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Two out of three years Art Ross goes to a player with less than 100 points

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Old
03-20-2017, 03:30 PM
  #76
Lebowski
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Refs are humans. Might work in the future when we have a supercomputer AI running things but I don't think it'll work like that.
I'm talking about calling the game the same way from the 1st minute of the first period to the 20th minute of the third period. I don't know why it would take a super computer to do that.

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Old
03-20-2017, 03:31 PM
  #77
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Well then maybe what the NHL needs is more fart jokes and cutaways to movie scenes from the 80s
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What are the concussion statistics over the last few years? I wouldn't be surprised if the NHL purposely wanted to show the game down (by letting more hooking and grabbing go) for safety reasons.
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Concussions from open ice hits and injuries related to hits on defencemen by players flying in on the forecheck are the two areas that was really noticed. However, there have been several other adjustments to limit dangerous open ice hits. I'd argue the forechecking hits could be controlled with a generous interpretation of what is considered a charge (obviously let teams know that flying in for a hit on the forecheck will be a charge every time).
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As much was said in those leaked e-mails a while back. Think it was conversations between Campbell and McKenzie where Campbell was complaining about how not being able to slow guys down with any kind of obstruction through the neutral zone had lead to players trying to throw more hits in the open ice. Which leads to more poorly timed hits and hits where you are extending to try to get pieces of guys which inevitably was leading to more dangerous hits.

I do think the league has intentionally slowed the game down as part of the overall attempt to reduce head injuries. And really, it's all been pretty successful. For player brains at least
This was discussed on CTV's W5.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/w5-tsn-inve...game-1.3320042

Seems fighting and hitting are gone because of all those enforcer deaths.

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Old
03-20-2017, 03:36 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Melrose Munch View Post
This was discussed on CTV's W5.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/w5-tsn-inve...game-1.3320042

Seems fighting and hitting are gone because of all those enforcer deaths.
I might be in the minority but I like how fights are now. Calgary has Brouwer, Ferland, Tkachuk, Versteeg, Engellend, Bennett, Bouma, Hathaway, Chiasson and Bartkowski all with fights this year. So much more enjoyable than McGratten fighting 15 times a year. Obviously better for the brain as well.

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03-20-2017, 03:37 PM
  #79
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Just like other people have said, call penalties like the rule book says they should be called and the league will be fine. It will make clutching and grabbing go down and will increase the amount of PPs and PP goals. All of these other suggestions, like making it illegal to block shots or making the goalies unsafe by getting rid of their equipment, are dumb compared to just calling the game the way it should be called.

The only proposed rule change I've heard that I like is not letting players out of the box on 2 minute powerplays if a goal is scored. Same as it is with a 5 minute major, a guy in the penalty box stays in the box for the entire two minutes regardless of whether the other team scores or not.
Eh, I don't think I like that last idea.... I think it makes it more likely that one bad call could swing a game in the playoffs... but I agree with everything else you say

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03-20-2017, 03:40 PM
  #80
Frank Drebin
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From the period of 1981-82 through 85-86 the Art Ross went to a guy who scored 200+points 4 out of 5 years, missing it one year by 4 points.

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03-20-2017, 03:41 PM
  #81
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Not sure why individual stat totals have any bearing on the entertainment of the on-ice product. If you're watching a game and then someone shows you the NHL stats, does the game not seem as fun anymore?

There is marginal decrease in scoring until they cut down on interference, and then it moderately rises, and starts marginally decreasing again. It's cyclical. But individual scoring totals on the leaderboards has more to do with better depth than anything else. We had much higher scoring leader point totals in the true dead puck era than now, and it's because there were weaker links to exploit, and the cream of the crop had an easier time rising to the top. The more talented the bottom NHL players get, the harder it is for the top players to dominate.

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Old
03-20-2017, 03:46 PM
  #82
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The idea of 30 teams playing like the Leafs sounds terrible to me.
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Good thing there's gonna be 31 teams then.
I think the Leafs are exciting and will be one of the most exciting teams in the future.
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I might be in the minority but I like how fights are now. Calgary has Brouwer, Ferland, Tkachuk, Versteeg, Engellend, Bennett, Bouma, Hathaway, Chiasson and Bartkowski all with fights this year. So much more enjoyable than McGratten fighting 15 times a year. Obviously better for the brain as well.
Fair enough, but guys like Brian McGrattan were important too. Also, I miss line brawls.

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Old
03-20-2017, 03:54 PM
  #83
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Fair enough, but guys like Brian McGrattan were important too. Also, I miss line brawls.
See I hated McGrattan and Bollig. Wasted 8 minutes of ice time and almost ruined Stajan's career.

Seeing Stajan with Chiasson, Ferland, Bouma and Brouwer on the 4th line just adds another weapon that didn't exist even 5 years ago. They can hem in top lines in their own end. Engellend and Ferland are the guys now that keep things honest.

Even Backlund is getting chippy, I love it. Now that there aren't unskilled monsters hanging around the middle weights can step up.

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03-20-2017, 03:58 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Frank Drebin View Post
From the period of 1981-82 through 85-86 the Art Ross went to a guy who scored 200+points 4 out of 5 years, missing it one year by 4 points.
And in those 5 years, he amassed more points than Crosby or Ovechkin have over their entire careers so far. lol

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03-20-2017, 03:58 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Anglesmith View Post
Not sure why individual stat totals have any bearing on the entertainment of the on-ice product. If you're watching a game and then someone shows you the NHL stats, does the game not seem as fun anymore?

There is marginal decrease in scoring until they cut down on interference, and then it moderately rises, and starts marginally decreasing again. It's cyclical. But individual scoring totals on the leaderboards has more to do with better depth than anything else. We had much higher scoring leader point totals in the true dead puck era than now, and it's because there were weaker links to exploit, and the cream of the crop had an easier time rising to the top. The more talented the bottom NHL players get, the harder it is for the top players to dominate.
This is very true - especially combined with the lower minutes for top players these days.

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Old
03-20-2017, 04:02 PM
  #86
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And in those 5 years, he amassed more points than Crosby or Ovechkin have over their entire careers so far. lol
Crazy!

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Old
03-20-2017, 04:08 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Anglesmith View Post
Not sure why individual stat totals have any bearing on the entertainment of the on-ice product. If you're watching a game and then someone shows you the NHL stats, does the game not seem as fun anymore?

There is marginal decrease in scoring until they cut down on interference, and then it moderately rises, and starts marginally decreasing again. It's cyclical. But individual scoring totals on the leaderboards has more to do with better depth than anything else. We had much higher scoring leader point totals in the true dead puck era than now, and it's because there were weaker links to exploit, and the cream of the crop had an easier time rising to the top. The more talented the bottom NHL players get, the harder it is for the top players to dominate.
They really don't, but it just so happens that the game was better to watch when top players were scoring more. More scoring chances, highlight reel plays, hitting, to a lesser extent fighting which I don't really care for much anymore, and less trapping, defensive systems, shot blocking and giant goaltenders. The game from 90-2010 was the best, that brief few year period before the 2004-05 lockout was getting pretty dull again though. Since 2010 the game has got increasingly less entertaining overall.

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Old
03-20-2017, 04:17 PM
  #88
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Bring back 80s goaltending!

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Old
03-20-2017, 04:18 PM
  #89
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They really don't, but it just so happens that the game was better to watch when top players were scoring more. More scoring chances, highlight reel plays, hitting, to a lesser extent fighting which I don't really care for much anymore, and less trapping, defensive systems, shot blocking and giant goaltenders. The game from 90-2010 was the best, that brief few year period before the 2004-05 lockout was getting pretty dull again though. Since 2010 the game has got increasingly less entertaining overall.
I mean, all of that is subjective. A lot of people love today's game and see it as the best version ever.

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03-20-2017, 04:30 PM
  #90
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I mean, all of that is subjective. A lot of people love today's game and see it as the best version ever.
Well, obviously. None of the reasons I stated as to why I find the game less entertaining are subjective though, they are factual. It would be hard for me to understand how anyone who watched the game for a good portion of the 90s or even since 2005 would find hockey today the most entertaining. The players are better than ever, but a majority of games now are far too void of individual showcases of skill leading to goals or back and forth action. I understand hitting being phased out, but that is undeniably a huge part of the entertainment value for a majority of fans, I don't actually know of a single person who finds todays hockey more fun to watch than ever.

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Old
03-20-2017, 04:45 PM
  #91
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Fans will watch their regional teams no matter what. Very few will watch out of town games without star power. The NFL/NBA understand this and have made changes so the marquee names can stand out. The NHL was heading this way post lockout. Pittsburgh/Washington games were must see TV. I would make a point to see Crosby/Ovechkin play as much as I can. Now I hardly ever watch them unless it is convenient.

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03-20-2017, 05:12 PM
  #92
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See I hated McGrattan and Bollig. Wasted 8 minutes of ice time and almost ruined Stajan's career.

Seeing Stajan with Chiasson, Ferland, Bouma and Brouwer on the 4th line just adds another weapon that didn't exist even 5 years ago. They can hem in top lines in their own end. Engellend and Ferland are the guys now that keep things honest.

Even Backlund is getting chippy, I love it. Now that there aren't unskilled monsters hanging around the middle weights can step up.
I think they brought an extra element. The fans used to be on their feet for Brandon and Brian. I get hockey is more skilled now, but I think the 04 flames for example are just as good as any team today.

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03-20-2017, 05:26 PM
  #93
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If goals such as this go in again, you cannot collapse.

I agree time and space is also an issue, but in my opinion it is a very secondary concern. The biggest issue is goalie pads.

Specifically, shoulder pad size and leg pad weight and shape. Pads are made to turn and form covering the five hole.

I don't want to try and "fix" the padding. Add another foot to the goal and you will have a much more entertaining game. Man on man defense will be implemented again. You cannot let a high slot shot be taken again.

The game, as always, flows from the goal outward.
DING DING DING

The problem, 100%, is goalie pads. Perimiter shots are no longer a threat, so teams collapse to the middle and block passing lanes. If the D actually needed to challenge on the perimiter it creates space in the slot and opens up passing lanes.

I would 100000000000% support the league going MLB style and banning anything but wood sticks if it means the goalies stop whining about their pads. Its pretty telling when former and even some current goalies flat out say they do it to cheat, not for protection. But they have the BS excuse of composite sticks. So ditch the sticks. Families across the world will thank you anyway, when they can suddenly purchase a multitude of sub $100 sticks again.

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03-20-2017, 06:01 PM
  #94
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Fans will watch their regional teams no matter what. Very few will watch out of town games without star power. The NFL/NBA understand this and have made changes so the marquee names can stand out. The NHL was heading this way post lockout. Pittsburgh/Washington games were must see TV. I would make a point to see Crosby/Ovechkin play as much as I can. Now I hardly ever watch them unless it is convenient.
Crosby and Ovechkin are far less entertaining than they used to be. The most entertaining players for me these days are the young guys on the Leafs, Kane, Malkin and most of all McDavid.

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Old
03-20-2017, 06:02 PM
  #95
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I think they brought an extra element. The fans used to be on their feet for Brandon and Brian. I get hockey is more skilled now, but I think the 04 flames for example are just as good as any team today.
Very doubtful.

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Old
03-20-2017, 06:12 PM
  #96
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I think they brought an extra element. The fans used to be on their feet for Brandon and Brian. I get hockey is more skilled now, but I think the 04 flames for example are just as good as any team today.
I don't at all.

Remove Kipper from the equation and the Flames right now mop the floor with the 04 Flames.

We got outplayed on almost every playoff game that year. Obviously Iggy was an absolute animal that could win any game today on his own but the depth is a blowout.

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03-20-2017, 06:14 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by SilverSeven View Post
DING DING DING

The problem, 100%, is goalie pads. Perimiter shots are no longer a threat, so teams collapse to the middle and block passing lanes. If the D actually needed to challenge on the perimiter it creates space in the slot and opens up passing lanes.

I would 100000000000% support the league going MLB style and banning anything but wood sticks if it means the goalies stop whining about their pads. Its pretty telling when former and even some current goalies flat out say they do it to cheat, not for protection. But they have the BS excuse of composite sticks. So ditch the sticks. Families across the world will thank you anyway, when they can suddenly purchase a multitude of sub $100 sticks again.
Isn't that coming next year?

Regulations on pad size would be great. I agree that it would open up the ice more than anything else.

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03-20-2017, 06:25 PM
  #98
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Isn't that coming next year?

Regulations on pad size would be great. I agree that it would open up the ice more than anything else.

There are already regulations on pad size and it's smaller than it was in the 90s. And narrower than it was in the 80s.

Also, goalies have always pushed the boundaries of the rulebook for equipment going back to at least the 70s (Esposito invented several equipment modifications that either caused rulebook rewrites, or equipment manufacturers adopted as standard design).

There is a difference in how the pad sits on the leg now though, which lends partly to the illusion of being 'massive'

But overall surface area? Likely equivalent to an 80s goalie of equal height.

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Old
03-20-2017, 06:35 PM
  #99
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Meh, I think this has been an extremely entertaining decade or so of hockey, but I like good passing, strong goal-tending, and good defense. I don't need 7 goals in a game to enjoy it.

I might be a little spoiled though. I can see how watching some of these teams would be difficult.

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03-20-2017, 06:46 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by SilverSeven View Post
DING DING DING

The problem, 100%, is goalie pads. Perimiter shots are no longer a threat, so teams collapse to the middle and block passing lanes. If the D actually needed to challenge on the perimiter it creates space in the slot and opens up passing lanes.

I would 100000000000% support the league going MLB style and banning anything but wood sticks if it means the goalies stop whining about their pads. Its pretty telling when former and even some current goalies flat out say they do it to cheat, not for protection. But they have the BS excuse of composite sticks. So ditch the sticks. Families across the world will thank you anyway, when they can suddenly purchase a multitude of sub $100 sticks again.
I like how people would rather see an extra .2 goals per game total instead of, you know, keeping the goalies safe. Yawn. Just like everything the NHL does, they'll screw up the goalie equipment size reductions and it will just result in goalies getting hurt more often.

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