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Forsberg the Lame?

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Old
03-18-2006, 10:56 PM
  #1
Cake or Death
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Forsberg the Lame?

He is sitting out again with what looks to be a near non-existent injury:

Quote:
Peter Forsberg: ďWe didnít have a morning skate and I got hurt a little bit [Friday] when I was trying to hit somebody in Tampa and I kind of missed him. I finished the game, but it was really sore this morning. I tried warm-ups, and itís a sprained MCL and it wonít be too long hopefully, but it was not good enough to play [Saturday] night.Ē

How does it feel right now?
PF: ďItís sore enough not to play. Iíve never had problems with knees before, so I donít think itís going to be a long-term thing. Itís just a little sprain but it was weak enough not to be able to play.Ē

How did it happen?
PF: ďIt happened in the third period [Friday] night. I was trying to run Martin St. Louis into the boards, and he got out of the way and we kind of went into the boards at the same time. I felt it right away but I finished the game. I was okay this morning, but as soon as we did some tests you could tell it was a little sprained.Ē
A little sprained? I know the Forsberg worshippers will rip me for this thread, but come on. Look at your paycheck this week real close and consider this ... Forsberg makes $70,000 a game. You'd think he'd have a little more heart and commitment, but it seems year after year he is taking more and more time off to vacation mid-season.

I could live with Forsberg's diving and whining - if that's how he wants to play, so be it. But these phantom 'injuries' are starting to get annoying.

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Old
03-18-2006, 10:59 PM
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avalanche_country
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good thing you work for the philly medical staff and can judge forsbergs injuries for yourself

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03-18-2006, 11:02 PM
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ScottyBowman
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Forsberg is extremely fragile and I would gladly take someone with less skill who can give me 75 games a year than someone who plays 50 and scores 66 pts. People who say that he's the best player are clearly forgetting that to be a great player, one must be able to last a nhl season. He clearly cannot.

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03-18-2006, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avalanche_country
good thing you work for the philly medical staff and can judge forsbergs injuries for yourself
Like I said, I knew Foppa fans would rip me. Nonetheless, he does seem to sit out damn easily year after year. When you couple the injuries with his constant whining and diving, it just doesn't paint the picture of a guy with any real integrity.

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03-18-2006, 11:08 PM
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How about ripping you because this thread is your way of ripping him? Your agenda is clearly laid out in your last post.

Players get hurt. Top players seem to get hurt more often. Teams rest top players so as not to create a bigger injury. Teams want their top players for their biggest games. Flyers vs. Atlanta is nowhere near a big game.

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03-18-2006, 11:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by priceperlb
How about ripping you because this thread is your way of ripping him? Your agenda is clearly laid out in your last post.

Players get hurt. Top players seem to get hurt more often. Teams rest top players so as not to create a bigger injury. Teams want their top players for their biggest games. Flyers vs. Atlanta is nowhere near a big game.
Rip me all you want. Not gonna change my life in any way or alter the fact that I'm entitled to my opinion.

And by resting their top players, do you mean allowing them to play in the Olympics?

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03-18-2006, 11:14 PM
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it happened get over it..........as long as he is rested up and playing well heading into the playoffs ........your case is moot

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03-18-2006, 11:17 PM
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Rested for the playoffs to do what? Get hurt again? The guy is like a piece of china, and that's unfortunate, because he's among the most talented players in the world.

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Old
03-18-2006, 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ExtremeHockeyFan
Rip me all you want. Not gonna change my life in any way or alter the fact that I'm entitled to my opinion.

And by resting their top players, do you mean allowing them to play in the Olympics?
Settle down. take a deep breath. Read a little........digest that.......realize you got owned.........move on.

What do the Olympics have to do with this? Oh yeah, your boy Crosby didn't get picked. Got it.

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03-18-2006, 11:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rohan
Rested for the playoffs to do what? Get hurt again? The guy is like a piece of china, and that's unfortunate, because he's among the most talented players in the world.
I think they're hoping he scores or helps score. Not sure, but that's what my plan would be for him. I'm no Brodeur or Gretzky, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn last night

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03-18-2006, 11:55 PM
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As soon as I read the words "lack" and "commitment" in the same sentence I started laughing.

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03-18-2006, 11:56 PM
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He does seem to be prone to injuries, but it's because he plays a rugged style and doesn't back down from physical play. Plus, his body has had a lot of wear and tear since he made the playoffs every year he played with Colorado. Forsberg playing 60 games a season is probably more beneficial than most players playing a full 82. That's just the way it is.

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03-18-2006, 11:59 PM
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he isnt a whiner... he's a very tough player and he plays through alot of injuries. You can't expect him to play through everything. Yes he's very fragile, but he never whines and he does play through alot.
His salary has nothing to do with this.... because he makes what? 7 million?, he's supposed to go out and play even when he physcially isnt able to and risk a long term injury?... that makes no sense... yes he's fragile but its not cause he's being a baby. His body is just breaking down due to the extremely rough style of hockey he plays.

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03-18-2006, 11:59 PM
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It's times like these I don't regret Lacroix letting him go.

Once the playoffs roll around however....I wouldn't mind Colorado having him.

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03-19-2006, 12:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottyBowman
Forsberg is extremely fragile and I would gladly take someone with less skill who can give me 75 games a year than someone who plays 50 and scores 66 pts. People who say that he's the best player are clearly forgetting that to be a great player, one must be able to last a nhl season. He clearly cannot.
This coming from a Red Wings fan who has seen Forsberg terrorize his club in the the playoffs single handedly on more then one occasion.

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03-19-2006, 12:12 AM
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I don't think anyone would debate that Forsberg is among the most talented (and arguably the most talented) players in the NHL. But to be the best player, I agree with Scotty - you must be able to play basically a full season (75-82 games minus family emergencies) most years.

Forsberg has too great a history of injury and of debatedly sitting out when he may not have to in the regular season (the ankle injury of some years ago comes to mind, when he missed the vast majority of the regular season only to show up for the playoffs) to be considered the "best" player in the NHL for me.

You can attribute it to whatever you want, playing style, being targeted by opponents or whatnot, but the undeniable injury history is there and a detrament to what could have otherwise been a record-shattering career.

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03-19-2006, 12:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471
I don't think anyone would debate that Forsberg is among the most talented (and arguably the most talented) players in the NHL. But to be the best player, I agree with Scotty - you must be able to play basically a full season (75-82 games minus family emergencies) most years.

Forsberg has too great a history of injury and of debatedly sitting out when he may not have to in the regular season (the ankle injury of some years ago comes to mind, when he missed the vast majority of the regular season only to show up for the playoffs) to be considered the "best" player in the NHL for me.

You can attribute it to whatever you want, playing style, being targeted by opponents or whatnot, but the undeniable injury history is there and a detrament to what could have otherwise been a record-shattering career.
The ankle injuries when he was in Denver was due to the skates he wore. I seem to recall him going to Bauer and asking them to help him out with his skates.

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03-19-2006, 12:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ice berg slim
This coming from a Red Wings fan who has seen Forsberg terrorize his club in the the playoffs single handedly on more then one occasion.
I don't understand what you're trying to imply.

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03-19-2006, 12:21 AM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottyBowman
I don't understand what you're trying to imply.
Im just saying a Forsberg who plays 65 games is still better then most players who play 82 games.

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03-19-2006, 12:23 AM
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Yeah, but my point is it's always something. It's his knee or his groin or his back or his ankles or whatever. Each injury in and of itself is explainable and seems somewhat routine. The frequency and variety of his injuries is what knocks him down a notch to me.

Is it his fault? Probably not, but I wouldn't know. A history of injuries like that could be completely arbitrary or it could point to a problem with conditioning or a genetic issue with muscles and joints. But the fact that he misses so many games is, to me, a significant negative mark against his career as a whole. He's a guy who is like a much, much more talented Eric Lindros. "Yeah, he has out-of-this-world skill, but he'll miss 15-60 games a year."

Edit: Just some numbers to back that up. In 11 NHL seasons, Forsberg has played what I would call a "full season" (75-82 games) four times, one of those being the lockout shortened 94/95 season. He averages 57.37 games per season. If you take out the lockout year, he averages 58.4 games per season (71 percent of the 82 game NHL season). Three times in non-lockout years he has played less than 50 regular season games (49 in 99/00, 0 in 01/02, 39 in 03/04). He also had the concussion problems last year in Sweden that forced him to play only 33 games and 1 playoff game.

Again, I will never debate his talent. But I think his fragility is a far more significant detriment than most appear to.

Edited again because he's played 11 NHL seasons, not 10, so my averages were skewed upward.


Last edited by Kritter471: 03-19-2006 at 12:37 AM.
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Old
03-19-2006, 12:28 AM
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Take a look at his playoff games-played stats. Forsberg very rarely misses post-season games. Other than that freak exploding organ experience, he's only missed a handful. He'll be ready when the games matter.

Playoffs > regular season

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Old
03-19-2006, 12:31 AM
  #22
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This thread is a joke. Peter Forsberg is one of the most commited and hard working players in the NHL. He plays at a level of intensity that only the top tier players in the world can play at. Agreed, he is often injured, but that is because he plays a physical game and always has the opposing defenders wrapped around him. Does he shy away from the rough stuff with his history of injuries? Definetley not, he goes out there and gets his nose dirty and when he's on his game, no one can knock him off the puck. Philidelphia needs their #1 superstar all ready for the playoffs and if he's injured, they are smart to let him rest. They didn't even need him tonight, they won handily. And as for your olympics comment, he was fine at the time of the olympics and helped Sweden get the gold medal. So as far as i'm concerned, all the more power to him. It's absolutley laughable that you think he needs more commitment. There's a reason this guy makes $70,000 dollars a game, and i'm sure any person on the Flyers staff would tell you that he's well worth it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottyBowman
Forsberg is extremely fragile and I would gladly take someone with less skill who can give me 75 games a year
Okay, so you would take Chris Dingman [2004 Stats: 74GP 1G 5A 6PTS] over Forsberg? Why not? He played 74 games and he has less skill.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottyBowman
He clearly cannot.
95/96 82GP
98/99 78GP
02/03 75GP

72GP in 97/98
73GP in 01/02

So, he clearly cannot play 75+ games.

And you're entitled to your opinion, but i'd take a Forsberg who consistantly puts up 90+ points per season while playing 10-20 fewer games than all the other top scorers, than a player who plays all 82 and can't put up numbers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ExtremeHockeyFan
I could live with Forsberg's diving and whining - if that's how he wants to play, so be it. But these phantom 'injuries' are starting to get annoying.
Now I know you're off your rocker. Diving and whining? Are you kidding me? Forsberg hardly ever gets knocked off the puck, forget getting knocked off his feet. So you can rule diving out of the question. As for whining? this is the first time i've ever heard anyone ever mention Forsberg and whining in the same sentence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ExtremeHockeyFan
But these phantom 'injuries' are starting to get annoying.
How Forsbergs personal injuries annoy you is beyond me.


I think we need to redirect where this thread is going. Some people are making comments about how they think Forsberg has got a lot of talent but you need to play X amount of games to be the best player on the planet and blah blah, but this thread is directed towards Forsberg's injury problems, so let's not make it into a "Is Forsberg the best player in the world" thread.

You've seen how long i've rambled about his regular season preformance.

Don't get me started on the playoffs.
To quote our favorite TSN analyst: Forsberg = Monster preformer in playoffs.

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Old
03-19-2006, 12:36 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revolverjgw
Playoffs > regular season
This is all that matters.

I don't know where the original poster gets off calling Forsberg a whiner. People go on and on about the diving, whatever. But whining? What the hell, do these two labels just go hand in hand? Anyone who is a diver is also a whiner? I know a particular teenager that fits both descriptions, but I don't see Forsberg being a whiner. He gets beat on worse than any player in this league and rarely opens his mouth to complain.

If Forsberg misses a playoff game due to some little nagging injury, then open your big mouth and whine. Until he does, starting threads like this exposes your agenda. I think you're grasping at straws.

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Old
03-19-2006, 12:38 AM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SillyRabbit
Agreed, he is often injured, but that is because he plays a physical game and always has the opposing defenders wrapped around him.
Lot's of guys play physical like Forsberg and don't miss every other season due to injury.

Face it, for all his awsomeness, he's completely injury prone. Dude's spleen exploded on him! I'm certain that one day he'll contract a disease so rare they actually name it after him.

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03-19-2006, 12:40 AM
  #25
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Well, I am not attempting to discredit Forsberg's skill with this post. Saying Forsberg isn't one of the most skilled players in the world is like saying Michael Jackson isn't a white woman.

The thing is, I've been watching hockey nearly 30 years, and I am used to seeing a guy get a cut, get 14 stiches and be back later in the game. So maybe I am jaded and used to guys fighting through it a little more or something.

While I do agree with the folks saying he is better off healthy for the playoffs, there are other dynamics to consider. For instance, when a guy is paid as much as Forsberg and may possibly be sitting out on marginal injuries, wouldn't you agree it can potentially create resentment with teammates? And after a warrior and leader like Keith Primeau, this can certainly be even more heightened on Philly. Additionally, when he is sitting out on his NHL club and then plays in the Olympics, again, this can cause problems within the team.

I do appreciate all the feedback thus far, though. I always love to hear different points of view.


Last edited by Cake or Death: 03-19-2006 at 12:52 AM.
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