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Expansion Draft - Part III [Protected lists Released]

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Old
06-18-2017, 11:07 AM
  #76
Mortimer Snerd
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Originally Posted by cbcwpg View Post
Wonder if Chevy is going to try to make a deal to keep Toby?

From a cap point of view I could see them picking up Toby... Vegas does have to get to the cap floor.
That's a red herring. They will have no trouble getting to the floor.

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06-18-2017, 11:08 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Rheged View Post
Bogosian also left unprotected in favor of a last minute acquired Beaulieu.
I could see Vegas selecting him from Buffalo's list.
Under contract for 3 more years @ cap hit of $5.1M per.

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06-18-2017, 11:23 AM
  #78
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Great choice to expose Dano over Copp.

A lot of people believe Dano is going to be the real deal...? Not sure how that's even remotely a possibility. His dedication to his physical fitness is lack luster, came to camp last season really out of shape.

Copp on the other hand, gained muscle mass and explosiveness, his skating was vastly improved. Copp will likely come to camp bigger, stronger and faster this season too. He'll be a guy who can move up and down the line up, play C and wing, pp and pk. And, improve.

Dano is a good player, but he'll never play higher than a 3rd line role due to his lack of dedication to the game and himself

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06-18-2017, 11:25 AM
  #79
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Maybe Vegas would prefer Postma over Dano or Enstrom? UFA but would they rather sign him early rather than wait for the competition on July 1?

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06-18-2017, 11:25 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by HPsauce View Post
Great choice to expose Dano over Copp.

A lot of people believe Dano is going to be the real deal...? Not sure how that's even remotely a possibility. His dedication to his physical fitness is lack luster, came to camp last season really out of shape.

Copp on the other hand, gained muscle mass and explosiveness, his skating was vastly improved. Copp will likely come to camp bigger, stronger and faster this season too. He'll be a guy who can move up and down the line up, play C and wing, pp and pk. And, improve.

Dano is a good player, but he'll never play higher than a 3rd line role due to his lack of dedication to the game and himself
Does send a message to team.

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06-18-2017, 11:26 AM
  #81
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Does send a message to team.
It might mean they are serious about players being dedicated to conditioning

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06-18-2017, 11:27 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Aavco Cup View Post
It might mean they are serious about players being dedicated to conditioning
It could also mean the overvalue their own draft picks. And even though copp or Lowry might not be as good they would rather have them

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06-18-2017, 11:28 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by csk View Post
I don't find this 1st sentence convincing evidence of the 2nd. My evaluation of Copp is as a below average 4th liner with potential to be an above average 4th liner. My evaluation of Dano is as an average middle 6 player with top 6 potential. This is worth being unhappy with.

Just because their are arguments in favour of Copp doesn't mean I find them convincing, or that they're good arguments. It by no means makes it a tie.
I understand that you find your arguments convincing. You must understand that the Copp supporters find their arguments convincing.

I'm saying that situation supports the argument that it is close between the 2. It isn't about how vehement the supporters of each side may be. It is about sentiment being somewhat evenly divided and there being good arguments on each side.

Copp is clearly more versatile than Dano. He can play LW or C. He might be able to manage RW too. He spent time on the 2nd line last year and performed well, so while he might end up a 4th liner with the Jets I'm pretty sure he could be a 3rd liner with many teams.

You aren't arguing that Dano should have been kept over Lowry. Why not? He is clearly a 4th line C with some PP usefulness. Why does he get a free pass over Dano?

The fact is that all of Lowry, Armia, Dano and Copp are fairly close to one another in value. Each has a different set of pros and cons.

How do you know it wasn't decided by Dano being willing to go to Vegas so he signed while Copp was unwilling so did not sign? It would have been quite clear to the agents that the XD was the reason to want to sign them at this time. Maybe Copp's agent advised him to resist signing now.

Of all the things that Chevy has done or not done that we argue about here this has to be the smallest one. Stempniak, Frolik, Pavelec and about a dozen other issues have all been much larger, more significant things than this one.

The important thing here was to accomplish 7+3+1 and Chevy got that done. Well done Chevy! And thanks Toby!

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06-18-2017, 11:29 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by HPsauce View Post
Great choice to expose Dano over Copp.

A lot of people believe Dano is going to be the real deal...? Not sure how that's even remotely a possibility. His dedication to his physical fitness is lack luster, came to camp last season really out of shape.

Copp on the other hand, gained muscle mass and explosiveness, his skating was vastly improved. Copp will likely come to camp bigger, stronger and faster this season too. He'll be a guy who can move up and down the line up, play C and wing, pp and pk. And, improve.

Dano is a good player, but he'll never play higher than a 3rd line role due to his lack of dedication to the game and himself
Agree with everything but the bolded. No one makes the NHL unless they are dedicated to their sport.

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06-18-2017, 11:29 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by D1G View Post
It could also mean the overvalue their own draft picks. And even though copp or Lowry might not be as good they would rather have them
Read up... Clearly means the Jets are more interested in players who are dedicated to the game. Copp and Lowry have that dedication, Dano does not.

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06-18-2017, 11:30 AM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheswick View Post
It's pretty likely Jets exposed Dano over Copp with the agreement Enstrom wouldn't be chosen.

With the signing of Dano is obvious they've reached an understanding with Vegas that that's who's being chosen.
This is my view too. I'm hoping it is a more encompassing deal as well (involving a keeper and a prospect or two).

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Old
06-18-2017, 11:32 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by DashingDane View Post
Agree with everything but the bolded. No one makes the NHL unless they are dedicated to their sport.
Some players have that natural talent, yet don't do much to improve. Dano is one of those players, a good hockey player, with a natural talent. Practices hockey and plays hockey. Yet, doesn't improve as an all around athlete. Dano could be great, he values other things more than improving himself

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06-18-2017, 11:32 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
I understand that you find your arguments convincing. You must understand that the Copp supporters find their arguments convincing.

I'm saying that situation supports the argument that it is close between the 2. It isn't about how vehement the supporters of each side may be. It is about sentiment being somewhat evenly divided and there being good arguments on each side.

Copp is clearly more versatile than Dano. He can play LW or C. He might be able to manage RW too. He spent time on the 2nd line last year and performed well, so while he might end up a 4th liner with the Jets I'm pretty sure he could be a 3rd liner with many teams.

You aren't arguing that Dano should have been kept over Lowry. Why not? He is clearly a 4th line C with some PP usefulness. Why does he get a free pass over Dano?

The fact is that all of Lowry, Armia, Dano and Copp are fairly close to one another in value. Each has a different set of pros and cons.

How do you know it wasn't decided by Dano being willing to go to Vegas so he signed while Copp was unwilling so did not sign? It would have been quite clear to the agents that the XD was the reason to want to sign them at this time. Maybe Copp's agent advised him to resist signing now.

Of all the things that Chevy has done or not done that we argue about here this has to be the smallest one. Stempniak, Frolik, Pavelec and about a dozen other issues have all been much larger, more significant things than this one.

The important thing here was to accomplish 7+3+1 and Chevy got that done. Well done Chevy! And thanks Toby!
a fair and balanced viewpoint imo

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06-18-2017, 11:34 AM
  #89
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I like Dana a lot, but with the forward strength the Jets have it becomes about fit, and there I think he and Copp are closer. Lowry was never going to be exposed, IMO. The Jets are heavily invested in him, and his size and perceived defensive skill set means he's likely got higher value than Dano as a trade chip.

The thing I don't get is the risk of LV taking Enstrom -- who do the Jets play in his place should that happen? What's their endgame here?

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06-18-2017, 11:35 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by HPsauce View Post
Read up... Clearly means the Jets are more interested in players who are dedicated to the game. Copp and Lowry have that dedication, Dano does not.
You know that how? Is there any evidence that Dano showed up out of shape or is it all just supposition Fuelled By Bias?

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06-18-2017, 11:35 AM
  #91
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The angst over Dano is amusing to me. We have so much forward depth prospect wise. Dano is easily replaceable in the lineup with very little drop off.

It was probably never about losing one of Dano or Copp. It was about losing Dano or Enstrom.

If Dano is selected then Chevy did his job

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Old
06-18-2017, 11:35 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by JetsUK View Post
I like Dana a lot, but with the forward strength the Jets have it becomes about fit, and there I think he and Copp are closer. Lowry was never going to be exposed, IMO. The Jets are heavily invested in him, and his size and perceived defensive skill set means he's likely got higher value than Dano as a trade chip.

The thing I don't get is the risk of LV taking Enstrom -- who do the Jets play in his place should that happen? What's their endgame here?
Don't think this happens but then they start:
Jmo trouba
Myers buff
Chiarot poolman
Stuart

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Old
06-18-2017, 11:37 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by D1G View Post
It could also mean the overvalue their own draft picks. And even though copp or Lowry might not be as good they would rather have them
I saw Dano do the beep test last TC. He was among the worst performers.

Copp on the other hand was outstanding and the only player to get close to Scheifele.

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06-18-2017, 11:38 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by JetsUK View Post
I like Dana a lot, but with the forward strength the Jets have it becomes about fit, and there I think he and Copp are closer. Lowry was never going to be exposed, IMO. The Jets are heavily invested in him, and his size and perceived defensive skill set means he's likely got higher value than Dano as a trade chip.

The thing I don't get is the risk of LV taking Enstrom -- who do the Jets play in his place should that happen? What's their endgame here?
No doubt that we are royally screwed if LV picks Enstrom.

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Old
06-18-2017, 11:44 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by cheswick View Post
It's pretty likely Jets exposed Dano over Copp with the agreement Enstrom wouldn't be chosen.

With the signing of Dano is obvious they've reached an understanding with Vegas that that's who's being chosen.
It isn't obvious at all. That is one of several possibilities. They may never have discussed this scenario with Vegas.

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06-18-2017, 11:48 AM
  #96
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If I am McPhee, I am pursuing Enstrom here and trying to determine if an extension is possible. Although; my personal feeling is that he will not be playing in the NHL after next season.

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Old
06-18-2017, 11:50 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Dayofthedogs View Post
Think Dano probably has the highest offensive ceiling out of the Lowry/Armia/Copp/Dano group.

Prefer protecting Lowry/Armia for their defensive acumen and Lowry being a C.

Okay with Protecting Copp over Dano to give Trouba extra incentive to stick around.

Truthfully I see Armia and Lowry as 2 pieces to a very good 4th line and I think right now that's harder to replace than a top 9 winger like Dano is.

As has been mentioned our winger depth for the top 9 is pretty stellar.

Wheeler
Ehlers
MP
Laine
Connor
Armia
Petan
Spacek
Lemieux

This is an acceptable and probably preferable loss in my opinion.
Agree with the bold.

Without assigning line numbers Armia and Lowry have very good defensive play that Dano can't match.

Copp doesn't have Dano's offensive potential. He might be able to reach Lowry's defensive level. He is more versatile than Dano. I think it comes down to which attributes Jets need most.

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06-18-2017, 11:51 AM
  #98
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I love Daňo's game, and I think lots of teams will lose much less valuable pieces, even without paying extra, but I don't mind them protecting Copp over him.

I'd protect Trouba's dog over Armia, if that was an option.

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06-18-2017, 11:52 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
Agree with the bold.

Without assigning line numbers Armia and Lowry have very good defensive play that Dano can't match.

Copp doesn't have Dano's offensive potential. He might be able to reach Lowry's defensive level. He is more versatile than Dano. I think it comes down to which attributes Jets need most.
Agree. I think it comes down to PK vs. non PK.

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06-18-2017, 11:54 AM
  #100
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It looks like there will be some interesting players available to Vegas. I'm not sure why the Islanders would protect Pelech over de Haan, anybody have any insight about that?

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