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Old
02-11-2017, 07:20 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
Poti was a young big dman who was on the all rookie team and could skate like the wind. He had just as much if not more value than York at that time and that is reflected in that trade. He also went on to have better years than York after the trade.

2 players (Semin/Steen) out of 21 picks is not great odds. My regret with the Bure trade is that Bure got hurt again not that we traded a pick that turned in to a nobody for him. When Bure played he was as exciting to watch as any Ranger player ever.
That first part is just not true, York had four 50 plus seasons while Poti only lived up to the hype two more seasons after getting here in late 2002. Poti's best season with us was when Henrik and Jagr played their first full seasons with us.

Who cares if any of the picks was a bust or not, busts are commonly used in trades when they still hold value, they are still assets. And at the time Steen and Semin were both being considered anywhere from 10-30 in that draft. Semin dropped because he was Russian but he was considered one of the most talented players in the draft, Rangers could have easily picked him just as they did Cherapanov a few years later.

Either way you slice it, the acquisitions of Bure and Lindros were win now trades, and neither showed to be healthy before the trades, horrible management for a team on a big decline.

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02-11-2017, 07:24 PM
  #52
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That first part is just not true, York had four 50 plus seasons while Poti only lived up to the hype two more seasons after getting here in late 2002. Poti's best season with us was when Henrik and Jagr played their first full seasons with us.

Who cares if any of the picks was a bust or not, busts are commonly used in trades when they still hold value, they are still assets. And at the time Steen and Semin were both being considered anywhere from 10-30 in that draft. Semin dropped because he was Russian but he was considered one of the most talented players in the draft, Rangers could have easily picked him just as they did Cherapanov a few years later.

Either way you slice it, the acquisitions of Bure and Lindros were win now trades, and neither showed to be healthy before the trades, horrible management for a team on a big decline.
Poti made the all star team for us. York got traded by the oilers and than by other teams as well within 3 years. I liked York a lot but you are only looking to bash Slats. I'm okay with the Lindros trade as well. Lindros was our best forward in his years. Brendl was a bust. Johnsson was okay but undersized.

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02-11-2017, 08:43 PM
  #53
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Poti made the all star team for us. York got traded by the oilers and than by other teams as well within 3 years. I liked York a lot but you are only looking to bash Slats. I'm okay with the Lindros trade as well. Lindros was our best forward in his years. Brendl was a bust. Johnsson was okay but undersized.
Poti making the all star team means nothing, everyone thought it was a joke at the time. York being traded by the geniuses working for Edmonton means nothing. At the time they were traded they had almost equal value. Looking to bash Sather, please, his record alone those first 6 years stand for themselves....

And again, the point is not who we traded for Lindros. its what could have been gained by trading Brendl and Johnsson who had good value at that time in regards to rebuilding.

Teams are STILL living off assets they handled right 10 to 15 years ago !

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02-11-2017, 09:00 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Poti making the all star team means nothing, everyone thought it was a joke at the time. York being traded by the geniuses working for Edmonton means nothing. At the time they were traded they had almost equal value. Looking to bash Sather, please, his record alone those first 6 years stand for themselves....

And again, the point is not who we traded for Lindros. its what could have been gained by trading Brendl and Johnsson who had good value at that time in regards to rebuilding.

Teams are STILL living off assets they handled right 10 to 15 years ago !
Are the Flyers are living of Johnsson and Brendl, Florida is living of Petr Tatíček , and the Oilers are living off York? Slats missed the playoffs for 4 seasons. We have been a playoff team every season except one since 2005.

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02-11-2017, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
Are the Flyers are living of Johnsson and Brendl, Florida is living of Petr Tatíček , and the Oilers are living off York? Slats missed the playoffs for 4 seasons. We have been a playoff team every season except one since 2005.
You don't get it, so forget it, what else can I say when you don't understand the value of an asset.

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02-11-2017, 11:03 PM
  #56
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Flyers held there first training camp here on PEI with Lindros . We were able to spend some time with him....he was great to us off the ice and signed multiple items for us. My friend took him out lobster fishing along with other guys from the team. He was great as were the whole club . I remember chatting with him one morning after breakfast at the local resort and I could not stop thinking about how damn HUGE he was...I cringe when thinking about going in a corner with him on a puck chase....he indeed was a physical specimen .
That's awesome.

I saw him in warmups once, he was just gigantic.

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02-11-2017, 11:04 PM
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What type of impact did he have on the ice? Was he still physical? I know how good he was in Philly but there is not much talk about his Rangers-years.

I will put my .2 in before I read the thread. Lindros earned my respect as a Ranger. He played hard every night, he played every game like it could be his last game. He wasn't the mean, nasty play that was a dominate force night in and night out but he still had spans where he could take over games. He dropped the gloves a couple of times too.

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02-11-2017, 11:13 PM
  #58
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You don't get it, so forget it, what else can I say when you don't understand the value of an asset.
I understand the value of an asset very well. Your hatred of Slats has you convinced that every pick or player we traded would have automatically turned in to the best player in that draft or a great player. None of that happened though. The number 9 pick was a bust. Yorks career declined fast. Brendl was a bust. We went on to make the playoffs in 11 of the last 12 seasons.

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02-11-2017, 11:19 PM
  #59
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Anyone remember McCabe bouncing of him against Toronto? Big E streaked down the left side of the ice, McCabe timed him perfectly and it looked like he was going to Kronwall him more or less, but Lindros didn't miss a stride and McCabe went spinning in the air. Lindros was something else physically. At least AO times 1.5...
I remember that. I remember being happy Lindros wasn't the one that got hurt. I think McCabe suffered the eye injury not long after that game.

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02-11-2017, 11:22 PM
  #60
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I'll never forget the hat trick against Atlanta, that was the birth of the FLY line. It was the Mark Smith concussion (I remember watching that game at my friend James' house) that derailed that season for Lindros. He might have challenged Iginla for the Art Ross had that happened.

He was easily the most physically dominant player I've ever seen in any sport in his prime. He could do everything the game asked of someone. He was a top scorer and playmaker. He had an absolute cannon of a shot. Was a tremendous playmaker. He was a nasty SOB when it came to the physical aspect of the game. He was also a feared fighter.

If the trade went through, the Rangers would have lost some significant pieces to Quebec, but they would have been able to build around the most physically dominant 1-2 punch in the history of the NHL and probably would have won multiple cups.
I remember Lindros playing with some journeyman whom he helped score a hat trick I can't remember the guys name but he played like and all star for like a week when he was on the same line with the big E. That was the type of affect Lindros could still have on players playing on his line.

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02-11-2017, 11:22 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
I understand the value of an asset very well. Your hatred of Slats has you convinced that every pick or player we traded would have automatically turned in to the best player in that draft or a great player. None of that happened though. The number 9 pick was a bust. Yorks career declined fast. Brendl was a bust. We went on to make the playoffs in 11 of the last 12 seasons.
Again, you don't know what an asset means - AT THE TIME WE HELD THAT ASSET, not what happened after the fact, that does not matter. At the time we had that asset, we used it to get older and win now, thats not what this franchise needed, it was evident then as it is now.

The organization turned around in 05-06, Sather lucked out, the ONE guy who remained in the organization from the Neil Smith regime was Henrik Lundqvist, imagine his legacy w/o Henke. Im agine Henkes legacy with a GM who was looking at the future when we were easily one of the worst teams from 00-05.

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02-11-2017, 11:24 PM
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I remember Lindros playing with some journeyman whom he helped score a hat trick I can't remember the guys name but he played like and all star for like a week when he was on the same line with the big E. That was the type of affect Lindros could still have on players playing on his line.

Jeff Toms

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02-11-2017, 11:24 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Baby Punisher View Post
I remember Lindros playing with some journeyman whom he helped score a hat trick I can't remember the guys name but he played like and all star for like a week when he was on the same line with the big E. That was the type of affect Lindros could still have on players playing on his line.
Jeff Toms?

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Old
02-11-2017, 11:29 PM
  #64
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Again, you don't know what an asset means - AT THE TIME WE HELD THAT ASSET, not what happened after the fact, that does not matter. At the time we had that asset, we used it to get older and win now, thats not what this franchise needed, it was evident then as it is now.

The organization turned around in 05-06, Sather lucked out, the ONE guy who remained in the organization from the Neil Smith regime was Henrik Lundqvist, imagine his legacy w/o Henke. Im agine Henkes legacy with a GM who was looking at the future when we were easily one of the worst teams from 00-05.
The value of an asset is not driven by your hatred of Slats. A unscratched lottery ticket is an asset but it is not worth a million dollars. Im not going to waste my time discussing 4 seasons we didnt make the playoffs over a decade ago. We have made the playoffs every season except one since 2005.

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02-11-2017, 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
The value of an asset is not driven by your hatred of Slats. A unscratched lottery ticket is an asset but it is not worth a million dollars. Im not going to waste my time discussing 4 seasons we didnt make the playoffs over a decade ago. We have made the playoffs every season except one since 2005.
Henrik Lundqvist.

If we bottomed out NATURALLY like Pitt, LA, Chicago, Boston who all had multiple top 5 and top ten picks in the draft, we would have won a Cup with Hank, IMO. Forget the fact the idiots totally mucked up the 2010 draft.....

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02-11-2017, 11:42 PM
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Jeff Toms
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Jeff Toms?
YES!

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02-11-2017, 11:44 PM
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Henrik Lundqvist.

If we bottomed out NATURALLY like Pitt, LA, Chicago, Boston who all had multiple top 5 and top ten picks in the draft, we would have won a Cup with Hank, IMO. Forget the fact the idiots totally mucked up the 2010 draft.....
Cool we could have had more Brendl like draft picks? Awesome. So you are mad we didn't make the playoffs for 4 seasons and also mad we did make the playoffs 11 of the last 12 seasons. If you ran the team we could be another Islanders? Florida? Toronto? Winipeg? Arizona? Edmonton? Ottawa?

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02-11-2017, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
The value of an asset is not driven by your hatred of Slats. A unscratched lottery ticket is an asset but it is not worth a million dollars. Im not going to waste my time discussing 4 seasons we didnt make the playoffs over a decade ago. We have made the playoffs every season except one since 2005.
Looking back on that time it's hard to kill Sather. He literally had nothing to work with talent wise. And I quote from an interview with the Sports Pope while addressing the Pontiff Sather blurted out "There was nothing here when I got here, NOTHING." Sather embarked on a full-scale rebuild and the fact he was able to get the superstars that he did even though they were declining he didn't give up much. Tom Poti was a spoiled brat who couldn't hit his own Mother. It wasn't until we got Brian Boyle until I saw a big guy like that who refused to throw a hit and take the body.

Just goes to show what happens to team when asset management is **** poor. It took 15 years to get the farm system in shape again.

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02-11-2017, 11:52 PM
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Cool we could have had more Brendl like draft picks? Awesome. So you are mad we didn't make the playoffs for 4 seasons and also mad we did make the playoffs 11 of the last 12 seasons. If you ran the team we could be another Islanders? Florida? Toronto? Winipeg? Arizona? Edmonton? Ottawa?
Outside of Toronto, no one has wanted to go to those teams, and those teams didnt have the money that the Rangers do, and that matters in scouting. Plus, those teams all had management/ownership issues that kept them from going anywhere. So did Chicago until their frugal owner died and they turned it around on a dime !

The more picks you have, the greater chance at getting the difference makers that teams like Chicago, LA, Pitt added just by playing the cards they were dealt. Instead the Rangers went after Lindros, Bure, Jagr, every friggen name that came up that had a big contract that no one wanted to pay for...except for Tom Poti, he was young, and a terrible defender.

I guess Pitt, Chicago, LA, San Jose really regret holding onto all those top 5/10 picks....

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02-11-2017, 11:58 PM
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Looking back on that time it's hard to kill Sather.
Ha, is this a joke??

He had a rebuilding team on his hands and didnt act like it. Adding all those free agents did nothing but keep us out of the top 5 picks. Every team that has won the Cup in recent memory has bottomed out naturally - meaning not adding guys like Lindros, Bure, Jagr etc. They played the cards they were dealt and it took a few years to get going, once they did they all have been great since. The Rangers lucked out with Henrik coming out of the 7th round. Imagine if a real rebuild would have started 5 years earlier, we would have had at least a few good young players that grew with him. All the young guys came along AFTER Henrik got here.

Horrible job his first 5 years as Rangers GM, not even debatable.

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02-12-2017, 12:04 AM
  #71
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Outside of Toronto, no one has wanted to go to those teams, and those teams didnt have the money that the Rangers do, and that matters in scouting. Plus, those teams all had management/ownership issues that kept them from going anywhere. So did Chicago until their frugal owner died and they turned it around on a dime !

The more picks you have, the greater chance at getting the difference makers that teams like Chicago, LA, Pitt added just by playing the cards they were dealt. Instead the Rangers went after Lindros, Bure, Jagr, every friggen name that came up that had a big contract that no one wanted to pay for...except for Tom Poti, he was young, and a terrible defender.

I guess Pitt, Chicago, LA, San Jose really regret holding onto all those top 5/10 picks....
Your hatred makes you twist everything to a ridiculous place. There are at least 10-12 teams getting top picks annually so you pick the only 3 that won the cup? There are teams that had way more pucks than Pitt or LA or Chi.

Anyway I see Slats, Lindros, Jagr, and Bure evetually in the HOF. You can sleep warmly at night knowing you would have drafted Tatíček and kept York, Carter and Brendl instead of getting those players.

Bottom line is this thread is about Lindros. Im glad we got Lindros, Bure and Theo. During a few years when we had almost nothing they gave Ranger fans some bright moments.

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02-12-2017, 12:12 AM
  #72
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Bottom line is this thread is about Lindros. Im glad we got Lindros, Bure and Theo. During a few years when we had almost nothing they gave Ranger fans some bright moments.
CHEAP thrills, small potatoes, the GMs who thought like me, instead of Slats, won cups.

/

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02-12-2017, 12:20 AM
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CHEAP thrills, small potatoes, the GMs who thought like me, instead of Slats, won cups.

/
GMs who thought like you? You mean like Arizona, Ottawa, The Jets, Florida, ETC LOL

How many NHL stanley cups have you won? Your hands must be full with all those hypothetical rings that you would have won if anyone would hire you to run a NHL team.

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02-12-2017, 12:32 AM
  #74
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GMs who thought like you? You mean like Arizona, Ottawa, The Jets, Florida, ETC LOL

How many NHL stanley cups have you won? Your hands must be full with all those hypothetical rings that you would have won if anyone would hire you to run a NHL team.
First, you keep mentioning certain things that are wrong:

Ottawa went to the Stanley Cup finals after they had MULTIPLE top 5 picks in the draft. Stop mentioning them, cause they support my argument.

Taticek. When we traded for Bure we were in line for the 4th overall pick, we were 4th worst team, Bures great play brought us to 9th overall. So technically, Pitkanen in your scenario would have been our pick, way better than any Dman we had in the system.

And again, you are comparing all the teams that had money and organizational issues, thats why they really don't even come close to comparing to big cities that had the money and stability to compete, just like we had except we went after way more fa's and trades for guys who were past their prime.

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02-12-2017, 12:46 AM
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First, you keep mentioning certain things that are wrong:

Ottawa went to the Stanley Cup finals after they had MULTIPLE top 5 picks in the draft. Stop mentioning them, cause they support my argument.

Taticek. When we traded for Bure we were in line for the 4th overall pick, we were 4th worst team, Bures great play brought us to 9th overall. So technically, Pitkanen in your scenario would have been our pick, way better than any Dman we had in the system.

And again, you are comparing all the teams that had money and organizational issues, thats why they really don't even come close to comparing to big cities that had the money and stability to compete, just like we had except we went after way more fa's and trades for guys who were past their prime.
We went to the cup as well. Oops.

How many cups have you won? When people think cups do they think of you?

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