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Mistakes the Jets Still Regret

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Old
06-04-2017, 02:42 AM
  #26
Zhamnov5GoalGame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebeeman View Post
Ya I wouldn't include ufas not re-signing, it's not like the team can control who wants to stay or go.

Trading Selanne instead if Tkachuk.
This is the mistake that most directly affected the Coyotes.
PHX would likely have had Selanne for most if not all of his career.
Tkachuk was a very good player (50 goal season in 1996) but Selanne was so much better and worth way more.
The real answer to this point is they shouldn't have traded either of them!!!
Teemu, Keith and Zhamnov were a great base of forwards for a team.
The financial deal / robbery of Manitoba Enterprises playing middle man and preventing the Jets ownership from making ANY money was the worst thing of all.

Jets easily could have sold 15,000+ season tickets that year (to keep the team) but even with that it wouldn't have worked because the owners were getting screwed by the local deal. People donated around a million dollars to a Save the Jets campaign, so if push came to shove and the Jets / NHL had given the fans an ultimatum I'm sure people would have ponied up. Hell, some people donated thousands of dollars that weren't even going towards any tickets or anything.

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Old
06-04-2017, 03:51 AM
  #27
Arthur Fonzarelli
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Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
Not taking Gretzky when Skalbania offered him to Winnipeg first.

Choosing to not protect Kent Nilsson in expansion.

Trading Babych for Neufeld

Alternating goalies in the 1990 playoffs

Mike Smith
Excellent synopsis.

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Old
06-04-2017, 09:34 AM
  #28
Mortimer Snerd
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Am I the only one who remembers the decision to renovate the old arena instead of building new? That was huge, IMO. Said at the time that losing the Jets was inevitable as a result.

The plan was in place for the 3 levels of government to build a new arena in '79. The Province and the Feds had both committed $$$. The City wouldn't put up their share, deciding to renovate and expand the existing arena instead.

As I recall the city's share was to be $25mil and the expansion/reno was estimated at $5mil.

Those numbers seem incredibly small now.

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Old
06-04-2017, 10:14 AM
  #29
Jets4Life
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Some others:


Trading away Stu Barnes for Journeymen in 93'.

Trading away Housley for Emerson and Quintal in 93'

Drafting Bautin in 92'

Drafting Lindgren in 93'

Protecting Scott Campbell over Kent Nilsson in WHA merger draft.

Promoting Mike Smith as GM in 88'

Cutting Hawerchuk's ice time, and having Smith ultimately drive him out of town.

Starting Rick Tabaracci in the 1992 playoffs against the Canucks, after Essensa was coming off a career best year.

Having Beauregard and Essensa "rotation" in 1990 playoffs.

Revolving door of coaches.


Last edited by Jets4Life: 06-04-2017 at 10:25 AM.
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Old
06-04-2017, 10:24 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhamnov5GoalGame View Post
This is the mistake that most directly affected the Coyotes.
PHX would likely have had Selanne for most if not all of his career.
Tkachuk was a very good player (50 goal season in 1996) but Selanne was so much better and worth way more.
The real answer to this point is they shouldn't have traded either of them!!!
Teemu, Keith and Zhamnov were a great base of forwards for a team.
The financial deal / robbery of Manitoba Enterprises playing middle man and preventing the Jets ownership from making ANY money was the worst thing of all.

Jets easily could have sold 15,000+ season tickets that year (to keep the team) but even with that it wouldn't have worked because the owners were getting screwed by the local deal. People donated around a million dollars to a Save the Jets campaign, so if push came to shove and the Jets / NHL had given the fans an ultimatum I'm sure people would have ponied up. Hell, some people donated thousands of dollars that weren't even going towards any tickets or anything.
I've heard countless rumours about why the deal with the Spirit of Manitoba group collapsed. The most prevalent one is that Shankerow was going to still be a minority owner, and still wanted to control the team, and would not budge. Not sure if it was true, but appearantly the Aspers, Chipman, and others lost interest as they did not want Shankerow to have the majority of power.

The Jets/Coyotes needed to trade either Tkachuk or Selanne as they were bleeding money, and could not afford both. At the time, it was the safest move. The new owners wanted a marketable player they could build the club around, and it was much easier to do with an American born kid from the Boston area, than a European. The main reason was that Selanne had bad knees, and the owners were afraid that his career may not last that long. Tkachuk was injury free, so they played it safe.

The "Save the Jets" fund collected $6,000,000 but unfortunately it was not enough. Everyone wanted the Jets to stay in the city, but in the end nobody in the community could get their ducks in a row, and save the team. It was a lesson that was learned a couple of years later when the Edmonton business community stepped i at the last minute to buy out Pocklington, and match the deal that would have moved the franchise to Houston.

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Old
06-04-2017, 10:26 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
Am I the only one who remembers the decision to renovate the old arena instead of building new? That was huge, IMO. Said at the time that losing the Jets was inevitable as a result.

The plan was in place for the 3 levels of government to build a new arena in '79. The Province and the Feds had both committed $$$. The City wouldn't put up their share, deciding to renovate and expand the existing arena instead.

As I recall the city's share was to be $25mil and the expansion/reno was estimated at $5mil.

Those numbers seem incredibly small now.
Unfortunately the Jets owners themselves were at fault for having the Winnipeg Arena expanded instead of getting a new building. According to an excerpt in the book 'Thin Ice', in April 1978, an ad hoc Committee of Council recommended that the city build a new $ 20 million arena at the CNR East Yards (the Forks site) on condition the Jets secure an NHL franchise and that the federal and provincial governments contribute $ 5 million and $ 2 million respectively to the new arena. Gobuty and Shenkarow were less than pleased with this proposal. They told council they preferred an immediate, 5000 seat arena expansion: "We want more seats. We want them cheap and we want them now." Gobuty added, "If you sell us the arena for a dollar, we will do the expansion."

At a September 20 meeting city council voted 23-6 in favor of a $ 3.5 million, 5000 seat expansion of the existing arena. In January 1979 the Jets agreed to an eight-year lease based on the proposed expansion to the existing arena. Gobuty remarked that the club "has no complaints whatsoever" with the terms of the lease and is "looking forward to many, many more years in the Winnipeg Arena."


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Old
06-04-2017, 10:33 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
But he should still write that not re-signing Stempniak was one of the big mistakes in the Jets' history. It needs to be recorded somewhere so our grandchildren can still think about how things could have been.
Exactly, Stempniak is such a huge talent that he has played for at least 10 different NHL teams; some of them for nearly 3 years!

My top 2 mistakes (others have already mentioned)
  1. Not taking 99 when they had the opportunity
  2. Winnipeg Enterprises being involved

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Old
06-04-2017, 10:37 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Yukon Joe View Post
The #1 mistake the Jets (and their fans) regret:

Not listening to Shenkarow and the various reports and going ahead to build a new arena in the early 1990s, thus preventing the Jets from having to leave town in the first place.
This is incorrect. I remember this vividly. Shankerow first made noises about the Jets needing an arena to survive in 88' but it was 1991 when he pretty much said that the Jets would be gone in a couple of years if a new arena was not built at the end of the year media gathering. The Manitoba Government acted fairly swiftly, agreeing to cover all Jets losses from 1991-95, on the condition that Shankerow keep the team in Winnipeg, and find local buyers. I remember a front page headline from the Winnipeg Free Press titled "Paradise on a parking lot?" detailing a plan to build the arena directly south of the Convention Centre. I believe the plan was to find local ownership that would have enough to buy the team, and cover a portion of the cost of building a new arena. There was also a big study done in 1990 by a private consulting firm hired by the Government to see what type of arena should be built. There was much talk of building a multiplex stadium similar to the Fargodome. There was a proposal by the Blue Bombers which would have attached the arena to the East Side grandstands, and renovated the East Side of the stadium so that it was indoors, and looked something like Assiniboia Downs. The study concluded that a free standing 18,000 seat arena in downtown, preferred by Shankerow and the Jets, was the most economically feasible option, if the Jets were to survive.

Unfortunately, when the agreement ended after the 1994-95 season, no local ownership group was found, and Shankerow announced he had no choice but to look at offers outside the province. I think there was a tentative deal in place to move the team to Minneapolis and the Target Center for the 1995-96 season, but it fell through. The book "Thin Ice" gives in in depth look at how the Jets saga ultimately went down. People in Winnipeg knew that the Jets were in trouble by 1990, and desperately needed a new arena. Everyone wanted an arena to be built, but at the end of the day, there just was never any local group that could raise the money for this to happen. When the Jets announced in 1995 that they would be fielding offers from American cities, I sad but not the least bit surprised. The business community had known this since at least 1988.


Last edited by Jets4Life: 06-04-2017 at 10:54 AM.
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Old
06-04-2017, 11:06 AM
  #34
Mortimer Snerd
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Mistakes the Jets (2.0) inherited that are still regretted.
'08 draft - Bogosian instead of Pietrangelo
'09 draft - Kane instead of OEL .... or even Brayden Schenn
'10 draft - Burmistrov instead of Granlund

OP didn't specify that Jets had to have made the mistakes themselves.

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Old
06-04-2017, 12:32 PM
  #35
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There were some bad trades made over the years that hurt the team.

The worst was probably the kings ransom we game up for Dave Manson. The package included Boris Mironov who by himself would have been equal or better value than Manson and then we also gave up Matts Lindgren (who we were quite high on that time) and the 4th overall pick in the upcoming draft.

The other example of the Jets squandering an asset was the series of trades made that involved Dave Christian. He was initially traded for a middle first round pick who turned out to be Bobby Dollas. Three years later we then traded Dollas away for Stu Kulak who played less then 20 games with us before settling into the minors for the rest of his career. Christian averaged over 30 goals a year over the next 6 seasons with Washington.

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Old
06-04-2017, 01:08 PM
  #36
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Resigning Mark Stuart for 4 yrs and Chris Thorburn for 3 yrs.

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Old
06-04-2017, 01:08 PM
  #37
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Trading Kris Draper to Detroit for $1.00.

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06-04-2017, 01:38 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jets4Life View Post
Some others:


Trading away Stu Barnes for Journeymen in 93'.

Trading away Housley for Emerson and Quintal in 93'

Drafting Bautin in 92'

Drafting Lindgren in 93'

Protecting Scott Campbell over Kent Nilsson in WHA merger draft.

Promoting Mike Smith as GM in 88'

Cutting Hawerchuk's ice time, and having Smith ultimately drive him out of town.

Starting Rick Tabaracci in the 1992 playoffs against the Canucks, after Essensa was coming off a career best year.

Having Beauregard and Essensa "rotation" in 1990 playoffs.

Revolving door of coaches.
Valid points as always Jets4Life. I've highlighted 2 of your items as those ones in particular stand out to me. It's bewildering how they could have left Kent Nilsson unprotected when he was easily the most skilled player they had at the time. It's unfortunate that Scott Campbell developed health issues and had to retire prematurely but even if his health had remained as it was in Houston, it was clear to most people that Nilsson should have been protected. I also think the Jets should have protected Terry Ruskowski over Morris Lukowich. I liked Lukowich and he was a good player but Ruskowski had become the 'heart' of the team by the end of the 1978-79 season. I think they could have really used his leadership when they entered the NHL.

The whole issue with the goalie rotation had the majority of Jets fans scratching their head at the time. It was clear that Essensa was the better goaltender and it was downright stupid for the coach to pretend otherwise. It was like going into a fight with one hand tied behind your back. The Jets players were more confident with Essensa in net and the Oilers knew he was the better goalie. They must have been extremely pleased when the Jets coach stubbornly went with Beauregard thereby handicapping the Jets and subsequently dooming us in the series finale.


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Old
06-04-2017, 01:44 PM
  #39
Channelcat
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Pat Elynuik

The initial 2.0 hirings, particularly coaching staffs.

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06-04-2017, 01:48 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
Mistakes the Jets (2.0) inherited that are still regretted.
'08 draft - Bogosian instead of Pietrangelo
'09 draft - Kane instead of OEL .... or even Brayden Schenn
'10 draft - Burmistrov instead of Granlund

OP didn't specify that Jets had to have made the mistakes themselves.
Good point. I wonder where the jets would be with even just pietrangelo instead of bogosian.

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06-04-2017, 01:49 PM
  #41
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Personally I was a kid when they traded Eddie oh for kris king and tie domi that one hurt I feel like it was a mistake but that's just my opinion

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06-04-2017, 02:16 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by RandomJetsFan View Post
Personally I was a kid when they traded Eddie oh for kris king and tie domi that one hurt I feel like it was a mistake but that's just my opinion
But did you get the sweet welcome to the Thunderdome poster?

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Old
06-04-2017, 02:17 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
Mistakes the Jets (2.0) inherited that are still regretted.
'08 draft - Bogosian instead of Pietrangelo
'09 draft - Kane instead of OEL .... or even Brayden Schenn
'10 draft - Burmistrov instead of Granlund

OP didn't specify that Jets had to have made the mistakes themselves.
Jesus that is bad.

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Old
06-04-2017, 03:00 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
Mistakes the Jets (2.0) inherited that are still regretted.
'08 draft - Bogosian instead of Pietrangelo
'09 draft - Kane instead of OEL .... or even Brayden Schenn
'10 draft - Burmistrov instead of Granlund

OP didn't specify that Jets had to have made the mistakes themselves.
Season 2016-17, when all the Finnish hype was finally warranted.

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Old
06-04-2017, 03:32 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
Mistakes the Jets (2.0) inherited that are still regretted.
'08 draft - Bogosian instead of Pietrangelo
'09 draft - Kane instead of OEL .... or even Brayden Schenn
'10 draft - Burmistrov instead of Granlund

OP didn't specify that Jets had to have made the mistakes themselves.
Make that Burmistrov instead of Tarasenko

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Old
06-04-2017, 03:37 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Whileee View Post
But he should still write that not re-signing Stempniak was one of the big mistakes in the Jets' history. It needs to be recorded somewhere so our grandchildren can still think about how things could have been.
The Gospels of St. Empniak will be told for generations to come. It shall be written.

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Old
06-04-2017, 03:54 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Zhamnov5GoalGame View Post
Make that Burmistrov instead of Tarasenko
I (mostly) just looked at the next man taken. It went Kane > Schenn > OEL. I couldn't resist skipping one more spot for that one. But, like I said - even Schenn. He is a good 2/3C who could move up to replace Little when the time comes.

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Old
06-04-2017, 04:32 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
I (mostly) just looked at the next man taken. It went Kane > Schenn > OEL. I couldn't resist skipping one more spot for that one. But, like I said - even Schenn. He is a good 2/3C who could move up to replace Little when the time comes.
When someone pointed out the draft bumbling of Burmistrov recently they pointed out that Burmistrov was not the highest ranked Russian available. Tarasenko was. But someone in the Thrashers scouting department was sure that Burmi was the next Datsyuk. I know it's pointless to look at all players not taken but if they wanted a Russian then taking the consensus ranked highest one would have yielded a better result.

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06-04-2017, 04:53 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Zhamnov5GoalGame View Post
When someone pointed out the draft bumbling of Burmistrov recently they pointed out that Burmistrov was not the highest ranked Russian available. Tarasenko was. But someone in the Thrashers scouting department was sure that Burmi was the next Datsyuk. I know it's pointless to look at all players not taken but if they wanted a Russian then taking the consensus ranked highest one would have yielded a better result.
Can you imagine Tarasenko sprinkled in amongst our talented forwards? Yikes.

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Old
06-04-2017, 05:20 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by PhoenixCoyotes19 View Post
Hey guys, Coyotes fan coming in peace.

I'm currently researching for an article regarding mistakes the Jets still regret. This involves both the original Jets, and the Jets 2.0. Here are some of the mistakes I've come up with so far.
Since the Jets 2.0 have nothing to do with the Jets 1.0 it's wrong to include mistakes made by the 1.0 team in with the 2.0 team. Different team, different time, different world.

And since the Jets 1.0 have actually been the dogs for longer than they were in Winnipeg, if we are making a list of mistakes the franchise has made.... I can list more than a few major ones done by the mess they call management in Glendale.

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