While I realize posting this in the Dallas Stars forum will probably bring some bias, I'm still curious. I really think he has played his game fabulously all season, but is it good enough to overshadow the performances of defensemen like McCabe, Lidstrom, and Visnovsky?
He easily deserves to be one of the 3 finalists, whether he should actually win it, I'm not sure. I think he's been on par with Lidström all season. The fact that some people still question Zubov's name when they hear the Norris Trophy is because he really, really has gotten no credit whatsoever in previous years. I honestly don't think Zubov is that much greater this season as he has been in the past for us.
Nick Lidström is unquestionably the better player. Heck, he's the best player in the NHL, but Zubov has been the only one who's managed to maintain his pace, both offensively as defensively. I'm not taking the little gap in points very seriously, as I think Zubov would've racked up the same totals, if not more playing in Detroit. He's gotten the oppertunity to be a little more open minded when it comes to offense this season, he's allowed to do more now. The 2-line rule dissapearing also helped Zubov more than anyone. 61 Points on the season already, yet, he's still holding back at times. Imagine when he goes out full throttle, and then not even in Dallas, but a Detroit or Ottawa. I can even recall Pierre McGuire, one of few I really listen too and respect, saying in 2003 how Zubov would be a favorite for the Norris if he was just playing in a more offense-friendly environment, ala Ottawa.
Sergei Zubov is a top 5 defenseman in the NHL, too bad it takes 14 NHL seasons before outside fans figured that out. It wouldn't be a farce if he were to win the Norris, I think it's either him or Lidström, but I see the odds as 5% Zubov, 95% Lidström..
Finalist definitely. Plus there's no question in my mind that he's ahead of Lubomir and McCabe. I'd place Zubov and Niedermayer as a tight 2/3 behind Lidstrom.
You guys should be happy that it's taking a career year by Lidstrom to stay ahead of Sergei.
What Scott Niedermayer has done in Anaheim is remarkable. He shoud edge out Zubov and Lidstrom. In fact, Schneider's number should bring down Lidstrom as Schneider has outscored Lidstrom by 7 goals and his +/- rating is way better than Lidstrom as well.
This scenario has happened before. Great veteran d-man having a good year at the end of his largely underappreciated career. Writers give him the Norris for a lifetime of service rather than his latest year. That's how Niedermayer got it. He was not the best defenceman in the NHL in 2003-04, Chara was. Chara had more goals, a much better +/- and is far better defensively.
Despite the fact he was clearly an elite defenceman, Niedermayer had only one second team all-star selection on his resume heading into the 2003-04 season. He came close so they gave it to him as a career award.
Unfortunately for Zubov, he's not from North America, he's not a highlight reel guy and Lidstrom is unbelieveable this year. This may be Zubov's year to get an all-star team berth but will have to at least duplicate his performance this year to get a Norris. Ridiculously, Zubov has zero all-star team selections on his resume to this point.
Unfortunately for Zubov, he's not from North America, he's not a highlight reel guy and Lidstrom is unbelieveable this year. This may be Zubov's year to get an all-star team berth but will have to at least duplicate his performance this year to get a Norris. Ridiculously, Zubov has zero all-star team selections on his resume to this point.
- To say Zubov is not a highlight reel player is rather ignorant. He makes jaw dropping plays nearly every game.
- I don't see what All-Star selections have anything to do with the topic. If anything it shows how underrated he's been. He's the only defenseman in NHL history to lead a first placed team in scoring, and this was in his first full NHL season. He didn't even get a mention that season, not for the Norris nor the All-Star team. It became indicticative for the rest of his career.. A better season is hardly not possible to imagine. If he didn't get the proper recignotion when putting up such a season, why would he get any now?
Niedermayer has always been recognized as a great defenseman. He stands out more due to his skating, and nationality ofcourse.
- To say Zubov is not a highlight reel player is rather ignorant. He makes jaw dropping plays nearly every game.
- I don't see what All-Star selections have anything to do with the topic. If anything it shows how underrated he's been. He's the only defenseman in NHL history to lead a first placed team in scoring, and this was in his first full NHL season. He didn't even get a mention that season, not for the Norris nor the All-Star team. It became indicticative for the rest of his career.. A better season is hardly not possible to imagine. If he didn't get the proper recignotion when putting up such a season, why would he get any now?
Niedermayer has always been recognized as a great defenseman. He stands out more due to his skating, and nationality ofcourse.
Paul Coffey did it the following year with the Wings. Though clearly not his first full NHL season.
But in general I agree with you on Zubov. He's long overdue for recognition. He has more highlight reel plays than Lidstrom. And IMO he should be the runner up to the Norris and finalist at the very least.
Paul Coffey did it the following year with the Wings. Though clearly not his first full NHL season.
But in general I agree with you on Zubov. He's long overdue for recognition. He has more highlight reel plays than Lidstrom. And IMO he should be the runner up to the Norris and finalist at the very least.
That was during the 1994 lock-out though where there were only like 45 games played. Details though..
Will be interesting if the media have been noticing Zubov as much as the fans have..
- To say Zubov is not a highlight reel player is rather ignorant. He makes jaw dropping plays nearly every game.
That's funny because I've been watching highlights all year and the only time I've seen Zubov is when he sprung Modano for a breakaway goal. Of course they repeatedly showed Modano but only gave a cursory nod to Zubov. I rarely see spectacular passes on highlight reels unless they end up as a goal. Frequently the spotlight is on the goal scorer not the passer.
I didn't say Zubov wasn't an extremely talented player, he is and I'm a big fan of his, but I stick by my contention that's he's not a highlight reel player. Highlight reels are generally reserved for goal scorers.
While I realize posting this in the Dallas Stars forum will probably bring some bias, I'm still curious. I really think he has played his game fabulously all season, but is it good enough to overshadow the performances of defensemen like McCabe, Lidstrom, and Visnovsky?
I'm a Toronto fan, so trust me here: PLEASE don't lump McCabe in with Zubov or Lidstrom.
I'm a Wings fan and Univ. of Michigan (and hence a Turco fan). I also have great respect for the Stars. Zubov definitly deserves to be a finalist this year. Any true hockey fan knows McCabe is a joke. IMO opinion (biased) Lidstrom is having an unbelievable year and will win Norris #4. Any of Zubov, Nieds, Pronger, or Redden would make great finalists.
What Scott Niedermayer has done in Anaheim is remarkable. He shoud edge out Zubov and Lidstrom. In fact, Schneider's number should bring down Lidstrom as Schneider has outscored Lidstrom by 7 goals and his +/- rating is way better than Lidstrom as well.
schneider and lidstrom do not play together, except on PP. schneider has better +/- b/c he doesn't have to defend the best players as lidstrom does. lidstrom often plays w/ maltby and draper to stop opposition's top line. all 3 have +/- below normal b/c maltby and draper haven't been able to score this season. (no coincidence that draper had a career season playing often w/ datsyuk.)
lidstrom is also far far better defensively than schneider (or most anyone else). schneider also makes many many many more stupid mistakes than lidstrom (who doesn't?). schneider is sorta like jovo or mccabe.
i've always thought zubov is very underrated and should be a finalist.
I think the playoffs performance can bring some bias, even if the judge can't make their choice on the playoffs performance, the last thing they will have in their hear will be the playoffs performance then if Zubov bring back the cup or just do good playoffs, he will be a real contender for the Norris.
IMO, this has been the best season of Zubov's career. He put up better numbers in 1993-94 with NYR, but he's been stellar this year. He definitely deserves Norris consideration. But I think Lidstrom has had nothing short of a juggernaut year. Lidstrom's a lock for the HHOF, but this has likely been his best regular season. Scott Niedermayer and Zdeno Chara also deserve strong consideration, but this is Lidstrom's year. Best season by a defenceman since Pronger's MVP year in 1999-2000.
McCabe and Visnovsky have nice numbers, but I don't see them getting consideration. They just aren't strong enough at 5-on-5.
BTW, there isn't a better defenceman in the league at keeping the puck in at the blue line than Zubov. It's a very under-rated and underappreciated skill for offensive defencemen.
I believe Zubov was a second-team all-star and a Norris finalist in 1993-94. I remember the outrage that Leetch wasn't a Norris finalist that year. (Not that Leetch cared after he won the Cup).
Mcabe will because of his 3rd place finish last season, not deserved though
Actually, I believe Pronger finished third in Norris balloting last year. McCabe made it to the second all-star team for some bizarre reason, but I think Aucoin actually beat McCabe in Norris balloting, too.
I think the playoffs performance can bring some bias, even if the judge can't make their choice on the playoffs performance, the last thing they will have in their hear will be the playoffs performance then if Zubov bring back the cup or just do good playoffs, he will be a real contender for the Norris.
Voting is done after the regular season ends, before the playoffs start.
Really, the only question right now is whether or not Lidstrom will sweep every first place vote.
If Zubie plays as well as he has all season for the next 3+ weeks it would not be unjust for him to get it. Unfortunately for Zubie fans I don't think he will overcome Nik this year either. A first team all star berth for Zubie should be a no-brainer but he will likely be shuttled down to 2nd team because of the "sexier" picks like either Chara and Niedermeyer. If he doesn't get even so much as a 2nd team berth then the voting is clearly flawed, IMO, because he's top 3 this year without question.
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