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Proposal: Tomas Kaberle for Eric Brewer

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Old
12-15-2003, 12:22 PM
  #1
SFD22
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Proposal: Tomas Kaberle for Eric Brewer

yes or no is this a fair trade for both teams?

Toronto needs a big guy that can eat up minutes whereas Edmonton needs a puck-moving offensive guy.

thoughts?

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12-15-2003, 12:28 PM
  #2
Mizral
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I know some like Brewer, but I like Kaberle more, particularly for the Oilers.

Why?

Well, Kaberle is the PP QB they need *BADLY*, he's still very young, makes as much money as Brewer, but more importantly, he's very offensivly adept whereas Brewer isn't quite as a nice passer/shooter/skater as Kaberle.

Some could argue Brewer has more potential, but we've been hearing Brewer supposedly has great potential for years now, and he still hasn't 'broken out'. If I'm both teams, I make this move.

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Old
12-15-2003, 12:28 PM
  #3
Darth Milbury
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFD22
yes or no is this a fair trade for both teams?

Toronto needs a big guy that can eat up minutes whereas Edmonton needs a puck-moving offensive guy.

thoughts?

I'd bet that EDM would say no. Two reasons:

1) $
2) Brewer's upside is higher and even though he has struggled of late, he is the more complete player.

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12-15-2003, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
I know some like Brewer, but I like Kaberle more, particularly for the Oilers.

Why?

Well, Kaberle is the PP QB they need *BADLY*, he's still very young, makes as much money as Brewer, but more importantly, he's very offensivly adept whereas Brewer isn't quite as a nice passer/shooter/skater as Kaberle.

Some could argue Brewer has more potential, but we've been hearing Brewer supposedly has great potential for years now, and he still hasn't 'broken out'. If I'm both teams, I make this move.

Well, if nothing else, you have to admit that this is a close deal. Kaberele is the more polished, more talented player. But, Brewer is more physical and has higher upside.

Sounds like a fair deal to me, although I'd rather have Brewer (and indication of how highly I think of Brewer - because I think Kaberele is a fine offensive dman).


I didn't realize the $ were even. I thought Brewer was making a bit less?

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12-15-2003, 12:32 PM
  #5
Peter Griffin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
I'd bet that EDM would say no. Two reasons:

1) $
Kaberle makes just $250,000 more than Brewer. I think the deal is pretty even, maybe Toronto would have to add something though.

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Old
12-15-2003, 12:42 PM
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And what is Tomas K's age???? that is the main reason for not doing the trade--

also---I don't think Kabby's that good and I would much rather have Brewer is who still relatively young and his upside is still jigh as long as he keep his head on right!

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Old
12-15-2003, 12:47 PM
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Yep...I think it is a very close deal. I would think strong and hard about doing it.

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Old
12-15-2003, 12:57 PM
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I think both teams would just keep the d-men they've got... they're both damn good.

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:00 PM
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I'd keep kaberle personally!

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12-15-2003, 01:05 PM
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I'd keep kaberle personally!
So would I.

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:12 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark
And what is Tomas K's age???? that is the main reason for not doing the trade--
Tomas Kaberle is one whopping year older than Eric Brewer... Are you sure you aren't mixing him up with Robert Svehla?

I'll add my vote to the group saying they would hold on to Kaberle btw...

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:27 PM
  #12
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I think Kaberle is miles ahead of Brewer both offensively and defensively.
I'd hold on to Kaberle if i were Toronto

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:40 PM
  #13
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I'd rather hold on to Brewer, it's no coincidence that we started getting points in the standings when he came back.

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Old
12-15-2003, 01:57 PM
  #14
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Obviously, we've got a very fair proposal here. There is debate on either side. Kaberele is the more established, and more offensively polished player. But, Brewer is much more physical and POTENTIALLY better in his own end.

Hard to pick one over the other because they are both such talented young dman. And, given that the age and $ are not all that different, it becomes very hard to pick.

IF I was Kevin Lowe, I'd probably rather have Brewer. But, it is a tough call.

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12-15-2003, 02:21 PM
  #15
Mizral
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Darth,

I think (no offense) that you might be a bit out of touch with Brewer. Not that he's bad, but he certainly isn't displaying the type of play expected of him. He is currently the 3rd best defenseman on his team, behind Jason Smith and Steve Staios.

That's not to say he's bad. He's pretty good. And might have the potential to become something more someday. However, in terms of team need, the Oilers could much more use a guy like Kaberle as they really don't have any good offensive defensemen on their blueline (unless you count rookie Bergeron).

And with the Oilers absolutely DISASTEROUS special teams (bottom 3 in both PK and PP I believe), Kaberle would proove to be an instant boost to the PP.

Furthermore, it'd be the shakeup the Oilers need. They'd get a young player who will be around for years, so no big loss on age. I didn't realize Kaberle made less money, but I know some Oil fans feel Brewer is a bit overpaid as is. Kaberle is bang for your buck right now.

Anyhow, I just look at it from a team need perspective. Age, money, and potential versus now is all about equal. But the Oilers could probobly use Kaberle more. I think the Leafs would consider this one, but probobly stick with Kaberle since they already have a lot of defense-first guys.

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Old
12-15-2003, 02:26 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
Kaberle would proove to be an instant boost to the PP.
That's what they said would happen with Oates and look what's happened so far.

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Old
12-15-2003, 02:29 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by York16
That's what they said would happen with Oates and look what's happened so far.
With Oates they said the second half of the season. Did you expect him to jump in and start amassing pts. right away?

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Old
12-15-2003, 02:39 PM
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Darth Milbury
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
Darth,

I think (no offense) that you might be a bit out of touch with Brewer. Not that he's bad, but he certainly isn't displaying the type of play expected of him. He is currently the 3rd best defenseman on his team, behind Jason Smith and Steve Staios.

That's not to say he's bad. He's pretty good. And might have the potential to become something more someday. However, in terms of team need, the Oilers could much more use a guy like Kaberle as they really don't have any good offensive defensemen on their blueline (unless you count rookie Bergeron).

And with the Oilers absolutely DISASTEROUS special teams (bottom 3 in both PK and PP I believe), Kaberle would proove to be an instant boost to the PP.

Furthermore, it'd be the shakeup the Oilers need. They'd get a young player who will be around for years, so no big loss on age. I didn't realize Kaberle made less money, but I know some Oil fans feel Brewer is a bit overpaid as is. Kaberle is bang for your buck right now.

Anyhow, I just look at it from a team need perspective. Age, money, and potential versus now is all about equal. But the Oilers could probobly use Kaberle more. I think the Leafs would consider this one, but probobly stick with Kaberle since they already have a lot of defense-first guys.

No offense, my friend, but you may be a little out of touch with Kaberle! He is a very strong two-way defensemen, after all this time, he hasn't really added a physical component to his game. Now, I still think he is an excellent dman, but I think Brewer has the POTENTIAL to be more complete. And, yeah, Brewer has stuggled this year and has not emerged as the number one on that team. But, Kaberle hasn't been perfect either.

As I said, its a tough call. Kaberle is the more polished guy right now and clearly has greater offensive upside. But, Brewer is more physical and, at the end of the day, I think that is why I think the Oil would not do this deal. But, it is certainly close.

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Old
12-15-2003, 02:49 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
No offense, my friend, but you may be a little out of touch with Kaberle! He is a very strong two-way defensemen, after all this time, he hasn't really added a physical component to his game. Now, I still think he is an excellent dman, but I think Brewer has the POTENTIAL to be more complete. And, yeah, Brewer has stuggled this year and has not emerged as the number one on that team. But, Kaberle hasn't been perfect either.

As I said, its a tough call. Kaberle is the more polished guy right now and clearly has greater offensive upside. But, Brewer is more physical and, at the end of the day, I think that is why I think the Oil would not do this deal. But, it is certainly close.
Agreed. That is exactly why the Oilers don't do this deal. Brewer is far more physical and if he lives up to an ounce of his potential, he'll be far better than Kaberle.

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Old
12-15-2003, 02:50 PM
  #20
Mizral
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I still see a lot of Kaberle since they have Leafs games nationally on Canada once or twice a week. I know he's not physical, but it's not a physical presence that is lacking on the Oilers blueline. It's a smooth skating puck mover, and PP QB.

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Old
12-15-2003, 03:50 PM
  #21
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Brewer has a shade more value overall even if he has struggled this year. Kaberle reminds me of a combination of Tom Bladon(passing)/Ian Turnbull(skating, but without Turnbull's slightly more physicality), while Brewer is more a mixture of a Brad McCrimmon and a Mattias Ohlund.
Of course, that's just my 2 bits worth, but the latter combination looks a lot better to me than the first two.
The bottom line IMO is that Kaberle is a better passer and offensively better overall, but Brewer matches him in the skating dept and "passes" him in the others...physical presence, def anticipation and because Kaberle is not head and shoulders above in his own strengths, my vote goes to Brewer.

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Old
12-15-2003, 04:21 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Voodoo Daddy
I think Kaberle is miles ahead of Brewer both offensively and defensively.
I'd hold on to Kaberle if i were Toronto
i totally agree w/you

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Old
12-15-2003, 04:48 PM
  #23
Darth Milbury
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i totally agree w/you

Well, I can't say I agree. I think that both players are just a hair below elite and I'd love to have either on my team.

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12-15-2003, 04:57 PM
  #24
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I think the wild card on this deal would be if Brewer finds his game with a change in surroundings. I think Quinn would make him a very good defenseman to reach his potential. But this is not a guarantee.

What is a guarantee is what Edmonton receives in Kaberle. This guy is as consistent as they come. He would be a real improvement and stabilizer to the Edmonton defense corps immediately.

In the case of edmonton, they need the change in chemistry.

In Toronto, why would you want to change anything right now? Kaberle has been a top 4 guy during the entire Quinn regime.

In Toronto they need Brewer's added physicality for the playoffs, and they have re-found an offensive gem in Pilar. Plus McCabe has found his game again in both ends, Klee is having a career year offensively and Berg is having a career year himself leading the team in + - and is very very steady.

Edmonton has grit on defense already but needs a powerplay guy and a steady puck possession guy to move the puck and maximize the speed of the Oiler forwards.

This is a great deal for both teams!

Both assume risk, but what trade does not involve some risk?

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Old
12-15-2003, 11:27 PM
  #25
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To Oilers:

Kaberle
Belak

To Leafs:

Brewer
B.Allen

Done. Oilers get back some toughness along with Kaberle and the Leafs get back a guy who can play a 6/7 role and replace Belak, opening a spot for Coliacovo or White as well.

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