HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Winnipeg Jets
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Expansion Draft - Part II

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-04-2017, 05:44 PM
  #51
KCjetsfan
Registered User
 
KCjetsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Gardner KS
Posts: 2,742
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffh View Post
enstrom will be exposed. enstrom will not be taken by vegas with only 1 year left on contract and 6 mill with all the better cheaper options available to them. enstrom plays out last year and then says goodbye after we use him as a rental and make the playoffs next year.
Why as a player would I negotiate a NMC, which presumably has a monetary value in contract negotiations, only to waive it .... Just because? There's no logical reason to it, unless I really do wish to play in Vegas.

KCjetsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-04-2017, 05:48 PM
  #52
larmex99
HFBoards Sponsor
 
larmex99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Mexico
Country: Mexico
Posts: 1,263
vCash: 1401
Quote:
Originally Posted by KCjetsfan View Post
Why as a player would I negotiate a NMC, which presumably has a monetary value in contract negotiations, only to waive it .... Just because? There's no logical reason to it, unless I really do wish to play in Vegas.
Answer: To have control of your future. Many players waive it if they think it benefits them. Will he? Who knows?

larmex99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-04-2017, 05:58 PM
  #53
KCjetsfan
Registered User
 
KCjetsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Gardner KS
Posts: 2,742
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by larmex99 View Post
Answer: To have control of your future. Many players waive it if they think it benefits them. Will he? Who knows?
But that's the thing. By waiving it for the XD he loses control of his destiny unless it is guaranteed Vegas drafts him, and he would only do it if he really really wants to play for Vegas. If they don't pick him then the jets hold all the cards and could deal him anywhere at any time. Makes no sense for him to agree to that.

KCjetsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2017, 10:40 AM
  #54
Dayofthedogs
Registered User
 
Dayofthedogs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 933
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KCjetsfan View Post
But that's the thing. By waiving it for the XD he loses control of his destiny unless it is guaranteed Vegas drafts him, and he would only do it if he really really wants to play for Vegas. If they don't pick him then the jets hold all the cards and could deal him anywhere at any time. Makes no sense for him to agree to that.
I dont believe thats true. The NMC stays intact I think.

Dayofthedogs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2017, 10:46 AM
  #55
Aavco Cup
Registered User
 
Aavco Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 24,250
vCash: 300
The NMC waivers for all players will only apply to the XD, not for the remainder of their contracts. Nobody will sign a blanket waiver for the rest of their contract. Why would any player give up leverage like that?

Aavco Cup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2017, 11:16 AM
  #56
Gil Fisher
Registered User
 
Gil Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,092
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10Ducky10 View Post
So, you lose Myers in the XD and a goalie to waivers? and you're a forward short on the list... No thanks.


Why would we lose a goalie to waivers?

Do you think Vegas has access to medical records of players available to be chosen?

I think they'd take one of the goalies.

I do need another forward to make available in the XD, which shouldn't be a huge problem.

Gil Fisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2017, 11:38 AM
  #57
KCjetsfan
Registered User
 
KCjetsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Gardner KS
Posts: 2,742
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
The NMC waivers for all players will only apply to the XD, not for the remainder of their contracts. Nobody will sign a blanket waiver for the rest of their contract. Why would any player give up leverage like that?
hmm my mistake then. i suppose that invalidates half of my reasoning but not the other.

KCjetsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-06-2017, 08:57 AM
  #58
Whileee
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 25,622
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
The NMC waivers for all players will only apply to the XD, not for the remainder of their contracts. Nobody will sign a blanket waiver for the rest of their contract. Why would any player give up leverage like that?
So if Enstrom waives his NMC just for the xD, then Vegas can't move him again? That would really reduce the likelihood that Vegas selects him.

Whileee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-06-2017, 10:07 AM
  #59
Aavco Cup
Registered User
 
Aavco Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 24,250
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
So if Enstrom waives his NMC just for the xD, then Vegas can't move him again? That would really reduce the likelihood that Vegas selects him.
If it wasn't that way why would any player waive their NMC? It would be like voluntarily removing it from your contract.

Vegas could trade him at the dealine provided he waives his clause again. But that ensures he has to move up to three times in the next year. Why would Enstrom want that?

Aavco Cup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-06-2017, 01:38 PM
  #60
Oilpeg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 115
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
If it wasn't that way why would any player waive their NMC? It would be like voluntarily removing it from your contract.

Vegas could trade him at the dealine provided he waives his clause again. But that ensures he has to move up to three times in the next year. Why would Enstrom want that?
Only way Toby waives is if he's guaranteed to not be picked. Chevy would have a deal in place with Vegas to stay away from Toby paying them with an additional pick or prospect. Toby waives for the betterment of the team as it would allow them to go 1-3-7 and lose either Copp or Dano instead of Lowry or Perreault, (for example). I'm not sure why people don't see the benefit of this for Toby, he gets to play on a better team next year if he waives. If he doesn't waive, the Jets lose a better player than they would if he does waive, thus he'd be playing on a weaker team next year. I'm sure he'd like to play on the best team he could.

I'm saying this with the giant caveat that Chevy must have a deal with Vegas to stay away from Toby. Maybe they ship Petan to Vegas and in exchange Vegas picks Chiarot. Or something similar.

Oilpeg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-06-2017, 03:01 PM
  #61
voyageur
The watchful one
 
voyageur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: North End Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,756
vCash: 500
I think Vegas is looking for an entry level contract from us. The strength of our team is in our prospect pool. You can not draft 30 NHL players, and establish depth. Because everyone of your players is subject to waivers claims.

They probably don't want 1 year contracts either, as their value is only in trade, down the road.

I see us making a trade with Vegas. A player like Lemieux, with good size in a big and strong division, would have value. Maybe we get our goalie for him. Pickard? Jimmy Howard? Add another prospect. Don't think Raanta will come available, suspect Nash will be taken.

But I suspect we address one of our weaknesses through the Expansion Draft, sacrificing some of our youth. If use Enstrom or Myers as assets, we can redeem other areas. Building a prospect pool is a good way to use assets, to avoid trades for picks, or overpriced UFAs.

voyageur is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-07-2017, 12:41 PM
  #62
buggs
nanoo nanoo
 
buggs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: somewhere flat
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,138
vCash: 162
Bit of an odd expansion draft question for our experts. This isn't my idea or suggestion but I am seeking clarification.

Overheard a conversation the other day regarding the expansion draft and what Vegas can actually take if they want. The suggestion pertained to goaltenders and they said Vegas can take up to six goaltenders if they want. That sounded kind of fishy to me though it would still leave them with 24 teams to pick D and forwards from. The conversation then suggested that Vegas was likely to do this because then they could deal quality goaltenders either for other players or picks in various years' drafts going forward. It continued merrily along with the suggestion that the Jets are working with the Knights to get them to take a goaltender they want and they'll then trade them Hutch plus to get that goaltender, whoever it may be.

On the surface it's a bit of an out there but somewhat plausible notion. I'm really not familiar with what happens in the XD from Vegas' standpoint so is this plausible, at least pertaining to the taking of six goaltenders? I suppose they could take 30 if they really wanted to but that would be the absurd end of the equation. What should Vegas be looking at doing in terms of stocking their team?

buggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-07-2017, 12:53 PM
  #63
Aavco Cup
Registered User
 
Aavco Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 24,250
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by buggs View Post
Bit of an odd expansion draft question for our experts. This isn't my idea or suggestion but I am seeking clarification.

Overheard a conversation the other day regarding the expansion draft and what Vegas can actually take if they want. The suggestion pertained to goaltenders and they said Vegas can take up to six goaltenders if they want. That sounded kind of fishy to me though it would still leave them with 24 teams to pick D and forwards from. The conversation then suggested that Vegas was likely to do this because then they could deal quality goaltenders either for other players or picks in various years' drafts going forward. It continued merrily along with the suggestion that the Jets are working with the Knights to get them to take a goaltender they want and they'll then trade them Hutch plus to get that goaltender, whoever it may be.

On the surface it's a bit of an out there but somewhat plausible notion. I'm really not familiar with what happens in the XD from Vegas' standpoint so is this plausible, at least pertaining to the taking of six goaltenders? I suppose they could take 30 if they really wanted to but that would be the absurd end of the equation. What should Vegas be looking at doing in terms of stocking their team?
These are their rules

* The Las Vegas franchise must select the following number of players at each position: 14 forwards, nine defensemen and three goaltenders.

That leaves 4 picks that are variable so I guess they could actually select 7 G. I doubt they pick like that though

Aavco Cup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-07-2017, 01:31 PM
  #64
Evil Little
Registered User
 
Evil Little's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 4,070
vCash: 1837
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
These are their rules

* The Las Vegas franchise must select the following number of players at each position: 14 forwards, nine defensemen and three goaltenders.

That leaves 4 picks that are variable so I guess they could actually select 7 G. I doubt they pick like that though
I think it's more likely they take a similar strategy but with defencemen, not goalies.

Though 1B/2A goalies are worth more than #5/6 defencemen, there will also be fewer teams with holes to fill in net.

I do think priority #1 will be their own roster, though. Guaranteed lottery picks make their situation pretty unique.

Evil Little is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2017, 09:49 PM
  #65
Aavco Cup
Registered User
 
Aavco Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 24,250
vCash: 300
Maybe we've been looking at this all wrong. Everyone is assuming that teams will try to entice Vegas to pick a certain player or to not pick a certain player by sending them additional asset(s) either draft pick or prospect variety.

But why couldn't it happen in reverse? In other words Vegas sends an asset to a team so that a particular player is unprotected so he can be selected in the draft.

For instance Vegas sends us a 3rd rd pick to leave Myers unprotected.

Aavco Cup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2017, 09:53 PM
  #66
uTurris
We the True North
 
uTurris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,704
vCash: 500
Armia is the smart decision to leave exposed over the rest.

I think why is because he'd most likely be in the pressbox most games or at least placed on waivers or the AHL. We could likely get him back quickly.

uTurris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2017, 10:13 PM
  #67
surixon
Registered User
 
surixon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,760
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
Maybe we've been looking at this all wrong. Everyone is assuming that teams will try to entice Vegas to pick a certain player or to not pick a certain player by sending them additional asset(s) either draft pick or prospect variety.

But why couldn't it happen in reverse? In other words Vegas sends an asset to a team so that a particular player is unprotected so he can be selected in the draft.

For instance Vegas sends us a 3rd rd pick to leave Myers unprotected.
Well I'd imagine Vegas will not look to deal assets when they have the upper hand so to speak. Also all their assets are futures and they will need to stockpile a system as they don't have any.

surixon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2017, 10:15 PM
  #68
Aavco Cup
Registered User
 
Aavco Cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 24,250
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by surixon View Post
Well I'd imagine Vegas will not look to deal assets when they have the upper hand so to speak. Also all their assets are futures and they will need to stockpile a system as they don't have any.
Well they acquire some and they send some away. They could still end up on the positive side after all the counting us done. It's just a different way of looking at things.

Aavco Cup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-11-2017, 12:02 PM
  #69
Coach G
King Props 2016
 
Coach G's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: In the corners
Country: Canada
Posts: 345
vCash: 1097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
Maybe we've been looking at this all wrong. Everyone is assuming that teams will try to entice Vegas to pick a certain player or to not pick a certain player by sending them additional asset(s) either draft pick or prospect variety.

But why couldn't it happen in reverse? In other words Vegas sends an asset to a team so that a particular player is unprotected so he can be selected in the draft.

For instance Vegas sends us a 3rd rd pick to leave Myers unprotected.
I hadn't thought of it this way. It would have to be McPhee making the call to Chevy though, not the other way around, and it would have to be before the protected lists are locked in... and if I were McPhee, I wouldn't tip my hand about who I wanted and thereby give up some of my bargaining power.
I'm not sure if the above will make sense to everyone, but I guess I'm saying that I don't think this would realistically happen.

Coach G is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-12-2017, 11:32 AM
  #70
CaptainChef
Registered User
 
CaptainChef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Bedroom Jetsville
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,588
vCash: 500
Hearing Maurice & Chevy talk the other day, there is absolutely no way that Lowry is left unprotected (talked about in him as a core young player along with Scheif, Morrissey, Laine, Ehlers, etc).

I don't see them wanting Perrault exposed either, so it seems inevitable that they either go 7-3-1 (doing something with Myers or Enstrom), or they have a deal cooked up with Vegas.

CaptainChef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-12-2017, 11:36 AM
  #71
ps241
Playoff push 2017
 
ps241's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 20,424
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainChef View Post
Hearing Maurice & Chevy talk the other day, there is absolutely no way that Lowry is left unprotected (talked about in him as a core young player along with Scheif, Morrissey, Laine, Ehlers, etc).

I don't see them wanting Perrault exposed either, so it seems inevitable that they either go 7-3-1 (doing something with Myers or Enstrom), or they have a deal cooked up with Vegas.
They may also make a deal with Vegas to protect the additional asset. Here is our 4-4-1 and we also want to protect Lowry what would you like in exchange?

ps241 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2017, 11:01 AM
  #72
Mortimer Snerd
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,252
vCash: 388
Quote:
Originally Posted by ps241 View Post
They may also make a deal with Vegas to protect the additional asset. Here is our 4-4-1 and we also want to protect Lowry what would you like in exchange?
The way Dano and Petan were consigned to the press box for the last (what, 15 games?) was a little strange even for Maurice. Even if it was a discipline/teaching a lesson thing it went on too long. Maybe it was the 'don't change a winning lineup' thing. Whatever it was having 2 good young players sitting while clearly inferior players are playing is unusual to say the least.

I know it is edging into tinfoil hat territory just a bit but I can't help suspecting that there is a trade arranged. LV is the obvious destination.

It could be a number of different things. Take Dano + Petan and we are done with the XD. Or something for after the XD, a goalie or a defenseman coming back.

Mortimer Snerd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2017, 11:06 AM
  #73
surixon
Registered User
 
surixon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,760
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
The way Dano and Petan were consigned to the press box for the last (what, 15 games?) was a little strange even for Maurice. Even if it was a discipline/teaching a lesson thing it went on too long. Maybe it was the 'don't change a winning lineup' thing. Whatever it was having 2 good young players sitting while clearly inferior players are playing is unusual to say the least.

I know it is edging into tinfoil hat territory just a bit but I can't help suspecting that there is a trade arranged. LV is the obvious destination.

It could be a number of different things. Take Dano + Petan and we are done with the XD. Or something for after the XD, a goalie or a defenseman coming back.
I have been of the mindset that Petan and a draft pick are going to Vegas for one of the three goalies Vegas will get and ensure Vegas takes Dano.

I also agree that usages where odd at the end of the year even for Maurice.

I think you saw what his ideal top 9 is in the last game of the year. I think they like Copp at C on the 4th and will look to bring in a Maurice type vet 4th line RW to kill penalties and crash and bang.

surixon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2017, 11:42 AM
  #74
ps241
Playoff push 2017
 
ps241's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 20,424
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
The way Dano and Petan were consigned to the press box for the last (what, 15 games?) was a little strange even for Maurice. Even if it was a discipline/teaching a lesson thing it went on too long. Maybe it was the 'don't change a winning lineup' thing. Whatever it was having 2 good young players sitting while clearly inferior players are playing is unusual to say the least.

I know it is edging into tinfoil hat territory just a bit but I can't help suspecting that there is a trade arranged. LV is the obvious destination.

It could be a number of different things. Take Dano + Petan and we are done with the XD. Or something for after the XD, a goalie or a defenseman coming back.
Quote:
Originally Posted by surixon View Post
I have been of the mindset that Petan and a draft pick are going to Vegas for one of the three goalies Vegas will get and ensure Vegas takes Dano.

I also agree that usages where odd at the end of the year even for Maurice.

I think you saw what his ideal top 9 is in the last game of the year. I think they like Copp at C on the 4th and will look to bring in a Maurice type vet 4th line RW to kill penalties and crash and bang.
Yea I could easily see Winnipeg trading for a goalie from Vegas. Has anyone constructed a list of goalies that will need to be exposed to Vegas yet that you guys have seen?

ps241 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-17-2017, 11:53 AM
  #75
surixon
Registered User
 
surixon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,760
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ps241 View Post
Yea I could easily see Winnipeg trading for a goalie from Vegas. Has anyone constructed a list of goalies that will need to be exposed to Vegas yet that you guys have seen?
Well the big one for me that I know that the Jets like is Raanta. Grubaur is a RFA I believe that will also be left exposed. I'm not sure who else.

surixon is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:02 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2017 All Rights Reserved.