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What Should the Bruins do this Summer? II

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Old
06-09-2017, 10:27 AM
  #51
northeastern
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Originally Posted by DKH View Post
A great point by friend I didn't think of:

If Charlie McAvoy never played against Ottawa he'd be in every other trade proposal plus the posters who vanished saying he was not good or needed years in the AHL would be posting over and over about this
There was a good number of people who saw McAvoy as untouchable before his debut. But agreed his play in that series changed things.

In my opinion the #18 pick will be a piece in whatever deal DS makes

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06-09-2017, 10:37 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by BiggioRainesHOF View Post
I hated the Frederic pick (or more specifically Gretzky's commentary on it). Sweeney 1 Biggio 0.

I'd still trade him in the right deal, but Brodin is not the right deal at all.
I still wonder WTF KG was thinking when he made that comment? Even if he thought that checking C was the kid's ceiling, why the hell would you say it publicly? Makes me think he knew he was leaving and reached the point where he didn't give a ****.

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06-09-2017, 10:42 AM
  #53
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I would trade JFK before Fredric. Also not giving up top prospects and a first round pick for Brodin, he is pretty good, but not a top pairing guy.

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06-09-2017, 11:22 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by bp13 View Post
This is fine but it's not an argument to keep every prospect right? I feel like you always caution people about being impatient with prospects or throwing them into deals, but a) you do have to give to get, and b) a significant percentage of prospects do NOT pan out.

I don't have much of a position on any of these prospects (aside from ones who've played in Boston already), but just because Frederic or any of them had promising years doesn't make them must-keeps right? Moreover, the Bruins have a glut of kids now, at least, that's the perception. I would argue if the hockey world is taking notice of your farm system, there's probably no better time to start moving a few. It comes down to which ones to move, right?
Totally agree. Besides Bruins followers how many services/publications have the Bruins system ranked as a top one? The Hockey News has it middle of the pack (take it for what it's worth), but how many respected scouting services have the Bruins with a can't miss group of prospects, and even then how many are looked at as impact players? Question marks on all of them, which is why they are prospects and not playing in the NHL.

While there may be good depth and a number of third and fourth line forward prospects how many are looked at as true top 6 impact players? Senyshyn? From the little I have seen I like his speed and scoring but will the scoring translate to the NHL? Was it just having mono that held him back this season from making bigger strides in the OHL or has he shown what he is and now needs to adapt that to the pro game? DeBrusk, Chelarik, JFK, Gabrielle all look like good third line prospects but does anyone of them seem like a can't miss top 6 forward? Bjork and Heinen may have the most offensive upside but that remains to be seen, Heinen to his credit went down, played well in Providence and seemed to have had a very good playoff, Bjork is still totally unproven and was not impressive in his limited time at the world championships. Frederic I like what I have heard but have not seen him play, I am assuming he is now projecting out as more than a checking center.

The D? Zboril has been a disappointment for the most part from what I have read, Lauzon has concussion issue I believe and I know nothing about Sherman besides Pierre McGuire likes him (not really a good thing IMO).

The point being that there is not one player there that I don't trade to improve this team, while you need young talent in your lineup in a cap league you also need top end talent to win. I do not believe there is any top end talent currently in the system that hasn't played in Boston yet. Your two top centers aren't getting any younger and all that is in the system are question marks (Donato and Fitzgerald I know little to nothing about but again nothing I hear beyond this board tells me they are top end talents). Rask is getting older with no goalie prospect looking like they are ready to take his place (I wouldn't even qualify Subban at this point, he has shown nothing to make me believe he is an NHL talent)

As far as this pick goes, number 18 in what could be a historically weak draft should not impede any type of trade. Yes there will be players who make the NHL after the top ten but none are even remotely sure things or even highly regarded. Move the pick, get talent for it or a pick in next years much deeper draft.

There was a Simpson episode years ago where Homer is having a yard sale, he puts out an old TV guide for 10.00 and says nobody will be stupid enough to give me 10.00 for this, a guy comes and offers him 10.00, Homer won't sell it because he thinks if this guy wants it he must know more than me and think it is worth more, he doesn't sell it and it is worthless. Don't make this mistake by overvaluing prospects, both the Red Sox and Bruins did it for years and Shayne Stevenson and Steve Lomasney didn't win them any championships.

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06-09-2017, 11:26 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by bbfan419 View Post
I would trade JFK before Fredric. Also not giving up top prospects and a first round pick for Brodin, he is pretty good, but not a top pairing guy.
Honest question for anyone:
Do you think Brodin COULD be a top pairing guy in the near future (2-3 years)?

If the answer is yes, I am in still definitely favor of acquiring him. And he's closer than any of our prospects not named McAvoy.

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06-09-2017, 11:28 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by WhalerTurnedBruin55 View Post
Honest question for anyone:
Do you think Brodin COULD be a top pairing guy in the near future (2-3 years)?

If the answer is yes, I am in still definitely favor of acquiring him. And he's closer than any of our prospects not named McAvoy.
He's still young so he quite possibly could and I don't think he's THAT far off from being a top pairing guy in the first place.

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06-09-2017, 12:25 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by WhalerTurnedBruin55 View Post
Honest question for anyone:
Do you think Brodin COULD be a top pairing guy in the near future (2-3 years)?

If the answer is yes, I am in still definitely favor of acquiring him. And he's closer than any of our prospects not named McAvoy.
Top "pairing"...possibly. #1 D...nope. I think if McAvoy ends up being what people think he is, then a Brodin-McAvoy pairing could be a legit top 5 pairing in short order. Brodin is really good. The injuries scare me a bit, but he's good and young, and immediately makes the Bruins markedly better.

For those that haven't watched him a ton...he's Dennis Seidenberg when Seidenberg was playing at his peak. Possibly a bit more offensive upside, but just super steady, good angles and defensive IQ, and a great first pass in terms of breakouts and transition.

Anyone who played D I think will get what I mean when I say this...Brodin is a GREAT D partner. As a standalone defenseman I don't think he anchors a pair, but he's a dream partner for a Right D to get paired with.

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06-09-2017, 01:19 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by WreckItRask View Post
Top "pairing"...possibly. #1 D...nope. I think if McAvoy ends up being what people think he is, then a Brodin-McAvoy pairing could be a legit top 5 pairing in short order. Brodin is really good. The injuries scare me a bit, but he's good and young, and immediately makes the Bruins markedly better.

For those that haven't watched him a ton...he's Dennis Seidenberg when Seidenberg was playing at his peak. Possibly a bit more offensive upside, but just super steady, good angles and defensive IQ, and a great first pass in terms of breakouts and transition.

Anyone who played D I think will get what I mean when I say this...Brodin is a GREAT D partner. As a standalone defenseman I don't think he anchors a pair, but he's a dream partner for a Right D to get paired with.
Yeah, I could see that. He might be a fine partner for McAvoy as he develops into a superstar in the league, but he is that quiet guy riding shotgun, not the guy leading the way.

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06-09-2017, 01:19 PM
  #59
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Last thread I talked about how I think Duchene should be their #1 target as he would help solve most of their problems up front and is only has two years left. Expensive but worth it in my mind. - but I would also ask about Eric Staal but they're probably not going to move him.

LHD isn't a problem at the moment. Much more concerned with getting another solid veteran forward myself and dealing with LHD next summer or the year after. Chara - Krug might not be ideal long term but it's more than fine next year. Fix the depth scoring and don't go on a wish and a hope that a whole tonne of kids can step in and be impact players off the hop.

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06-09-2017, 01:31 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by b in vancouver View Post
Last thread I talked about how I think Duchene should be their #1 target as he would help solve most of their problems up front and is only has two years left. Expensive but worth it in my mind. - but I would also ask about Eric Staal but they're probably not going to move him.

LHD isn't a problem at the moment. Much more concerned with getting another solid veteran forward myself and dealing with LHD next summer or the year after. Chara - Krug might not be ideal long term but it's more than fine next year. Fix the depth scoring and don't go on a wish and a hope that a whole tonne of kids can step in and be impact players off the hop.
They way I look at it, they need a partner for McAvoy, a #3C you don't have to shelter, and a 2nd line winger to be contenders. In the short term, I feel better about lucking into the latter two with kids than I do lucking into the former with kids.

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06-09-2017, 01:35 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by wintersej View Post
They way I look at it, they need a partner for McAvoy, a #3C you don't have to shelter, and a 2nd line winger to be contenders. In the short term, I feel better about lucking into the latter two with kids than I do lucking into the former with kids.
Short term... Chara?

Long term, someone like Brodin or De Haan, etc?

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06-09-2017, 01:38 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by bp13 View Post
This is fine but it's not an argument to keep every prospect right? I feel like you always caution people about being impatient with prospects or throwing them into deals, but a) you do have to give to get, and b) a significant percentage of prospects do NOT pan out.

I don't have much of a position on any of these prospects (aside from ones who've played in Boston already), but just because Frederic or any of them had promising years doesn't make them must-keeps right? Moreover, the Bruins have a glut of kids now, at least, that's the perception. I would argue if the hockey world is taking notice of your farm system, there's probably no better time to start moving a few. It comes down to which ones to move, right?
I posted I'd trade 18, one of Lauzon, Zboril, Lindgren, & a winger like Gabrielle who I like a lot

Lauzon & Gabrielle plus the unborn 18 are legit prospects

Been told to much even

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06-09-2017, 02:01 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by wintersej View Post
What about...

Carlo + Spooner + Colin

for

Dumba + Coyle

Carlo == Dumba, but MIN gets to protect Brodin and doesn't have to protect Carlo. Colin replaces Dumba's skill set for MIN, and won't be selected with Scandella still available.

For the favor, MIN swaps Spooner for Coyle.

(still prefer going after Brodin, of course)
I'm not in favor of dealing Carlo especially for Dumba kind of guy. Not sure about Coyle. What does he do? Plus, I'm not sure that makes sense for Minnesota.

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Yeah ... I'm with you.

I still don't see the immediate urgent need for a LHD.

But then again, sense is never common
How do you figure this? You do understand that Boston currently has 2 LHD with more than 5 gams of NHL experience signed for next year? Morriw is a RFA. Liles is an UFA. If you lose one of the Millers to expansion, what's the plan? A Miller-McQ bottom pairing? Playing Miller on the left side with either Carlo or McAvoy?

That's not even to mention that Chara is 40 with 1 year left on his deal. He played great last year, and I think he'll be fine next year, but there has to be a plan going forward. They've done a nice job of picking some guys, but being able to make a move for a 23 year old LHD with over 200 games of experience would be an ideal move.

Whether it's Frederic or a 1st round pick or whatever, you have to give to get. Minnesota is in a very unique situation. Plus with Frederic, you have centers in Bergeron(2022), Krejci(2021), and Backes(2021) locked up long-term and younger guys in JFK and maybe even Spooner depending on what they do with him. If you don't deal the first, you can pick another center.

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06-09-2017, 02:04 PM
  #64
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^^^ I'm starting to think envisioning Backes back at C is fools gold.

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06-09-2017, 02:22 PM
  #65
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^^^ I'm starting to think envisioning Backes back at C is fools gold.
I agree. Don't think he plays C here. But he could move to C if needed. Still gives you Berg, Krejci, JFK at center. I don't think it's a huge need for 2-3 years, just strictly because of the contracts. I'm also not considering guys like Nash, Kuraly, Czarnik, maybe Moore that could play some C.

Quote:
Originally Posted by b in vancouver View Post
Last thread I talked about how I think Duchene should be their #1 target as he would help solve most of their problems up front and is only has two years left. Expensive but worth it in my mind. - but I would also ask about Eric Staal but they're probably not going to move him.
I'm really starting to get on board with Duchene. I'd be fine with Landeskog or Duchene. His position versatility would be a great fit. You could play him as a 3rd line C with Vatrano and maybe JFK. LW on Krejci's line would be filled by one of the young guns. Would allow JFK to slowly work his way into the line-up. He could play LW with Krejci with Backes on the right. If you get an injury, he can slide up and down the line-up. I would not be opposed to bringing him in.

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06-09-2017, 05:10 PM
  #66
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I don't think trading for Duchene makes sense unless we're also planning on moving Krejci or Backes out as well. I could be wrong here, but I believe Colorado moving him to the wing was about as effective as us playing Spooner there, and that was with MacKinnon as his C. If we're getting him just to play wing anyways, Landeskog would be a cheaper and likely better fit, as well as other players around the league like Palat. And for a team already as close to the cap as we are, it makes no sense to get him to play 3C.

LD might not be an issue for next year, but I have a hard time believing any of our prospects will be top-4 ready by 18/19, and then we're banking on a 41-year old Chara who needs a new contract or Torey Krug to be our #1LD. Brodin is looking doubtful to be a legit #1D, but with his contract and the potentially diminished cost to get him, he'd be fine all up and down that left side depending on how everyone else develops, and he helps balance out the offensive parts of our D. I have no interest in moving assets for Dumba though -- he's redundant in this defense now as an offensive guy, and moving Carlo (one of our only defensive D) for him makes even less sense.

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06-09-2017, 05:15 PM
  #67
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Coyle would be a huge upgrade over Spooner at 3C and the way that trade looks is Spooner for Coyle 1 for 1 and Minnesota laughs at us.

I dont wanna be bent over a barrel for Brodin because in the end, Minnesota are the ones in cap trouble and expansion trouble. So why should Boston be the ones overpaying? I get that it takes 2, but do you give a First, and 2 legit prospects for Brodin? I don't. 1 prospect yes, 2? No.

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06-09-2017, 06:07 PM
  #68
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Coyle would be a huge upgrade over Spooner at 3C and the way that trade looks is Spooner for Coyle 1 for 1 and Minnesota laughs at us.

I dont wanna be bent over a barrel for Brodin because in the end, Minnesota are the ones in cap trouble and expansion trouble. So why should Boston be the ones overpaying? I get that it takes 2, but do you give a First, and 2 legit prospects for Brodin? I don't. 1 prospect yes, 2? No.
I would agree about the number of prospects. The problem is that if Minnesota just does nothing, they still have 4 top D coming back. If they trade one, they may be stuck with only 3. They do have some good prospects on the left, which may be some of the motivation to move these guys and protect Dumba.

Colorado is also very interested in defense help, so I'm assuming that to get Landeskog or Duchene that one or maybe even two of the defense prospects are going to Colorado.

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06-09-2017, 06:35 PM
  #69
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06-09-2017, 06:55 PM
  #70
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Interesting. I like Brodin. I think he would be a good fit with the Bs. He is a very good skater and a smart player. He has been playing in a fairly conservative system in which his offensive skill set has not been able to be fully showcased. It's likely that his offensive numbers will improve under Cassidy. It's also important to note that Brodin had a rotating cast of characters this past season paired with him. He handled it well. I like his contract and I believe he will continue to improve. If a fair deal is able to be worked out with the Wild for Brodin I will be a happy camper.

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06-09-2017, 07:00 PM
  #71
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Interesting. I like Brodin. I think he would be a good fit with the Bs. He is a very good skater and a smart player. He has been playing in a fairly conservative system in which his offensive skill set has not been able to be fully showcased. It's likely that his offensive numbers will improve under Cassidy. It's also important to note that Brodin had a rotating cast of characters this past season paired with him. He handled it well. I like his contract and I believe he will continue to improve. If a fair deal is able to be worked out with the Wild for Brodin I will be a happy camper.

Like him a lot as well and always been a big fan and follower of his since he's been drafted.

A very underrated d-man!

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06-09-2017, 07:25 PM
  #72
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They have to get a LHD that can take minutes off of Chara. That's the goal this summer. A veteran RW would be nice too.

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06-09-2017, 09:15 PM
  #73
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Hopefully ads will be able to make a trade this offseason

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06-10-2017, 06:55 AM
  #74
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So I very much like the idea of trading for Jonas Brodin. He is young enough to be part of the young core going forward without having to throw a Zboril or Lauzon straight into the fire of playing at the NHL when Chara can't skate in the Top 4 anymore.

Let's say we trade our 1st Round Pick + Spooner + C.Miller for Brodin.

McQuaid/K.Miller is taken by Vegas. Lets just say McQuaid

Sign a cheap RW veteren (Stafford since he was here and is what you can get for cheap) Personally a guy like Sharp would be a more upside signing but probably is not a contract we should want. But lets just say Stafford for a 1-2 year deal as a stop-gap for a guy like Senyshyn to play a year at the AHL level and be ready by next year.

Marchand-Bergeron-Backes
Bjork-Krejci-Pastrnak
DeBrusk-JFK-Stafford
Beleskey-Nash-Kuraly

Chara-McAvoy
Krug-Carlo
Brodin-K.Miller

Rask
McIntyre

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06-10-2017, 07:05 AM
  #75
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Interesting. I like Brodin. I think he would be a good fit with the Bs. He is a very good skater and a smart player. He has been playing in a fairly conservative system in which his offensive skill set has not been able to be fully showcased. It's likely that his offensive numbers will improve under Cassidy. It's also important to note that Brodin had a rotating cast of characters this past season paired with him. He handled it well. I like his contract and I believe he will continue to improve. If a fair deal is able to be worked out with the Wild for Brodin I will be a happy camper.
It's not always the flashy big name, can't miss type acquisitions that can complete a team. The more immediate situation on the roster is a factor as is the longer term projection for the team. There are more flashy offencive minded options in the system, in addition to the Krug, McAvoy and C Miller current roster types, that project to fill that need on the roster for the longer term.

Reminded of the deal that brought Sidenberg and Campbell to the Bruins and both played such keys roles in the teams stanley cup win. See Brodin as being similar in that regard. Should Sweeny be able to have Neiderreiter included in a package in could be a déjà Vous situation.

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