @ Pittsburgh Penguins , Jan 21st, 2:00pm, NBC

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Old
01-20-2006, 10:33 AM
  #1
Art Vandelay
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GDT: Philadelphia Flyers @ Pittsburgh Penguins , Jan 21st, 2:00pm, NBC

I'll start this one early, it's the lowly Penguins after all. Please keep the Crosby talk to a minimum, there is enough of that on the main hockey board and you'll just end up getting this thread closed

TV: NBC, Radio: WIP

Philadelphia Flyers vs.Pittsburgh Penguins
vs.
(28-11-8) vs. (11-27-9)
Last 20 Encounters:
(W-L-T-OTL)

12-3-4-1


03/04 Season Series:
(W-T-OTL)

Flyers
: 3-0-1


Home/Road Records:
Penguinsat Home: 6-13-5
Flyers on the Road: 15-5-3



Projected Starting Goalies:
#42 Robert Esche
05/06: (11-4-2, 3.14GAA, .890Sv%, 2 SO)
Career vs. PIT: (2-2-2, 2.48
GAA, .891Sv%, 0 SO)

#29 Marc-Andre Fleury
05/06: (5-14-3, 3.23GAA, .899Sv%, 0 SO)
Career vs. PHI: (1-1-0, 4.48GAA, .889Sv%, 0 SO)




Projected Lineups:
Philadelphia

Simon Gagne -
Michal Handzus - Mike Knuble
Sami Kapanen - Petr Nedved - Branko Radivojevic
Brian Savage - Mike Richards - Turner Stevenson
Donald Brashear -Jeff Carter - R.J Umberger

Joni Pitkanen - Mike Rathje
Freddy Meyer - Derian Hatcher
Chris Therien - Randy Jones

Antero Niittymaki
Robert Esche


Pittsburgh
Tomas Surovy - Sidney Crosby - Colby Armstrong
John LeClair - Ryan Malone - Mark Recchi
Konstantin Koltsov- Shane Endicott - Michel Oullet
Guillaume Lefebvre - Maxime Talbot - Eric Boguniecki

Sergei Gonchar - Josef Melichar
Dick Tarnstrom - Robert Scuderi
Ric Jackman - Eric Cairns

Marc-Andre Fleury
Sebastien Caron




Top Point Producers vs Opponent:(healthy)
Philadelphia

(Player GP-G-A-P +/- PIM)
Sami Kapanen
40-13-13-26 +6 8
Simon Gagne 26-9-16-25 +8 6
Turner Stevenson 43
-10-13-23 +25 34
Petr Nedved 35-13-9-22 -13 18
Kim Johnsson 29-2-15-17 -6 10

Pittsburgh
(Player GP-G-A-P +/- PIM)
Mark Recchi 43-11-28-39 -19 27
Sergei Gonchar 38-7-13-20 -3 44
Lyle Odelein 53-3-9-12 -2 185
John LeClair 15-3-8-11 +3 10
Sidney Crosby 4-6-3-9 +1 4




Team Leaders: (healthy)
Philadelphia

Goals: Simon Gagne (32)
Assists: Michal Handzus (28)
Points: Simon Gagne (56)
+/-:
Simon Gagne (+23)
PIM: Donald Brashear (57)
Shots:
Simon Gagne (206)
TOI/G (D): Derian Hatcher (24:30)
TOI/G (F): Simon Gagne (21:22)


Pittsburgh
Goals: Sidney Crosby (23)
Assists: Sidney Crosby (30)
Points: Sidney Crosby (53)
+/-: Eric Cairns (+1)
PIM: Sidney Crosby (72)
Shots: Sidney Crosby (160)
TOI/G (D): Sergei Gonchar (24:22)
TOI/G (F): Mark Recchi (20:54)




Team Stats:
Philadelphia
|Wins|Loss|OTL |Pts |Win%|G/G |GA/G|PP% |PK% |FO% |
| 28 | 11 | 8 .| 64 |.681|3.51|3.06|18.4|79.7|49.7|
|7th |28th|3rd |4th |4th |6th |14th|13th|25th|15th|

Pittsburgh
|Wins|Loss|OTL |Pts |Win%|G/G |GA/G|PP% |PK% |FO% |
| 11| 27| 9 .| 31 |.330|2.74|3.98|17.6|78.5|46.8|
|29th|3rd |1st |29th|29th|25th|30th|15th|29th|30th|




Injuries:
Philadelphia
Peter Forsberg - Mild left groin strain, Day-to-day
Eric Desjardins - Right shoulder subluxation, February
Keith Primeau - Concussion, Out indefinitely


Pittsburgh
Brooks Orpik - Broken foot, early February
Mario Lemieux - Irregular Heartbeat, sidelined indefinitely
Matt Murley - Shoulder injury, sidelined indefinitely
Jocelyn Thibault - Hip surgery, sidelined indefinitely
Ryan Vandenbussche - Cervical strain, sidelined indefinitely




Quote:

Pitkanen, Esche return

Flyers coach Ken Hitchock said last night that defenseman Joni Pitkanen and goalie Robert Esche will return tomorrow, but that Esche will serve in a backup role for the Penguins game.

"Joni's going to play Saturday," Hitchock said.
Quote:




Last edited by Art Vandelay: 01-21-2006 at 01:38 PM.
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Old
01-20-2006, 10:54 AM
  #2
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Hopefully it turns out better than it did against the "lowly" Bruins.This skid needs to be turned around now. Divisional games are were it's at !!!!!

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01-20-2006, 11:03 AM
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i think Hitch is still gonna be stupid, and start Nitty again


4-3 penguins

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01-20-2006, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Flyers_
i think Hitch is still gonna be stupid, and start Nitty again


4-3 penguins
Nitty needs a rest.

The Flyers better look out that the Pens acquired Cairns. He will be looking for retribution and will go after any player that hits Crosby. The Flyers I hope don’t come out scared because of this. Brashear doesn’t fight anymore so who is going to protect our players? They may be very intimidated!

Hope Forsberg plays though as he is obviously sorely needed.

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01-20-2006, 11:51 AM
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GO FLYERS!!!

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01-20-2006, 12:09 PM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Flyers_
i think Hitch is still gonna be stupid, and start Nitty again


4-3 penguins

Why is Hitch stupid for playing him?

All I hear on these boards is how Nitty should be the number one guy.
Well this is how you figure it out.
Anyone one ever think Hitch is trying to see how Nitty holds up in a slump.
Ever think Hitch is seeing what Nitty is made to determine his playoff ability?
That whole tired crap is an excuse. Nitty needs to suck it up and rebound from the past few games.

everyone *****es about having a playoff goalie, well lets see if we have one.
NOW, not during the playoffs.
You want to take a run at the cup with a goalie that can't get through difficult times?

Look at cup winning goalies. think they can just be tired. Think it is going to get easier in the playoffs?

think there wont be times when Nitty would be beat up exausted in the playoffs?

the tired crap excuse needs to end. nitty is a young guy that should be able to handle the load. I'd much rather find out what we have now than in the playoffs.

there is no resting in the playoff

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01-20-2006, 12:12 PM
  #7
Dr Love
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodOnTheIce
Why is Hitch stupid for playing him?

All I hear on these boards is how Nitty should be the number one guy.
Well this is how you figure it out.
Anyone one ever think Hitch is trying to see how Nitty holds up in a slump.
Ever think Hitch is seeing what Nitty is made to determine his playoff ability?
That whole tired crap is an excuse. Nitty needs to suck it up and rebound from the past few games.
17 straight games is a lot. Only guys like Brodeur and Luongo can and do pull that off.

Quote:
everyone *****es about having a playoff goalie, well lets see if we have one.
NOW, not during the playoffs.
You want to take a run at the cup with a goalie that can't get through difficult times?
You want to run him dog tired before the playoffs even begin?

Quote:
Look at cup winning goalies. think they can just be tired. Think it is going to get easier in the playoffs?
They also catch a break before the playoffs begin, and there aren't many back to back games in the playoffs.

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01-20-2006, 12:30 PM
  #8
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Nitty as proved more than he has needed to. Esche should get the start on Tuesday as he was schedualed purley as a back up for the game in Pitt. As good as Nitty has played I would love to see Esche come and steal this show...if he is as good as Nitty on regular shots he should keep the job because Nitty cant stop a breakaway for his life, anything Esce does would be an improvement. Remeber all the time that Esche stugled this season he was playing though this injury. Finally get Joni back against "the worst defence in the league"

5-3 Flyers

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01-20-2006, 12:45 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Love
17 straight games is a lot. Only guys like Brodeur and Luongo can and do pull that off.



You want to run him dog tired before the playoffs even begin?



They also catch a break before the playoffs begin, and there aren't many back to back games in the playoffs.

17 game is a lot. But tell me, do you want Esche for the payoffs or Nitty? what are you going to base it off? For me this is big. Nitty is a rookie. If I am going to the playoffs with the rookie then I want to see what has in the tank.

run him dog tired before the payoffs? um, it is january. he can get plenty of rest before the playoffs. i don't know where you were going with that. I never said "now starting forever Nitty"

yeah there aren't many back to back game in the playoffs. so are you saying the payoffs are easier?

Nitty is going to get a break. Esche will come back and rest will be available.
Your arguement of burning him out is unfounded. If this was mid- March then I would agree.

Right now Nitty has a chance to learn. He has to learn you have to fight through being tired. You have to fight through hard times. It is critical experience.

If he can learn that now, it makes him a better canidate for the playoffs.

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01-20-2006, 12:59 PM
  #10
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it WILL get better in the playoffs...didn't nitty win 9 of 11 on that roadtrip? if he kept that level of play up in the playoffs, they'd be winning 4 and 5 game series...which means everyone gets a break, and nitty isn't playing back-to-back games...we could also have a pretty nasty tandem with esche spelling nitty in the playoffs, or vice versa

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01-20-2006, 01:04 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodOnTheIce
17 game is a lot. But tell me, do you want Esche for the payoffs or Nitty? what are you going to base it off?
Frank is clearly the best goalie on the team. How many games in a row do you want him to play? 30?


Quote:
For me this is big. Nitty is a rookie. If I am going to the playoffs with the rookie then I want to see what has in the tank.
At this rate you're going to run out of gas. He needs a night off to fill up.

Quote:
run him dog tired before the payoffs? um, it is january. he can get plenty of rest before the playoffs. i don't know where you were going with that.
And he's got the Olympics coming up, and then the rest of the season. One night off.


Quote:
yeah there aren't many back to back game in the playoffs. so are you saying the payoffs are easier?
Where did I say that? Where? Use some common sense, without the back to back games, he gets more rest.

Quote:
Right now Nitty has a chance to learn.
Learn what? The playoffs last year weren't enough to show you he has the stamina? Going 8-2-1 on a 11 game road trip wasn't enough?

Quote:
He has to learn you have to fight through being tired. You have to fight through hard times. It is critical experience.
He's done that already. The guy just needs one night off. Yeesh.

Quote:
If he can learn that now, it makes him a better canidate for the playoffs.
Candidate? He better be the starter in the playoffs.

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01-20-2006, 01:05 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GameFace247SON
it WILL get better in the playoffs...didn't nitty win 9 of 11 on that roadtrip? if he kept that level of play up in the playoffs, they'd be winning 4 and 5 game series...which means everyone gets a break, and nitty isn't playing back-to-back games...we could also have a pretty nasty tandem with esche spelling nitty in the playoffs, or vice versa

show me where it has been benefical in winning the Cup to have a playoff tandem

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01-20-2006, 01:44 PM
  #13
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It's on TV, and I get to see it. I think the slump will continue.

Turner Stevenson has to be one of the slowest skaters in the league. Watching him Thursday makes me wonder how or why he's playing over Eager, other than the contract part.

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01-20-2006, 01:46 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Love
Frank is clearly the best goalie on the team. How many games in a row do you want him to play? 30?

At this rate you're going to run out of gas. He needs a night off to fill up.

And he's got the Olympics coming up, and then the rest of the season. One night off.

Where did I say that? Where? Use some common sense, without the back to back games, he gets more rest.

Learn what? The playoffs last year weren't enough to show you he has the stamina? Going 8-2-1 on a 11 game road trip wasn't enough?

He's done that already. The guy just needs one night off. Yeesh.

Candidate? He better be the starter in the playoffs.
I never said he had to play a certain number. I think he benefits from playing now.

Did you read? I said he will get rest. He will get plenty of rest. Esche is coming back and he will be rested.
Use common sense? did you read what you typed? By stating there are no back to back games in the playoffs you are implying that it will be easier because there is more rest? what? no **** sherlock there is more rest, but there is no break in intensity. a playoff run will be far more demanding than this strech.

playoffs last year. sure, he shown what it takes to win at the AHL level.
and sure the 11 game trip was impressive. Is that enough to prove to me that he can be a playoff goalie? No

How can you say he has already learned to battle through adversity while tired?
This is his first real test, at the NHL level, of a slump. Had he worked through something like this before then ok you have an agruement. But he hasn't been through a NHL slump yet. I want to see how he works through it. The best goalie on the team shrugs off the losses, shrugs off being tired, and goes out to win.
Frank needs to prove that. He is not a proven goalie yet. I guess if half a season convinces you then good for you, but I'm not conviced yet. call me hard headed or whatever you want, but if you are completely comfortable with our playoff goalie situation, then you are better than me.

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01-20-2006, 01:47 PM
  #15
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Joni's Back!!!



We're going to see alot more of this come game time...link He will devour Sidney Crosby and terrorize Pittsburgh like Godzilla on vacation in Iwo Jima. He will single handedly lift Hitch into the stratosphere to look down on all of Therien's (god for you non-Flyer fans) creatures and spit on them! This will be the most convincing win the Flyers have ever seen since the last one they had and when we look back, we can say it's because of Pitkanen. The same Pitkanen that invented ice hockey arenas prior to being born so that he would have entertainment aside from laughing at HFs 'Pitkanen vs. McCabe' poll.

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01-20-2006, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyerfanofthepeg
It's on TV, and I get to see it. I think the slump will continue.

Turner Stevenson has to be one of the slowest skaters in the league. Watching him Thursday makes me wonder how or why he's playing over Eager, other than the contract part.
Turner Stevenson makes at least 300 K more than Benny. The only way I can justify Stevenson being on the ice is because he plays on the PK (quite crappily if I may add) and he's a vateran (aka worn out injury prone checking-line winger who just had a good season but is turning out to be a bust because of how much time he spends on the pine). [damn that was one long run on sentance.]

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01-20-2006, 01:55 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodOnTheIce
I never said he had to play a certain number. I think he benefits from playing now.
How does playing now benefit him over getting a night off?

Quote:
Did you read? I said he will get rest. He will get plenty of rest. Esche is coming back and he will be rested.
Yeah, 'cause last time Esche came back, he got plenty of rest.

Quote:
Use common sense? did you read what you typed? By stating there are no back to back games in the playoffs you are implying that it will be easier because there is more rest? what? no **** sherlock there is more rest
Of course now you realize that point after it's been pointed out to you.


Quote:
but there is no break in intensity. a playoff run will be far more demanding than this strech.
I never said otherwise.


Quote:
playoffs last year. sure, he shown what it takes to win at the AHL level.
In the most talent-laden AHL season.

Quote:
and sure the 11 game trip was impressive. Is that enough to prove to me that he can be a playoff goalie? No
An 18th straight start against the lowly Penguins isn't going to make or break his ability to be a playoff goalie.

Quote:
How can you say he has already learned to battle through adversity while tired?
Because this isn't the first time in his career he's done it.

Quote:
This is his first real test, at the NHL level, of a slump. Had he worked through something like this before then ok you have an agruement. But he hasn't been through a NHL slump yet. I want to see how he works through it. The best goalie on the team shrugs off the losses, shrugs off being tired, and goes out to win.
And sometimes a guy needs a night off when there's back to back games. I said this about the Chicago game and since that game the Flyers are 1-4.

Quote:
Frank needs to prove that. He is not a proven goalie yet. I guess if half a season convinces you then good for you, but I'm not conviced yet. call me hard headed or whatever you want, but if you are completely comfortable with our playoff goalie situation, then you are better than me.
I'm comfortable with Frank in goal, I am not with Esche in goal. And it's going to be one of those two come playoff time.

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01-20-2006, 02:15 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic Youth
Turner Stevenson makes at least 300 K more than Benny. The only way I can justify Stevenson being on the ice is because he plays on the PK (quite crappily if I may add) and he's a vateran (aka worn out injury prone checking-line winger who just had a good season but is turning out to be a bust because of how much time he spends on the pine). [damn that was one long run on sentance.]
he's a better player than Eager right now... that may change in time, but for right now he's a better option. he JUST got back... give him a week or two before you start railing on him.

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01-20-2006, 02:30 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Love
How does playing now benefit him over getting a night off?



Yeah, 'cause last time Esche came back, he got plenty of rest.



Of course now you realize that point after it's been pointed out to you.




I never said otherwise.




In the most talent-laden AHL season.



An 18th straight start against the lowly Penguins isn't going to make or break his ability to be a playoff goalie.



Because this isn't the first time in his career he's done it.



And sometimes a guy needs a night off when there's back to back games. I said this about the Chicago game and since that game the Flyers are 1-4.



I'm comfortable with Frank in goal, I am not with Esche in goal. And it's going to be one of those two come playoff time.

okay, now i have a headache.
guess we just see things different

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01-20-2006, 02:48 PM
  #20
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i hope randy jones doesnt play. meyer deserves the spot over him. jones turnovers/misreads lead to 3 of bostons goals last night.

and anyone think nedved might play tomorow?

and nitty does deserve a break. 17 games in a row is a lot for him, and it would be a lot for esche. there both young around the same age. and maybe with eshce having to battke for the number 1 spot will step up his game.

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01-20-2006, 02:51 PM
  #21
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2-2 after OT. Open Shootout.

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01-20-2006, 03:00 PM
  #22
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Is Nedved gonna play tomorrow night?

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01-20-2006, 03:26 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodOnTheIce
show me where it has been benefical in winning the Cup to have a playoff tandem
the wild reached the conference finals in '03 with fernandez and rolston trading games...and i'd take esche and nitty over those two, both individually and as a pair

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01-20-2006, 03:30 PM
  #24
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Lets assume Nedved is in, what's your lines for tommorow?

Gagne - Handzus - Kapanen
Nedved - Richards - Knuble
Savage - Carter - Stevenson
Brashear - Umberger - Radivojevic




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01-20-2006, 03:48 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GameFace247SON
the wild reached the conference finals in '03 with fernandez and rolston trading games...and i'd take esche and nitty over those two, both individually and as a pair
and did they win the cup? cup teams don't tandem goalies

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