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Phoenix CXXVII: Neither a Barroway Nor a Lender Be

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Old
05-15-2017, 03:01 PM
  #51
Killion
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Originally Posted by Llama19 View Post
Today, May 15, Hockey Operations Manager of Team Services Rick Braunstein is leaving to join the Las Vegas Golden Knights...
Well, I sure hope he had an assistant in Arizona who's up to speed on things because thats a job and a half, absolutely top heavy logistics... planning, scheduling, booking and coordinating everything from flights to ground transportation, from accommodations to meals, road practice schedules & so on & so forth... in addition to acting as a sort of liason to players moving to or from Arizona, insuring they have appropriate housing... working with the minor league franchise... with the Asst GM, Scouts, Trainers, Medical Staff & both team & League Security etc etc etc etc etc etc.... a job that is so easy to screwup in its not even funny.... like herding cats and no ones ever happy.... but.... could be fun times ahead. Add a whole new dimension to this saga when the Coyotes charter lands in Nashville for a game that night in Vancouver.

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05-15-2017, 03:15 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Killion View Post
Well, I sure hope he had an assistant in Arizona who's up to speed on things because thats a job and a half, absolutely top heavy logistics... planning, scheduling, booking and coordinating everything from flights to ground transportation, from accommodations to meals, road practice schedules & so on & so forth... in addition to acting as a sort of liason to players moving to or from Arizona, insuring they have appropriate housing... working with the minor league franchise... with the Asst GM, Scouts, Trainers, Medical Staff & both team & League Security etc etc etc etc etc etc.... a job that is so easy to screwup in its not even funny.... like herding cats and no ones ever happy.... but.... could be fun times ahead. Add a whole new dimension to this saga when the Coyotes charter lands in Nashville for a game that night in Vancouver.
Well, they need to find someone who knows the Seattle area really well...

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05-15-2017, 03:27 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by The Feckless Puck View Post
Well, they need to find someone who knows the Seattle area really well...
Yeah, and they did hire some guy named Godot ages ago but are still awaiting his reports..... and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting...... and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and wai.....

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05-15-2017, 03:29 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Killion View Post
Yeah, and they did hire some guy named Godot ages ago but are still awaiting his reports..... and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting...... and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and wai.....
Forget about the Seattle option if the Seattle Storm (WNBA) signs a long-term deal to keep playing at Key Arena as it will include a significant penalty if they have to relocate due to renovations.

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Old
05-15-2017, 04:05 PM
  #55
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Forget about the Seattle option if the Seattle Storm (WNBA) signs a long-term deal to keep playing at Key Arena as it will include a significant penalty if they have to relocate due to renovations.
From the tentative agreement...

"The City’s obligation to pay F10H for Additional Costs and Lost Revenue due to relocation shall be capped at $260,000 per Home Game up to ten (10) games per season, and up to $2.6 million per season, with the exception of payments for playoff games during dislocation. Payments for playoff games during relocation are in addition to the payments for additional costs and lost revenue and are paid at flat rate fees established in preceding paragraphs, and
shall not count towards the cap," the tentative deal reads."

When Bettman is stating franchises are worth north of half-a-billion dollars...a couple of million as a 'relocation' penalty is a drop in the bucket...

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05-15-2017, 05:01 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Llama19 View Post
From the tentative agreement...

"The City’s obligation to pay F10H for Additional Costs and Lost Revenue due to relocation shall be capped at $260,000 per Home Game up to ten (10) games per season, and up to $2.6 million per season, with the exception of payments for playoff games during dislocation. Payments for playoff games during relocation are in addition to the payments for additional costs and lost revenue and are paid at flat rate fees established in preceding paragraphs, and
shall not count towards the cap," the tentative deal reads."

When Bettman is stating franchises are worth north of half-a-billion dollars...a couple of million as a 'relocation' penalty is a drop in the bucket...
A subtle correction, but a mistake I see everyone make:

Expansion is not relocation.

It's like adding a person to a dinner reservation, vs. just switching out a friend. Fundamentally different things. Don't use the 500 mill expansion fee (which is hilariously overpriced) as a comparison to the coyotes situation.

It's still a ridiculous number, especially when you take a look at the number of fires burning in the NHL currently, and the fact the most recent relocation was a 170 million dollar purchase.

I'd expect a Seattle move to be less than 250.

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05-15-2017, 05:04 PM
  #57
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any guess as to what proportion of coyotes staff and/or operations expertise have now indicated a move to vegas? this is a pretty interesting little subplot.

makes me wonder though, is there an effort by foley or whoever to bring in a 'team' of staff? (which begs the question, how effective have these people been while in phoenix) or is it more a case of just hiring whoever is looking for a job? seems more than a coincidence.

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05-15-2017, 05:18 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Llama19 View Post
Chief Operating Officer Ari Segal left May 3...

Source: http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2017/05/03/...r-being-hired/

Today, May 15, Hockey Operations Manager of Team Services Rick Braunstein is leaving to join the Las Vegas Golden Knights...

I would call that a possible start to a mass exodus...
Of course you would..... that's like trying to equate a three legged sack race with gerbils as the Kentucky Derby but who's worried about the details???

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05-15-2017, 05:19 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by GuelphStormer View Post
any guess as to what proportion of coyotes staff and/or operations expertise have now indicated a move to vegas? this is a pretty interesting little subplot.

makes me wonder though, is there an effort by foley or whoever to bring in a 'team' of staff? (which begs the question, how effective have these people been while in phoenix) or is it more a case of just hiring whoever is looking for a job? seems more than a coincidence.
It may seem that way, but it's not. Foley is hiring the best people he can, and this guy he hired away from the Coyotes has been doing team logistics in the Southwest for over two decades.

Now if Ari Segal shows up in Vegas and then Oliver Ekman-Larsson's name shows up on the Business Journal's register of new million-dollar home buyers, then I might believe something might be fishy.

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05-15-2017, 05:19 PM
  #60
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Don't judge me quite yet... I haven't decided if I am going to write it straight or if I'm going to go all Douglas Adams on this suckah...
Don't worry..... I always keep a towel handy.

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05-15-2017, 05:36 PM
  #61
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Uh.... what exodus???

This week the hired a new director of hockey ops and lose a director of team services.

It's a perennial stampede to the door I tell ya.
Any news on Gary Drummond the fellow who was supposedly in charge only a few short months ago? He seems to have slipped silently into the night without a single word from IA. I am sure there are others who have left that you are not aware of. Don`t forget legend, this team does not have the funds or the credibility to hire top notch people anymore.

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05-15-2017, 05:43 PM
  #62
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Any news on Gary Drummond the fellow who was supposedly in charge only a few short months ago? He seems to have slipped silently into the night without a single word from IA. I am sure there are others who have left that you are not aware of. Don`t forget legend, this team does not have the funds or the credibility to hire top notch people anymore.
First of all, Gary Drummond is an OWNER, not an employee. So if he were to divest his interest there would be a pretty large paper trail indicating such. Second, anyone above the level of office drone - that is, anyone in team administration - would merit a public announcement, however brief, if they were to leave the company.

And the team just barely hired a new hockey ops guy within the past week, so that puts an immediate kibosh on your idea that they are too broke or toxic to bring new people aboard.

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05-15-2017, 05:47 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by The Feckless Puck View Post
  • Andrew Barroway is majority owner. The IceArizona partners are minority owners. Barroway is trying to buy out IceArizona but does not have the money or partnership to pull it off yet.
  • There are no other prospective ownership groups interested in the Arizona Coyotes at this time.
  • The prospects for a new arena are dim indeed so long as Barroway/IceArizona insist upon it being 2/3rds publicly funded.
  • The only possible outcome if the new arena is not built is eventual relocation. Neither Barroway nor IceArizona nor the league seem to believe that running the Coyotes intelligently where it is is a valid option. Thus, they will either get their white elephant in the eastern metro Phoenix area or they will flip the team for relocation.
Thanks fur the update, TFP.

So of the prospects for a new arena or new ownership are dim, then what is the timeline for relocation? My understanding is that they will for sure play in Glendale next season or is there a chance they move this off-season?

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05-15-2017, 05:56 PM
  #64
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. . . the club plans to build a privately financed stadium . . .

Now don't be talkin' crazy talk there, buddy! Just calm down there - the NHL has got re-education camps, reorientation therapy for that kind of crazy thinking! What do you want to do, throw the whole NHL arena financing scheme, er, I mean, mutually beneficial public-private payment structure out the window?!

Believe me, you don't want to get on Bettman's OTHER Rolodex!!

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05-15-2017, 06:11 PM
  #65
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I totally understand the high turnover of the Coyotes personnel. Can you imagine how annoying, stressful and distracting this insane saga must be for them? A circus year after year after year after year after year, with no end in sight?

I bet whenever one of the people working there gets an offer from another team, they say yes and book the one-way tickets before negociating their salary...

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05-15-2017, 06:16 PM
  #66
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Thanks fur the update, TFP.

So of the prospects for a new arena or new ownership are dim, then what is the timeline for relocation?
The timeline for relocation has been "two weeks" since 2009, so for about 420 weeks/210 fortnights now, give or take. Anyone looking for anything to happen fast is going to be pulled down a drain of endless conjecture, rumor, into a vortex that you just don't want to go, and from which there is no return.

Advice: leave now while you have your senses about you. You seem like a sensible, reasonable person. You won't be after a few years of this. I mean, read some of Killion's humorous stuff. He was a perfectly logical, analytical observer when this all started. Broke him. Hard to watch

We all think that we can handle the illogic that is Bettman, Daly, LeBlanc, et al. But we can't. We're only human for God's sake!! (Sorry, slipping into a little breakdown myself there. Got to log out and watch some hockey. I'll be OK).

Run!!

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Old
05-15-2017, 06:42 PM
  #67
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Of course you would..... that's like trying to equate a three legged sack race with gerbils as the Kentucky Derby but who's worried about the details???
It starts by...

Put one foot in front of the other
And soon you'll be walking 'cross the floor
Put one foot in front of the other
And soon you'll be walking out the door...

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05-15-2017, 07:19 PM
  #68
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I totally understand the high turnover of the Coyotes personnel. Can you imagine how annoying, stressful and distracting this insane saga must be for them? A circus year after year after year after year after year, with no end in sight?.
Yet On May 5, 2016, Tippett was signed to a five-year extension with the Coyotes to be Head Coach/Executive VP of Hockey Operations. Amazing what people will do for wads of cash and ultimate control. They will stay anywhere.

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05-15-2017, 07:28 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by WildGopher View Post
Advice: leave now while you have your senses about you. You seem like a sensible, reasonable person. You won't be after a few years of this. I mean, read some of Killion's humorous stuff. He was a perfectly logical, analytical observer when this all started.......
.... no, no not so much WG.... not in 08, not in 98, not in 88, not in 78, not in 68, not in 58....

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05-15-2017, 07:29 PM
  #70
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Given how many municipalities have built arenas for sports teams, given how much money Glendale gave to the Coyotes... while the odds of a new arena in Arizona are no doubt low, I wouldn't say they are near zero...
You can only burn so many bridges in one market before everybody get wise about your con game. The NHL did not just burn bridges in Arizona it stole the gas to do it. Something about don't eat where you crap, and don't crap twice at the same place.

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05-15-2017, 09:44 PM
  #71
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Don't judge me quite yet... I haven't decided if I am going to write it straight or if I'm going to go all Douglas Adams on this suckah...
Somehow I think you and Killion could meet halfway between Adams and Terry Pratchett... and I'd pay to read that.

It's May, huh? Accelerated Key Arena timeline in Seattle. Not for this year, and I know better than to write anything about S**ttle in pen, but there's something to watch out of town.

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05-15-2017, 10:29 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Llama19 View Post
It starts by...

Put one foot in front of the other
And soon you'll be walking 'cross the floor
Put one foot in front of the other
And soon you'll be walking out the door...

Sure thing.... but when you're in the Mall of America it takes a little while.

Keep trying.

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05-15-2017, 10:39 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by mesamonster View Post
Any news on Gary Drummond the fellow who was supposedly in charge only a few short months ago? He seems to have slipped silently into the night without a single word from IA. I am sure there are others who have left that you are not aware of. Don`t forget legend, this team does not have the funds or the credibility to hire top notch people anymore.
Quote:
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First of all, Gary Drummond is an OWNER, not an employee. So if he were to divest his interest there would be a pretty large paper trail indicating such. Second, anyone above the level of office drone - that is, anyone in team administration - would merit a public announcement, however brief, if they were to leave the company.

And the team just barely hired a new hockey ops guy within the past week, so that puts an immediate kibosh on your idea that they are too broke or toxic to bring new people aboard.

To add to Feck's response.

Gary Drummond is an original member of IA. However up until the point where it was made known he was buying up a portion of shares that Barroway originally did not follow through on, nobody had even heard of him.

But with the bigger investment came a larger say within the ownership group, and he chose to be President of Hockey Ops. to oversee the on ice product. But how many presidents of hockey operations do you ever see out front in the media?? Not too many. Right now Mesa you're just taking a bunch of wild shots in the dark because it's always been the "megathread thing to do".


Last edited by TheLegend: 05-15-2017 at 10:47 PM.
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Old
05-15-2017, 10:43 PM
  #74
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You can only burn so many bridges in one market before everybody get wise about your con game. The NHL did not just burn bridges in Arizona it stole the gas to do it. Something about don't eat where you crap, and don't crap twice at the same place.
Sure you do.... the Chargers did it in San Diego for decades until they finally moved their port-a-can up north to a soccer field.

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Old
05-16-2017, 12:07 AM
  #75
The Feckless Puck
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Thanks fur the update, TFP.

So of the prospects for a new arena or new ownership are dim, then what is the timeline for relocation? My understanding is that they will for sure play in Glendale next season or is there a chance they move this off-season?
They are playing for sure in Glendale next season. After that, who knows? Nobody here does, and I doubt even the ownership does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLegend View Post
To add to Feck's response.

Gary Drummond is an original member of IA. However up until the point where it was made known he was buying up a portion of shares that Barroway originally did not follow through on, nobody had even heard of him.
Drummond actually bought into the Coyotes with IceArizona on three days' notice after another of the original IA crew bowed out at the last minute. When Barroway bought in, Drummond got more aggressive with his influence. He and Tippett are big pals and he's still the titular President of Hockey Operations as well as being an owner. So the hiring of Jake Goldberg as Director of Hockey Ops last week, combined with the Barroway buyout effort, has introduced a lot of intrigue as to what is going to happen with the team's front office if Barroway succeeds.

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