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Old
02-16-2017, 04:16 PM
  #26
Coach Parker
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Originally Posted by Fonzerelli View Post
It's a fair point. No secret around here that I am not a fan of what those guys did (yes, yes, I know, it's within their right in the CBA), but if Vesey hadn't of done what he did there is a good chance he would be in the American Hockey League right now. I guess you goota do what you gotts do, but I'm still a fan of getting in line, paying your dues and working your way up the old fashioned way. Of course, I'm sure they learn different at Harvard. I'm just an old country boy.
I honestly think you are going to see a slow transition to the NCAA route as far as the NHL prospects go; at least in the WHL and USHL.

Parents are now pushing for their sons to go the NCAA route, get a degree paid for and then choose their own path. Slowly you are seeing the NCAA get stronger and produce more high draft picks.

BCHL thrives on it; they actually promote it here on the radio as the #1 NCAA recruitment program.

NBA: Drafts out of NCAA.
NFL: Drafts out of NCAA.
MLB: Drafts out of NCAA.
NHL: Drafts out of Junior hockey mainly, then NCAA.

Exceptional status players usually get identified early and know their path but when you stop and look at the current Bruins prospects and where they are playing, you can see a pattern emerging.

Fabbro and his parents (amongst many in that group) were always clear that NCAA was the path for Dante. More and more parents think that way at the minor hockey league level and I cannot think of a response that the junior leagues have other than 'we have better competition, better coaching and will help with paying for your education in Canada.'

As the competition gets better in the NCAA, coaches are paid more to go to NCAA jobs, coaches are hired from the NCAA to NHL/AHL the slow progression to that league paired with the possible financial disputes between junior hockey players and team owners over compensation we may be witnessing the transition as we speak.

Hell, teams may be negotiating out the NCAA clause as early as possible to avoid the Wheeler's and Vesey's from moving on.

Fabbro signed yet with Nashville?
Jost?
How many Bruins prospects have signed?

Not to raise alarm bells, but why sign now when you can explore all options after your degree? The consequences are minimal and people quickly move on if you produce. Wheeler still get booed in Arizona? Vesey in Nashville?

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Old
02-16-2017, 04:19 PM
  #27
Coach Parker
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Originally Posted by BruinDust View Post
None probably.

Me being optimistic, I think Bjork signs here.

But each case is so unique, it's hard to say what these NCAA guys do. Almost becomes a crap-shoot.

And what motivates a guy to sign, or not to sign, with the team that drafts him varies from player to player. Vesey would of been gifted a spot in Nashville, and he still had zero interest.
And there lies the point; it's now his interests and choice as to where he plays, for how much and when. How many players can say that after their draft?

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02-16-2017, 04:20 PM
  #28
Coach Parker
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You also get the bonus for teams that draft NCAA players or future NCAA players; their ELC contracts don't even start up until 21-22 sometimes. Cost control. Pushing back the NHL talent (minus the exceptional status players) a couple years is huge for the salary cap.

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02-16-2017, 04:21 PM
  #29
Fonzerelli
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Good post Coach. It has advantages for sure. And with the mess the CHL is in right now in the courts, it may be inevitable that things all steer that way. Perhaps it's for the better. Maybe what we should be looking at doing is incorporating the top Canadian Schools into the NCAA. Bring up the level accross the board and create a North American College Hockey experience.

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02-16-2017, 04:44 PM
  #30
WithOutPaperss
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Originally Posted by Coach Parker View Post
I honestly think you are going to see a slow transition to the NCAA route as far as the NHL prospects go; at least in the WHL and USHL.

Parents are now pushing for their sons to go the NCAA route, get a degree paid for and then choose their own path. Slowly you are seeing the NCAA get stronger and produce more high draft picks.

BCHL thrives on it; they actually promote it here on the radio as the #1 NCAA recruitment program.

NBA: Drafts out of NCAA.
NFL: Drafts out of NCAA.
MLB: Drafts out of NCAA.
NHL: Drafts out of Junior hockey mainly, then NCAA.

Exceptional status players usually get identified early and know their path but when you stop and look at the current Bruins prospects and where they are playing, you can see a pattern emerging.

Fabbro and his parents (amongst many in that group) were always clear that NCAA was the path for Dante. More and more parents think that way at the minor hockey league level and I cannot think of a response that the junior leagues have other than 'we have better competition, better coaching and will help with paying for your education in Canada.'

As the competition gets better in the NCAA, coaches are paid more to go to NCAA jobs, coaches are hired from the NCAA to NHL/AHL the slow progression to that league paired with the possible financial disputes between junior hockey players and team owners over compensation we may be witnessing the transition as we speak.

Hell, teams may be negotiating out the NCAA clause as early as possible to avoid the Wheeler's and Vesey's from moving on.

Fabbro signed yet with Nashville?
Jost?
How many Bruins prospects have signed?

Not to raise alarm bells, but why sign now when you can explore all options after your degree? The consequences are minimal and people quickly move on if you produce. Wheeler still get booed in Arizona? Vesey in Nashville?
Being from Canada, I never understood why a player would choose CHL over NCAA. Getting a fallback for your hockey career is a no-brainer to me, and NCAA provides the best option for that.

It would be cool to see Canadian schools start producing more players, but I think they have more strict rules when it comes to paid tuition - which I believe is the main reason that you don't see many pros come from Canadian schools. (I'm only guessing, could be very wrong)

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02-16-2017, 04:46 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Fonzerelli View Post
Good post Coach. It has advantages for sure. And with the mess the CHL is in right now in the courts, it may be inevitable that things all steer that way. Perhaps it's for the better. Maybe what we should be looking at doing is incorporating the top Canadian Schools into the NCAA. Bring up the level accross the board and create a North American College Hockey experience.
I wish Canadian schools would produce some more pros (do they even produce any?). I would have to think that rules on having tuition paid for you are different here than for NCAA which is part of the reason, coupled with in general just having most of the Canadian talent either drafted or playing major junior hockey instead.

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02-16-2017, 04:54 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach Parker View Post
I honestly think you are going to see a slow transition to the NCAA route as far as the NHL prospects go; at least in the WHL and USHL.

Parents are now pushing for their sons to go the NCAA route, get a degree paid for and then choose their own path. Slowly you are seeing the NCAA get stronger and produce more high draft picks.

BCHL thrives on it; they actually promote it here on the radio as the #1 NCAA recruitment program.

NBA: Drafts out of NCAA.
NFL: Drafts out of NCAA.
MLB: Drafts out of NCAA.
NHL: Drafts out of Junior hockey mainly, then NCAA.

Exceptional status players usually get identified early and know their path but when you stop and look at the current Bruins prospects and where they are playing, you can see a pattern emerging.

Fabbro and his parents (amongst many in that group) were always clear that NCAA was the path for Dante. More and more parents think that way at the minor hockey league level and I cannot think of a response that the junior leagues have other than 'we have better competition, better coaching and will help with paying for your education in Canada.'

As the competition gets better in the NCAA, coaches are paid more to go to NCAA jobs, coaches are hired from the NCAA to NHL/AHL the slow progression to that league paired with the possible financial disputes between junior hockey players and team owners over compensation we may be witnessing the transition as we speak.

Hell, teams may be negotiating out the NCAA clause as early as possible to avoid the Wheeler's and Vesey's from moving on.

Fabbro signed yet with Nashville?
Jost?
How many Bruins prospects have signed?

Not to raise alarm bells, but why sign now when you can explore all options after your degree? The consequences are minimal and people quickly move on if you produce. Wheeler still get booed in Arizona? Vesey in Nashville?
None of the Bruins NCAA drafted prospects has signed. Unlike Juniors, they lose their eligibility if they sign a professional contract even though they don't play and are not paid.

This is the reason you see college players at Development Camp, where they pay their own way, and not at Training Camp as their Junior and European counterparts.

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02-16-2017, 05:07 PM
  #33
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If he's afraid to sign cuz there are too many prospects then good riddance.

He's a competitor, he will sign.

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Old
02-16-2017, 05:16 PM
  #34
VeddarRants
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Bjork plays on the RW as a left hand shot.

Marchand -- Bergeron -- Backes

Cehlarik -- Krejci -- Pasta

Vatrano -- Spooner -- Bjork

Schaller -- Moore -- Nash

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02-16-2017, 05:17 PM
  #35
WhalerTurnedBruin55
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Is there actually any legit concern he wouldn't sign here?

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02-16-2017, 05:21 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WithOutPaperss View Post
I wish Canadian schools would produce some more pros (do they even produce any?). I would have to think that rules on having tuition paid for you are different here than for NCAA which is part of the reason, coupled with in general just having most of the Canadian talent either drafted or playing major junior hockey instead.
They have produced a fair number of minor pro players below the level of the AHL and while it's been a while since I kept up with AA level of hockey, quite a few coaches would pick up guys who played juniors then went the Canadian University route. I know that isn't quite what you mean, and it would be nice to see some of those schools become competitive with the NCAA.

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02-16-2017, 05:33 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by WhalerTurnedBruin55 View Post
Is there actually any legit concern he wouldn't sign here?
Kirk has said pretty vehemently that there's no reason for concern this early on. I'll take his word for it and hope he's right!

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02-16-2017, 05:34 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by WhalerTurnedBruin55 View Post
Is there actually any legit concern he wouldn't sign here?
Concern would be he has yet to confirm publicly he will sign with bruins there's a risk.

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02-16-2017, 06:30 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by WithOutPaperss View Post
Being from Canada, I never understood why a player would choose CHL over NCAA. Getting a fallback for your hockey career is a no-brainer to me, and NCAA provides the best option for that.

It would be cool to see Canadian schools start producing more players, but I think they have more strict rules when it comes to paid tuition - which I believe is the main reason that you don't see many pros come from Canadian schools. (I'm only guessing, could be very wrong)
CHL still puts more players in the NHL than any other developmental league. Once their CHL career is over they get to go to school, which I believe they can defer up to two years while they pursue other interest , with their tuition paid for equalling the number of years they played in the CHL. Lots of players on scholarships in the NCAA are only partial, not full. Also when a pkayer leaves NCAA Early they do so without a degree, yes some finish up afterwards but doubt many do. It is a players choice to play where they wish, lots of Canadians go south and NCAA route and lots of Americans cone north to go the CHL route. The reason you don't see many players come out of Canadians schools is because they go there after their CHL careers are over, get their degree and move on in life.

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Old
02-17-2017, 01:06 AM
  #40
Coach Parker
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Originally Posted by Fonzerelli View Post
Good post Coach. It has advantages for sure. And with the mess the CHL is in right now in the courts, it may be inevitable that things all steer that way. Perhaps it's for the better. Maybe what we should be looking at doing is incorporating the top Canadian Schools into the NCAA. Bring up the level accross the board and create a North American College Hockey experience.
Funny you should mention that as UBC and SFU push into the NCAA.

It's on the horizon and I wouldn't be surprised at all to hear about the NHL teams trying to close the loops exposing their drafted players next CBA.

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02-17-2017, 01:09 AM
  #41
Coach Parker
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Originally Posted by Ratty View Post
None of the Bruins NCAA drafted prospects has signed. Unlike Juniors, they lose their eligibility if they sign a professional contract even though they don't play and are not paid.

This is the reason you see college players at Development Camp, where they pay their own way, and not at Training Camp as their Junior and European counterparts.
I was referring more to historically signing from their NCAA to Boston. It is clear the Bruins have shifted their development to the NCAA players to a large degree.

Have the Bruins had anyone walk away after the three years?

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02-17-2017, 01:16 AM
  #42
Coach Parker
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Originally Posted by BBB24 View Post
CHL still puts more players in the NHL than any other developmental league. Once their CHL career is over they get to go to school, which I believe they can defer up to two years while they pursue other interest , with their tuition paid for equalling the number of years they played in the CHL. Lots of players on scholarships in the NCAA are only partial, not full. Also when a pkayer leaves NCAA Early they do so without a degree, yes some finish up afterwards but doubt many do. It is a players choice to play where they wish, lots of Canadians go south and NCAA route and lots of Americans cone north to go the CHL route. The reason you don't see many players come out of Canadians schools is because they go there after their CHL careers are over, get their degree and move on in life.
Well said. Have some family members and close friends who did just that. Hell, I got to play hockey and go to a Canadian University and have some amazing years.

CHL is the NHL farm. What is interesting is the transition of the draft seeing more and more NCAA players drafted.

As solid prospects choose the NCAA over the CHL they create a stronger league for themselves that will in turn entice more players to look in that direction.

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02-17-2017, 07:03 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Coach Parker View Post
I was referring more to historically signing from their NCAA to Boston. It is clear the Bruins have shifted their development to the NCAA players to a large degree.

Have the Bruins had anyone walk away after the three years?
You could make the argument Vesey did...

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02-17-2017, 07:33 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Blowfish View Post
You could make the argument Vesey did...

Vesey walked away from Nashville and Buffalo, he was never Boston "property". There is no argument/discussion to be had here.

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02-17-2017, 07:36 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by GloryDaze4877 View Post
Vesey walked away from Nashville and Buffalo, he was never Boston "property". There is no argument/discussion to be had here.
Understood however out of every team bidding for Vesey it made the most logical sense Vesey select his home town favourite hockey team. Odd n'est pas?

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02-17-2017, 07:52 AM
  #46
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Understood however out of every team bidding for Vesey it made the most logical sense Vesey select his home town favourite hockey team. Odd n'est pas?
In his mind, obviously not.

Once again, not drafted by Boston, rights never acquired by Boston.

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02-17-2017, 07:55 AM
  #47
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In his mind, obviously not.

Once again, not drafted by Boston, rights never acquired by Boston.
Had julien been let go this time last years and based on his fathers comments about coaching style he would have been a bruin.

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02-17-2017, 08:01 AM
  #48
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Had julien been let go this time last years and based on his fathers comments about coaching style he would have been a bruin.
I don't believe for a second that Julien was the deciding factor. His father also said that because of local pressure, he felt it would be better for his son to start his pro career outside of Boston.

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02-17-2017, 08:05 AM
  #49
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I don't believe for a second that Julien was the deciding factor. His father also said that because of local pressure, he felt it would be better for his son to start his pro career outside of Boston.
And would probably be catching a **** ton of flak if he was in Boston and has 6-3-9 in his last 35 games.

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02-17-2017, 08:28 AM
  #50
Dom - OHL
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I honestly think you are going to see a slow transition to the NCAA route as far as the NHL prospects go; at least in the WHL and USHL.
i think Junior A leagues will suffer a little with the USHL increasing their import allowance to six from 4 as long as the two extra are Canadian. USHL will now be a bigger option for Canadians wanting to head to NCAA


Quote:
Originally Posted by Midship View Post
Kirk has said pretty vehemently that there's no reason for concern this early on. I'll take his word for it and hope he's right!
Bruins have until Aug 15, 2018 to sign him

Quote:
Originally Posted by WithOutPaperss View Post
I wish Canadian schools would produce some more pros (do they even produce any?). I would have to think that rules on having tuition paid for you are different here than for NCAA which is part of the reason, coupled with in general just having most of the Canadian talent either drafted or playing major junior hockey instead.
Randy Gregg, Jody Shelley, Jack Valiquette, Stu Grimson, Mike Ridley, Mathieu Darche, Joel Ward are a few you might recognize.

Francis Beauvillier was pick by the panthers in the 6th round in 2012 and stands a good chance to make the NHL

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