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Old
02-14-2017, 02:36 PM
  #76
David Singleton
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Originally Posted by PeterLax View Post
I'd be all in for Duchene, more players from central Ontario the better. As long as he works out better than our pickup from Haliburton.

I think you have to take into account the probable increase in protection slots as well, if the deal revolves around Ekholm. It would be foolish to not include Ekholm, as you'd be losing him or someone like Arvidsson if we did a deal revolving around prospects. If we went from 8-1 to 7-3-1, not only do you get to hold onto Jarnkrok and Arvidsson, you can essentially decide who you want to send to Vegas, since we will only have one halfway decent option.

I think the reasonable offer would be Ekholm+1st+prospect (Fiala/Fabbro/Girard). I would prefer if we gave up a lesser prospect, but you have to give to get. I wonder what Poile's holdup is, trading Ekholm or the prospect.
If the rumors are to be believed, David has already offered Girard. So a prospect, unless it's one in which he won't give up, would not be the holdup- from the perspective of the Predators.

Regarding Ekholm, I wouldn't want to give him up if it wasn't required. I'd rather keep him for the rest of the year even if I would ultimately lose him in the expansion draft. That said, it's a long ways until the expansion draft and a separate trade with Vegas could also protect Ekholm too.

But, if Ekholm, a 1st and a prospect would fetch Duchene, I'd do it.

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02-14-2017, 02:46 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Drake744 View Post
Local source? No but Swiss outlets say 7. Whatever it is, it's not great whether it's 3, 5 or 7. Duchene has had one.
Duchene had one this season in November and a knee injury last March, and 24 games in 2011 with knee and ankle injuries.

Comparing the health of the 2 shows that Josi has had far less injuries with the 2 concussions he's had since coming to the NHL.

Duchene hasn't had back to back healthy seasons in a long time (2010/2011), Roman has 3 of the last 4.

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02-14-2017, 02:46 PM
  #78
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Everyone keeps talking about the expansion draft, but it seems likely Duchene is traded after the draft anyway. Doesn't sound like Sakic will be getting what he wants before the trade deadline (2 weeks away).

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02-14-2017, 02:48 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by triggrman View Post
Duchene had one this season in November and a knee injury last March, and 24 games in 2011 with knee and ankle injuries.

Comparing the health of the 2 shows that Josi has had far less injuries with the 2 concussions he's had since coming to the NHL.
I seem to recall Josi breaking his wrist during his first NHL training camp. Anyone else remember that?

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02-14-2017, 02:50 PM
  #80
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I seem to recall Josi breaking his wrist during his first NHL training camp. Anyone else remember that?
I remember it being a shoulder injury

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Old
02-14-2017, 02:52 PM
  #81
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regardless, he's been healthy most seasons. His so called injury history isn't bad at all.

I'd worry more about a guy that depends on his speed that has had 2 knee injuries already.....



Edit sorry, 3 knee injuries he also injured his knee in 2014


Last edited by triggrman: 02-14-2017 at 02:59 PM.
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Old
02-14-2017, 03:22 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by David Singleton View Post
If the rumors are to be believed, David has already offered Girard. So a prospect, unless it's one in which he won't give up, would not be the holdup- from the perspective of the Predators.

Regarding Ekholm, I wouldn't want to give him up if it wasn't required. I'd rather keep him for the rest of the year even if I would ultimately lose him in the expansion draft. That said, it's a long ways until the expansion draft and a separate trade with Vegas could also protect Ekholm too.

But, if Ekholm, a 1st and a prospect would fetch Duchene, I'd do it.
From a value standpoint Ekholm, 1st and prospect(Fabbro) would be something that Sakic is looking for. The thing now with so many other teams interested according to the hockey writers not just HF posters would that be a package that another team could not beat? To be honest Duchene could well force Johanson down to the 2C. Duchene scores .341 goals per game Johanson .23 goals per game. Duchene is a .75 point per game player in the NHL and Johanson is .65 points per game over there careers. Johanson cost a potential 1st pair dman so it is not out of the imagination Colorado would want the same or more. With little doubt I think there will be a bidding war for Duchene. If the player had any choice where he wanted to go I think this is one that would choose Nashville due to his reaction from the AS game last year but he has no power of his destination. Could Solorado be tempted by Ekholm and Ellis both and a 1st? A complete number 2 pair? Then what would it do for this team if they were to offer both of those up????? I still think they would prefer Josi + a pick or Subban straight up might get it done. Who knows but I think the move will be made before the trade deadline because they will get more.

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Old
02-14-2017, 08:15 PM
  #83
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Josi or Subban for Duchene would be stupid..

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02-14-2017, 08:47 PM
  #84
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The thing is that at least after the ED, teams won't have a solid top-4. Most teams will go 7-3 route and that usually leaves them with a solid top-3. So we wouldn't be the only team to not have a good top-4.

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02-16-2017, 10:39 AM
  #85
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The thing is that at least after the ED, teams won't have a solid top-4. Most teams will go 7-3 route and that usually leaves them with a solid top-3. So we wouldn't be the only team to not have a good top-4.
If that's accurate, then Poile knows it, too, and might be more likely motivated to hang onto Ek since we'll be "ahead" of most because we have 4 while everyone else is scrambling to find a forth, and the F to replace whoever we lose may fly under the radar and come more reasonably.

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02-16-2017, 11:00 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by deanwormer View Post
If that's accurate, then Poile knows it, too, and might be more likely motivated to hang onto Ek since we'll be "ahead" of most because we have 4 while everyone else is scrambling to find a forth, and the F to replace whoever we lose may fly under the radar and come more reasonably.
We're "ahead" of most other teams now and with the forward group we have, it ain't doing us any good. If you can trade a 2nd pairing LHD plus a prospect and pick for a 1C, you do it. Bottom line.

You snag a rental D this year if necessary and worry about the rest in the offseason. It's a hell of a lot easier to find a 2nd pairing left D than a 1C.

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02-16-2017, 02:26 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Mortiest Morty View Post
We're "ahead" of most other teams now and with the forward group we have, it ain't doing us any good. If you can trade a 2nd pairing LHD plus a prospect and pick for a 1C, you do it. Bottom line.

You snag a rental D this year if necessary and worry about the rest in the offseason. It's a hell of a lot easier to find a 2nd pairing left D than a 1C.
This I agree with.

I just didn't like the Josi for Duchene post, that's absurd and nearly equal in value...

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02-16-2017, 02:31 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Mortiest Morty View Post
We're "ahead" of most other teams now and with the forward group we have, it ain't doing us any good. If you can trade a 2nd pairing LHD plus a prospect and pick for a 1C, you do it. Bottom line.

You snag a rental D this year if necessary and worry about the rest in the offseason. It's a hell of a lot easier to find a 2nd pairing left D than a 1C.
You make it sound as if a 2nd pairing LD just grows on trees. Top LD are nearly as hard to find as the 1C. Why exactly do you think Colorado, Edmonton, and for that matter Montreal or even the Pens have had trouble locating LD. That is not to say that Poile should not trade a top 4 guy to replenish the forwards but it is not as easy as everyone speaks. This team has been blessed with defense for a number of years. But the depth is about gone. If Poile does trade one of them Ekholm or Ellis and either Subban or Josi miss a full season to injury then what? Irwin is not as good as most think in HF world. It was not all that long ago that Granberg was spoken of highly here and now???? Josi could be one hit away from losing a year like Crosby did or heaven forbid put out of the game like Pronger or a host of others. These are the things Poile has to be considering, how far can he dig into the D depth before it ruoins the rest of the team. A case can be made now that he is at that point. Currently the offense night in night out can not score enough to overcome the D and shaky goaltending.

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02-16-2017, 02:45 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
You make it sound as if a 2nd pairing LD just grows on trees. Top LD are nearly as hard to find as the 1C. Why exactly do you think Colorado, Edmonton, and for that matter Montreal or even the Pens have had trouble locating LD. That is not to say that Poile should not trade a top 4 guy to replenish the forwards but it is not as easy as everyone speaks. This team has been blessed with defense for a number of years. But the depth is about gone.
Preds wouldn't be looking for a "Top LD", finding a passable 2nd pairing left D isn't incredibly tough. There is one available in free agency every year. In fact, this offseason may be the easiest in history to find one. Vegas will have an opportunity to pick up plenty of 2nd pairing D-men and they'll likely look to trade from that position of strength to improve their prospect pool and forward group most likely.

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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
If Poile does trade one of them Ekholm or Ellis and either Subban or Josi miss a full season to injury then what? Irwin is not as good as most think in HF world. It was not all that long ago that Granberg was spoken of highly here and now????
You don't pass on a trade because of the threat of a potential injury, that's just flat out ridiculous. What happens if Johansen misses a full season to injury? That sounds a hell of a lot worse than an injury to one of the D-men.

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02-17-2017, 09:59 AM
  #90
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Curious to hear from our Ads fans whether Kamenev looks like a legit option for #2C next season. If so, this may be another reason why the Duchene trade isn't necessarily a perfect fit, unless Kamenev would be one of the pieces going to Colorado in return. Acquiring Duchene would presumably be a long-term play if we are giving up Ekholm or Ellis, so does that mean Fisher would hang around 1 more year and then we slot Kamenev into #3C starting the following year?

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02-17-2017, 10:20 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Mortiest Morty View Post
Preds wouldn't be looking for a "Top LD", finding a passable 2nd pairing left D isn't incredibly tough. There is one available in free agency every year. In fact, this offseason may be the easiest in history to find one. Vegas will have an opportunity to pick up plenty of 2nd pairing D-men and they'll likely look to trade from that position of strength to improve their prospect pool and forward group most likely.



You don't pass on a trade because of the threat of a potential injury, that's just flat out ridiculous. What happens if Johansen misses a full season to injury? That sounds a hell of a lot worse than an injury to one of the D-men.
And you do not castrate a steer because you have already cut his nuts off. The depth of the D here is non existent to replace the top 4 until Fabbro develops and that will be Hmmmm 5 years. Because there is an attractive player out there being shopped why create another hole you have no fill for. Now last year there was an extra defenseman so one could make a move. To not even consider the risk of injury for TWO of the top 4 is beyond dangerous.

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02-17-2017, 10:37 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
And you do not castrate a steer because you have already cut his nuts off. The depth of the D here is non existent to replace the top 4 until Fabbro develops and that will be Hmmmm 5 years. Because there is an attractive player out there being shopped why create another hole you have no fill for. Now last year there was an extra defenseman so one could make a move. To not even consider the risk of injury for TWO of the top 4 is beyond dangerous.
This is one hell of a way to lead off a paragraph.

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Old
02-17-2017, 10:52 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
And you do not castrate a steer because you have already cut his nuts off. The depth of the D here is non existent to replace the top 4 until Fabbro develops and that will be Hmmmm 5 years. Because there is an attractive player out there being shopped why create another hole you have no fill for. Now last year there was an extra defenseman so one could make a move. To not even consider the risk of injury for TWO of the top 4 is beyond dangerous.
What about the risk of injury for those playing as our top TWO centers? What about our top TWO goalies? This risk of injury and its impact can be found anywhere on the roster. And all would be dangerous.

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Old
02-17-2017, 10:55 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
And you do not castrate a steer because you have already cut his nuts off. The depth of the D here is non existent to replace the top 4 until Fabbro develops and that will be Hmmmm 5 years. Because there is an attractive player out there being shopped why create another hole you have no fill for. Now last year there was an extra defenseman so one could make a move. To not even consider the risk of injury for TWO of the top 4 is beyond dangerous.
First off, I don't think that's actually a saying. If it is, it's certainly one I've never heard and I think it's time to put it out to pasture. Hell, if TWO top 4 D could get injured, we should be trading forwards for D-men!!

Center depth right now is worse than defense depth would be post trade. If Johansen is injured you're looking at:

Fisher
Jarnkrok (maybe gone to expansion)
Kamenev (Who probably isn't ready)
Sissons.

Like I said, it's much, much, much easier to get a second pairing LD than a 1C. You're filling a gaping hole with a tremendous player and creating a small hole that can be plugged at the deadline and then filled in the offseason. It's a no-brainer.

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02-17-2017, 12:23 PM
  #95
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I think that's an awesome saying and I will be stealing it.

As for the other, I leave all that discussion to you folks. I will say that I think Jarnkrok is gone after this year and that distresses me.

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Old
02-17-2017, 12:37 PM
  #96
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I think that's an awesome saying and I will be stealing it.

As for the other, I leave all that discussion to you folks. I will say that I think Jarnkrok is gone after this year and that distresses me.

Same here. I believe Jarny is one of our most important players. Although he isn't counted on heavily to produce goals and points, his ability to play any spot in the lineup and make it work makes him extremely valuable. He isn't just a one trick pony like many of our other mid-bottom six.

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02-17-2017, 12:54 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
And you do not castrate a steer because you have already cut his nuts off. The depth of the D here is non existent to replace the top 4 until Fabbro develops and that will be Hmmmm 5 years. Because there is an attractive player out there being shopped why create another hole you have no fill for. Now last year there was an extra defenseman so one could make a move. To not even consider the risk of injury for TWO of the top 4 is beyond dangerous.

Fabbro is another RHD. We may have a Seth Jones situation in a few years or trade one of Ellis/Subban.

He has to develop still though.

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Old
02-17-2017, 05:49 PM
  #98
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I look at it like this, how often do you see 2nd pairing Dmen on the market? It's not rare. How often do you find a top notch Center that would finally push Fisher down to the 3rd line and wouldn't leave us completely neutered if he retired? Not very.

Not to make the trade because of possible injury, or ifs, or what's is silly if it makes your team better both long term and short term.

Any way you want to look at it we don't really have a guy who should be playing #2 center. Right now either Fisher or Jarnkrok is doing it and although not guaranteed, there is a definite possibility that both could be gone before next season kicks off.

Essentially if you don't get someone you are probably looking at

Johansen
Fisher
Kamanev
Sissons

or you are going out once again and praying to god to find a 2 or 3 on the market and hoping Fisher can hold it together another season, assuming the man doesn't go home to chill with his hot ass wife once and for all. If that happens, well have fun with that.

I'd much rather be looking or trying to find a guy to replace Eks than trying to find a 2 and possibly a #3 center in the same off season.

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Old
02-17-2017, 06:11 PM
  #99
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Jarnkrok, still being overlooked....

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Old
02-17-2017, 06:29 PM
  #100
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Jarnkrok, still being overlooked....
No, I don't think he will be here tbh because of the draft.

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