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Montoya for Staal?

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02-26-2006, 07:51 PM
  #26
Burberry Manning
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Personally, I would do Montoya for Staal in a heartbeat if I felt that Staal has the goods to be a top center. I might be going out on a limb but Henrik Lundquist has shown just a couple of flashes that indicate he could possibly be a quality NHL starter. In all honesty he has cemented his status as a top goaltender in my book, and a top offensive specimen, namely a #1 center, has been the glaring hole of this organization for a while. It isn't like we would be throwing 'toya out there for a bag of pucks, rather we would be receiving a player who immediately eliminates our glaring need. With Lundy being only 23 years old, the need for another stud goaltender is much less and a player of Montoya's stature should be viewed as a commodity to help shore up other weaknesses. It's not as if we cant insure our goaltending strength by other means such as free-agency or future drafts.

Of course, as others have mentioned, Montoya alone would most likely fail to land you Jordan Staal. However, I would even be interested in adding something to the deal to land a player of Staal's caliber at a position of such great need.

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02-26-2006, 07:53 PM
  #27
Kluivert4Ever
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burberry Manning

Of course, as others have mentioned, Montoya alone would most likely fail to land you Jordan Staal. However, I would even be interested in adding something to the deal to land a player of Staal's caliber at a position of such great need.

I honestly feel that Montoya and the 20th pick will get you the 5th pick.
Perhaps even getting a 2nd rounder back as well.

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02-26-2006, 07:56 PM
  #28
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I would hang onto Montoya for the time being. If Henrik can have another solid year or two, it would only make sense to ship Montoya because his value will (hopefully) be high enough to fill holes elsewhere (i.e. Jordan Staal etc). But Lundqvist hasn't proven himself as a #1 guy capable of bringing the team into the next decade. Don't get me wrong, he has had one of the best rookie goaltending seasons in recent history, but I don't think it is possible for him to prove himself as THE future until he has played two NHL seasons MINIMUM. There's no point in shipping Montoya right now.

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02-26-2006, 07:57 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
Montoya was a #6 pick. To me there is more weight to a quality goaltender then there is for any other position. If you don't have a keeper it is extremely hard to be competitive, let alone good.
But look around. It seems like almost everyone has or thinks they have a stud goaltender either on their NHL team or in their prospect pipeline. Sure, a goaltender is the most important player on the ice but the market for them doesn't seem as hot as it is for future 1st line centers, perhaps because the market is more saturated. Also, look at what some other quality goaltending prospects have brought back in trades. If a quality young goaltender was a hotter commodity than other positions we wouldn't have seen Montoya last until the 6th pick in the first place.

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02-26-2006, 07:58 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kluivert4Ever
I honestly feel that Montoya and the 20th pick will get you the 5th pick.
Perhaps even getting a 2nd rounder back as well.
I havent studied this draft yet so I'm not fully aware of the level of depth offered but having heard about Staal, I would certainly consider dealing Montoya and the 20th pick for Staal and that team's 2nd rounder.

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02-26-2006, 08:02 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus
I think that's the flaw in the original post. Montoya alone doesn't get you a top-5 draft pick.
Logically he should. He is 2 years removed from being a 6th overall pick, and in those 2 years he has developed well, including a great year in the pros. Teams in recent years have been willing to use a top 5 pick on what they think is a franchise goalie, I dont see why they wouldnt trade one for Montoya. In the end I think it depends on what teams in the top 5 need, and if the deal needs to be expanded to suit both sides.

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02-26-2006, 08:04 PM
  #32
Kluivert4Ever
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burberry Manning
I havent studied this draft yet so I'm not fully aware of the level of depth offered but having heard about Staal, I would certainly consider dealing Montoya and the 20th pick for Staal and that team's 2nd rounder.

Food for thought:

In three years: Jordan Staal as our bonafide number one center, Petr Prucha as our star winger, Henrik Lundqvist in net and Tytuin and Staal at the back.
Is that a good foundation or what?

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02-26-2006, 08:06 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyrmessier011
I would hang onto Montoya for the time being. If Henrik can have another solid year or two, it would only make sense to ship Montoya because his value will (hopefully) be high enough to fill holes elsewhere (i.e. Jordan Staal etc). But Lundqvist hasn't proven himself as a #1 guy capable of bringing the team into the next decade. Don't get me wrong, he has had one of the best rookie goaltending seasons in recent history, but I don't think it is possible for him to prove himself as THE future until he has played two NHL seasons MINIMUM. There's no point in shipping Montoya right now.
I understand your train of thought but by the same token I feel that by hanging onto Montoya in order for Henrik to simply put the finishing touches on his game could develop more problems for the Rangers. First off, you run the risk of Montoya hurting his trade value due to poor performance. You also run the risk that teams would value having Montoya in their system at a younger age, also diminishing his value. Then on the other side the Rangers would miss valuable time of having the assets that Montoya eventually returns. All things being equal, it would be better to trade Montoya now and have that #1 center in our system next year than it would be to trade Montoya in a year and have that #1 center arrive a year later. It's like the Time Value of Players, all things being equal, give me the player and production now. There is also the risk that the market changes and no #1center, if that is what we deem the Ranger's greatest need, is available.

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02-26-2006, 08:09 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burberry Manning
I understand your train of thought but by the same token I feel that by hanging onto Montoya in order for Henrik to simply put the finishing touches on his game could develop more problems for the Rangers. First off, you run the risk of Montoya hurting his trade value due to poor performance. You also run the risk that teams would value having Montoya in their system at a younger age, also diminishing his value. Then on the other side the Rangers would miss valuable time of having the assets that Montoya eventually returns. All things being equal, it would be better to trade Montoya now and have that #1 center in our system next year than it would be to trade Montoya in a year and have that #1 center arrive a year later. It's like the Time Value of Players, all things being equal, give me the player and production now. There is also the risk that the market changes and no #1center, if that is what we deem the Ranger's greatest need, is available.

Exactly, I love Montoya and dont really want to trade him but Jordan Staal will never come cheaper than on draft day, and he is a guy we can build our entire offence around, if there is a chance to get him you take it.

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02-26-2006, 08:10 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kluivert4Ever
Food for thought:

In three years: Jordan Staal as our bonafide number one center, Petr Prucha as our star winger, Henrik Lundqvist in net and Tytuin and Staal at the back.
Is that a good foundation or what?
Throw in a little mix of Jessiman, Dawes, Korpikoski, Baranka, Immonen, Sauer, Dubinsky, with Jed, Hollweg, Moore, and Betts battling it out for 3rd and 4th line duties. And then the reigning NHL heavyweight champ in Colton Orr..........wow, this team would be lookin kinda nice.

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Old
02-26-2006, 08:11 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burberry Manning
Throw in a little mix of Jessiman, Dawes, Korpikoski, Baranka, Immonen, Sauer, Dubinsky, with Jed, Hollweg, Moore, and Betts battling it out for 3rd and 4th line duties. And then the reigning NHL heavyweight champ in Colton Orr..........wow, this team would be lookin kinda nice.


Exactly, we got all the pieces in our system to build a good offence, except a number one center.
Give us Jordan Staal and you give us a solid offence for years tocome.

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02-26-2006, 08:14 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666
but what does Carolina or Cam ward have to do with anything??

It's not Eric Staal the post was talking about, but rather his younger brother Jordan.

Did I miss something??
Yeh sorry I just realized I read it wrong. Its been a long bad day.

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02-26-2006, 08:16 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by jas
Now that you've corroborated my accuracy, your point is?
I just realized I read it wrong and apologized. No need to get nasty brother. I'll play it like you in the future, zinz?

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02-26-2006, 08:21 PM
  #39
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Hey we have our number 1 goaltender in Lundqvist, I would do that in a heartbeat....

and we can always draft a goalie to replace montoya, who will have no value on the rangers because he would be behind Henry

But Staal would have major value and he is suppose to be the best one out of all of them.....

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02-26-2006, 08:28 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyrmessier011
I would hang onto Montoya for the time being. If Henrik can have another solid year or two, it would only make sense to ship Montoya because his value will (hopefully) be high enough to fill holes elsewhere (i.e. Jordan Staal etc). But Lundqvist hasn't proven himself as a #1 guy capable of bringing the team into the next decade. Don't get me wrong, he has had one of the best rookie goaltending seasons in recent history, but I don't think it is possible for him to prove himself as THE future until he has played two NHL seasons MINIMUM. There's no point in shipping Montoya right now.
Didnt he just win gold?

I think that shows he can carry to load

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02-26-2006, 08:29 PM
  #41
Kluivert4Ever
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noonan25
Didnt he just win gold?

I think that shows he can carry to load

Tommy Salo also won the gold, eight years later he was the national goat.
Not saying that Lundqvist will share the same fate but I fully understand people who are reluctant to trade Montoya.

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02-26-2006, 08:50 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATLANTARANGER
Montoya was a #6 pick. To me there is more weight to a quality goaltender then there is for any other position. If you don't have a keeper it is extremely hard to be competitive, let alone good.
My point exactly. Aside from E Johnson and perhaps Kessel, IMO, Montoya has more value now the any player in the upcoming draft. He was drafted as a potential franchise goalie, and was named AHL All-Star in his first year professional. He already has two years of development on any player in the draft.

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02-26-2006, 08:51 PM
  #43
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As one poster pointed out...

you trade Montoya and Holt is next in line in terms of depth at goaltending for the future. I would guess Sather tries to find another Lundqvist somewhere in the 4th - 7th round to fill up the pipeline.

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02-26-2006, 08:51 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thefiestygoat
I just realized I read it wrong and apologized. No need to get nasty brother. I'll play it like you in the future, zinz?

I'm sorry if it sounded nasty, I wasn't sure what you were saying, especially with what I considered to be a terse answer. I'll cool the sarcasm unless necessary.

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02-26-2006, 08:54 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
you trade Montoya and Holt is next in line in terms of depth at goaltending for the future. I would guess Sather tries to find another Lundqvist somewhere in the 4th - 7th round to fill up the pipeline.
I would that would be the case. You deal Montoya for a top pick (I'm betting on FLA), take the center you want, and draft a goalie somewhere else in the draft. Or maybe you make a side deal by picking up a goalie prospect eslewhere. How many times have we seen Sather trade down in a round to get extra picks. Betcha he does it again on draft day. Would it shock anyone to see the Rangers grab a goalie in the draft after moving Montoya?

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02-26-2006, 08:55 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus
Only if Montoya is traded on draft day.
No reason to do it before then.

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02-26-2006, 08:58 PM
  #47
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I'd do it for Peter Meuller......for Staal? probably not

The Rangers I think are extremely high on Toews.

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02-26-2006, 08:58 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyrmessier011
I would hang onto Montoya for the time being. If Henrik can have another solid year or two, it would only make sense to ship Montoya because his value will (hopefully) be high enough to fill holes elsewhere (i.e. Jordan Staal etc). But Lundqvist hasn't proven himself as a #1 guy capable of bringing the team into the next decade. Don't get me wrong, he has had one of the best rookie goaltending seasons in recent history, but I don't think it is possible for him to prove himself as THE future until he has played two NHL seasons MINIMUM. There's no point in shipping Montoya right now.
If this was a goalie coming out of juniors or college we're talking about, I'd agree. But he just spent the last season playing against NHLers during the lockout. He, for all intents and purposes, HAS been playing NHL caliber talent. Plus, (and I can't stress this enough), just delivered while carrying the hopes of a whole nation on the biggest stage internationally. You can't much more pressure put on you than that.

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02-26-2006, 09:23 PM
  #49
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I'd trade Montoya for a top 5 pick to grab a future #1 center this club so desperately needs.

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02-26-2006, 09:26 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine88
I'd trade Montoya for a top 5 pick to grab a future #1 center this club so desperately needs.
It's been what I've desired for this team for a LONG time. Just watching Forsberg, Sudnin and Jokinen today, big skilled centers, made me realize how much I want that type of center as part of the core this team is building.

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