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Jesse Puljujärvi 4th Overall 2016 Draft. Part IV

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Old
06-08-2017, 11:47 AM
  #851
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Originally Posted by Digger12 View Post
That would be up to Fleming, assuming the Oilers don't replace him as coach next season.

Listening to Stauffer this past week, he's been indirectly fairly critical of how the Oilers need to emulate Nashville's philosophy of having their AHL affiliate play their young guys in prominent roles no matter what, and not sitting them in favour of AHL veterans with little long term future with the NHL club. It was a less than subtle dig at Fleming's handling of Puljujarvi IMO.
The guys with NHL futures and the AHL/NHL tweeners need lots of ice because they will be counted on by the big club at some point. Puljujarvi is a massive prospect for us that we simply cannot afford to screw up.

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06-08-2017, 11:48 AM
  #852
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Originally Posted by Digger12 View Post
That would be up to Fleming, assuming the Oilers don't replace him as coach next season.

Listening to Stauffer this past week, he's been indirectly fairly critical of how the Oilers need to emulate Nashville's philosophy of having their AHL affiliate play their young guys in prominent roles no matter what, and not sitting them in favour of AHL veterans with little long term future with the NHL club. It was a less than subtle dig at Fleming's handling of Puljujarvi IMO.
The ONE area that still needs significant/some change for the Organization is at the AHL level. This is more of an impression than having hard facts but it just seems that way to me. A few hangers on need to be flushed, like Mac T and Bucky, update our AHL affiliate and I think we would be hard pressed to find faults.

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06-08-2017, 12:10 PM
  #853
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The ONE area that still needs significant/some change for the Organization is at the AHL level. This is more of an impression than having hard facts but it just seems that way to me. A few hangers on need to be flushed, like Mac T and Bucky, update our AHL affiliate and I think we would be hard pressed to find faults.
I guess the question comes down to what's best for player development:

1) Playing your young high profile prospects and giving them lots of minutes no matter the circumstance, even if it your AHL team suffers for it in the win/loss column.

2) Playing your young high profile prospects less minutes in favour of more veteran AHL guys who know how to win at that level, resulting in a winning environment but fewer minutes for the prospects the NHL club have a lot invested in.

I remember back in the EIG days when the Oilers ran a tighter financial ship and wouldn't shell out the 6 figure salaries for the high end AHL vets, they'd be forced to play their young guys in prominent roles. As a result, their AHL team would often miss the playoffs and lose quite often.

For a young player, is it better for their development to have them play lots but often in a losing cause against teams you simply didn't have a hope of beating? Or play AHL vets over them so that your prospects have fewer minutes/games, but are in a winning environment?

For an AHL head coach trying to get himself noticed for a prospective NHL job somewhere, whether it be with your parent club or with someone else, I can see the temptation of the 2nd choice as winning teams and long Calder Cup playoff runs look better on a resume.

The dagger though is if you run with the AHL vets and your team still misses the playoffs. THAT is what will put you on thin ice with the parent club.

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06-08-2017, 06:54 PM
  #854
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Originally Posted by Digger12 View Post
I guess the question comes down to what's best for player development:

1) Playing your young high profile prospects and giving them lots of minutes no matter the circumstance, even if it your AHL team suffers for it in the win/loss column.

2) Playing your young high profile prospects less minutes in favour of more veteran AHL guys who know how to win at that level, resulting in a winning environment but fewer minutes for the prospects the NHL club have a lot invested in.

I remember back in the EIG days when the Oilers ran a tighter financial ship and wouldn't shell out the 6 figure salaries for the high end AHL vets, they'd be forced to play their young guys in prominent roles. As a result, their AHL team would often miss the playoffs and lose quite often.

For a young player, is it better for their development to have them play lots but often in a losing cause against teams you simply didn't have a hope of beating? Or play AHL vets over them so that your prospects have fewer minutes/games, but are in a winning environment?

For an AHL head coach trying to get himself noticed for a prospective NHL job somewhere, whether it be with your parent club or with someone else, I can see the temptation of the 2nd choice as winning teams and long Calder Cup playoff runs look better on a resume.

The dagger though is if you run with the AHL vets and your team still misses the playoffs. THAT is what will put you on thin ice with the parent club.
Which is basically where we are at. It really seems that neither AHL success or development of young prospects is doing as well as it should be. 10 years of high picks and also decent vet signings.

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06-09-2017, 05:44 AM
  #855
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In many cases I wouldn't mind so much and would think sending a guy to the AHL isn't necessarily a bad thing to do. However, when I read how people here felt about Pulju e.g. last October and start of November, and saw his relative stats compared to several veterans, I think it makes no sense to even consider not giving him a real chance in the Oilers.

I think starting him with a top6 or top9+some pp time spot should not do real harm to the Oilers, but could very well pay off by turning Pulju into a player that could help a lot already during the next season. At least sending Jesse immediately to the AHL and trading Eberle to a 30-50 point RW (as someone suggested in another thread) seems a bit strange when you have that kind of a talent already in the roster.

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06-15-2017, 12:46 AM
  #856
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digger12 View Post
I guess the question comes down to what's best for player development:

1) Playing your young high profile prospects and giving them lots of minutes no matter the circumstance, even if it your AHL team suffers for it in the win/loss column.

2) Playing your young high profile prospects less minutes in favour of more veteran AHL guys who know how to win at that level, resulting in a winning environment but fewer minutes for the prospects the NHL club have a lot invested in.

I remember back in the EIG days when the Oilers ran a tighter financial ship and wouldn't shell out the 6 figure salaries for the high end AHL vets, they'd be forced to play their young guys in prominent roles. As a result, their AHL team would often miss the playoffs and lose quite often.

For a young player, is it better for their development to have them play lots but often in a losing cause against teams you simply didn't have a hope of beating? Or play AHL vets over them so that your prospects have fewer minutes/games, but are in a winning environment?

For an AHL head coach trying to get himself noticed for a prospective NHL job somewhere, whether it be with your parent club or with someone else, I can see the temptation of the 2nd choice as winning teams and long Calder Cup playoff runs look better on a resume.

The dagger though is if you run with the AHL vets and your team still misses the playoffs. THAT is what will put you on thin ice with the parent club.
I think you have to give the minutes to the vets first but must also be very flexible with your lines. All of your youngsters need the opportunity to prove themselves and learn what they still need to learn. When they prosper in a situation you've never put them in before that's ice time the vets shouldn't be getting back.

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06-15-2017, 12:50 AM
  #857
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I find it disturbing as to how many people around here think that Puljujarvi is gonna be our 1st line RW next year if Ebs is gone. I don't understand how that works.

He wasn't having an easy time in the AHL and he was used sparingly at the worlds.
I would like to see Maroon-McDavid-Puljujari for an exhibition game.

Would also like to see Slepy-Drake-Puljujarvi during an exhibition game. If somehow Puljujarvi finds a way to digest all the information he needs to take the next step over this off-season that could be a cool young line to watch. I think Slepy-Drake-Pitlick is a realistic 3rd line next year. It's very possible that we see Pitlick get hurt 2-3 months into the season and I don't think it would be surprising to see Puljujarvi get called and and given a chance. Mind you Kassian could look decent on that line as well.

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06-15-2017, 09:52 AM
  #858
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Originally Posted by thadd View Post
I find it disturbing as to how many people around here think that Puljujarvi is gonna be our 1st line RW next year if Ebs is gone. I don't understand how that works.

He wasn't having an easy time in the AHL and he was used sparingly at the worlds.
I would like to see Maroon-McDavid-Puljujari for an exhibition game.

Would also like to see Slepy-Drake-Puljujarvi during an exhibition game. If somehow Puljujarvi finds a way to digest all the information he needs to take the next step over this off-season that could be a cool young line to watch. I think Slepy-Drake-Pitlick is a realistic 3rd line next year. It's very possible that we see Pitlick get hurt 2-3 months into the season and I don't think it would be surprising to see Puljujarvi get called and and given a chance. Mind you Kassian could look decent on that line as well.
Young players develop in weird ways. Remember when Draisaitl played 9 games in the AHL and did nothing? then came to NHL and played as a 2C for the rest of the year? As shown before, JP had one of the best seasons for an 18 year old you can have. I wouldnt be suprised to see him 2RW right out the gate next year

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06-15-2017, 09:58 AM
  #859
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Originally Posted by Aceboogie View Post
Young players develop in weird ways. Remember when Draisaitl played 9 games in the AHL and did nothing? then came to NHL and played as a 2C for the rest of the year? As shown before, JP had one of the best seasons for an 18 year old you can have. I wouldnt be suprised to see him 2RW right out the gate next year
Draisaitl may have moped for 9 AHL games at the start of 2015/16, but it doesn't change the fact that:
1) He absolutely destroyed the WHL after his NHL-demotion
2) He was Mem Cup MVP
3) He was one of our better forwards in training camp

So he had prove a lot more in his time away from the NHL and the trajectory was already quite positive. Pulju has been ok since leaving the NHL, but hardly as dominant as Draisaitl was.

I just can't imagine he's going to be ready yet. I have no longer term worries about the guy, but given language us such an issue I just don't see him having absorbed all of what he needs to just yet.

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06-15-2017, 10:09 AM
  #860
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I just can't imagine he's going to be ready yet. I have no longer term worries about the guy, but given language us such an issue I just don't see him having absorbed all of what he needs to just yet.
Of course you may be right, but as I've written before it's interesting to read what people here thought about him at the end of October and beginning of November when he was probably playing his best hockey. If he can play at that level and have some natural development (+better language skills) he should be fine.

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06-15-2017, 10:13 AM
  #861
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Originally Posted by bucks_oil View Post
Draisaitl may have moped for 9 AHL games at the start of 2015/16, but it doesn't change the fact that:
1) He absolutely destroyed the WHL after his NHL-demotion
2) He was Mem Cup MVP
3) He was one of our better forwards in training camp

So he had prove a lot more in his time away from the NHL and the trajectory was already quite positive. Pulju has been ok since leaving the NHL, but hardly as dominant as Draisaitl was.

I just can't imagine he's going to be ready yet. I have no longer term worries about the guy, but given language us such an issue I just don't see him having absorbed all of what he needs to just yet.
Completely apples to oranges. LD destroyed the WHL on a stacked team. Puljujarvi would also destroy the CHL if he went there. As I mentioned before JP set records for shot rates by an 18 year old in the AHL, while also putting up an impressive PPG.

Point is, trajectory for these young players is so unknown. Nylander went from AHL to 61 points in NHL. Tons of other examples of sudden breakouts. Its not forsure by any means, but lets not act like it doesnt happen pretty regularly with u20 players

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06-16-2017, 08:06 PM
  #862
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http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/ho...erle-next-year
Big chance coming to Puljujarvi?

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06-16-2017, 08:16 PM
  #863
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I certainly hope that while we give him every chance in the world to succeed that he is not penned into a spot already. Signing a stop gap to take pressure off of him would be great.

I still see him having elite potential and think a summer of training will help as he missed lots last summer with his knee.

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06-17-2017, 05:59 AM
  #864
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Originally Posted by bucks_oil View Post
Draisaitl may have moped for 9 AHL games at the start of 2015/16, but it doesn't change the fact that:
1) He absolutely destroyed the WHL after his NHL-demotion
2) He was Mem Cup MVP
3) He was one of our better forwards in training camp

So he had prove a lot more in his time away from the NHL and the trajectory was already quite positive. Pulju has been ok since leaving the NHL, but hardly as dominant as Draisaitl was.

I just can't imagine he's going to be ready yet. I have no longer term worries about the guy, but given language us such an issue I just don't see him having absorbed all of what he needs to just yet.
Draisaitl did absolutely dominate after his demotion however it was Junior..Puljujarvi was sent down to the AHL and was the youngest player in that league and he did pretty good..not great.
AHL is a HUGE step up from Junior..just ask guys like Mitch Moroz and Greg Chase

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06-17-2017, 10:00 AM
  #865
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I certainly hope that while we give him every chance in the world to succeed that he is not penned into a spot already. Signing a stop gap to take pressure off of him would be great.

I still see him having elite potential and think a summer of training will help as he missed lots last summer with his knee.
It's not an secret that knee injury ruined Puljujarvi's summer training season last year.
Knee injury is probably one of the worst injuries what NHL player can get.

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06-17-2017, 10:50 AM
  #866
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Draisaitl did absolutely dominate after his demotion however it was Junior..Puljujarvi was sent down to the AHL and was the youngest player in that league and he did pretty good..not great.
AHL is a HUGE step up from Junior..just ask guys like Mitch Moroz and Greg Chase
Yup. I really suspect Pulju could be ready to play on the second line and potentially the first. That would lessen the sting of losing Eberle.

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06-17-2017, 10:59 AM
  #867
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In general I'm in favor of assuming that JP gets a spot, but it would be on the third line, considering that line is sheltered mostly. But, if we did move out Eberle and replace him with a UFA winger or whatever, there would be a definite chance that JP climbs the depth chart, and he would eventually become either Eberle's replacement or the player to permanently push Drai down to 2C

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06-17-2017, 11:47 AM
  #868
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You play your prospects big minutes because it's a development league.

Winning doesn't matter. Look how that's benefited the Oilers giving huge minutes to Ryan Hamilton/Matt Ford/Brad Hunt.

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06-17-2017, 02:45 PM
  #869
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In general I'm in favor of assuming that JP gets a spot, but it would be on the third line, considering that line is sheltered mostly. But, if we did move out Eberle and replace him with a UFA winger or whatever, there would be a definite chance that JP climbs the depth chart, and he would eventually become either Eberle's replacement or the player to permanently push Drai down to 2C
I would like to see Nuge as 1RW to start the season and Pulju as 2RW.

That leaves the Oilers needing to find a couple D and a 3C. Hopefully an Eberle trade nets a D and a 3C.

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06-17-2017, 02:49 PM
  #870
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I would like to see Nuge as 1RW to start the season and Pulju as 2RW.

That leaves the Oilers needing to find a couple D and a 3C. Hopefully an Eberle trade nets a D and a 3C.
I think I'd rather have Pulju start as 3RW, but I agree with everything else. I'd like to see a guy like Bonino as our 3C, I think that'd be a good place for Puljujarvi to start.

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06-17-2017, 03:03 PM
  #871
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Originally Posted by bucks_oil View Post
Draisaitl may have moped for 9 AHL games at the start of 2015/16, but it doesn't change the fact that:
1) He absolutely destroyed the WHL after his NHL-demotion
2) He was Mem Cup MVP
3) He was one of our better forwards in training camp

So he had prove a lot more in his time away from the NHL and the trajectory was already quite positive. Pulju has been ok since leaving the NHL, but hardly as dominant as Draisaitl was.
The CHL stuff Drai did is irrelevant to the discussion. AHL competition is much higher level than CHL.

You are correct that Draisaitl did very well in training camp. I suspect Pulju will be a pleasant surprise at training camp. That's why I don't think the Oilers should acquire more than a solid 3RW who can step up to a 2 RW role temporarily.

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06-20-2017, 11:05 PM
  #872
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Hey guys,

Added two Jesse videos today, had to use dailymotion for the Shift-by Shift.

Here is the link for the Shift-by-Shift:

Shift by Shift | Jesse Puljujarvi | May. 8th, 2017

And here are Season Highlight videos for Jesse:



Here is a link to the Oilers SH.

Here is a link to the Condors SH.

Enjoy.

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06-20-2017, 11:36 PM
  #873
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Hey guys,

Added two Jesse videos today, had to use dailymotion for the Shift-by Shift.

Here is the link for the Shift-by-Shift:

Shift by Shift | Jesse Puljujarvi | May. 8th, 2017

And here are Season Highlight videos for Jesse:



Here is a link to the Oilers SH.

Here is a link to the Condors SH.

Enjoy.
That goal at :45 seconds on the Condor video is so great.

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06-20-2017, 11:37 PM
  #874
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Hey guys,

Added two Jesse videos today, had to use dailymotion for the Shift-by Shift.

Here is the link for the Shift-by-Shift:

Shift by Shift | Jesse Puljujarvi | May. 8th, 2017

And here are Season Highlight videos for Jesse:



Here is a link to the Oilers SH.

Here is a link to the Condors SH.

Enjoy.
90% of his points this season on the big club seem to come from Maroon or McDavid cleaning up after him. There was some nice passes in there though.

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06-21-2017, 04:23 AM
  #875
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Some say he has low hockey IQ, but I disagree heavily. He mishandled puck many times (growth quite many inches during last years and isn't fully aware of his limbs all the time) and is physically very raw player but his hockey IQ is good/great. He is also shoot first winger and Oilers need that kind of forwards. After TC we see what he is. It seems that after benched few times he lost confidence. Maybe it wasn't clear why he was benched and it makes him wonder.

Not many of our forwards can keep in pace when Connor goes full speed with the puck.

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