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Disinterest in the Devils?

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Old
10-22-2003, 08:03 PM
  #1
porknbeans
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Disinterest in the Devils?

The Devils played tonight against Florida in front of an ANNOUNCED crowd of 10,026. There were no doubt LESS than 10,000 actually in the building.

Can someone see this team surviviing? How? No one cares about them. They draw only 14,000 when their among the top teams in the league! What happens if they go down to a 80 point team? They'll draw 12000! This teams best ever attendance was 86% capacity! Best EVER!

I dont think the team is in debt, but come on, this is just ridiculous.

Is there any other instance in NHL history in which a MULTIPLE Cup champ has drawn so poorly the year(s) of and after the Cups?

What the heck is wrong with this market?

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10-22-2003, 09:08 PM
  #2
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Simple, fans going to the game asking for entertainment, New Jersey plays very boring brand of hockey. True they draw crowd in the playoff because they are winner, i mean as long there are possibility of winning the fan will show up, but winning in the regular means nothing to the Devils fans because they are basically expected to make it into the playoff.

i mean look at the game between Avs Vs Oilers or Canucks Vs Detriot, those are the ways hockey should be played, but due to the business nature of the game where the owner demands result from the coach, and the coach tries to provide it with defensive trap system, such as the one that is so successful for the Devils. And those trap WORKS, i mean look at the Wild, Ducks, and Devils. And look at the Habs this season, those trap works wonder, i don't know what the league can do about it, maybe enable more 4 on 4 situation, because in 4 on 4 situation you cannot really play trap, that was the suggestion made by Bowman last Saturday.

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10-22-2003, 09:26 PM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MVP

i mean look at the game between Avs Vs Oilers or Canucks Vs Detriot, those are the ways hockey should be played, but due to the business nature of the game where the owner demands result from the coach, and the coach tries to provide it with defensive trap system, such as the one that is so successful for the Devils. And those trap WORKS, i mean look at the Wild, Ducks, and Devils. And look at the Habs this season, those trap works wonder, i don't know what the league can do about it, maybe enable more 4 on 4 situation, because in 4 on 4 situation you cannot really play trap, that was the suggestion made by Bowman last Saturday.
Sure the trap may be boring to watch, but if a team can win with it, they should use it....as for the habs, yes they use the trap but they also have the skill to score more than New Jersey so far.....every team has the right to play whatever system they want...if you dont want the trap, too bad

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10-22-2003, 10:11 PM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOMO_ROCKS
Sure the trap may be boring to watch, but if a team can win with it, they should use it....as for the habs, yes they use the trap but they also have the skill to score more than New Jersey so far.....every team has the right to play whatever system they want...if you dont want the trap, too bad

That was my point actually, but his question is why does not there are more people watching the Devils during the regular season, and it is the lack of excitement as a result of the trap, of course team can play whatever system they want, i already address in more detail fashion in my previous post on that matter.

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10-22-2003, 10:19 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MVP
That was my point actually, but his question is why does not there are more people watching the Devils during the regular season, and it is the lack of excitement as a result of the trap, of course team can play whatever system they want, i already address in more detail fashion in my previous post on that matter.
why no people watching Devils during the regular season?.....obviously the trap is a big factor along with there no being many exciting players to watch offensively...and by this i dont mean a superstar. Some teams are more exciting to watch that play the trap....without Gaborik and Dupuis in the lineup, the Wild are easily the most boring team to watch.....if a team can score and play the trap(win for the most part) it is not that boring as some may make it out to be.

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Old
10-22-2003, 10:52 PM
  #6
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location surely a factor

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Old
10-23-2003, 03:10 AM
  #7
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There are several factors at work here.

1)World Series. They are competing with the Yankees post-season.

2)Location. They are competing with the established markets of the Rangers, Islanders, and Flyers.

3) Arena. CAA is one of the older arenas in the NHL and poorly accessible to public transit. Ideas have been tossed around on whether to relocate or refurbish for several years now. With a seating capacity of 19,040, it is larger than many.

4) Public Relations. The Devils do not promote individual players. They prefer to fly under the radar.

5) Economics. Attendance is down around the league, with some exceptions including Minnesota. Ticket prices are high, even though they haven't increased recently.

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10-23-2003, 03:27 AM
  #8
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The schedule surely doesn't help, as the Devs have hosted Tampa and Florida in two of their three home starts so far this season, not exactly what you'd call big draws.

But the overwhelming reason I think is the World Series; 80k+ sports fans at the stadium and every one of the thousands of bars in the tristate area packed with fans desperate to see the Rocket's last game.

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Old
10-23-2003, 04:24 AM
  #9
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I think the reasons people have mentioned here such as location, arena, and competition is what is hurting this team.

I think NJ's attedance woes are blamed on the trap much too often. I think if this team, with all the success it's had was in any other market over the past 10 years, that those markets would be enjoying a higher attendance/ticket price level.

Fans like winning. They do like an exciting product, but I think winning is the number one factor for retaining fans, and not many teams can boast a better record than NJ, and that most teams would gladly take the stigma that goes with the trap if they can have Jersey's success.

At the end of the day, NJ is the third man in the New York market for the fourth biggest sport. They're the casualty of an overcrowded market. What worries me is that the team is winning so much. This franchise may only have enough life in it to last until Brodeur's retirement. After that, they may go through a rebuilding process, and it doesn't sound like they have the fan base to support it.

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Old
10-23-2003, 06:49 AM
  #10
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New Jersey will never draw, and IMO should be the first franchise to be moved, either to another city, or to replace a team in existing city after contraction.

Other cities have trouble selling out, but that is generally because they put a bad product on the ice.

IMO any other NHL city would have packed the building if they had a team as successful as the Devils have been the last decade.

IMO the trap has nothing to do with why the Devils do not draw.

Problems the Devils have are:

#1. History - Hockey fans in that area were already with Rangers, Islanders, or Flyers fans.

#2. Building location - Not in a city, it's an exit of the New Jersey Turnpike.

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10-23-2003, 08:32 AM
  #11
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The Devils' ticket prices also are amongst the highest in the league I believe. Just did a search now, upper bowl center ice is $75 (other parts of the upper deck are $50, $35, and $20). Essentially the same seat in Los Angeles is $35.

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10-23-2003, 09:39 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brodeur
The Devils' ticket prices also are amongst the highest in the league I believe. Just did a search now, upper bowl center ice is $75 (other parts of the upper deck are $50, $35, and $20). Essentially the same seat in Los Angeles is $35.

On the Devils website it lists those tickets at $70, not $75. But regardless, upper bowl center ice in New Jersey is a lot different ticket then upper bowl center ice in LA. At the Staples Centre, you'll be twice the distance as at the Meadowlands.

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10-24-2003, 10:56 AM
  #13
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I'd be worried about NJ's future, if their having difficulty drawing fans now as one of the most successful teams in the NHL over the past 6-7yrs... what will it be like if/when the enter a rebulding phase and miss the playoffs for a few years?

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Old
10-24-2003, 11:14 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDaddyMeatWhistle
On the Devils website it lists those tickets at $70, not $75. But regardless, upper bowl center ice in New Jersey is a lot different ticket then upper bowl center ice in LA. At the Staples Centre, you'll be twice the distance as at the Meadowlands.
I included the $5 Ticketmaster "convenience" charge. It is true about the difference in vantage point, I'm still not sure if it's worth the $35 difference in price for a regular season game.

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Old
10-24-2003, 03:31 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
New Jersey will never draw, and IMO should be the first franchise to be moved, either to another city, or to replace a team in existing city after contraction.

Other cities have trouble selling out, but that is generally because they put a bad product on the ice.

IMO any other NHL city would have packed the building if they had a team as successful as the Devils have been the last decade.

IMO the trap has nothing to do with why the Devils do not draw.

Problems the Devils have are:

#1. History - Hockey fans in that area were already with Rangers, Islanders, or Flyers fans.

#2. Building location - Not in a city, it's an exit of the New Jersey Turnpike.
I can't argue with the history aspect, but I drove down(from Ottawa) to New Jersey for game 4 against the Senators. Our hotel was about a 2 minute drive from CAA and Giants stadium was right next door. I know the NFL is much more popular, but they sell-out so fast. In fact, there are 15 year waiting lists for the Jets' season tickets. Plus, we took a bus from our hotel into Manhattan and it took less then 30 minutes, so the distance part is not that bad!!!

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Old
10-24-2003, 03:45 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craven Morehead
I can't argue with the history aspect, but I drove down(from Ottawa) to New Jersey for game 4 against the Senators. Our hotel was about a 2 minute drive from CAA and Giants stadium was right next door. I know the NFL is much more popular, but they sell-out so fast. In fact, there are 15 year waiting lists for the Jets' season tickets. Plus, we took a bus from our hotel into Manhattan and it took less then 30 minutes, so the distance part is not that bad!!!

A few things.

#1. Football teams only play 10 home games a year, with 90% of them being on Sunday afternoons. Traffic is not a problem. Also Football is 20 times more popular than Hockey in the U.S.

#2. I think the location of the stadium is less an issue than history. there just aren't that many devils fans. People in that area grew up Rangers fans.


I've been to the rink a few times and the football stadium there a number of times, I don't mins at all that it's off an exit of the NJ Turnpike, actually makes it easier for me to get there. From my house about 90 minutes

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10-24-2003, 04:03 PM
  #17
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oh please..settle down...the devils sold out game one, had 16, 000 in game 2 and a pathetic showing against the panthers. All three games have gone up against playoff baseball...Game 7 of Yankees -Red Sox (game was sold out) and others went up against Yankee World Series...Devils don't have great fan support...but does it surprise you that a Flyer fan is calling for the devs to be moved...I would too if the Devs had a team they couldn't beat...unfortunately, the Devils aren't near the bottom in attendance...not good enough, i agree though

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Old
10-24-2003, 07:23 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craven Morehead
I can't argue with the history aspect, but I drove down(from Ottawa) to New Jersey for game 4 against the Senators. Our hotel was about a 2 minute drive from CAA and Giants stadium was right next door. I know the NFL is much more popular, but they sell-out so fast. In fact, there are 15 year waiting lists for the Jets' season tickets. Plus, we took a bus from our hotel into Manhattan and it took less then 30 minutes, so the distance part is not that bad!!!
First of all, Devils fans don't stay in hotels, and they don't live in Manhatten, which is where the only bus that goes to CAA originates from. That's the problem, all of New Jersey is designed to commute to New York. Consider for example, my situation, if I could take a train to CAA (or a bus) for under $5, I'd buy $20 tickets all the time and go to games. As it is I almost never go to games. Also, because of the way the cable monopolies work, half the Devils fans in North Jersey can't even watch the team on tv on saturday nights. Trust me, it's frustrating as hell trying to follow the team sometimes.

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10-24-2003, 07:44 PM
  #19
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As a Devils fan in NJ, it's EXPENSIVE (I'm a student, so money isn't exactly in large amounts in my pockets) to go games. The upper area ranges from $20 (ehh, up in the nosebleeds and the corners) to $70 (EH!?), and the lower level's $90! Plus, parking is another $10. So I'd essentially be dropping $30-$80 to get in the upper section, and $100 for the lower section. Even if I had a steady income, I don't see how I could afford to go to many games at those prices. Moreover, it's a PAIN to get to the games! I'd have to drive up the NJ Turnpike, pay for the tolls (a few bucks), and drive back after the game-something that'd take 2+ hours both ways. Buses are out of the question, they just don't run in my area to the Meadowlands. Why should I and many others drop so much money and go through so much to see a hockey game I can easily watch on Fox Sports NY or go spend money on the many other accessbile things in NJ or NYC?

If the Devils lower the ticket prices and there's a train line to the Meadowlands (or to another arena where the Devils play), attendence will surely increase. Low attendance doesn't mean no one in the state cares.

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10-24-2003, 07:47 PM
  #20
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Every team has expensive tickets. That's not really an issue.

Location of their arena is, though. That's a big thing with Ottawa, too, as I understand it.

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10-25-2003, 04:06 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burke's Evil Spirit
Every team has expensive tickets. That's not really an issue.

Location of their arena is, though. That's a big thing with Ottawa, too, as I understand it.
From what I understand about the Devil's arena, the situation is quite a bit different from Ottawa's. The Senators play in a suburb on the very west end of the city. It's not central by any means, but it is located in a populated area.

The Devil's arena is even further isolated the way I understand it. I know the Sens location costs them in terms of attendance, which means that New Jersey must definitely be hurting by it.

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10-25-2003, 07:42 AM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackjack
First of all, Devils fans don't stay in hotels, and they don't live in Manhatten, which is where the only bus that goes to CAA originates from. That's the problem, all of New Jersey is designed to commute to New York. Consider for example, my situation, if I could take a train to CAA (or a bus) for under $5, I'd buy $20 tickets all the time and go to games. As it is I almost never go to games. Also, because of the way the cable monopolies work, half the Devils fans in North Jersey can't even watch the team on tv on saturday nights. Trust me, it's frustrating as hell trying to follow the team sometimes.
They don't stay in Hotels??? My point was that we were near-bye, so obviously, it was very accessible for us. I should have elaborated more, my mistake!!! This idea that the stadium has no fans around is not as black and white as it seems. Still on the Jersey side, there were large pockets of areas where people live before we got into the Manhattan side. I don't know the area very well, so maybe I'm seeing what I want to see and some of those areas weren't the greatest(meaning, many of them probably couldn't afford to go to a hockey game even if they wanted to). From what I saw, it isn't as bad as people make it out to be!!!

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Old
10-26-2003, 04:36 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerseydevil
oh please..settle down...the devils sold out game one, had 16, 000 in game 2 and a pathetic showing against the panthers. All three games have gone up against playoff baseball...Game 7 of Yankees -Red Sox (game was sold out) and others went up against Yankee World Series...Devils don't have great fan support...but does it surprise you that a Flyer fan is calling for the devs to be moved...I would too if the Devs had a team they couldn't beat...unfortunately, the Devils aren't near the bottom in attendance...not good enough, i agree though

The bottom line is that the Devils attendance is brutal compared to the quality of the team they put on the ice.

Take a look at the attendance of teams that have had similar success to the Devils in recent years. You'll notice that it's not even close.

This has nothing to do with the Flyers/Devils rivalry.

2003 NHL attendance

Devils were 23rd and of the 7 teams below the Devils, only one was a playoff team last year.

2002 Devils were 19th

2001 Devils were 19th

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10-26-2003, 05:46 PM
  #24
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The bottom line is that No One really cares about the Devils

The big problem is that no one really cares about the Devils. Before the Devils were good after 1994, was anyone seriously a Devils fan? Probably most Devils fans after 1994 were either Rangers fans or Isles fans just tired of losing.

This is a huge problem for the league, and it has been for a few years now. For a league to survive, teams have to win championships every once in a while where people actually CARE that the team won the title. People in Dallas really don't care all that much about the Stars (I'm not dissing Stars fans here, they're a great team, but the Cowboys and Mavs are much more popular). And people in NY/NJ don't really care about the Devils.

The problem for the NHL is that they need a city where hockey is a huge sport to win the title, say a Canadian city, or a Boston, Philly, Minnesota (a hockey state) to win the title. Other than Detroit over the past 10 years, no Cup winner has really fallen into this category.

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Old
11-07-2003, 03:30 AM
  #25
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Right now the Rangers and Islanders have the same identity and fan problems the Devils have. Last night the local television's three stations all began their sports reports with Nets Basketball. To say nothing of the baseball spending about to dominate headlines in the NY area.

It's a baseball media market where rumors get more coverage than the most important of hockey games. Messier and LaFontaine could not get a single cover of any paper this week.

And Msg has not be filled or even close for their opener despite what they announced. Detroit, Colorado or Dallas. 11-12,000 fans in an 18,200 seat facilty.

The Isles hit the fans with a huge ticket increase and people do not want to pay to see Czerkawski on the first line and had 10,000 on a Saturday day game. The Ranger tickets are already very expensive and a large percentage of the Rangers tickets are co-owned with the Knicks and the basketball operation is a disaster and not selling.

I think folks looking just at the Devils as the problem with hockey here are not looking at the big picture. Both the Rangers and Islanders are losing revenue also.

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