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17-18 Bruins/NHL Summertime Talk

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Old
06-11-2017, 11:31 PM
  #1
bruinsfan1970
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17-18 Bruins/NHL Summertime Talk

Offseason talk for the B's and NHL.....


Last edited by Fenway; 06-22-2017 at 08:47 PM..
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06-12-2017, 12:45 AM
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I think sarge88 and myself are about the only ones happy with this result. Here's a few random thoughts:

I just could never get on the Nashville bandwagon. I think the Preds' popularity was primarily fueled by hatred for the teams they played (mainly Chicago and Pittsburgh). As players, Subban and Neal are extremely unlikable. And while fast, as Pat Kane alluded to, they drop guys back a lot. Back to back shutouts against a depleted Pens defense.

And I asked in another thread and got no answer - but exactly how does publicists informing their 'country' clients to attend a hockey game translate to anything meaningful long term for the NHL?

Faith Hill and Tim McGraw make Nickelback sound like freaking Mozart. And every time they showed Keith Urban, I though it was Jon Bon Jovi (have those two ever been seen in the same room at the same time?). It reeks of the NHL's obvious desperation - 'Look at us, we're cool, too.' It fails, because outside of its demographic, most people think country music is awful.

The reffing and coach's challenges are a bad look for the NHL; but we were a double overtime bounce in a Game 7 away from a #12 seed having home ice over a #16 seed. The #16 seed went scoreless in their last two games; so what would've happened against Ottawa?

If the league is serious about growing the game, it will forget about pandering to lame entertainers that offer the league nothing, and make the game so the stars can shine. Yes, the extreme opposite of that is what's going on in the NBA right now; but there is a happy medium.

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06-12-2017, 01:22 AM
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It becomes Even more glaring that the Bruins only managed one Cup during their window.

Chicago, Pittsburgh and Los Angeles all have multiple Cups.

From an all time standpoint, would you rather have six Cups in over 90 years or five Cups in over 50 years?

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06-12-2017, 01:27 AM
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We should have had the 2013 Cup. Its the one that got away in our short (Thanks Chia you ****ing idiot) window. But we could be sitting there in 5 years from now after winning two cups saying who gives a ****? No one saw the Pens winning the cup last year. Nor did they see them repeating this year with injuries. I mean ****, they won 2 cups with that defence. It helps too when you have to of the leagues best players on the same roster though

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06-12-2017, 01:38 AM
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Originally Posted by smithformeragent View Post
It becomes Even more glaring that the Bruins only managed one Cup during their window.

Chicago, Pittsburgh and Los Angeles all have multiple Cups.

From an all time standpoint, would you rather have six Cups in over 90 years or five Cups in over 50 years?
I'd rather 1 cup in last 6 years than 0 cups in the last 24.

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06-12-2017, 02:55 AM
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I'm just glad it's over so we can get back to business...

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06-12-2017, 03:06 AM
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Fenway
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I'd rather 1 cup in last 6 years than 0 cups in the last 24.
BMC will be so happy when she wakes up and sees this




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06-12-2017, 06:06 AM
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Originally Posted by smithformeragent View Post
It becomes Even more glaring that the Bruins only managed one Cup during their window.

Chicago, Pittsburgh and Los Angeles all have multiple Cups.

From an all time standpoint, would you rather have six Cups in over 90 years or five Cups in over 50 years?

Glaring? Massive overstatement. As much as I disliked the way Chia left the B's, the first five years, he did a great job building a team via in house players, FA's and trades. The B's didn't have the plethora of high picks those other teams did. How many people expected BOS to reach two Finals in three years?


PIT won the first Cup of their window in 2009. Draft picks leading up to it:

2002 - 5th
2003 - 1st
2004 - 2nd
2005 - 1st
2006 - 2nd


CHI won the first Cup in their window in 2010. Draft picks leading up to it:

2004 - 3rd
2005 - 7th
2006 - 3rd
2007 - 1st
2008 - 11th


LA won the first Cup in their window in 2012. Draft picks leading up to it:

2005 - 11th
2006 - 11th
2007 - 4th
2008 - 2nd
2009 - 5th


Bruins won their cup in 2011 and reached Finals in 2013. Draft picks leading up to it:

2004 - 63rd
2005 - 22nd
2006 - 5th
2007 - 8th
2008 - 16th

(2010 - 2nd)


Notice anything different? I give PIT the least amount of "credit" of all those teams. They had five straight years of Top 5 picks and tanked for a generational player. Chicago would be next in line for benefiting from the draft, then LA.


I give Boston more credit for what they did, not less. I guess it's just a matter of perspective?

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06-12-2017, 06:09 AM
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RetiredWBC8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithformeragent View Post
It becomes Even more glaring that the Bruins only managed one Cup during their window.

Chicago, Pittsburgh and Los Angeles all have multiple Cups.

From an all time standpoint, would you rather have six Cups in over 90 years or five Cups in over 50 years?
I'd rather have the team that didn't tank on purpose to get Lemieux or make some back room save the team deal to make those ping pong balls come out Crosby.

Only silver lining is those loser bandwagon fans didn't get to see them skate around with the cup. They don't deserve it.

Pitt was also fortunate enough to run into a 6 and 8 seed in the finals, not an Edmonton or Chicago dynasty.

Boston did underachieve in 09, 12 and 14, but I don't think you'd find anyone who would be more inclined to choose Pittsburgh over Boston as all time great franchises.


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06-12-2017, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by ashnathan View Post
We should have had the 2013 Cup. Its the one that got away in our short (Thanks Chia you ****ing idiot) window. But we could be sitting there in 5 years from now after winning two cups saying who gives a ****? No one saw the Pens winning the cup last year. Nor did they see them repeating this year with injuries. I mean ****, they won 2 cups with that defence. It helps too when you have to of the leagues best players on the same roster though
Shero/Rutherford did a great job w some of those draft picks and trades so they should get some credit but when you are able to select two generational talents (even when they lose a lottery they still get a Malkin) you are set. Chicago benefited as well (Pitt passing on Toews was nice).

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06-12-2017, 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by weaponomega View Post
I'd rather 1 cup in last 6 years than 0 cups in the last 24.
Yes!

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06-12-2017, 06:47 AM
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At the end of the day, it's about winning Stanley Cups.

When I look up at the rafters, I see ONLY six championship banners.
Feels like a major underachieving franchise.

I feel like it's always "but something" with this organization.

But Orr's knees
But the Canadiens getting first dibs on Canadian players
But WHA player exodus
But the Oilers
But Neely's knees

I don't care about playoff streaks in a 21 team league.
I don't care about Adams Division Championships.

I think it's disgusting how little this club has to show for the last ten years.
One Cup.

Better than Washington, I suppose.
I'll take one Cup over knocking on the door repeatedly with nothing to show.

However, I feel that there are many who would give this organization a pass and look fondly on 2011 with rose colored glasses while other teams are actually winning.

There are many ways to skin a cat.
Sure, Pittsburgh and Chicago sucked for years and got too talent to show for it.
The Bruins did their share of sucking. They had Kessel. They moved him and had Seguin.
Not looking to open that can of worms again, but it's a fair comparison IMO.

Slice up the blame pie however you see fit.
Blame the Jacobs, Neely, Chiarelli, Sweeney, Clode, the players, Don Delnegro.
It doesn't matter anymore whose fault it is.

Scoreboard.

(And yes, I'm pissed off)

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06-12-2017, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Aeroforce View Post
I think sarge88 and myself are about the only ones happy with this result. Here's a few random thoughts:

I just could never get on the Nashville bandwagon. I think the Preds' popularity was primarily fueled by hatred for the teams they played (mainly Chicago and Pittsburgh). As players, Subban and Neal are extremely unlikable. And while fast, as Pat Kane alluded to, they drop guys back a lot. Back to back shutouts against a depleted Pens defense.

And I asked in another thread and got no answer - but exactly how does publicists informing their 'country' clients to attend a hockey game translate to anything meaningful long term for the NHL?

Faith Hill and Tim McGraw make Nickelback sound like freaking Mozart. And every time they showed Keith Urban, I though it was Jon Bon Jovi (have those two ever been seen in the same room at the same time?). It reeks of the NHL's obvious desperation - 'Look at us, we're cool, too.' It fails, because outside of its demographic, most people think country music is awful.

THIS I tried so much to like Nashville. But I hate country music, hate Neal more than anyone else and even though my hate for Subban has subsided with his move from MTL I still couldn't get behind them.

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06-12-2017, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithformeragent View Post
At the end of the day, it's about winning Stanley Cups.

When I look up at the rafters, I see ONLY six championship banners.
Feels like a major underachieving franchise.

I feel like it's always "but something" with this organization.

But Orr's knees
But the Canadiens getting first dibs on Canadian players
But WHA player exodus
But the Oilers
But Neely's knees

I don't care about playoff streaks in a 21 team league.
I don't care about Adams Division Championships.

I think it's disgusting how little this club has to show for the last ten years.
One Cup.

Better than Washington, I suppose.
I'll take one Cup over knocking on the door repeatedly with nothing to show.

However, I feel that there are many who would give this organization a pass and look fondly on 2011 with rose colored glasses while other teams are actually winning.

There are many ways to skin a cat.
Sure, Pittsburgh and Chicago sucked for years and got too talent to show for it.
The Bruins did their share of sucking. They had Kessel. They moved him and had Seguin.
Not looking to open that can of worms again, but it's a fair comparison IMO.

Slice up the blame pie however you see fit.
Blame the Jacobs, Neely, Chiarelli, Sweeney, Clode, the players, Don Delnegro.
It doesn't matter anymore whose fault it is.

Scoreboard.

(And yes, I'm pissed off)
You seem pretty angry

Hope whatever is causing this works out for you

Have a great day

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06-12-2017, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by smithformeragent View Post
At the end of the day, it's about winning Stanley Cups.

When I look up at the rafters, I see ONLY six championship banners.
Feels like a major underachieving franchise.

I feel like it's always "but something" with this organization.

But Orr's knees
But the Canadiens getting first dibs on Canadian players
But WHA player exodus
But the Oilers
But Neely's knees

I don't care about playoff streaks in a 21 team league.
I don't care about Adams Division Championships.

I think it's disgusting how little this club has to show for the last ten years.
One Cup.

Better than Washington, I suppose.
I'll take one Cup over knocking on the door repeatedly with nothing to show.

However, I feel that there are many who would give this organization a pass and look fondly on 2011 with rose colored glasses while other teams are actually winning.

There are many ways to skin a cat.
Sure, Pittsburgh and Chicago sucked for years and got too talent to show for it.
The Bruins did their share of sucking. They had Kessel. They moved him and had Seguin.
Not looking to open that can of worms again, but it's a fair comparison IMO.

Slice up the blame pie however you see fit.
Blame the Jacobs, Neely, Chiarelli, Sweeney, Clode, the players, Don Delnegro.
It doesn't matter anymore whose fault it is.

Scoreboard.

(And yes, I'm pissed off)
I am on board with you, the only defense I will give is this lack of true success can be traced to one man and his minion, Jacobs and Sinden. When your idea of a successful season is defined by profit and loss and you don't care about winning and have a hitman in place as your GM it's tough to win championships.

All the failures lead back to Jacobs, they always have and always will.

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06-12-2017, 07:34 AM
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BMC
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Originally Posted by Fenway View Post
BMC will be so happy when she wakes up and sees this



Woooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!


:vha ppy:

Bruins fans- Hab fans-

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06-12-2017, 07:37 AM
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I am on board with you, the only defense I will give is this lack of true success can be traced to one man and his minion, Jacobs and Sinden. When your idea of a successful season is defined by profit and loss and you don't care about winning and have a hitman in place as your GM it's tough to win championships.

All the failures lead back to Jacobs, they always have and always will.
I'm pretty sure you don't accumulate the wealth that you do to be able to own a hockey team without wanting to "win"..

I do love being compared to a garbage franchise like Pittsburgh though, where fans abandoned their team twice and they actually threw games to get Lemieux. They just happened to step in **** twenty years apart basically in getting the generational players that they did to build around.

As for Chicago, they had the picks yes, but they also has a far superior coach and GM then we did. But again, they had the picks to build around, and made some nice trades.

It's not the be all end all (picks in the top ten) but I'm not going to get my panties in a bunch when teams win the Cup 3 times had that benefit. Will be like when the Oilers eventually win. I'm sure you ALL will be mocking their draft position and "big deal they should have won with all those top picks"..Not sure why you guys are missing that with Pittsburgh and Chicago.

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06-12-2017, 07:49 AM
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Love them, hate them or perhaps indifferent the Pens are to be congratulated on the cup win. Winning one is a major accomplishment in any era but back to back in the cap era is noteworthy. The way the first 4 games had unfolded, just could not see how they could prevail but they did. Overcoming adversity is part of a champions DNA. Nashville deserves full credit for being a deserving finalist and creating such a favourable buzz in the hockey world.

This season will forever be the year officiating died. How anybody in the NHL brain thrust can not see a broken system that is in desperate need of an overhaul is simply in denial. Will add my desire for off ice offical additions to work with on ice officials. The game is simply too fast and the abundance of video footage and a semi reliance on a flawed review system has made the job for any on ice official near impossible. Paralysis by analysis from the unrelenting scurinty on seemingly ever play is not effective nor fair to players or officials. Sadly I don't foresee the NHL's lead denial poster boy being prepared to do anything about the situation.

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06-12-2017, 07:51 AM
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I did a 10 year study on points playoffs draft from 2008-2017 and the Bruins

1. Were 1 of only 3 teams to have 90 points every year

2. Had 5 100 point seasons (prorated 106 2013) top 5

3. One of three teams who won a Cup and won a Presidents Trophy in separate years and also went to multiple finals

They also did not have the luxury of

Chicago- sucking and getting Kane 1 & Toews 3

Pittsburgh- in a four year period going
2003- Fleury 1
2004 - Malkin 2
2005- Crosby 1
2006- Staal 2

Washington

Ovechkin 1 Backstom 4 Alzner 5

Boston aggregate pre draft rookie pick value was in the 20's which suck to build but they got Marchand Lucic Krejci Bergeron none before 45

What a bunch a whiny entitled babies you guys are

You don't deserve this team

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06-12-2017, 07:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Sharp Shooting Neely View Post
Love them, hate them or perhaps indifferent the Pens are to be congratulated on the cup win. Winning one is a major accomplishment in any era but back to back in the cap era is noteworthy. The way the first 4 games had unfolded, just could not see how they could prevail but they did. Overcoming adversity is part of a champions DNA. Nashville deserves full credit for being a deserving finalist and creating such a favourable buzz in the hockey world.

This season will forever be the year officiating died. How anybody in the NHL brain thrust can not see a broken system that is in desperate need of an overhaul is simply in denial. Will add my desire for off ice offical additions to work with on ice officials. The game is simply too fast and the abundance of video footage and a semi reliance on a flawed review system as made the job for any on ice official near impossible. Paralysis by analysis from the unrelenting scurinty on seemingly ever play is not effective nor fair to players or officials. Sadly I don't foresee the NHL's lead denial poster boy being prepared to do anything about the situation.
Great post, if anything, Bettman and his crew suffer from overthinking what is/was otherwise the best sport in the world and a game that is best watched when it was simple, not filled with BS systems or skills competitions to decide a "winner"

They wanted to make the game quicker? Sure, let`s offer coaches opportunities to review whether or not a skate blade is less than 1/8th of an inch off the ice to help it out. There are just too many things this league has done which, for this fan , has forced me into watching less hockey despite there now being endless avenues to watch any game I want to on any given night.

As for the Pens? ***k em`, but I`m one who loved watching dynasties (teams not the TV show) and while I can`t call the Pens anything close to being a dynasty, I`m not one for parody.

I`m actually a fan who has long believed that the truest reward for teams should be that those who finish near the top of the standings deserve the top picks in the draft, not the other way around. For those teams at the bottom of the pack well........

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06-12-2017, 08:01 AM
  #21
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Originally Posted by smithformeragent View Post
At the end of the day, it's about winning Stanley Cups.

When I look up at the rafters, I see ONLY six championship banners.
Feels like a major underachieving franchise.

I feel like it's always "but something" with this organization.

But Orr's knees
But the Canadiens getting first dibs on Canadian players
But WHA player exodus
But the Oilers
But Neely's knees

I don't care about playoff streaks in a 21 team league.
I don't care about Adams Division Championships.

I think it's disgusting how little this club has to show for the last ten years.
One Cup.

Better than Washington, I suppose.
I'll take one Cup over knocking on the door repeatedly with nothing to show.

However, I feel that there are many who would give this organization a pass and look fondly on 2011 with rose colored glasses while other teams are actually winning.

There are many ways to skin a cat.
Sure, Pittsburgh and Chicago sucked for years and got too talent to show for it.
The Bruins did their share of sucking. They had Kessel. They moved him and had Seguin.
Not looking to open that can of worms again, but it's a fair comparison IMO.

Slice up the blame pie however you see fit.
Blame the Jacobs, Neely, Chiarelli, Sweeney, Clode, the players, Don Delnegro.
It doesn't matter anymore whose fault it is.

Scoreboard.

(And yes, I'm pissed off)
That's your rebuttal? Scoreboard?

Yeah, PIT and CHI sucked for years, but the B's did their fair share of sucking too? They got Kessel? That's it? As I said earlier, it's all a matter of perspective (which is a nice way of saying we see what we want to see).

You are always welcome to your opinion, but the stats say otherwise.

Here's a study done in 2015 that crunches all the numbers (wins, playoff appearances, Cups) and comes up with the NHL's most successful franchises over the previous 10 years. Obviously, PIT is going to be Number 1 after back to back titles, but BOS was 6th (out of 30):

http://www.bizjournals.com/pittsburg...st-decade.html


Not far enough back? It's all about the Cups?

In the last 20 years, the NHL has had 11 champions:

DET (4)
PIT (3)
CHI (3)
NJ (2)
LA (2)
ANA (1)
BOS (1)
CAR (1)
COL (1)
DAL (1)
TB (1)

So, by your measure of success, the Bruins are, without a doubt, in the top third of the league over the last two decades. That means they have been better than two thirds of the league? Better than 19/20 other teams? In other words you are "pissed off" because your franchise is not in the Top 5? Maybe you could become a fan of the Sabres? Nucks? Rags? Habs? Or one of the other 15 franchises that have not won a title in the past 20 years.

Talk about coming across as entitled...


Maybe Vegas? Only way to go is up for the Knights

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06-12-2017, 08:09 AM
  #22
RetiredWBC8
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Since 2001-02.

Points

Bruins 1411
Caps 1384
Hawks 1370
Pens 1365
Kings 1297

Top 5 draft position bottom finishes in the past fifteen years.

Penguins 5
Caps 3
Kings 3
Hawks 3
Bruins 1

Finished top 11 draft position bottom finishes in the past fifteen years

Penguins 6
Kings 6
Hawks 5
Caps 4
Bruins 2


So, trust me I get the disappointment for not winning more, but the Bruins have been a top franchise the past fifteen years and counting.

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06-12-2017, 08:09 AM
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A few feel good story's from this years champs.

- Hainsey plays in his first playoff game of his long career and fulfills his and every NHL players dream.
- the Pens entire no-name type defence gets it done. Interesting that there was not one Norris vote recipient in the mix.
- Fleury arguably was the Pens best player and the main reason they were in the Eastern finals. Murray's reemergence was largely a seamless transition. Can't recall a recent winner that did not ride just one goalie on their way to winning it all. Great way for a Fleury to end his time in Pittsburgh.
- Gunzel's had a magical run and played such an important role in stepping up when others faltered. Heady stuff.
- Kessel has found the perfect home as a Pen. Was on a track to be labeled a major career underachiever and now is forever a two time cup champion and counting.
- Sid, love him or hate him - and it seems to be decidedly one or the other, has cemented his legacy as deserving to be in the conversation when discussing who are the NHL greats of all time. His resume is impressive and he still has runway in front of him.

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06-12-2017, 08:12 AM
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A few feel good story's from this years champs.

- Hainsey plays in his first playoff game of his long career and fulfills his and every NHL players dream.
- the Pens entire no-name type defence gets it done. Interesting that there was not one Norris vote recipient in the mix.
- Fleury arguably was the Pens best player and the main reason they were in the Eastern finals. Murray's reemergence was largely a seamless transition. Can't recall a recent winner that did not ride just one goalie on their way to winning it all. Great way for a Fleury to end his time in Pittsburgh.
- Gunzel's had a magical run and played such an important role in stepping up when others faltered. Heady stuff.
- Kessel has found the perfect home as a Pen. Was on a track to be labeled a major career underachiever and now is forever a two time cup champion and counting.
- Sid, love him or hate him - and it seems to be decidedly one or the other, has cemented his legacy as deserving to be in the conversation when discussing who are the NHL greats of all time. His resume is impressive and he still has runway in front of him.
And this was posed to make me "feel good" why?

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06-12-2017, 08:15 AM
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GloryDaze4877
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetiredWBC8 View Post
And this was posed to make me "feel good" why?
Feel good if it was posted on the Pens board, I guess?

PIT and MTL are neck and neck for my most hated franchise.

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