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Flyers - Stars proposal

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Old
02-14-2006, 07:58 AM
  #1
steinie77
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Flyers - Stars proposal

To Dallas: Handzus, Ruzicka, Therien, and 2 2nds

To Philly: Arnott and Skoula

Flyers get 2nd line center and depth dman while Dallas gets defensive center, promising offensive winger, and depth

Flyers could use Arnott and Nedved as Primeau and rookie insurance for the playoffs and Skoula is insurance against injury and youth.

Flame away...

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:01 AM
  #2
GKJ
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No

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:25 AM
  #3
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Dallas fan?

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:28 AM
  #4
GKJ
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Here is my reasoning as to why this proposal sucks:


Skoula sucks



Therien sucks I'm sure Doug Armstrong knows that.


Handzus is probably going to be the shutdown center, which if we get Arnott for Handzus, we'd probably have to put Richards in that role and that is recipe for disater putting that kind of pressure on a rookie.

And out resouces are better served elsewhere.

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:33 AM
  #5
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I can't see the Stars making this deal either.

They are leading their division, only 4 pts from top spot in the West - definitely a team that is playing well as a "team" ... teams in this situation just do not deal their leading scorer.

Arnott has been a key player for them all season... why would they deal him now, when the team is playing so successfully (maybe even overachieving from their start of the season predictions of this team)?

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:50 AM
  #6
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My guess is the stars would like to resign both Boucher and Arnott longer term as neither has an immediate replacement in the system. Kaps and Ott are real solid defensively. If there is a need it is likely offense where a consistent winger for Modano and Lets could be. Jokinin is great on the pp (and an amazing 8 for 8 in the shootout)but disappears at times 5 on 5. Erikkson could see time next year. The new third/fourth line of Barnes-Ott-Tjarnqvist is feisty and has been better offensively. In all likelihood, they will likely do little unless they feel they need insurance somewhere for cheap. They have 7 quality d-men 2 good goalies and decent forward depth.

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:50 AM
  #7
steinie77
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I am a Flyers fan, but the deal makes sense from a Flyers perspective and a Dallas perspective.

The Flyers get the big second line center Clarke covets, who has won the Stanley CUp, has been a leader on and off the ice, and has waged battle on the ice in the Eastern Conference playoffs before with success. Arnott would also give the Flyers options on the power play down low which they haven't had since LeClair was healthy. He would give the Flyers a second line threat to Knuble on the first line and power play unit. The Flyers could also add a veteran center at the deadline as a rental as "rookie insurance." The Richards "not being able to handle it stuff" is crap, IMO, he has handled the pressure at every single level he has played. He won a PROFESSIONAL championship last year and has continued to show he is clutch and can skate with whomever Hitchcock needs him to skate with and do so with success while making his wingers better on every line. If absolutely necessary, the Flyers could add a playoff rental of a veteran center as well to provide insurance if needed, but they also have Nedved who can skate as 2/3 center at full strength.

Skoula is insurance and has playoff experience. If the deal needed to be pared down to say Handzus and a 2nd for Arnott, then fine, but Skoula is better than Therien and adds veteran experience who isn't looking to join the AARP.

Dallas would add a younger center who is a definite defensive center, but would also get some depth for the future up front.

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:58 AM
  #8
NFITO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steinie77
I am a Flyers fan, but the deal makes sense from a Flyers perspective and a Dallas perspective.

The Flyers get the big second line center Clarke covets, who has won the Stanley CUp, has been a leader on and off the ice, and has waged battle on the ice in the Eastern Conference playoffs before with success. Arnott would also give the Flyers options on the power play down low which they haven't had since LeClair was healthy. He would give the Flyers a second line threat to Knuble on the first line and power play unit. The Flyers could also add a veteran center at the deadline as a rental as "rookie insurance." The Richards "not being able to handle it stuff" is crap, IMO, he has handled the pressure at every single level he has played. He won a PROFESSIONAL championship last year and has continued to show he is clutch and can skate with whomever Hitchcock needs him to skate with and do so with success while making his wingers better on every line. If absolutely necessary, the Flyers could add a playoff rental of a veteran center as well to provide insurance if needed, but they also have Nedved who can skate as 2/3 center at full strength.

Skoula is insurance and has playoff experience. If the deal needed to be pared down to say Handzus and a 2nd for Arnott, then fine, but Skoula is better than Therien and adds veteran experience who isn't looking to join the AARP.

Dallas would add a younger center who is a definite defensive center, but would also get some depth for the future up front.
It was obvious actually you were a Flyers fan (at least to me)... you can always tell by seeing which team is getting the draft picks (usually the other team to "even" up the deal).

This deal still does not work for the Stars IMO.... the fact that Handzus is younger is irrelevant - I've said this a 1000 times now in similar trade proposals... he's a UFA after this year, so why does age matter? either way, both players are hitting UFA status.

But you're asking the Stars - who aren't rebuilding, and are as much in the conference race as the Flyers are in their conference - to give up their leading scorer for more defensive depth? how does that make sense?

And Therien's value is pretty much nothing... he's a throw in, in this deal basically.

I just don't think it's realistic to expect a team that is leading their division and challenging for the conference title, to make a major move like this and deal one of their best players.... doesn't make any sense at all.

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Old
02-14-2006, 08:59 AM
  #9
Ajacied
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No thank you..

We need Arnott more than we need Handzus. Then it's basicly a 2nd for Skoula, which is more than fair valuewise, but Skoula has been just fine in Dallas, is still fairly young and provides depth as well as having the experience of a Cup winner.

Valuewise it's a perfect deal, it just doesn't make any sense what so ever from a Stars perspective. Arnott is averaging near a ppg, is well-liked within the group and has chemestry with Morrow. I see him as the ideal 2nd line center. Handzus is more defensive orrientated and I'd consider him the ideal 3rd line center, a position the Stars are stacked with for now and the future (Barnes, Kapanen, Ott, Hagos). We currently need all the offense we can get, this trade only weakens that IMO.

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Old
02-14-2006, 10:42 AM
  #10
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Blake Sloan has 'the Cup experience' I don't see teams lining up for him.



Skoula is not worth a 2nd. What's next? He has better puck poise than Lidstrom?



If Skoula was worth a 2nd he wouldn't be an extra defenseman

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Old
02-14-2006, 10:47 AM
  #11
NFITO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514

If Skoula was worth a 2nd he wouldn't be an extra defenseman
he's 5th on their blueline in icetime (3rd in PP time), and has played in all 57 games for the Stars this year... how is he an "extra" dman again? looks to me like he's their #5 guy?

Therien on the other hand, is a good description of an extra dman - 8th on the blueline in icetime, has missed games this season.

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02-14-2006, 11:22 AM
  #12
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Its pretty simple-Skoula while he costs a bit too much has been solid as a 5/6 d-man who can man apoint on the pp-Dallas first two pairs will likely be Boucher-Zubov at 25 minutes plus and Klemm_daley at over 20 minutes plus. Janne, Robidas and Skoula will split the rest of the time and rotate . It is unclear who is the extra at this point. Skoula couls be moved but generally teams need 7 d-men come playoff time. Remeber also Jancevski has been good in the AHL for 2 years now and Traverse has NHL experience. If someone offered a #2 for Skoula they might take it but he is likely not being shopped. Arnott is not being traded and will likely be resigned.

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Old
02-14-2006, 11:26 AM
  #13
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Thats a bad trade...in fact horrible from a Flyers perspective. Handzus is already a top center whose reliable fro us( 250 straight starts), and Ruzicka is a decent prospect. Therien sucks and yeah we'd wanna get rid of him but for Skoula???and on top of that throwing away two 2nd round picks, thats crazy from a flyers perspective, only b/c of Zus's production for us...maybe give us a defensemen besides Skoula and it would be more considerable.

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Old
02-14-2006, 11:29 AM
  #14
Viberg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steinie77
To Dallas: Handzus, Ruzicka, Therien, and 2 2nds

To Philly: Arnott and Skoula

Flyers get 2nd line center and depth dman while Dallas gets defensive center, promising offensive winger, and depth

Flyers could use Arnott and Nedved as Primeau and rookie insurance for the playoffs and Skoula is insurance against injury and youth.

Flame away...
HAHA

Handzus > Arnott
Therien, Ruzicka > Skoula

Zeus is a better 2nd or 3rd line center than Arnott. Skoula sucks, why would Clarke trade a promising def and a strong def for him?

And then 2 2nd rounders to Dallas?


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Old
02-14-2006, 11:32 AM
  #15
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I would think it is much easier for Philly to give aprospect or pick for Recci or Leclair and get Weinrich from Stl for next to nothing

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Old
02-14-2006, 12:06 PM
  #16
Ajacied
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Viking
HAHA

Handzus > Arnott
Therien, Ruzicka > Skoula

Zeus is a better 2nd or 3rd line center than Arnott. Skoula sucks, why would Clarke trade a promising def and a strong def for him?

And then 2 2nd rounders to Dallas?

I fail to see the logic behind Handzus > Arnott..

Skoula is the 3rd best player in this deal. The pick adds nothing to a possible Cup run this year. The Stars are the ones who decline this trade, not the Flyers.

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Old
02-14-2006, 12:14 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514
Here is my reasoning as to why this proposal sucks:


Skoula sucks



Therien sucks I'm sure Doug Armstrong knows that.


Handzus is probably going to be the shutdown center, which if we get Arnott for Handzus, we'd probably have to put Richards in that role and that is recipe for disater putting that kind of pressure on a rookie.

And out resouces are better served elsewhere.
Therian lead the Stars in playoff scoring during the playoffs 2 years ago

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Old
02-14-2006, 04:10 PM
  #18
mercury
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Michal Handzus is NOT a UFA. He is signed through 2006-07.

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Old
02-14-2006, 04:43 PM
  #19
mdm815
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how about Umberger for Jokinen??

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Old
02-14-2006, 05:02 PM
  #20
mercury
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I forgot to add: HORRIBLE deal for the Flyers.

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