HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Jordie Benn

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-19-2017, 11:32 PM
  #76
Belial
Registered User
 
Belial's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Montreal
Posts: 5,689
vCash: 50
Trade Beau for Duclair and protect Benn.

Belial is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:45 PM
  #77
get25
Registered User
 
get25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 962
vCash: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfm133 View Post
Again. Beaulieu will be protected or traded.
Of course.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaP View Post
We will see this summer. But i'm almost sure i'm right. Beaulieu will be protected and Benn wont be claimed. I will be very surprised if LV claim Benn.
Agreed. Worst case, we can offer a contract to Beaulieu that makes him less interesting to LV.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankenheimer View Post
It's not an easy decision. Beaulieu is still young and produces more offensively. I love Benn but does not make long term sense. This expansion draft really sucks. I see it as 50/50 decision.
Beaulieu is 23 years old and can produce easily 30 points.
Benn is 30 years old and scored 20 points once.

Also Benn started to play in NHL at 25 years old.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaffy27 View Post
I've "Benn" saying it for a while now, when it comes to the D, protect :

Weber
Petry
Benn

This will be beyond the easiest decision Bergevin will have to make.
If he does that it will be his worst decision as a GM.

Benn will most likely never reach 30 points and at 29 what you have is what you get. Once 20 points and that's it.

As for Beaulieu, at 23, it is 25 points in 65 games for now: a pace of 33 points...
Last year: 19 points in 64 games. A pace of 25 points.

For now, Markov and Weber are producing more for sure.
Petry is about the same as Beaulieu and that is the best season for Petry so far. Before that his best season was 2 goals and 25 points in 73 games.
Beaulieu has already done better.

Actually, who will be the best d-men at 29 years old: Petry now or Beaulieu in 6 years? Benn now or Beaulieu in 6 years?
He still does errors but he is learning and his defense is improving.
Slowly but improving.

I keep repeating: Beaulieu might score 40 points at 25-26 years old.
How many d-men scored 40 points last season? 26...
With Beaulieu, Weber and Markov getting 40 points we would be the only team besides Calgary to have three d-men with 40 points.

Beaulieu is on pace for 30 points right now.

How many d-men scored 30 points last season? 50

Besides Nsh, LAK, CGY, Tor and Stl, what team had 3 or more d-men with 30 points last year? None.
Ari, Bos, Chi, SJS, Mtl, Col, Dal, NYR, Wsh all had two d-men with 30 points.

Lets resume: Nsh had 4 d-men with 30 points till they traded Jones.
So basically 5 teams in NHL had 3 d-men with 30 points.
9 other teams in NHL had two d-men with 30 points.
That leaves 16 teams with one (or none) d-men with 30 points.

Just for reference: Sekera scored 30 points, Jones/Martinez/Campbell/Gardiner scored 31 points, Muzzin/Leddy scored 40 points. Parayko: 33 points, Pietro: 37 points. Shattenkirk will most likely get 7MX7 years with his 44 points last season.

One last comment: protecting Weber, Petry and Benn, who plays as LHD?

With Weber, Petry, Beaulieu, Markov and Sergachev we could have could have four or five d-men who could score 30 points.

BTW, so far this season, there are only 48 d-men who have 30 points and 57 (including Beaulieu) who have 25 points.

We are the only team in the league who has 4 d-men with 25 points: Weber, Markov, Petry, Beaulieu. A few team have three and most teams have one or two.

Teams with one or two d-men with 25 points (bolded teams have only one):
Ana, Ari, Bos, Buf, Car, CBJ, Chi, Col, Dal, Det, Fla, Edm, Lak, Njd, Nyi, Ott, Phi (after trading Streit), Sjs, Stl (after Shattenkirk trade), Tbl, Tor, Wpg.

So 22 teams have at best 2 d-men with 25 points and half of them (11) only have one.

Now tell me that you want to trade Beaulieu for a bag of puck or protect Benn instead of him again?
Note that there are 42 d-men older than Beaulieu in that list and only 14 who are younger.

If you offer me a trade for Beaulieu+ for Duchene then fine (anyway, as you can see, Col has one d-men with 25 points so far).
Plekanec would most likely need to go the other way for SCap purpose.

Faulk, Parayko, Klinsgberg, Trouba, Rielly and Gotisbehere are about the same age as Beaulieu but they get first PP while Beaulieu was almost always behind Markov and PK/Weber.
Where would he be with same PP TOI?

So Benn or Beaulieu: choice seems clear to me.
I still love Benn as a bottom-6 and I also love him as a team player.
If Bergevin can make any deal with LV to keep him, fine with me.

get25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:46 PM
  #78
get25
Registered User
 
get25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 962
vCash: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post
Trade Beau for Duclair and protect Benn.
Duclair has no value for now.

get25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:52 PM
  #79
Belial
Registered User
 
Belial's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Montreal
Posts: 5,689
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by get25 View Post
Duclair has no value for now.
Exactly, buy low !

Belial is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:03 AM
  #80
MontrealPredators
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 186
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post
Exactly, buy low !
Beaulieu is worth more than Duclair right now...

MontrealPredators is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:14 AM
  #81
Belial
Registered User
 
Belial's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Montreal
Posts: 5,689
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by MontrealPredators View Post
Beaulieu is worth more than Duclair right now...
Duclair scored 20 goals last year, I know he has some attitude issues apparently but he's only 21 years old! Weber will settle him on the right path!

Belial is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:15 AM
  #82
get25
Registered User
 
get25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 962
vCash: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddyjack View Post
I'm sorry but it would be obvious for LV to pick up Beaulieu. Come on guys, the guy is still a good skater, can produce points, can fight, and he is what, 24? And you would lose that for free??
He has 25 points. 57 d-men in the league (less than 2 per team) have 25 points.

Maybe this has no value to some of you guys but Mtl is the only team with 4 d-men with 25 points.

BTW, McDonagh played 40 games in NHL at 22 years old and played his first full season in NHL at 23 years old. He also had 32 points in his first full NHL season (and only 9 points in 40 games in his first season).
Beaulieu has about the same pace with 25 points in 65 games.

Of course, McDonagh is better in defense but he was also getting top PP TOI pairing with Girardi.

Beaulieu will probably never be as good as McDonagh in defense but if you make Beaulieu, Byron, Plekanec, Emelin, Benn, Shaw and Mitchell available, I am sure LV will jump on Beaulieu.

We are so lucky that Markov seems to be happy to sign with us so we can keep Beaulieu.

get25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:37 AM
  #83
get25
Registered User
 
get25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 962
vCash: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial View Post
Exactly, buy low !
You would need a major part from Arizona for Beaulieu, Duclair could be the + part of the equation.

Something like Dvorak/Strome/Keller + Duclair for Beaulieu + 1st.
For now Duclair is worth a third or a late second at best.

You understand that Duclair had 10 points in 48 NHL games and 8 points in 16 AHL games this season.
His 44 points playing with Domi might very well a one time wonder.

One thing for sure, he does skates fast.

But Beaulieu and Duclair are not in the same deal unless major parts are coming back our way.

To be frank Arizona does not need Beaulieu: OEL, Goligoski, Chykrun and Murphy are the top-4. Beaulieu could replace Murphy but I do not see them trading for Beaulieu.

get25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 02:19 AM
  #84
Habssince89
Feel the Radulove
 
Habssince89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,695
vCash: 351
Trade Beaulieu in the summer for a solid forward prospect with size OR a good pick. Benn is a heart and soul kind of guy, he's on a good deal and he has both size and mobility, with a quick hockey IQ. Sounds alot like what Petry is when he's on his game, but with some more physicality. Beaulieu will have a career, but Montreal shouldn't wait on it if they can solve an expansion problem by liquidating Beaulieu's value.

To be fair, If Beaulieu were to stay I'd be fine with it, but we have an opportunity to do those two things at once. Why not?

Habssince89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 07:56 AM
  #85
jaffy27
From Russia wth Pain
 
jaffy27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Orleans
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,782
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by get25 View Post
Of course.

Agreed. Worst case, we can offer a contract to Beaulieu that makes him less interesting to LV.

Beaulieu is 23 years old and can produce easily 30 points.
Benn is 30 years old and scored 20 points once.

Also Benn started to play in NHL at 25 years old.

If he does that it will be his worst decision as a GM.

Benn will most likely never reach 30 points and at 29 what you have is what you get. Once 20 points and that's it.

As for Beaulieu, at 23, it is 25 points in 65 games for now: a pace of 33 points...
Last year: 19 points in 64 games. A pace of 25 points.

For now, Markov and Weber are producing more for sure.
Petry is about the same as Beaulieu and that is the best season for Petry so far. Before that his best season was 2 goals and 25 points in 73 games.
Beaulieu has already done better.

Actually, who will be the best d-men at 29 years old: Petry now or Beaulieu in 6 years? Benn now or Beaulieu in 6 years?
He still does errors but he is learning and his defense is improving.
Slowly but improving.

I keep repeating: Beaulieu might score 40 points at 25-26 years old.
How many d-men scored 40 points last season? 26...
With Beaulieu, Weber and Markov getting 40 points we would be the only team besides Calgary to have three d-men with 40 points.

Beaulieu is on pace for 30 points right now.

How many d-men scored 30 points last season? 50

Besides Nsh, LAK, CGY, Tor and Stl, what team had 3 or more d-men with 30 points last year? None.
Ari, Bos, Chi, SJS, Mtl, Col, Dal, NYR, Wsh all had two d-men with 30 points.

Lets resume: Nsh had 4 d-men with 30 points till they traded Jones.
So basically 5 teams in NHL had 3 d-men with 30 points.
9 other teams in NHL had two d-men with 30 points.
That leaves 16 teams with one (or none) d-men with 30 points.

Just for reference: Sekera scored 30 points, Jones/Martinez/Campbell/Gardiner scored 31 points, Muzzin/Leddy scored 40 points. Parayko: 33 points, Pietro: 37 points. Shattenkirk will most likely get 7MX7 years with his 44 points last season.

One last comment: protecting Weber, Petry and Benn, who plays as LHD?

With Weber, Petry, Beaulieu, Markov and Sergachev we could have could have four or five d-men who could score 30 points.

BTW, so far this season, there are only 48 d-men who have 30 points and 57 (including Beaulieu) who have 25 points.

We are the only team in the league who has 4 d-men with 25 points: Weber, Markov, Petry, Beaulieu. A few team have three and most teams have one or two.

Teams with one or two d-men with 25 points (bolded teams have only one):
Ana, Ari, Bos, Buf, Car, CBJ, Chi, Col, Dal, Det, Fla, Edm, Lak, Njd, Nyi, Ott, Phi (after trading Streit), Sjs, Stl (after Shattenkirk trade), Tbl, Tor, Wpg.

So 22 teams have at best 2 d-men with 25 points and half of them (11) only have one.
Benn over Beaulieu would be the worst decision ever?

Listen, you value Beaulieu more than I do, that's fine. But to say it would be THE WORST decision ever is a bit of a stretch.

Beaulieu by the way has been 24 since last December.

So who is Beaulieu? What does he bring to this team? What's his identity?

He has a hard time making a first pass in the sense where it's a real nice pass or he gives it away, he doesn't really hit, he doesn't have a bomb from the point, he can't quarterback a PP.......

This is the problem with him, he does everything well but doesn't really stand out or excel on any of them. I say while his value is still good because of his age, you package him for some offensive help and Sergachev slides into his spot next fall.

jaffy27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 08:04 AM
  #86
Respeck
RESPECK MY NAME
 
Respeck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,031
vCash: 500
Meanwhile Pateryn, who was apparently better than Benn at the time of the trade, has been scratched 6 out of the 9 games in Dallas.

Respeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 08:23 AM
  #87
Doc McKenna
Registered User
 
Doc McKenna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,564
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaP View Post
Why?

They wont win next 3 to 5 seasons minimum. They'll be looking for kids or proven vets with lot of experience to help the kids (ideally tradeable at the next deadline or two for good picks). Benn is neither.
Same here. I dont even think benn should be part of our 'core' which is what he would be ifhe was protected. If he is part of the core we are a long ways from contenders.

Doc McKenna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 08:27 AM
  #88
Coldplay
Courage
 
Coldplay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Montréal
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,699
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Respeck View Post
Meanwhile Pateryn, who was apparently better than Benn at the time of the trade, has been scratched 6 out of the 9 games in Dallas.
Glad we had yahoos telling us that Benn wasn't even an NHL-calibre d-man when the deal went down. They sure showed us uneducated plebeians.

Coldplay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 08:33 AM
  #89
habergeon
Registered User
 
habergeon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Country: Canada
Posts: 200
vCash: 500
I'm a Jordie Benn fan, but I don't believe he'll be protected. Beaulieu is definitely getting protected as Las Vegas would take him in a heart beat.

habergeon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 09:46 AM
  #90
KawaYui
Registered User
 
KawaYui's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,378
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by habergeon View Post
I'm a Jordie Benn fan, but I don't believe he'll be protected. Beaulieu is definitely getting protected as Las Vegas would take him in a heart beat.
This, a young top 4 defenseman or a good bottom pairing defenseman
Its a no-brainer...

KawaYui is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 09:54 AM
  #91
habdynasty
Registered User
 
habdynasty's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,306
vCash: 500
Hard to believe Benn is signed for 3 years at 1 millions n a season , what a contract.

habdynasty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 10:00 AM
  #92
the
Registered User
 
the's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,214
vCash: 908
I thought at first that we got Jordie Benn in a twisted attempt by Bergevin to get Jamie Benn one day. Who knew Jordie was going to be this good for us and we can still hope that Jamie would waive his NMC one day.

the is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 10:02 AM
  #93
Simarino
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 398
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Respeck View Post
Meanwhile Pateryn, who was apparently better than Benn at the time of the trade, has been scratched 6 out of the 9 games in Dallas.
****in french coach again probably!!!

Simarino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 10:10 AM
  #94
CaptainBenn
King Thranduil swag
 
CaptainBenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: FIREBERGEVIN
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 4,964
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Respeck View Post
Meanwhile Pateryn, who was apparently better than Benn at the time of the trade, has been scratched 6 out of the 9 games in Dallas.
His wife must be freaking out

CaptainBenn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 10:24 AM
  #95
BLONG7
Registered User
 
BLONG7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 17,244
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by habdynasty View Post
Hard to believe Benn is signed for 3 years at 1 millions n a season , what a contract.
What a solid, solid guy..........stand up for his team mates, chips in with a couple of goals, and keeps an eye on guys who are getting too close to Price...this move is just a wow type of move...kudos to MB.

CJ must just be loving this guy...

BLONG7 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 11:34 AM
  #96
Estimated_Prophet
Registered User
 
Estimated_Prophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,495
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KawaYui View Post
This, a young top 4 defenseman or a good bottom pairing defenseman
Its a no-brainer...
Beaulieu is trash and is clearly inferior to Benn. Good riddance if LV takes Beaulieu imo.

Estimated_Prophet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 11:38 AM
  #97
LaP
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Quebec City, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,400
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Beaulieu is trash and is clearly inferior to Benn. Good riddance if LV takes Beaulieu imo.
At the same age (when benn was 24) Beaulieu is superior to Benn.

LaP is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 11:43 AM
  #98
Jrham15
Registered User
 
Jrham15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: windsor
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,010
vCash: 539
Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Beaulieu is trash and is clearly inferior to Benn. Good riddance if LV takes Beaulieu imo.
Beaulieu has improved every year he has been in the NHL. There is no reason he still doesn't have room to grow. I think he has been quite good this year. Yeah he makes his mistakes but he will learn.

Jrham15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 07:23 PM
  #99
crazyd
Canada is hockey
 
crazyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,303
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrham15 View Post
Beaulieu has improved every year he has been in the NHL. There is no reason he still doesn't have room to grow. I think he has been quite good this year. Yeah he makes his mistakes but he will learn.
I just don't get the trash Beaulieu gets on these boards. He is a fine d-man, playing in the +'s, and is nearing 30 points this season. Has speed, mobility, good shot....Markov ain't getting younger you know...and Sergachev won't crack the lineup next year. Sergachev will have is rookie mistakes and he will be awesome for us in 2-3 years time.

Ideally, you keep Benn and Beaulieu, no question. If you have to pick, you need to evaluate what other teams might be leaving on the table to gain perspective on chances that either one of Benn or Beaulieu gets nabbed.

LV needs to fulfill the cap minimum like any other team. Plekanec would be a great way for them to achieve this. Plekanec is still a very much a quality player, albeit on a bad year.

crazyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 07:31 PM
  #100
scrubadam
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 6,192
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyd View Post
I just don't get the trash Beaulieu gets on these boards. He is a fine d-man, playing in the +'s, and is nearing 30 points this season. Has speed, mobility, good shot....Markov ain't getting younger you know...and Sergachev won't crack the lineup next year. Sergachev will have is rookie mistakes and he will be awesome for us in 2-3 years time.

Ideally, you keep Benn and Beaulieu, no question. If you have to pick, you need to evaluate what other teams might be leaving on the table to gain perspective on chances that either one of Benn or Beaulieu gets nabbed.

LV needs to fulfill the cap minimum like any other team. Plekanec would be a great way for them to achieve this. Plekanec is still a very much a quality player, albeit on a bad year.
I agree. And we like Benn's contract but for LV it might be too cheap.

Whats legal at expansion though? Can LV take Beau and trade him back to the habs for a 2nd and Pleks with cap retained? Or MB tells them to take Mitchel and we send them a 2nd + prospect or something.

scrubadam is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:18 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2017 All Rights Reserved.