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Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 2016-17 Part XXI

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05-25-2017, 01:19 PM
  #51
CobraAcesS
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Originally Posted by LTC Pain View Post
Hurricanes open for business! I've no problem with a Duchene for Hanifan /1st/??? trade.

http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2017/05/25/...ign-out-there/
There seems to be one of those articles (or a couple of them) every year lately regarding Carolina. Ron Francis has never been shy about talking to the media regarding certain things kicking up dust. Yet nothing much happens either. There has been smoke around Faulk, Skinner, Hanifin, goal-tending and "Their young defense" off and on for a while now.

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05-25-2017, 01:23 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by CobraAcesS View Post
There seems to be one of those articles (or a couple of them) every year lately regarding Carolina. Ron Francis has never been shy about talking to the media regarding certain things kicking up dust. Yet nothing much happens either. There has been smoke around Faulk, Skinner, Hanifin, goal-tending and "Their young defense" off and on for a while now.
Carolina can't afford to miss the playoffs again. Literally. They need fans and money. The team is for sale w/ no buyer, owner got sued for Canes money issues and removed himself from the NHL executive comitee...it's not good.

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05-25-2017, 01:26 PM
  #53
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I don't see Francis weakening the Canes blueline to add Duchene. Hanifin is not a stud yet, but he is an established NHL player. He really has no idea how Fleury could fill that role this season.

If he wants to add Duchene and have his strongest team going into the playoffs, I think he would look at offering a package from the following: Fleury/Bean/Carolina First (12th overall).

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05-25-2017, 01:28 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Goulet17 View Post
I don't see Francis weakening the Canes blueline to add Duchene. Hanifin is not a stud yet, but he is an established NHL player. He really has no idea how Fleury could fill that role this season.

If he wants to add Duchene and have his strongest team going into the playoffs, I think he would look at offering a package from the following: Fleury/Bean/Carolina First (12th overall).
yeah but that should be an easy no from the avs. An All futures deal where the futures (IMO) are not even all that good. Ugh.

For a deal without the top4 Ds to work, I would have demanded Lindholm+ 1st + prospect but that is certainly off the table after Duchenes terrible finish to the season and Lindholms great finish to the season...

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05-25-2017, 01:31 PM
  #55
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November 11th.

Funny, Duchene lead the team with 11 points in 12 games before that game where he was concussed. Mackinnon was 2nd on the team with 7. I often forget about the concussion this year since it kept him out for a few games but now that I look at the stats it isn't hard to see when things started going south for Duchene.
After returning he had 11 points in the next 13 games. After those 13 games, starting Dec 20th, is when thing went south.

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05-25-2017, 01:38 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by JoemAvs View Post
yeah but that should be an easy no from the avs. An All futures deal where the futures (IMO) are not even all that good. Ugh.

For a deal without the top4 Ds to work, I would have demanded Lindholm+ 1st + prospect but that is certainly off the table after Duchenes terrible finish to the season and Lindholms great finish to the season...

Bean + Fleury + 1st is a better deal for us than Lindholm+ by a pretty significant margin.


That would be a great trade for us.

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05-25-2017, 01:38 PM
  #57
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After returning he had 11 points in the next 13 games. After those 13 games, starting Dec 20th, is when thing went south.
Interesting. The December 20th game the Avs got absolutely pounded by the Wild and were outshot 33-18. The game following the Dec 20th game was the embarassment against the Leafs which was when Dreger and the rest of the clowns started preaching the Avs have to do something now and when Duchene's name really started being tossed around.

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05-25-2017, 01:40 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Pierce Hawthorne View Post
Bean + Fleury + 1st is a better deal for us than Lindholm+ by a pretty significant margin.


That would be a great trade for us.
Well given that with prospect I meant one of Bean / Gauthier, I would probably highly disagree with that.

But I am higher on Lindholm than most and lower on Bean and Fleury than you are so it makes sense.

My point was basically that with Lindholm there would be atleast a very young roster player with some potential coming in return that is a safe bet to be atleast a decent 2nd liner.

Very different to an all futures deal that has a decent chance of you having nothing to show for duchene a few years from now...

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05-25-2017, 01:44 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Pierce Hawthorne View Post
Bean + Fleury + 1st is a better deal for us than Lindholm+ by a pretty significant margin.


That would be a great trade for us.
Yeah... I'd take Lindholm + over that deal easily.

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05-25-2017, 02:17 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Pierce Hawthorne View Post
Bean + Fleury + 1st is a better deal for us than Lindholm+ by a pretty significant margin.


That would be a great trade for us.
No it's not better for us by a significant margin. Then again I'm a pretty big fan of Lindholm.

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05-25-2017, 02:30 PM
  #61
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Canes have too many D and not enough F, they obviously aren't trading us Lindholm, especially since we need D more than anything. It's almost upsetting that his name is mentioned at all on this board.

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05-25-2017, 02:37 PM
  #62
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What is this talk about landeskog needing a wedge to fix his hips?

Also the more I think about it the more Duchene and Lando being traded makes sense if full rebuild mode is engaged. There are enough stop gaps (with expansion fodder) to replace them poorly for the next couple of years while the avs embrace tank nation.

Give the team to EJ, Mack, Barrie, jost, zadorov etc and hope 3 seasons from now EJ can be replaced with this year's #4 or Lando/Duchene trade.

I don't think landeskog goes though I think just Duchene.

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05-25-2017, 02:40 PM
  #63
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Canes have too many D and not enough F, they obviously aren't trading us Lindholm, especially since we need D more than anything. It's almost upsetting that his name is mentioned at all on this board.
I think its just that the fans here are starting to think that Avs won't get a top line young defensmen back so they are staring to plug the trade in with young forwards and futures defenseman. Sakic does not have to trade Duchene and it will be other team that will need to bend backwards in order to get a top line center for their team.

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05-25-2017, 02:51 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by AvsJost98 View Post
I think its just that the fans here are starting to think that Avs won't get a top line young defensmen back so they are staring to plug the trade in with young forwards and futures defenseman. Sakic does not have to trade Duchene and it will be other team that will need to bend backwards in order to get a top line center for their team.
The whole mindset of "The Avs don't have to trade Duchene..." is really rather incorrect, in my view. I would say that he's definitely lost a step when it comes to his speed/explosiveness in his skating. He's not a bad skater by any stretch of the imagination, but the injuries he's had have taken their toll and he's lost a bit there.

Whether it's fair or not, he'll be entering his 9th season with the team, and they haven't really accomplished anything. And when his current deal expires in two years, he's either walking for a better opportunity or if he does re-sign, I don't imagine he'll be taking a cut from the current 6M that he's making now, and I don't think he'll be worth more than 6M on that deal.

It's time to move on--for the betterment of both parties.

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05-25-2017, 02:58 PM
  #65
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Duchene has to go. It's time to move on.

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05-25-2017, 03:00 PM
  #66
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When someone says Duchene doesn't have to be traded they just mean right now (most people at least).

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05-25-2017, 03:01 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Cousin Eddie View Post
Interesting. The December 20th game the Avs got absolutely pounded by the Wild and were outshot 33-18. The game following the Dec 20th game was the embarassment against the Leafs which was when Dreger and the rest of the clowns started preaching the Avs have to do something now and when Duchene's name really started being tossed around.
He also talked about the Habs blowout and how the org did nothing after that to let them all know it was over. He said Varly stole them the game vs the Leafs after that but the honest and they didn't win and he knew it was over then. So couple those two things together I guess.

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05-25-2017, 03:01 PM
  #68
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When someone says Duchene doesn't have to be traded they just mean right now (most people at least).
Value will continue to decrease in that scenario. No matter how it's sliced, the closer he gets to UFA, the more his value decreases.

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05-25-2017, 03:11 PM
  #69
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I came across this Hockey News article from back in March that lists the top-10 falling NHL prospects.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/ar...ling-prospects

It may interest some as a few of the prospects are often mentioned by fans of other teams as potential pieces in a Duchene/Landeskog trade.

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05-25-2017, 03:19 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Goulet17 View Post
I came across this Hockey News article from back in March that lists the top-10 falling NHL prospects.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/ar...ling-prospects

It may interest some as a few of the prospects are often mentioned by fans of other teams as potential pieces in a Duchene/Landeskog trade.
Good catch. There's several here I've said their perception is greater than reality. They aren't trash but should not be main pieces in a deal.

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05-25-2017, 03:37 PM
  #71
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Value will continue to decrease in that scenario. No matter how it's sliced, the closer he gets to UFA, the more his value decreases.
Not neccessarily. Let's say he rebounds to 60 points. And then next summer, with just one year left on his contract, he agrees to an extension with said trading team.

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05-25-2017, 03:46 PM
  #72
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Canes have too many D and not enough F, they obviously aren't trading us Lindholm, especially since we need D more than anything. It's almost upsetting that his name is mentioned at all on this board.
Meh. I only brought it up under the premise that the Canes would not be willing to trade anyone out of their top4 Ds.

Because Lindholm++ is the only way I could have seen that work.


But only before Duchene tanked his value at the end of the season while Lindholm was raising his. Right now that won't be happening.


To be honest the only deal that makes sense is around Duchene and Hanifin. Otherwise I really don't see a deal that could even remotely makes sense.

And I highly doubt that the Canes will move Hanifin for Duchene so I don't think we will be doing business with them. Atleast we shouldn't. Their prospects + 1st simply is not good enough IMO to land them Duchene.

Maybe Landy for Hanifin. But probably not Duchene.


I disagree with you RL...

2018 1st >>> 2017 1st.

Right now teams will insist on giving up their 2017 1st. After the draft if they want Duchene, we will be talking 2018 1sts...


Also Duchene will have a chance to restore his value somewhat till the deadline.

Sure there is a chance that it will go down further.

But honestly looking at the other pieces rumored to be coming besides a 1st round, I really don't care.

The Juulsens, DeHaans, Gallaghers or Fleurys of this world won't really help us with our rebuild anyways.

Might as well take a bit of a gamble and wait and see what we can get at the last moment or once teams are allowed to discuss an extension with Duchene.

Too bad that the NHL is not going to the Olympics. Pretty sure "I want to make Team Canada Matt Duchene" would have significantly increased his value till the deadline.

Oh well...

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05-25-2017, 03:46 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Goulet17 View Post
I came across this Hockey News article from back in March that lists the top-10 falling NHL prospects.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/ar...ling-prospects
There's a very high number of bigger, slower, defensemen on that list.

I still believe in MDC:

Quote:
Dal Colle finished last season strongly in major junior, posting some monster numbers after a trade from Oshawa to Kingston reignited his game. His adjustment to the AHL has gone rockily, though, hence Josh Ho-Sang getting the call-up over him. Dal Colle does have 15 points in his past 16 games with Bridgeport, however, as he adjust to the league’s speed. He still has more than enough time to become a legit NHL goal scorer – if the Islanders give him an opportunity. They block their youngsters with signings like 37-year-old Jason Chimera.
I really think he's a sleeper and if we could get him as a secondary piece in a bigger trade I'd be very pleased.


Last edited by Balthazar: 05-25-2017 at 03:53 PM.
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05-25-2017, 03:52 PM
  #74
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Ventured over to the habs trade board...eesh.

Duchene AND Landeskog, and we still don't get sergachev nor Galchenyuk.

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05-25-2017, 03:56 PM
  #75
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What is this talk about landeskog needing a wedge to fix his hips?

Also the more I think about it the more Duchene and Lando being traded makes sense if full rebuild mode is engaged. There are enough stop gaps (with expansion fodder) to replace them poorly for the next couple of years while the avs embrace tank nation.

Give the team to EJ, Mack, Barrie, jost, zadorov etc and hope 3 seasons from now EJ can be replaced with this year's #4 or Lando/Duchene trade.

I don't think landeskog goes though I think just Duchene.
There is a report out there that Landy's hips are offset, one is higher than the other. So to make them even while he is playing his skates have a wedge built into one to make it higher.

It could explain the downgrade in his play.

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