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Old
03-19-2006, 05:54 PM
  #326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
over the money and the length of Malik's contract...
Then maybe you should get over it already.

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03-19-2006, 06:18 PM
  #327
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCanada77
haha Lets Go Mets!

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03-19-2006, 06:44 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by MoochiNorris
Then maybe you should get over it already.
Is this deja vu all over again? Didn't we just cover this type of drivel?

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03-19-2006, 06:46 PM
  #329
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SoS...

perhaps not immovable, but tough to move. Many of the defensemen moved had expiring contracts. Malik's signed for at least two more seasons. That makes him a tougher move. He is on par with the defensemen traded at the deadline, except for the contract. He's been a pleasant surprise to me this season, but I still think he's overpaid, and I hope in the next couple seasons, the extra $500K or $1 million isn't meaningful. Tough to predict at this point.

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03-19-2006, 06:49 PM
  #330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
Is this deja vu all over again? Didn't we just cover this type of drivel?
Drivel..great SAT word!

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Old
03-19-2006, 07:01 PM
  #331
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Went to the game last night. Suprise gift from my GF. Garden was rocking rather well. Lot of leaf fans and they were angry lol I LOVE IT!

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Old
03-19-2006, 07:40 PM
  #332
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when the cap increases, and run of the mill defenseman start getting more money, marek malik's contract will be more than reasonable for his level of play...if he keeps it up (and here's hoping he does)

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03-20-2006, 05:38 AM
  #333
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The question will be...

do run of the mil defensemen's contracts increase, or do the services for guys like Chara and Redden increase? If the cap increases, do we see a bit of an outrageous price for defensemen (and forwards) who can be classified as elite?

I can't answer that. I also cannot answer where the cap goes. And I cannot answer if that materially affects some teams because a team like the Devils are basically capped out.

Will he keep it up? It's almost not in his hands since it's more the overall system that makes these defensemen look good. If the goalie falters, or Jagr doesn't carry the play, it could expose the defensemen. But, we hope neither happens so it should be a moot point (or hopefully will be I should say).

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03-20-2006, 06:07 AM
  #334
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Fleetch, in perspective of Maliks $$$ I think it will be both...

...I haven't been able to get a grip on the new CBA yet. Don't know if the top will go to 45 or the bottom get higher. Or how the higest salarys will be affected. If the top goes to 45 what happends to the individual cap?

This year there is (supposed to be) a ton of high profile UFA d's available, though come july there will be less, in august I doubt all that many will have changed teams. Maybe 2-3 top 2 D's (Like Chara/ Redden/ Lidström/ McCabe/ Kubina/ Blake/ Zidlicky/ Jovo) and 4-5 top 4 D's (like Salei/ Slegr/ Kuba/ Roszival/ Poti) will change teams this summer, with 27-28 teams looking for help on defense.

At the same time basically all the good looking teams have pretty good finances. I think allot of reporters ect. don't really get that. The buyers the next coupld of years won't be the Red Wings, Toronto, Philly, Dallas or Colorado. Pronger went to Edmonton last summer. I wouldn't at all be suprised if a player like Blake goes to a team like Buffalo, Columbus, Carolina, Minnesota or Nashville. Teams like that have players on the rise and allot of cap room. Thoose teams will snatch the available players pretty fast and will be willing to offer allot of $ for a good player, because thats what it is all about. Getting your hands on the best players, not ending up playing a ton for a over the hill 36 y/o veteran who will miss 75% of the season.

When Malik is in his final year of his contract, and of course if he still plays at the level he have this year, I don't think signing him will be a looked at as a misstake, it won't be a steal, like if we for example had tied up Straka for 3 year 9m contract, but it will be a decent siging..

On the same subject Ozolinsh contract next year could be interesting too. Me and just about everyone else who had opinions on "the trade" felt that it was a big minus that he had another year on his contract. If Ozo keeps playing like he did against Toronto, or atleast close to that level, 2.8 million for him next year could, quit frankly, be a big steal. This summer you won't get a D who can run the PP and contribute on rushing the puck for much less then a 4y 16-20m deal.


Last edited by Ola: 03-20-2006 at 06:14 AM.
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Old
03-20-2006, 08:09 AM
  #335
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola
...I haven't been able to get a grip on the new CBA yet. Don't know if the top will go to 45 or the bottom get higher. Or how the higest salarys will be affected. If the top goes to 45 what happends to the individual cap?
I don't think that the cap is going to $45. If the rumors are to be believed, the max that the cap will be raised will be to $42. That said, like Fletch, I have to agree that Malik has been a surprise. However, like Fletch, I also think that he is signed for too long and too much.
IMO, the success of our overall defense (speaking strictly of defesnsemen) is predicated onto the system that Renney has installed. IMO, it is the system, Henke & the backchecking by the forwards (or keeping the puck in the offensive zone in the case of Jagr's line) that has made our overall fairly mediocre defense look good. IMO, it did not have to be Malik, Rozsival & Poti that are now looking good. It could have been anyone. Heck, it made Strudwick look good for the better of two months. Therefore, since a case can be made for the system making the players and not vica-versa, someone cheaper than Malik could have probably done the same job.
I say this and at the same time I admit that Malik has not been as poor as I thought he would be, but, IMO, $2.5 is far too much for him.
If the cap raises, it will directly affect how much money a player like Redden will make, not the 3rd pair defensemen. Redden will be able to command a $5.5m+ salary. Players like Malik will not suddenly become $2.5-3m players. I think that the higher-end players will reap any benefits first and foremost, and what is leftover, if anything, will get trickled down.
Quote:
If Ozo keeps playing like he did against Toronto, or atleast close to that level, 2.8 million for him next year could, quit frankly, be a big steal.
And if he plays like he did in the all the games preceeding Toronto, it will look like an albatross. The 4 goals that Washington scored when he was on the ice, still resonates in my mind.
Quote:
This summer you won't get a D who can run the PP and contribute on rushing the puck for much less then a 4y 16-20m deal.
Personally, I would rather pay $4m for one of those defensemen and play a rookie than pay someone like Rozsival $2.5m. There are a few defensemen that will be worth that money and will play a better brand of defense.

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03-20-2006, 08:23 AM
  #336
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We'll see about Ozo...

he has Malakhov-like tendencies. Malakhov had one very good season with the Rangers in which, I would say, he was the team's best defenseman. Ozo can be a force at times, or he can really sit back and be a loafer. Hopefully moving to a new team is a new start for him, and being in a first place team gearing up for the playoffs motivates him. Next season is a different story and is oddly enough what I worry more about (I worry about him over 82 games more than the last 1/5 and the playoffs - more time to notice how he can sit back).

I'm not as anti-Malik as I was when he was signed, but again, just not in love with the contract. Would've love the opportunity to have had two Rozsival-type players and contracts out there and be able to get rid of one and sign the other (I still think Rozsival will be signed, and for the right price and length, that may be the right move).

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Old
03-20-2006, 08:48 AM
  #337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
(I still think Rozsival will be signed, and for the right price and length, that may be the right move).
Much as I may not like it, I think he will as well. However, what in your opinion is the right length & time for him? IMO, it is a two-year $1.5m/per for length & amount.

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Old
03-20-2006, 09:19 AM
  #338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
IMO, the success of our overall defense (speaking strictly of defesnsemen) is predicated onto the system that Renney has installed. IMO, it is the system, Henke & the backchecking by the forwards (or keeping the puck in the offensive zone in the case of Jagr's line) that has made our overall fairly mediocre defense look good. IMO, it did not have to be Malik, Rozsival & Poti that are now looking good. It could have been anyone.
I can't dissagree with anything in that post. We probably could have found someone cheeper, and defenitly could have paid more for less last summer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
he has Malakhov-like tendencies. Malakhov had one very good season with the Rangers in which, I would say, he was the team's best defenseman. Ozo can be a force at times, or he can really sit back and be a loafer. Hopefully moving to a new team is a new start for him, and being in a first place team gearing up for the playoffs motivates him. Next season is a different story and is oddly enough what I worry more about (I worry about him over 82 games more than the last 1/5 and the playoffs - more time to notice how he can sit back).
I have to add though that Malakhov and every other D in NY the last 9 years had absolutely no help at all gooing by NHL standards, so we shouldn't become paranoid. What True Blue described as the reason why Rozival, Malik and Poti have looked good here this season is the way it should be. Malik looked good in Vancouver too. Allot of questionable D's have looked really good in Detroit for a long period of time. If we could have Malakhov back in 02' form with the new rules I think he would have been a big hit.

Whats usually really hard for a D is to get comfortable, learn the system, get to know his new teammates. Thats allot more important for a D then any player at another position. Thats why Albelin have played at the age of 44 or something for NJ this year. Thats why Detroit always load up with D's with a ton of experience, like Fredrik Olausson and Steve Duschne, because they know how to handle that.

Its based on that I was so happy seeing Ozo showing great chemistry with JJ and Co. If he can add defense to that he could turn out to be quit a steal.

On Malik, he also have a positive attribute with his mix of size and poise with the puck. Had we brought in a Rahje type of player he might have been hard to have on the ice with JJ and Co. Malik isn't. At the same time I only think Malik is really good defensivly on the PK. 5 on 5 he makes alittle bit to many misstakes.

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Old
03-20-2006, 09:49 AM
  #339
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Off the cuff, TB...

I would say that that's generally what I'd pay - of course this is without me having a list of a salaries going out the next couple seasons, compared to expected caps, and expected other Rangers who will get pay raises and potential UFAs, etc., so my analysis is pretty unsophisticated and is based on what he may be worth, as opposed to what the Rangers could afford. To me, he isn't an extraordinary defenseman. OK offensively, but nothing great. Same defensively. I only keep him because of his right-handed shot, his synergies with other players, and he's under 30. I liked the Rozsival signing originally (on an individual basis, not when combined with others). I'm glad he turned things around because despite his earlier stats, I thought for the first 1/3-1/2 of the season, he was pretty bad - and the pairing was pretty dangerous. They turned it around, but interestingly enough, so did the entire defensive corps, including Poti and Tyutin.

Mostly agree ola. And agree on Malik. As the season went on, though, Malik has become better at 5-on-5, and has been beat a lot less to the outside and is clearing the puck a bit better (I thought he gave up a lot of second chances).

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