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Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 2016-17 Part XXIV

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Old
06-17-2017, 10:51 PM
  #51
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I need a beer.

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06-17-2017, 10:55 PM
  #52
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I need a beer.
I'm having a Stella as we type.

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06-17-2017, 10:56 PM
  #53
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I'm having a Stella as we type.
Your positive posts make me want to drink.

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06-17-2017, 11:00 PM
  #54
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Your positive posts make me want to drink.
Hang in there legend, we are only 3 odd months from happier times to commence. It will be an Avalanche of victories for us next season !!

I re-watched the April 4-3 win in O/T over The Balckhawks this morning, with what will be quite a few of these young men coming through (Jost, Barbs and others).

After the first 35 odd minutes, we clicked into gear, and BOOM !

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06-17-2017, 11:35 PM
  #55
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It's something I mentioned once before. The fan base in here is extremely divided in opinions on the state of the team. Are we rebuilding or competing for the playoffs? Are we 1 year away or 3 years or 5+? No one seems to agree.

My opinion, with a solid trade or three, a frugal UFA signing, a competent coaching staff, and a bit (read: a ton) of luck, the Avs could be a playoff team next year. Mack, Duchene, Rantanen, EJ, Barrie, etc are good players that can fulfill their respective roles on the team. They are relatively young too. With these type of players in place, a rebuild is not strictly necessary. Go back to 2009 when Duchene was drafted and look at the roster that actually needed a rebuild. We currently have 6-8 players more talented than anyone on that team apart from Statsny and Hejduk (and Ryan Smyth at the time was probably in there). Finishing bottom 5 in 2018 is far from the only path for future success for the Avalanche. I believe coaching and expectations/desires from upper management were the biggest reasons for the Avs season last year, not the roster (though the roster has tons of room for improvement).

BUT, I don't have faith in Sakic pulling off good trades. I don't see any impact UFA wanting to sign here at a reasonable price. Jared Bednar is still the coach. I expect Sakic/Kroenke/front office are planning for a bottom 5 finish in 2018.

Frankly, I'm just tired of losing. Let's start winning.

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06-17-2017, 11:47 PM
  #56
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+ Barrie - world championships (one of the best Canadien D-men) medal winner
+ Landeskog - youngest ever captain - world championships (one of the best Swedish forwards) medal winner
+ Mackinnon - see Barrie + All Star game
+ Duchene - see Mackinnon
+ EJ - was going to be selected an All Star but got injured, and has played Internationally
+ Rantanen - world championships (one of the best Finnish players)

These young men are all International quality players (top 25 odd players in their nation in their respective positions), some are All Stars.

Don't base a flat period in one careers as an indicator of that players legacy as a player. That's harsh.

Yes, I think they are superstars, and with superstar potential.

Our team has quality all the way through it - straight up. They all just crapped the bed at the same time. Happens. people need to get over it, and move forward. Let's be competitive again. Winners do that.
Sea Eagles, you keep the spirit alive. I agree with you. Did you watch the Rookie inspiring positive speech? I agree with you in that we are missing a top Dman and top 6 winger. We have all other pieces set and hopefully Radulov knows that he can win a Stanley Cup with our team in 2-3 years.

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Old
06-18-2017, 12:25 AM
  #57
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I know nobody wants me to keep repeating it but it's not going to be hard to get back to "competitive" but it's that hurdle to consistent that's the real challenge. A miracle year is possible any year, especially with a bunch of kids. I'm not calling it impossible but they have to handle it differently and take it for what it is and don't deviate from the plan if it does happen. I think regardless next year will be more "fun", which is not a high bar to cross, but there will be signs of improvement. The roster does have talent, there are some hope in the prospects but that's not different from every other team. Sakic will do a few things right, every time he shows a pulse it's "there, told you so!" Of course he has to do SOMETHING right at some point or else they aren't even keeping up as a NHL franchise. But it's about getting ahead, being better than other teams, making more right decisions, getting more talent, gathering more assets than average, it's consistently beating par that's going to make this team better and actually legitimately competitive, consistent and strong so they aren't so dependent on the whims uncertainty from year to year.

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Old
06-18-2017, 12:36 AM
  #58
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So according to Pens fans in the main trade forum, Duchene is a semi capable 3C and that's why they'd want to acquire him so he can slot in behind Malkin and Crosby. Further proof that if you don't play on the East coast you are garbage. Lol what a joke.

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06-18-2017, 01:48 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by tigervixxxen View Post
I know nobody wants me to keep repeating it but it's not going to be hard to get back to "competitive" but it's that hurdle to consistent that's the real challenge. A miracle year is possible any year, especially with a bunch of kids. I'm not calling it impossible but they have to handle it differently and take it for what it is and don't deviate from the plan if it does happen. I think regardless next year will be more "fun", which is not a high bar to cross, but there will be signs of improvement. The roster does have talent, there are some hope in the prospects but that's not different from every other team. Sakic will do a few things right, every time he shows a pulse it's "there, told you so!" Of course he has to do SOMETHING right at some point or else they aren't even keeping up as a NHL franchise. But it's about getting ahead, being better than other teams, making more right decisions, getting more talent, gathering more assets than average, it's consistently beating par that's going to make this team better and actually legitimately competitive, consistent and strong so they aren't so dependent on the whims uncertainty from year to year.
What bothers me is the idea that when Sakic does something right, it's just expected, but when the tiniest thing isn't perfect, it's the end of the ****ing universe.

Take Butcher, for example. He's not an NHL asset and will probably never dress for an NHL game. When he walks, this board will fall all over itself to beat their chests and crow that they were right, and Sakic IS the worst GM in the past, present, and future. But really, the only way to prevent him from walking was to sign him last summer, when everybody on here agreed he wasn't ready. Now that he has a big head from a Hobey Baker win, he is going to seek NHL stardom elsewhere in free agency, and there is nothing Sakic can do about that. And even if he could, it's has a negligible effect on our future.

But still, people like to complain, and stranger still, seem to take good news begrudgingly because it denies them the opportunity to do so. When Dater spitballed that Beach was going to be back next year, there were pages of rage. When the news of the buyout broke, it was all "Well, what does Sakic want, a medal?"

You can't give him all the credit for his failures (and they are many) but give him no credit for his victories.

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Old
06-18-2017, 02:29 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
So according to Pens fans in the main trade forum, Duchene is a semi capable 3C and that's why they'd want to acquire him so he can slot in behind Malkin and Crosby. Further proof that if you don't play on the East coast you are garbage. Lol what a joke.
To be fair, in Pittsburgh he would be the 3C, lol

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Old
06-18-2017, 02:38 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by McMetal View Post
What bothers me is the idea that when Sakic does something right, it's just expected, but when the tiniest thing isn't perfect, it's the end of the ****ing universe.

Take Butcher, for example. He's not an NHL asset and will probably never dress for an NHL game. When he walks, this board will fall all over itself to beat their chests and crow that they were right, and Sakic IS the worst GM in the past, present, and future. But really, the only way to prevent him from walking was to sign him last summer, when everybody on here agreed he wasn't ready. Now that he has a big head from a Hobey Baker win, he is going to seek NHL stardom elsewhere in free agency, and there is nothing Sakic can do about that. And even if he could, it's has a negligible effect on our future.

But still, people like to complain, and stranger still, seem to take good news begrudgingly because it denies them the opportunity to do so. When Dater spitballed that Beach was going to be back next year, there were pages of rage. When the news of the buyout broke, it was all "Well, what does Sakic want, a medal?"

You can't give him all the credit for his failures (and they are many) but give him no credit for his victories.
Let's not forget, Nieto, Andrighetto and Barberio are waiver claims or trades for guys like Martinsen, but come on, these guys are pure gold. Sven got 16 points, in 19 games and wasn't a minus player. BUT, the thing I loved about that is he didn't seem (to me anyways) to be playing in a fashion that you'd think it was a honeymoon period. And heck, 20 odd games is 20 odd games - or 25% of a season.

BUT, I have to say a HUGE thank you to McMetal, AvsJost98, tigervixxxen & GeniusSuperior for the last few posts. I have literally been losing faith a little in our fanbase (a fanbase I consider the most well informed, passionate, die hard group in the league).

It's completely devastating to me (considering this team is my life) that people have, or are losing faith & hope.

I honestly think I've posted a line-up, with but JUST two free agent acquisitions (hell, not even a trade involved), that I feel would have us competing - yes - competing for a play-off position. I'm not so one eyed to say that roster would win a Stanley Cup, but challenging for at least the playoffs, and IN the playoffs is more rebuilding & developing in my eyes, than losing hard every year and hoping for the 1st overall picks to save us - seriously, how did the best teams fans oin the league start feeling this way?

I made a worm bet about Kevin Porter, and lost (but followed through - on youtube). If Avs make the P/O's next year, I'm flying over there, and buying 50 of you 3 rounds of beers each, next season ! Take that and bank it.

I look forward to sharing some cups with you all.

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Old
06-18-2017, 02:41 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sea Eagles View Post
Let's not forget, Nieto, Andrighetto and Barberio are waiver claims or trades for guys like Martinsen, but come on, these guys are pure gold. Sven got 16 points, in 19 games and wasn't a minus player. BUT, the thing I loved about that is he didn't seem (to me anyways) to be playing in a fashion that you'd think it was a honeymoon period. And heck, 20 odd games is 20 odd games - or 25% of a season.

BUT, I have to say a HUGE thank you to McMetal, AvsJost98, tigervixxxen & GeniusSuperior for the last few posts. I have literally been losing faith a little in our fanbase (a fanbase I consider the most well informed, passionate, die hard group in the league).

It's completely devastating to me (considering this team is my life) that people have, or are losing faith & hope.

I honestly think I've posted a line-up, with but JUST two free agent acquisitions (hell, not even a trade involved), that I feel would have us competing - yes - competing for a play-off position. I'm not so one eyed to say that roster would win a Stanley Cup, but challenging for at least the playoffs, and IN the playoffs is more rebuilding & developing in my eyes, than losing hard every year and hoping for the 1st overall picks to save us - seriously, how did the best teams fans oin the league start feeling this way?

I made a worm bet about Kevin Porter, and lost (but followed through - on youtube). If Avs make the P/O's next year, I'm flying over there, and buying 50 of you 3 rounds of beers each, next season ! Take that and bank it.

I look forward to sharing some cups with you all.
I will fly to Denver for my 3 free beers because I'm Indian and cheap.

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Old
06-18-2017, 03:09 AM
  #63
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I will fly to Denver for my 3 free beers because I'm Indian and cheap.
If you fly in from India, your night is on me champion.

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Old
06-18-2017, 03:19 AM
  #64
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None of them are superstars like Rads; though MacK can get there.
Radulov is not a superstar, either.

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Old
06-18-2017, 03:43 AM
  #65
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Let's not forget, Nieto, Andrighetto and Barberio are waiver claims or trades for guys like Martinsen, but come on, these guys are pure gold. Sven got 16 points, in 19 games and wasn't a minus player. BUT, the thing I loved about that is he didn't seem (to me anyways) to be playing in a fashion that you'd think it was a honeymoon period. And heck, 20 odd games is 20 odd games - or 25% of a season.

BUT, I have to say a HUGE thank you to McMetal, AvsJost98, tigervixxxen & GeniusSuperior for the last few posts. I have literally been losing faith a little in our fanbase (a fanbase I consider the most well informed, passionate, die hard group in the league).

It's completely devastating to me (considering this team is my life) that people have, or are losing faith & hope.

I honestly think I've posted a line-up, with but JUST two free agent acquisitions (hell, not even a trade involved), that I feel would have us competing - yes - competing for a play-off position. I'm not so one eyed to say that roster would win a Stanley Cup, but challenging for at least the playoffs, and IN the playoffs is more rebuilding & developing in my eyes, than losing hard every year and hoping for the 1st overall picks to save us - seriously, how did the best teams fans oin the league start feeling this way?

I made a worm bet about Kevin Porter, and lost (but followed through - on youtube). If Avs make the P/O's next year, I'm flying over there, and buying 50 of you 3 rounds of beers each, next season ! Take that and bank it.

I look forward to sharing some cups with you all.
Yeah I agree we have to have more this optimism in here otherwise its no fun! I thought i was the only so to speak crazy one to not be so down on the avs, on sakic, on our core guys etc. I expect a bounce back year to a bubble playoff team. ;D

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Old
06-18-2017, 04:18 AM
  #66
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There's nothing wrong with cautious optimism, but if you go into it with unreasonable expectations you're only setting yourself up for more disappointment. Despite all the struggles the last ~10 years, this fanbase has generally been perpetually hopeful and has been rewarded with two first-round exits and questionable-to-befuddling FO moves. I've personally seen too many of these "just wait and see" conversations year after year to know that nothing will happen until it happens. This team, from top to bottom, hasn't done much in the way of earning trust and should be treated as such until they do. Do I hope that happens as early as next season? You damn well better believe. But signs don't exactly point in the direction quite yet.

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06-18-2017, 04:45 AM
  #67
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What bothers me is the idea that when Sakic does something right, it's just expected, but when the tiniest thing isn't perfect, it's the end of the ****ing universe.

Take Butcher, for example. He's not an NHL asset and will probably never dress for an NHL game. When he walks, this board will fall all over itself to beat their chests and crow that they were right, and Sakic IS the worst GM in the past, present, and future. But really, the only way to prevent him from walking was to sign him last summer, when everybody on here agreed he wasn't ready. Now that he has a big head from a Hobey Baker win, he is going to seek NHL stardom elsewhere in free agency, and there is nothing Sakic can do about that. And even if he could, it's has a negligible effect on our future.

But still, people like to complain, and stranger still, seem to take good news begrudgingly because it denies them the opportunity to do so. When Dater spitballed that Beach was going to be back next year, there were pages of rage. When the news of the buyout broke, it was all "Well, what does Sakic want, a medal?"

You can't give him all the credit for his failures (and they are many) but give him no credit for his victories.
Why should he be praised for simply doing his job correctly and according to common sense expectations? The only move he's made on his own that was a pleasant surprise was the Martinsen for Andrighetto trade. Everything else was par for the course. His failure to acquire any draft picks at the deadline should be scrutinized as inexperienced incompetence. Any team in last place plummeting to the bottom goes out and acquires draft picks and young prospects.

When you go to a restaurant, you expect a certain level of service and competence from your waiter. Sakic is that waiter that only comes to your table after you've been seated for a twenty minutes. Then mixes up your drink order and disappears for another 20 minutes while your stomach rumbles in hanger. You can just sense that he doesn't want to be there, and he's soft spoken and not assertive at all. Any confidence you could have had in him performing his job properly is gone. Finally after bumbling his way through your order, he doesn't ask if you want dessert but he leaves you an extra mint. The extra mint was the Ghetto trade. You're not going to tip a waiter who sucks at his job, just because he eventually fulfilled his job requirements at a basic and incompetent level. Most people would ask a manager for another waiter. Or they would be too polite to ask because he seems like a nice guy, and just endure the terrible service until it's over.

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Old
06-18-2017, 07:21 AM
  #68
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Seems most on the trade board believe MTL got bad value for Beaulieu. I think they did a solid job cashing in on a guy whose stock is quickly dropping. I don't think it'll be too long until Beaulieu is essentially valueless. A third is a third. I wish we could pull that off with Grigorenko.

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Old
06-18-2017, 07:25 AM
  #69
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As much as I'd love brodin from Vegas I think Minny protects brodin, and Vegas selects scandella and trades him for Galchenyuk.

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06-18-2017, 08:02 AM
  #70
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06-18-2017, 08:21 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Sea Eagles View Post
I made a worm bet about Kevin Porter, and lost (but followed through - on youtube). If Avs make the P/O's next year, I'm flying over there, and buying 50 of you 3 rounds of beers each, next season ! Take that and bank it.

I look forward to sharing some cups with you all.
Fly via Singapore and I will meet you at the airport for a pint (which is roughly the cost of 3 in the US).

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Old
06-18-2017, 08:21 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by tigervixxxen View Post
I know nobody wants me to keep repeating it but it's not going to be hard to get back to "competitive" but it's that hurdle to consistent that's the real challenge. A miracle year is possible any year, especially with a bunch of kids. I'm not calling it impossible but they have to handle it differently and take it for what it is and don't deviate from the plan if it does happen. I think regardless next year will be more "fun", which is not a high bar to cross, but there will be signs of improvement. The roster does have talent, there are some hope in the prospects but that's not different from every other team. Sakic will do a few things right, every time he shows a pulse it's "there, told you so!" Of course he has to do SOMETHING right at some point or else they aren't even keeping up as a NHL franchise. But it's about getting ahead, being better than other teams, making more right decisions, getting more talent, gathering more assets than average, it's consistently beating par that's going to make this team better and actually legitimately competitive, consistent and strong so they aren't so dependent on the whims uncertainty from year to year.

This is exactly the point. I'm sure if the Avs signed Radulov and Kulikov this summer and Varlamov returned to form that the Avs could absolutely compete for playoffs.


But the problem is we've seen proof already that they're not good enough to actually make playoffs and if they do manage to squeak in it'd be a quick first round defeat once again.



The current Avs roster even with Radulov added to it us simply not good enough to contend for a cup. So what's the point of try to be a middle of the pack team when that's the absolute base case scenario with this team.


The best thing that could happen to this team is another awful season and subsequentlya Top 5 pick and an actual superstar talent that can change the dynamic of this team.


Anything else and it's just a continuation of the endless cycle of mediocrity we've already had to endure for the better part of 15 years now.

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Old
06-18-2017, 08:22 AM
  #73
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Take Butcher, for example. He's not an NHL asset and will probably never dress for an NHL game.
This reminds me of what was said about Kyle Wood at the TDL, "He's just a 3rd round pick who will probably never ....."

Meanwhile Woods in his 1st year in the AHL makes the All-star team, ends up with the highest PPG of any rookie D, ends up 2nd in PP Goals by any D

Sakic didn't have to say a word to Butcher last year other than keep improving and we will go from there. Instead he kicks the kid to the curb and then a year later, with contract in hand, has to suck up and beg for him to sign.

As for Beauch buyout, why should Sakic get credit for it when he was the moron who signed him in the first place? You would think Sakic would have learned his lesson about signing over-the-hill D when he traded a 2nd for Stuart, but instead he double downed with Beauch and gave him an even longer contract.

Just like how Duchene needs to move on the same can be said for Sakic.

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06-18-2017, 08:22 AM
  #74
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Radulov is not a superstar, either.
Yes he is. Maybe not in North America, but in Russia, he was second to none currently playing pro (maybe Kovy).

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Old
06-18-2017, 08:26 AM
  #75
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It's nice seeing these list coming out and seeing that there actually is a good chunk of quality teams at risk of losing good players for nothing. Yet our team is so bad we are hoping Vegas poaches our extra weight!


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