HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > National Hockey League Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

Crosby Hat Trick and 2nd 40 goal or more season and still the best player in the NHL

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-19-2017, 11:35 PM
  #26
Pancakes
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 9,678
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Toews Era View Post
- old coach was holding him back
- new coach also holding him back by forcing him to play with his handpicked favorite winger of all time kunitz
- missed 6 games
- more goals than mcdavid (but ovechkin wasnt better all those years he scored more goals)
- free square in the middle

Crosbingo!
- Scores over 70 points in a season only once despite playing whole career with best american winger to ever play the game

- Gets considered better than Malkin because Canadian

- Wins faceoffs or something I guess

- free square in the middle

Toewsbingo

Pancakes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:35 PM
  #27
Honour Over Glory
Registered User
 
Honour Over Glory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North America
Country: United States
Posts: 23,469
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pancakes View Post
Being tied with Mcdavid and in six less games and with many more goals = Sid is having the better year, and is still the better player.

Mcdavid is amazing and he might take over the crown as soon as next year, but I don't see how anyone can think he's got it now.

Mcdavid will take over the title. It's only a matter of time.
Poor guy McDavid, he has to carry 1st round pick Draisatl and Patrick Maroon (producing at a pace hes produced in Anaheim before, more goals vs assists this time though).

Honour Over Glory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:36 PM
  #28
NHLsnipers
Registered User
 
NHLsnipers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,725
vCash: 500
Preach! Torch isn't close to being passed.

NHLsnipers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:41 PM
  #29
Invalid cuz QoC
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 124
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Toews Era View Post
- old coach was holding him back
- new coach also holding him back by forcing him to play with his handpicked favorite winger of all time kunitz
- missed 6 games
- more goals than mcdavid (but ovechkin wasnt better all those years he scored more goals)
- free square in the middle

Crosbingo!
ToewsBingo consists of ONE square...........

QoC

Stamped, what's my prize.


Last edited by Invalid cuz QoC: 03-19-2017 at 11:42 PM. Reason: Reverse Bingo
Invalid cuz QoC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:42 PM
  #30
Frank the Tank
Blue, you're my boy!
 
Frank the Tank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago, IL
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,624
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnybegood13 View Post
Please!

I watch McDavid all the time, if a team lets him wind up he'll hurt you with speed but he's done otherwise. Crosby on the other hand can kill you with a total 200 foot game and can score a 100 different ways.

2nd assists, fathom assists and playing minutes like he's a defenseman doesn't make McOnemove close to the talent of Crosby.
Glad to see McDavid's torching of the Flames this season already has him in their fans' heads.


Last edited by Frank the Tank: 03-20-2017 at 12:06 AM. Reason: a word
Frank the Tank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:49 PM
  #31
DearDiary
Cutest Poster 2016
 
DearDiary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,385
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
Crosby gets a lot more help not just from matchups with Malkin and Kessel but from the Pens D being better at moving the puck, switch them and McDavid is flirting with 90 points
Who are these Pens D better at moving the puck other than Schultz? Letang, Maatta and Daley are gone yet Crosby is still trucking along.

DearDiary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:50 PM
  #32
Empoleon8771
Kunitz Was There
 
Empoleon8771's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 19,364
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revelation View Post
Crosby gets a lot more help not just from matchups with Malkin and Kessel but from the Pens D being better at moving the puck, switch them and McDavid is flirting with 90 points
Quote:
Originally Posted by Empoleon8771 View Post
That's a pretty unfair argument to make, you're basically punishing Crosby for being on a better team. Crosby also having Malkin on his team doesn't make him a worse player.
Read this post in response to that. You're basically punishing Crosby for being on a better team.

Empoleon8771 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:55 PM
  #33
Tkachuk4MVP
26 Years of Fail
 
Tkachuk4MVP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 12,314
vCash: 500
Took about five posts for this thread to be predictably derailed. Yes I know the OP referenced Sid being the best player in the league, but I guess it's too much to ask that we just enjoy one of the all-time greats continuing to play great hockey into his late 20s/early 30s and reinventing himself with a different set of linemates.

Tkachuk4MVP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:58 PM
  #34
Frank the Tank
Blue, you're my boy!
 
Frank the Tank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago, IL
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,624
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Empoleon8771 View Post
Read this post in response to that. You're basically punishing Crosby for being on a better team.
That's the reality of the situation though. It will be considered by Hart Trophy voters in particular. Less so by Lindsay Trophy and All-Star team voters.

Frank the Tank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-19-2017, 11:59 PM
  #35
Empoleon8771
Kunitz Was There
 
Empoleon8771's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 19,364
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank the Tank View Post
That's the reality of the situation though. It will be considered by Hart Trophy voters in particular. Less so by Lindsay Trophy and All-Star team voters.
That's valid for the Hart since it's awarded to the most important player to his team, but "the most important to his team" is not "the best". That's not me ****ing on McDavid either, he's a phenomenal talent. I just think it's unfair to say that McDavid is better because Crosby is on a better team.

Empoleon8771 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:03 AM
  #36
Frank the Tank
Blue, you're my boy!
 
Frank the Tank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago, IL
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,624
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Empoleon8771 View Post
That's valid for the Hart since it's awarded to the most important player to his team, but "the most important to his team" is not "the best". That's not me ****ing on McDavid either, he's a phenomenal talent. I just think it's unfair to say that McDavid is better because Crosby is on a better team.
I'm not advocating that argument. I'm a big fan of both players and to this point in the season would consider either player worthy of the Hart, Lindsay, and/or Art Ross Trophies. A competent voter has to consider Kane and Marchand to be in the mix too. It should be an exciting finish to the season.

Frank the Tank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:13 AM
  #37
Honour Over Glory
Registered User
 
Honour Over Glory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North America
Country: United States
Posts: 23,469
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank the Tank View Post
I'm not advocating that argument. I'm a big fan of both players and to this point in the season would consider either player worthy of the Hart, Lindsay, and/or Art Ross Trophies. A competent voter has to consider Kane and Marchand to be in the mix too. It should be an exciting finish to the season.
The people would also need to look at how much Crosby is producing while playing less games. Being top 3 with that incredible PPG pace is where the cream rises to the top. Oh and the kids he plays with are not 60+pt players like say...Panarin, Pastrnak or Draisaitl. But they're still solid players in their own right and likely going to get to that point next season.

Honour Over Glory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:13 AM
  #38
radapex
Registered User
 
radapex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Canada, Eh
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,932
vCash: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank the Tank View Post
They are both great players who have lived up to the enormous expectations placed upon them since they were teenagers. Why drag one down in an attempt to prop the other up?

As an Oilers fan, I wouldn't be upset if Crosby grabs another Rocket, Art Ross, Hart, Lindsay, etc... to cement his legacy among the all-time greats. The fact that McDavid in his sophomore season is alongside a still dominant Crosby represents a significant achievement.
As a Pens fan, I'm obviously biased in wanting to see Crosby win those trophies. But man... how impressive would it be for him to do that after missing the start of the season with a concussion, and with the kind of seasons McDavid, Marchand, and Kane are having.

radapex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:19 AM
  #39
SupremeTeam16
5-14-6-1
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,079
vCash: 500
As an Oilers fan Crosby is still the best in the world. They are clearly on another level from everyone else talent wise but I don't see how anyone can sit there and say McDavid is clear cut better then Crosby because it simply isn't true.

That's not to say it won't change though. Crosby has a decade's worth of experience on McDavid, in 2-3-5 years when McDavid has played hundreds of NHL games and has had years to refine his skills and improve areas of his game then the pendulum likely swings in his favour. The one thing they both share besides sublime hockey talent is their drive to be the absolute best they can. That's what I've always admired about Crosby he is constantly seeking to turn his weaknesses into strengths. At times during his career he's been criticized for his draws, his two way play, his lack of goal scoring ability and he's always gone out and made the adjustments to turn these perceived weaknesses into clear strengths in his game without sacrificing other areas.

SupremeTeam16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:20 AM
  #40
notsocommonsense
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 933
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevy999 View Post
give me a break lol Crosby plays on the Stanley cup Champions who are a higher scoriong team lol Mcdavid has created so many more chances than Crosby and his teammates don't finish it off. You can't just go by a measily 8 point difference over so many games lol and how the hell cares about goals, Mcdavid passed most of the year and gave up so many chances to score. Bottom line is when i see Mcdavid and Crosby play, Mcdavid looks more dangerous every time.
You guys do realize that Pitt won the cup last year in large part do to um, Crosby right?

This argument that mcdavid has had the better year despite a large gap in goals and ppg because crosbys team won the cup last year is hilarious

And I love mcdavid, but Crosby is quite clearly still the better player

2nd place isn't so bad

notsocommonsense is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:21 AM
  #41
radapex
Registered User
 
radapex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Canada, Eh
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,932
vCash: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tkachuk4MVP View Post
Took about five posts for this thread to be predictably derailed. Yes I know the OP referenced Sid being the best player in the league, but I guess it's too much to ask that we just enjoy one of the all-time greats continuing to play great hockey into his late 20s/early 30s and reinventing himself with a different set of linemates.
And if anyone wants to question that... see: http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/recor...e-leaders.html

Despite playing in one of the lowest scoring eras in NHL history, Crosby has still managed to hold down the #5 spots in career points per game. He's also now surpassed Mike Bossy and Bobby Orr in career games played (at 772), so we're not talking about an insignificant sample size. Love him or hate him, Crosby has done more than enough to cement himself as one of the all-time greats.

radapex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:28 AM
  #42
Se829ne
Expendable enforcer
 
Se829ne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,333
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NHLsnipers View Post
Preach! Torch isn't close to being passed.
Yep. Switch in torch carrying gonna take some more time. Hopefully McDavid's future path with health issues won't be like Crosby's past path. Quite impressive season for Crosby. One of his best.

All things considered, if there happens to ever occur difficulties to choose whom would be Masterton-worthy maybe it would be time to award that to Crosby.

Quote:
The Bill Masterton Memorial Trophy is awarded annually to the National Hockey League player who best exemplifies the qualities of perseverance, sportsmanship, and dedication to ice hockey...
...It is often awarded to a player who has come back from career....
Crosby's career seems to me like a Lemieuxesque-perpetual come back to the top from injuries. Dedication is unquestionable, and it takes some perseverance too, repeat the feat again and again and again, while seasoning and getting better like an old wine...

Se829ne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:28 AM
  #43
Tkachuk4MVP
26 Years of Fail
 
Tkachuk4MVP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 12,314
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by radapex View Post
And if anyone wants to question that... see: http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/recor...e-leaders.html

Despite playing in one of the lowest scoring eras in NHL history, Crosby has still managed to hold down the #5 spots in career points per game. He's also now surpassed Mike Bossy and Bobby Orr in career games played (at 772), so we're not talking about an insignificant sample size. Love him or hate him, Crosby has done more than enough to cement himself as one of the all-time greats.

That's nuts, had no idea he was that high on the list.

Tkachuk4MVP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:40 AM
  #44
Se829ne
Expendable enforcer
 
Se829ne's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,333
vCash: 500
I want to add to my last comment, that I was not any kind Crosby fan during his first years. due his attitude problems, and personality issues. Further his career has gone, further he has grown out from these kind of things, making him much more easier to like as a player then before.

Whatever, his deeds on ice are what count now regardless... Something nobody can excuse out. His grip to the torch seems remain rather firm.

Se829ne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 12:43 AM
  #45
GetThePuckOuttaHere*
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 290
vCash: 500
Sid's still the best, but McDavid deserves the Hart. I'm fed up with Art Ross = Hart. When Kane won it last season, I **** bricks. "Most valuable to his team." Give me a break.

GetThePuckOuttaHere* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 01:10 AM
  #46
zar
Oiler Fan
 
zar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Edmonton AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,013
vCash: 500
Another Oiler fan here to day Crosby is still ahead of McDavid. While I feel Connor is a more exciting player to watch, he is not as well rounded of a player as Sid and not as good defensively.

Just to set one thing straight though... having Malkin as #2 C is an advantage... it's logical and a valid factor, not a 'punishment', when comparing McDavid vs. Crosby.

zar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 01:18 AM
  #47
Empoleon8771
Kunitz Was There
 
Empoleon8771's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 19,364
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by zar View Post
Another Oiler fan here to day Crosby is still ahead of McDavid. While I feel Connor is a more exciting player to watch, he is not as well rounded of a player as Sid and not as good defensively.
I actually don't think McDavid is worse defensively than Crosby, I think the big thing that separates those two is Crosby's goal scoring ability. You don't usually see a guy be as solid defensively as McDavid is at his age, I think he'll easily end up better than Crosby defensively in the long run.

Quote:
Just to set one thing straight though... having Malkin as #2 C is an advantage... it's logical and a valid factor, not a 'punishment', when comparing McDavid vs. Crosby.
People overall use it as a negative towards Crosby though, that's why I say it's a punishment towards Crosby. People are saying Crosby isn't as good as offensively as the stats say because they have Malkin on another line, which isn't fair for Crosby.

Empoleon8771 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 01:32 AM
  #48
Sidney the Kidney
Unsustainable
 
Sidney the Kidney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,248
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by zar View Post

Just to set one thing straight though... having Malkin as #2 C is an advantage... it's logical and a valid factor, not a 'punishment', when comparing McDavid vs. Crosby.
It's an advantage to the Penguins because it gives them two star players they can send out there shift after shift, but I'm not entirely sure why Malkin's such an advantage to Sid on an individual level?

Sid draws the toughest match-ups. Malkin doesn't help with that. Sid plays on a different line, so Malkin's not helping him rack up even strength points. Sid also takes the tougher zone assignments than Malkin, so it's not even like Malkin frees Sid up to only take O-zone draws.

So what, exactly, does Malkin being on the team help Sid with when it doesn't change how the other team game-plans (ie. all the top defensive players/shutdown players are up against Sid)?

Sidney the Kidney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 01:38 AM
  #49
Honour Over Glory
Registered User
 
Honour Over Glory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North America
Country: United States
Posts: 23,469
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Se829ne View Post
I want to add to my last comment, that I was not any kind Crosby fan during his first years. due his attitude problems, and personality issues. Further his career has gone, further he has grown out from these kind of things, making him much more easier to like as a player then before.

Whatever, his deeds on ice are what count now regardless... Something nobody can excuse out. His grip to the torch seems remain rather firm.
You need to not let HFboards skew your view about players, that sort of crap was perpetuated more here than anywhere else. Crosby might have chirped a ton his first year because of the crap he had to put up with, but after that first year, he was relatively quiet and Captains always talk to refs a lot, it's part of that role.

Personality stuff..the guy has never not been a great ambassador to the sport with fans and people alike.

Honour Over Glory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-20-2017, 01:40 AM
  #50
Honour Over Glory
Registered User
 
Honour Over Glory's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North America
Country: United States
Posts: 23,469
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by zar View Post
Another Oiler fan here to day Crosby is still ahead of McDavid. While I feel Connor is a more exciting player to watch, he is not as well rounded of a player as Sid and not as good defensively.

Just to set one thing straight though... having Malkin as #2 C is an advantage... it's logical and a valid factor, not a 'punishment', when comparing McDavid vs. Crosby.
Yeah and a lot of teams do that, to get favorable match-ups if their 1st line is getting the bulk of the shutdown units. Teams will never not employ them against Crosby first, Malkin 2nd.

Just like teams do against the Hawks when Kane and Toews are separated or the Stars when Benn an Seguin are (I think they stack all 3 now). But to say it as a detriment to Crosby's production as it being lesser some of the more ridiculous things said about him. Literally no one says that sort of stuff besides people here. If you ever read what analysts and hockey personalities say about Crosby or even his peers, people would get it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GetThePuckOuttaHere View Post
Sid's still the best, but McDavid deserves the Hart. I'm fed up with Art Ross = Hart. When Kane won it last season, I **** bricks. "Most valuable to his team." Give me a break.
McDavid has a good case for it for sure, but I think Sid would edge him out based on his production vs him missing games and his team's man games lost.

Honour Over Glory is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:50 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. @2017 All Rights Reserved.