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Realistic Off-season Expectations from Chevy

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Old
07-16-2017, 05:20 PM
  #426
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Interesting middle of July and no contract news for Chevy and more surprising for pmo. Draft, FA & ED now long behind us, I would of thought pmo would be announced by now. Huge make it or break it year for pmo this year, wonder if chevy only wants to give him a one year extension until he can make us a winner
You'd think a Chevy extension would come before a Maurice extension. Seems pretty risky to extend the coach before the GM. If Chevy is not around the coach is likely gone soon after so why extend before you are secure?

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07-16-2017, 05:25 PM
  #427
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You'd think a Chevy extension would come before a Maurice extension. Seems pretty risky to extend the coach before the GM. If Chevy is not around the coach is likely gone soon after so why extend before you are secure?
True

I would of thought we would hear extension for both by now or at least very soon.

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07-16-2017, 05:38 PM
  #428
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True

I would of thought we would hear extension for both by now or at least very soon.
If I had to guess Chevy gets signed late summer in the quiet dog days. Maurice goes into the season on his final year and only gets signed if the team has success. I really don't think Maurice is worried about the extension. If he gets canned he has had a long coaching career and he will have easy gigs making nice coin in the media. It is just my opinion but I think he is more than fine with the back against the wall image of a coach in his final year.

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07-16-2017, 07:11 PM
  #429
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If I had to guess Chevy gets signed late summer in the quiet dog days. Maurice goes into the season on his final year and only gets signed if the team has success. I really don't think Maurice is worried about the extension. If he gets canned he has had a long coaching career and he will have easy gigs making nice coin in the media. It is just my opinion but I think he is more than fine with the back against the wall image of a coach in his final year.
I would love to see PMO go into the season without a extension. Then he needs to earn it, prove he can make the team a winner with the tools Chevy has provided. Sign extension Xmas or all star break if we're doing well as expected.

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07-16-2017, 07:53 PM
  #430
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I would love to see PMO go into the season without a extension. Then he needs to earn it, prove he can make the team a winner with the tools Chevy has provided. Sign extension Xmas or all star break if we're doing well as expected.
I'm not really sure I understand the logic. Do you think that Maurice wouldn't try to coach to win if he had a longer contract?

I think that we need to put his coaching of the past few seasons into perspective. He was given an explicit objective of evaluating the roster in his first year. He and Chevy both clearly decided after the 2014-15 season that they needed to turn over the roster and go heavily into a youth movement. The past two seasons they've been clear that they were in a development mode, introducing a bunch of young players.

Now they've made it clear that they really are focused on making a run, and will construct the roster and coach accordingly. I doubt that the contract situation would alter that.

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07-16-2017, 08:00 PM
  #431
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He might coach differently if he thinks he is on the verge of getting canned if they start off poorly. I'd offer him a 2 year deal with a Jets' option for the third year.
What would he make a year for a 3 year deal? 2.5-3m?

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07-16-2017, 08:07 PM
  #432
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I'm not really sure I understand the logic. Do you think that Maurice wouldn't try to coach to win if he had a longer contract?

I think that we need to put his coaching of the past few seasons into perspective. He was given an explicit objective of evaluating the roster in his first year. He and Chevy both clearly decided after the 2014-15 season that they needed to turn over the roster and go heavily into a youth movement. The past two seasons they've been clear that they were in a development mode, introducing a bunch of young players.

Now they've made it clear that they really are focused on making a run, and will construct the roster and coach accordingly. I doubt that the contract situation would alter that.
Are you suggesting that for two years Maurice coached developing over winning? And if so, why would they be mutually exclusive?

The logic for not extending him at this time is that he should first prove he can coach this team into a winner before we take on the financial burden of paying for two head coaches for 2-3 years should Maurice fail early, fail often this coming season.

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07-16-2017, 08:13 PM
  #433
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I agree with waiting to give Maurice an extension but i think no contract Maurice is much more of a line juggler than he already is as contract term Maurice.

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07-16-2017, 09:22 PM
  #434
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Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
I'm not really sure I understand the logic. Do you think that Maurice wouldn't try to coach to win if he had a longer contract?

I think that we need to put his coaching of the past few seasons into perspective. He was given an explicit objective of evaluating the roster in his first year. He and Chevy both clearly decided after the 2014-15 season that they needed to turn over the roster and go heavily into a youth movement. The past two seasons they've been clear that they were in a development mode, introducing a bunch of young players.

Now they've made it clear that they really are focused on making a run, and will construct the roster and coach accordingly. I doubt that the contract situation would alter that.
Ok deep breath here.....maybe you didn't understand my point and I'm not understanding yours.

Let me ask you this, do you think if PMO is failing to coach the team as constructed to a reasonable record (no crazy injuries totals as a excuse) by whatever time line you want to draw in the sand (American thanksgiving or all star break or end of season, etc) his contract (term & $$$$) will have no bearing on if he gets fired?

Your debating points that have no bearing on my point. I don't care about the two previous seasons as far as this point goes. This is about is PMO a good coach, which is certainly in doubt.


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07-16-2017, 10:16 PM
  #435
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Are you suggesting that for two years Maurice coached developing over winning? And if so, why would they be mutually exclusive?

The logic for not extending him at this time is that he should first prove he can coach this team into a winner before we take on the financial burden of paying for two head coaches for 2-3 years should Maurice fail early, fail often this coming season.
I agree that there is uncertainty over whether Maurice can coach this type of talented team effectively. I've maintained that position for some time.

Yes, I do believe that Maurice was asked to focus on developing young talent as the number one priority. I don't think that's necessarily contrary to winning. I also think that it doesn't preclude benching or sending young players at times, or even having veterans who were expected to mentor young players about having a pro attitude. That's consistent with how he's coached.

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07-16-2017, 10:22 PM
  #436
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Ok deep breath here.....maybe you didn't understand my point and I'm not understanding yours.

Let me ask you this, do you think if PMO is failing to coach the team as constructed to a reasonable record (no crazy injuries totals as a excuse) by whatever time line you want to draw in the sand (American thanksgiving or all star break or end of season, etc) his contract (term & $$$$) will have no bearing on if he gets fired?

Your debating points that have no bearing on my point. I don't care about the two previous seasons as far as this point goes. This is about is PMO a good coach, which is certainly in doubt.
Actually, I think we agree. I think the jury is out about whether Maurice can coach this team into a winner, as I note above and have posted many times before.

I think our disconnect was in the phraseology. I don't think Maurice's performance with the Jets has necessarily displayed a lack of capability or focus on winning. Perhaps it was the use of the term "earn it". I would have perhaps phrased it as "merited it". It's a nuanced difference, I'll admit.

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07-16-2017, 11:04 PM
  #437
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Actually, I think we agree. I think the jury is out about whether Maurice can coach this team into a winner, as I note above and have posted many times before.

I think our disconnect was in the phraseology. I don't think Maurice's performance with the Jets has necessarily displayed a lack of capability or focus on winning. Perhaps it was the use of the term "earn it". I would have perhaps phrased it as "merited it". It's a nuanced difference, I'll admit.
Uh, yeah. Kinda like there's a nuanced difference between hockey and ice hockey.

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07-16-2017, 11:07 PM
  #438
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Actually, I think we agree. I think the jury is out about whether Maurice can coach this team into a winner, as I note above and have posted many times before.

I think our disconnect was in the phraseology. I don't think Maurice's performance with the Jets has necessarily displayed a lack of capability or focus on winning. Perhaps it was the use of the term "earn it". I would have perhaps phrased it as "merited it". It's a nuanced difference, I'll admit.
I don't see the difference and I think we're saying the same thing.

Last thing I want to see is PMO getting a 3-4 year deal this summer then sucking when coaching after half a season b/c IMO no chance he gets fired then....then we're stuck with him. If he gets through this year or even 3/4 of the year and the team is playing very well under his coaching then I'm more ok extending him.

Don't want to see Pavs contract 2.0 but with a coach.


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07-16-2017, 11:25 PM
  #439
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I'm not really sure I understand the logic. Do you think that Maurice wouldn't try to coach to win if he had a longer contract?

I think that we need to put his coaching of the past few seasons into perspective. He was given an explicit objective of evaluating the roster in his first year. He and Chevy both clearly decided after the 2014-15 season that they needed to turn over the roster and go heavily into a youth movement. The past two seasons they've been clear that they were in a development mode, introducing a bunch of young players.

Now they've made it clear that they really are focused on making a run, and will construct the roster and coach accordingly. I doubt that the contract situation would alter that.
Maybe he won't bag-skate the team into the ground during training camp? Make sure they have a little gas in the tank to start the season...

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07-16-2017, 11:56 PM
  #440
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Mo could be in one of those weord situations where the coach is fired 15 games into the season - which is dumb due to variance in hockey and a wasted off-season.

I hope it doesn't get there because I want wins, but I don't have much faith in Mo. Still, hoping for a career year.

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07-17-2017, 01:15 AM
  #441
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Maybe he won't bag-skate the team into the ground during training camp? Make sure they have a little gas in the tank to start the season...
Hope so. I thought that was idiotic.

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07-17-2017, 01:17 AM
  #442
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Uh, yeah. Kinda like there's a nuanced difference between hockey and ice hockey.
The English language is full of wonderful nuance.

Say hockey in South Asia or Australia and ice doesn't come to mind.

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07-17-2017, 09:47 AM
  #443
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Actually, I think we agree. I think the jury is out about whether Maurice can coach this team into a winner, as I note above and have posted many times before.

I think our disconnect was in the phraseology. I don't think Maurice's performance with the Jets has necessarily displayed a lack of capability or focus on winning. Perhaps it was the use of the term "earn it". I would have perhaps phrased it as "merited it". It's a nuanced difference, I'll admit.
I don't think your change of wording quite gets it. How about we say that he needs to demonstrate it?

I don't think he necessarily coaches any differently without an extension, though he might. If he did it might be more likely to result in failure. He will coach the best way he knows how. It will succeed or fail and his extension should depend on that.

He is approaching the all time leaders in games coached and in losses. In spite of a very long coaching career he has very little success. If that is because he has never had the horses before then this is his big chance to show that he is a good coach who can win in the NHL. He has the material to work with.

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07-17-2017, 09:56 AM
  #444
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I don't think your change of wording quite gets it. How about we say that he needs to demonstrate it?

I don't think he necessarily coaches any differently without an extension, though he might. If he did it might be more likely to result in failure. He will coach the best way he knows how. It will succeed or fail and his extension should depend on that.

He is approaching the all time leaders in games coached and in losses. In spite of a very long coaching career he has very little success. If that is because he has never had the horses before then this is his big chance to show that he is a good coach who can win in the NHL. He has the material to work with.
Demonstrate would be a better term, in my view.

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07-17-2017, 10:00 AM
  #445
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Mo could be in one of those weord situations where the coach is fired 15 games into the season - which is dumb due to variance in hockey and a wasted off-season.

I hope it doesn't get there because I want wins, but I don't have much faith in Mo. Still, hoping for a career year.
If PMo gets the goaltending he will look like a much smarter coach this season (see Torts in Ohio) but people will still complain allot (me included). Honestly every fan base seems to hate their coach once the honeymoon is done so its to be expected. I really doubt TNSE pull the trigger after 15 games but this does seem to be a more win now Chevy and I don't think he wants to waist this season so hopefully we don't have to find out.


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07-17-2017, 10:24 AM
  #446
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If PMo gets the goaltending he will look like a much smarter coach this season (see Torts in Ohio) but people will still complain allot (me included). Honestly fan base seems to hate their coach once the honeymoon is done so its to be expected. I really doubt TNSE pull the trigger after 15 games but this does seem to be a more win now Chevy and I don't think he wants to waist this season so hopefully we don't have to find out.
I agree that opportunity and goaltending really influence perception of a coaches abilities with the general public way more than they should.

Coaching is something that you could potentially get better at with age and more experience. So when I see posts about how many games PoMo has lost, I mean he was 28 years old coaching the Hartford Whalers. When you compare that to Mike Babcock, who lots of people assume is the best coach (or at least one of the best) he didn't start coaching in the NHL until he was 42. According to Wikipedia both coaches have won an identical 596 regular season games. If you coach longer you'll have more losses. Tom Landry has the third most coaching losses in NFL history, Don Shula has 4th most as an example from a different sport. Or if you look at baseball 8 of the top 10 "most losing Managers" are in the Hall of Fame.

PoMo has played the kids to help their development, just like the front office wanted and the Jets will be better for it long term. Doing this absolutely cost us some games and some coaches (Claude Julien for example) don't play rookies or young players. PoMo also said in multiple interviews that he wasn't going to coach the skill out of the kids' game and once they learn to play offense then he'll start teaching them defence.

To me the only reason PoMo doesn't have an extension is because Chevy doesn't have an extension. Once Chevy is extended a PoMo extension is close behind IMO.

I think that PoMo will have the horses this year and we should make the playoffs. No playoffs this year is not acceptable, despite the strength of the rest of the division.

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07-17-2017, 10:40 AM
  #447
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I agree that opportunity and goaltending really influence perception of a coaches abilities with the general public way more than they should.

Coaching is something that you could potentially get better at with age and more experience. So when I see posts about how many games PoMo has lost, I mean he was 28 years old coaching the Hartford Whalers. When you compare that to Mike Babcock, who lots of people assume is the best coach (or at least one of the best) he didn't start coaching in the NHL until he was 42. According to Wikipedia both coaches have won an identical 596 regular season games. If you coach longer you'll have more losses. Tom Landry has the third most coaching losses in NFL history, Don Shula has 4th most as an example from a different sport. Or if you look at baseball 8 of the top 10 "most losing Managers" are in the Hall of Fame.

PoMo has played the kids to help their development, just like the front office wanted and the Jets will be better for it long term. Doing this absolutely cost us some games and some coaches (Claude Julien for example) don't play rookies or young players. PoMo also said in multiple interviews that he wasn't going to coach the skill out of the kids' game and once they learn to play offense then he'll start teaching them defence.

To me the only reason PoMo doesn't have an extension is because Chevy doesn't have an extension. Once Chevy is extended a PoMo extension is close behind IMO.

I think that PoMo will have the horses this year and we should make the playoffs. No playoffs this year is not acceptable, despite the strength of the rest of the division.
Thank you for highlighting how poor of an argument the whole PoMo has so many loses point is. It's silly and continues to be silly but gets pushed here to no end.

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07-17-2017, 11:55 AM
  #448
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Chevy deserves a 3-5 year extension. Arguably the best draft team since they came back and he has built a team from what was the Atlanta team. I would give him a 3 year deal.
Maurice should get a 2-3 year extension but not until after the new year. This team needs to make the playoffs and the schedule isn't an excuse this year (although, I can see them going 3-8 or 4-7 to start off the season).
We'll get injuries but here's hoping there aren't as many this year.
Anyone think Chevy is finished with the roster until TC?

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07-17-2017, 03:29 PM
  #449
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Thank you for highlighting how poor of an argument the whole PoMo has so many loses point is. It's silly and continues to be silly but gets pushed here to no end.

Paul himself has said your record is what you are.
He's a coach who will have to produce this year outside his career norms.
I want him to have a career year.
I'm pretty excited at the roster and the opportunity to reach post season and I am sure Paul is as well.

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07-17-2017, 04:19 PM
  #450
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Paul himself has said your record is what you are.
He's a coach who will have to produce this year outside his career norms.
I want him to have a career year.
I'm pretty excited at the roster and the opportunity to reach post season and I am sure Paul is as well.
Whether you like / trust Maurice or not, this is a great way to look at it. Time to put up or shut up, as he's got the roster to really work with now.

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