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Jets General Rumour, Trade, Free Agent and Waiver Speculation 17-18 Part XVIX

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Old
07-15-2017, 06:42 PM
  #751
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Originally Posted by 10Ducky10 View Post
Little's last 4 season's points totals starting with last year...

47
42
52
64

4 x 5m is what I would offer.
he is getting 6 years on the open market for sure. chevy is well aware of this. what would st. louis montreal and the rangers to name a few pay for little. the bidding will likely start at 6 years for chevy.


Last edited by ffh: 07-15-2017 at 06:51 PM.
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Old
07-15-2017, 06:43 PM
  #752
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Originally Posted by 10Ducky10 View Post
Little's last 4 season's points totals starting with last year...

47
42
52
64

4 x 5m is what I would offer.
Did you really omit games played
21 goals in 59 games last year, ya he sucks!

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07-15-2017, 06:49 PM
  #753
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Honestly....I would hope that we coukd retain him for a 6yr/5.5-75 AAV...but it could be six or so.

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07-15-2017, 07:16 PM
  #754
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If the Jets are serious about making a run with this group I think they need to re-sign him. Yes giving term to a 30 year old player hurts but that's the price of winning in the NHL

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07-15-2017, 11:13 PM
  #755
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Originally Posted by mcpw View Post
FAgeP/82TermAAV
Ryan2860.377.250
Krejci2966.067.250
Stastny2860.347.000
Kesler3149.566.875
Radulov3058.366.250
Marchand2962.386.125
Lucic2852.776.000
Okposo2866.176.000
Eriksson3053.166.000
Backes3254.956.000
Dubinsky2950.065.850
Callahan2956.365.800
Oshie3060.985.750
Steen3365.945.750
Ladd3059.875.500
Nielsen3252.065.250
Hanzal3049.834.750
Little3062.7

P/82 is last 4 seasons before signing the contract/extension
Age is when contract comes into effect

Market seems to suggest that 6 years, 6 million could already be the discounted contract.
Something between Stastny (28yo; 4x7.0m) and Steen (33yo; 4x5.75m) on a four year extension would be optimal. Maybe a bit of a hometown discount and come in around 6.25m?

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07-16-2017, 12:36 AM
  #756
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should the jets sign hudler?

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07-16-2017, 02:53 AM
  #757
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he is getting 6 years on the open market for sure. chevy is well aware of this. what would st. louis montreal and the rangers to name a few pay for little. the bidding will likely start at 6 years for chevy.
Except he isn't on the open market...if we are paying in excess of 5.5m for over 4 years, there will be no money to re-sign Wheeler.

Why would I post his ppg? It was already posted to show the stats in the favor of that argument. I posted what he actually scored not what he would have scored "if".

I wouldn't give him much more than 5m over 4 years.


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07-16-2017, 03:07 AM
  #758
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Palat is 4 years yonger and had
52
40
53
69
over the last 4 years and he signed for 5.3m x 5...
I am not worried about how much Chevy will give him because I know he won't give him much more than 5m...I am worried he gets more than 5 years...4 would be ideal.

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07-16-2017, 05:34 AM
  #759
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Originally Posted by 10Ducky10 View Post
Except he isn't on the open market...if we are paying in excess of 5.5m for over 4 years, there will be no money to re-sign Wheeler.

Why would I post his ppg? It was already posted to show the stats in the favor of that argument. I posted what he actually scored not what he would have scored "if".

I wouldn't give him much more than 5m over 4 years.
other then insult little beyond belief I have no idea what 5x4 does for him when he knows he is getting 6x5.5 in less then a year on the open market by almost every team in the league. and you better believe he is negotiating like he is on the open market because this contract starts on july 1st next year when he will be on the open market. you don't think the islanders are negotiating with tavares like he is on the open market right now. 6 or 7x 5.5 is a bargain for little.

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07-16-2017, 10:05 AM
  #760
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If the Jets are serious about making a run with this group I think they need to re-sign him. Yes giving term to a 30 year old player hurts but that's the price of winning in the NHL
Umm, but what if it isn't? What if the days of overpaying aging UFA's are coming to an end, and everyone shifts to amassing more twenty-something talent through offer sheets? Just throwing that out there for consideration.

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07-16-2017, 03:32 PM
  #761
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Umm, but what if it isn't? What if the days of overpaying aging UFA's are coming to an end, and everyone shifts to amassing more twenty-something talent through offer sheets? Just throwing that out there for consideration.
The question to ask here is- do you ever see the Jets participating in offer sheet shenanigans? I don't. My comment is more about the fact Little is not really replacable, is one of the best C playing on the 2nd line in the NHL. Having him and Scheifele gives the Jets one of the best 1-2 punches down the middle in the league (only Pens and Oilers are clearly better, Ducks and Leafs are close) and C depth helps you win cups. Last year was a bit of a down year for Little in terms of his two way play but I willing to chalk that up as an abberation, if the Jets want to make a run with this group in the next few years they need someone who can help then now like Little.

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07-16-2017, 04:00 PM
  #762
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Originally Posted by JetsFan815 View Post
The question to ask here is- do you ever see the Jets participating in offer sheet shenanigans? I don't. My comment is more about the fact Little is not really replacable, is one of the best C playing on the 2nd line in the NHL. Having him and Scheifele gives the Jets one of the best 1-2 punches down the middle in the league (only Pens and Oilers are clearly better, Ducks and Leafs are close) and C depth helps you win cups. Last year was a bit of a down year for Little in terms of his two way play but I willing to chalk that up as an abberation, if the Jets want to make a run with this group in the next few years they need someone who can help then now like Little.
They might not have a choice if that becomes the norm. Like we prairie folk say, if you don't shift with the pair o' dimes you won't be worth a plug nickel.

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07-16-2017, 04:02 PM
  #763
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other then insult little beyond belief I have no idea what 5x4 does for him when he knows he is getting 6x5.5 in less then a year on the open market by almost every team in the league. and you better believe he is negotiating like he is on the open market because this contract starts on july 1st next year when he will be on the open market. you don't think the islanders are negotiating with tavares like he is on the open market right now. 6 or 7x 5.5 is a bargain for little.
I think a lot depends on what Little is looking for. I doubt discussions start with an "insulting" offer from out of the blue. More likely Chevy and Little's camp talk about fit and the future and then gradually come together on money and term. Little may have no intention of going the UFA route if he likes where he is and merely negotiate something fair that doesn't tie Chevy's hands. If he has invested well he probably already has more money than he can spend in a life time.

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07-16-2017, 04:12 PM
  #764
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I think a lot depends on what Little is looking for. I doubt discussions start with an "insulting" offer from out of the blue. More likely Chevy and Little's camp talk about fit and the future and then gradually come together on money and term. Little may have no intention of going the UFA route if he likes where he is and merely negotiate something fair that doesn't tie Chevy's hands. If he has invested well he probably already has more money than he can spend in a life time.
I see them working through the negotiations professionally but also in good order. Ladd wanted to be overpaid and waited until someone stepped up. I just don't sense the Little deal will go the same way. I think Ladd was fine to move on whereas I think Little wants to see this thing through. Once we won the lottery and added Laine to the mix I think things got a bit real.

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07-16-2017, 07:00 PM
  #765
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None of them started in roles they were so completely unsuited for. None of them exceled in roles they were unsuited for prior to being put in roles they were suited for. Armia was not particularly suited for any role. He was an offensive player who wasn't quite good enough for a purely offensive role. He has learned to excel in a checking role. All credit to him. You don't expect every player to do that. Why on earth would you?...
I just don't think we will see eye to eye when it comes to Petan. What I will say, Mort is that I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. I feel like you aren't one to get so entrenched in your opinion that you just let your bias overrule logical thought. I also like that you actually consider the others argument instead of just glancing over it and continuing to push your own POV. It's fun debating with someone where you both feel like you can persuade them with solid points, and also learn something from their counters.

Time will tell with Petan. I've just seen a lot of 'Petan's' come and go.

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07-16-2017, 07:24 PM
  #766
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no one is interested in hudler? he can play on lw or rw

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07-16-2017, 07:35 PM
  #767
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I just don't think we will see eye to eye when it comes to Petan. What I will say, Mort is that I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. I feel like you aren't one to get so entrenched in your opinion that you just let your bias overrule logical thought. I also like that you actually consider the others argument instead of just glancing over it and continuing to push your own POV. It's fun debating with someone where you both feel like you can persuade them with solid points, and also learn something from their counters.

Time will tell with Petan. I've just seen a lot of 'Petan's' come and go.
I remember getting torched pretty good back in Nic's third and fourth WHL years. I brought up the fact that I didn't see a lot of growth in his game and I was concerned that he hovered a lot waiting for things to happen as opposed to making things happen himself. I never doubted his passing ability but would have liked to see a little more (tanev like) tenacity and urgency to his game
I really hope Nic finds a way to succeed at this level. There's no doubt that he has some incredible skills. I certainly wouldn't mind if he was given a full year with the Moose with talented players beside him.
Certainly don't want to see him in the press box every night.


Last edited by Mud Turtle: 07-16-2017 at 07:41 PM.
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Old
07-16-2017, 10:05 PM
  #768
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no one is interested in hudler? he can play on lw or rw
Seems like he is on a sharp decline. What interests you about him?

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07-17-2017, 05:25 AM
  #769
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I just don't think we will see eye to eye when it comes to Petan. What I will say, Mort is that I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. I feel like you aren't one to get so entrenched in your opinion that you just let your bias overrule logical thought. I also like that you actually consider the others argument instead of just glancing over it and continuing to push your own POV. It's fun debating with someone where you both feel like you can persuade them with solid points, and also learn something from their counters.

Time will tell with Petan. I've just seen a lot of 'Petan's' come and go.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mud Turtle View Post
I remember getting torched pretty good back in Nic's third and fourth WHL years. I brought up the fact that I didn't see a lot of growth in his game and I was concerned that he hovered a lot waiting for things to happen as opposed to making things happen himself. I never doubted his passing ability but would have liked to see a little more (tanev like) tenacity and urgency to his game
I really hope Nic finds a way to succeed at this level. There's no doubt that he has some incredible skills. I certainly wouldn't mind if he was given a full year with the Moose with talented players beside him.
Certainly don't want to see him in the press box every night.
I thought Nic was at his best late in the 2015-16 season down the stretch when they played him with Dano and Copp (I think that was the line) and he put up good numbers over about a 10 game sample size. Thorburn is now gone and he single handedly destroyed Nic (great usage Paul?) so I will quit making excuses for a Nic now. I like his game but admit it's put up or shut up time for him. I think he could be odd man out early on but there are always injuries and he REALLY needs to establish himself this season or I think he may be done in Winnipeg

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07-17-2017, 06:17 AM
  #770
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I thought Nic was at his best late in the 2015-16 season down the stretch when they played him with Dano and Copp (I think that was the line) and he put up good numbers over about a 10 game sample size. Thorburn is now gone and he single handedly destroyed Nic (great usage Paul?) so I will quit making excuses for a Nic now. I like his game but admit it's put up or shut up time for him. I think he could be odd man out early on but there are always injuries and he REALLY needs to establish himself this season or I think he may be done in Winnipeg
Boy that's laying a lot on Thorburn. Ehlers survived his time with Thor just fine. Don't buy the destroying a player unless you are putting them in above their head for an extended period of time and start messing with their head. IMO it is time for Petan to adapt to an NHL role. We saw Armia do it last year. But agree that this is very likely Petan's last season to find his spot.

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07-17-2017, 06:42 AM
  #771
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You have to let Little walk.
We are so deep in young centres who will be getting paid pennies and are cap friendly. In a cap league, this is how you have to run a team. A mix of stars and young blood. Little is great but you choose Scheifele, Wheeler, Laine, Ehlers over him. At centre, you look at Copp, Appleton, Roslovic, Lowry, Petan.

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07-17-2017, 06:52 AM
  #772
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You have to let Little walk.
We are so deep in young centres who will be getting paid pennies and are cap friendly. In a cap league, this is how you have to run a team. A mix of stars and young blood. Little is great but you choose Scheifele, Wheeler, Laine, Ehlers over him. At centre, you look at Copp, Appleton, Roslovic, Lowry, Petan.
back to the drawing board. little isn't going anywhere, 2nd line centres that can score over 50 points don't grow on trees. and you don't trade players and hope someone can replace them who haven't proven they could score even half as much so far in there careers or even made it to the nhl.


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07-17-2017, 07:01 AM
  #773
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At centre, you look at Copp, Appleton, Roslovic, Lowry, Petan.
At center, you look at Copp, Appleton, Roslovic, Lowry, Petan, and compare them to Kesler/Krejci/Backlund/Carter/Dubinsky/T.Johnson/E.Staal/Malkin/Spezza/Anisimov and many other 2Cs around the league, and inevitably come to the conclusion that, if we want to win something, we better find a guy who has scored 30 points once in his career.

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07-17-2017, 08:30 AM
  #774
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I just don't think we will see eye to eye when it comes to Petan. What I will say, Mort is that I have a lot of respect for you as a poster. I feel like you aren't one to get so entrenched in your opinion that you just let your bias overrule logical thought. I also like that you actually consider the others argument instead of just glancing over it and continuing to push your own POV. It's fun debating with someone where you both feel like you can persuade them with solid points, and also learn something from their counters.

Time will tell with Petan. I've just seen a lot of 'Petan's' come and go.
I agree with the bold. I know what you mean about having seen a lot come and go. Me too. There are always those that just never quite seem able to fulfill the potential we see. At some point we just have to accept it and move on. Petan may well be one of those.

I just hate to see it happen when a player has been set up to fail. I've seen that happen many times too. I don't understand the reluctance to put him in a position to succeed and see what he can do. If nothing else it might create some trade market value for him. Last year, being a development year was the time to have done that. I expect him to start this year with the Moose.

Not trying to argue on here. I can agree to disagree. Cheers

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07-17-2017, 09:00 AM
  #775
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Boy that's laying a lot on Thorburn. Ehlers survived his time with Thor just fine. Don't buy the destroying a player unless you are putting them in above their head for an extended period of time and start messing with their head. IMO it is time for Petan to adapt to an NHL role. We saw Armia do it last year. But agree that this is very likely Petan's last season to find his spot.

To the first bolded Ehlers didn't survive his time with Thor it sucked the life out of his production and he needed to be moved away from Thor to get back on his game and Ehlers is a much better player than Nic at creating his own offense. Petan suffered a similar fate but never seemed to leave the hotel California for more than a day pass. To your second bolded I agree and as I mentioned in my post that can't be used as an excuse this year and Nic has to put up or shut up now if he even gets a shot? The problem is the forward slots are now really crowded and other more talented young players like Connor and Jack R are going to need spots so its a numbers game now and I am not sure Nic will survive it? He is one of the few prospects we have where I can clearly visualize both paths for him. I already saw how productive he could be in the NHL and I could see that again if he was on a talented 3a type line......and I have no problem visualizing him being sent back to the Moose and becoming a career AHL PPG player that came close but never quite made it.


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