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Old
07-13-2017, 06:03 PM
  #101
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What I will say about Corsi is that last summer it was the number 1 topic on this board. Everything was Corsi. PK is great look at Corsi. MT sucks look at Corsi. Habs can never win a cup look at Corsi.

Since habs have become one of the better Corsi teams it seems to have completely dropped off as a topic of discussion. Its barely even mentioned at all. Its interesting because Corsi was revered around here.

Bold prediction if habs bottom out on Corsi this season you will see tons of post about Corsi. If habs are at the top (which most CJ teams are) you will not see anyone mention Corsi.
This is a great point

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07-13-2017, 06:06 PM
  #102
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I'm Alzner should go with Petry, and somebody else should go with Weber.

Can Schlemko carry the puck?
Yes they need to find a left handed d-man to play with Weber and a center,someone like Brady Skjei from the Rangers they also have an RFA center with Zibanejad,they need to trade Pacioretty and other pieces Rangers also need a goalie prospect like Lindgren.

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:08 PM
  #103
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This is where I stop discussing with you. Losing to Boston was heart breaking. I was very upset that night. With Subban tying game 7 in the dying seconds, I thought the Habs had all the momentum. This was an amazing back and forth series.

You are comparing Boston in 10-11 to the Rangers in 16-17? Well if that wasn't your intention, you did. Boston went on to win the Cup, Rangers were stifled by the Sens in 6 games, where the MVP of the previous series, didn't even look Lundqvist good, he looked down right bad in half of those games.

If you think for a second that this team was their regular season record... you are just pushing your silly division title argument.

Even worse, you think Max Pacioretty, a player on fire before his injury, would have had no effect on this series? He played the Bruins so well that year, 4g and 6pts in 3 games against them.

You refuse to see what actually happened with the Habs team and insert your own "standings" narrative. Worst of all you value these standings in thinking that MB is doing a good job, progress right? Well the players on this roster aren't progressing, regardless of the standings.

Keep paying homage to the standings, I will actually watch the hockey games and see why the team is performing well or struggling.
not including the fact 100 points is meaningless in a 3 or sometimes 2 point/game system. Does anyone have the stats on total OT compared to 10 years ago. I am betting it is at least 20% higher meaning 20% extra OT points. Yes Dorothy, you can get to 100 point seasons and not be as good as those pre 2004 teams. 100 points in a salary capped 3 point OT system is nothing. It is meaningless. There is parody across the league(with a few failures that look the part) but compare that vs 20 years ago.
https://www.hockey-reference.com/leagues/NHL_1996.html


Eastern Conference

Playoff teams are marked with an asterisk (*)

GP W L T PTS PTS% GF GA SRS SOS
Atlantic Division
Philadelphia Flyers* 82 45 24 13 103 .628 282 208 0.88 -0.03
New York Rangers* 82 41 27 14 96 .585 272 237 0.43 0.00
Florida Panthers* 82 41 31 10 92 .561 254 234 0.27 0.02
Washington Capitals* 82 39 32 11 89 .543 234 204 0.38 0.02
Tampa Bay Lightning* 82 38 32 12 88 .537 238 248 -0.07 0.05
New Jersey Devils 82 37 33 12 86 .524 215 202 0.20 0.04
New York Islanders 82 22 50 10 54 .329 229 315 -0.94 0.11
Northeast Division
Pittsburgh Penguins* 82 49 29 4 102 .622 362 284 0.90 -0.05
Boston Bruins* 82 40 31 11 91 .555 282 269 0.17 0.01
Montreal Canadiens* 82 40 32 10 90 .549 265 248 0.20 -0.01
Hartford Whalers 82 34 39 9 77 .470 237 259 -0.22 0.05
Buffalo Sabres 82 33 42 7 73 .445 247 262 -0.16 0.03
Ottawa Senators 82 18 59 5 41 .250 191 291 -1.12 0.10
Western Conference

Playoff teams are marked with an asterisk (*)

GP W L T PTS PTS% GF GA SRS SOS
Central Division
Detroit Red Wings* 82 62 13 7 131 .799 325 181 1.64 -0.11
Chicago Blackhawks* 82 40 28 14 94 .573 273 220 0.61 -0.04
Toronto Maple Leafs* 82 34 36 12 80 .488 247 252 -0.07 0.00
St. Louis Blues* 82 32 34 16 80 .488 219 248 -0.35 0.00
Winnipeg Jets* 82 36 40 6 78 .476 275 291 -0.18 0.02
Dallas Stars 82 26 42 14 66 .402 227 280 -0.60 0.05
Pacific Division
Colorado Avalanche* 82 47 25 10 104 .634 326 240 0.93 -0.12
Calgary Flames* 82 34 37 11 79 .482 241 240 -0.04 -0.05
Vancouver Canucks* 82 32 35 15 79 .482 278 278 -0.05 -0.05
Mighty Ducks of Anaheim 82 35 39 8 78 .476 234 247 -0.19 -0.03
Edmonton Oilers 82 30 44 8 68 .415 240 304 -0.78 0.00
Los Angeles Kings 82 24 40 18 66 .402 256 302 -0.59 -0.03
San Jose Sharks 82 20 55 7 47 .287 252 357 -1.25 0.03

Red wings 131 points, Sens 41 points, Leafs, Blues, Jets, flames and canucks make the playoffs with less than .500 teams 80 or less points. 100 points in todays NHL =/= to NHL past.

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07-13-2017, 06:08 PM
  #104
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Thanks for the link.

If I'm reading it correctly, Mtl was the 3rd best possession team in the league last year, in terms of judging my corsi..?
They were a strong shot differential team in terms of placement in the league, but not all that strong relative to the league average. A few years back if you were a top 5 shot differential team you were running at least 3% points above league average and had a much bigger advantage than the one Montreal had this season.

Basically there aren't any puck possession powerhouse teams like there used to be. The top half of the league used to have a 5% spread from elite to average, now its more like 2.5%. This has helped teams like Washington and Pittsburgh, who are good but not great at puck possesion but have elite finishers and goaltenders to go with it to thrive. Meanwhile a team like Nashville with a pretty weak center line compared to the old dominant 5 on 5 clubs is one of the best possesion clubs in the West. Puck possession skill is at a high level of parity now, so a team like Montreal can be ranked 3rd in corsi% without having the huge tangible advantage over teams ranked 10th or 15th that used to entail.

Structurally, the Habs do have a finishing problem lacking both great playmakers and most of their best goal scorers being volume rather than quality shooters (Gallagher and Pacioretty in particular), but they are still are reasonably good 5 on 5 offensive team based on ability to produce pressure (mainly when Petry and/Markov are on the ice). Their biggest offensive weakness is a godawful powerplay that doesn't do anything but pass to Weber to shoot. The other big worry right now is that everyone who played in the top 4 cratered in performance without Markov who is both unsigned and ancient.

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:10 PM
  #105
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You don't walk into the pens because they are a well built team already. Thats the point, this is about the best any rookie manager can get, lou REBUILT toronto, not like he was getting what we had.
Didn't Rutherford walk into the Pens 2 years ago (or was that Shero always get em mixed up)? Lou walked into a TOR team that was amassing top 5/10 picks for years and managed to land a number 1 pick. Same thing with PC in EDM. So walking onto a contending team like WASH/PENS or a Bottom feeder like TOR/EDM is a better situation than walking onto a middle of the pack team with few high picks and bad contracts.

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What do you call getting 3rd overall pick? Besides I don't get it, you keep saying the team he inherited sucked, if they sucked so bad how come they didn't have better draft picks(oh right blame goat, gainey, savard, houle) 6 YEARS now and he is worse than what he started with. If we sucked so bad back then how come the team is worse now then in 2013? Your defence of MB is like a black hole collapsing in upon itself.
Jesus I am not even defending MB. I keep saying in my posts I am not talking about how much credit MB should or shouldn't get.

Before MB came on board the habs were a bottom half team that struggled to make the playoffs. Thats worse then being a bottom feeder because you don't get high picks. And worse then being a top contender because you don't have those superstar players.

Are you seriously trying to say that from 09-11, the habs team lead by guys like Gomez/Cammy/Gio/Spacek/Gill etc... were contenders and a great team that had a bright future? Really? I am not talking about MB improving this team or not. The team he came onto was not a good team, was lead by small/weak players and had bad contracts. MB got lucky with the lockout + buyouts + Price/PK/Max maturing at the same time. But he didn't walk into a Pens or Washington with a team that was considered a contender or a step or 2 away from the cup.

I bet if you were posting back then in 09/10/11 you probably thought the hab sucked and were going nowhere. Lets not forget this was a team that was being lead at Center by Scott Gomez!

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:11 PM
  #106
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What I will say about Corsi is that last summer it was the number 1 topic on this board. Everything was Corsi. PK is great look at Corsi. MT sucks look at Corsi. Habs can never win a cup look at Corsi.

Since habs have become one of the better Corsi teams it seems to have completely dropped off as a topic of discussion. Its barely even mentioned at all. Its interesting because Corsi was revered around here.

Bold prediction if habs bottom out on Corsi this season you will see tons of post about Corsi. If habs are at the top (which most CJ teams are) you will not see anyone mention Corsi.
Peoples will talk more about ongoing issues than non-issue? Bold prediction indeed.

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:14 PM
  #107
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Revisionism at its finest, you do know in 2009-2010 GOMEZ as our 2nd line center had 59 points. 2nd on the team after Pleks with 70 points. So if that team sucked what does it say about our number 1C being a 40 point center? our 2nd C with 28 points??? Yep SOOOOO much better this amazing team that MB has constructed.
"If you want to attribute the team turning around because Price/Max/PK got older so be it. If its just because Markov was finally heatlhty so be it. But before MB came on board those conditions didn't exsist and the team was bad. "

I am not debating MB here I even said you can attribute the turn around not to MB.

Its more like the MB haters are so entrenched that they can't even recognize the reality that the habs from 09-11 were not a good team, one that struggled to make the playoffs.

This is hilariouse that all of a sudden the 09-11 is some golden age of Habdom where the habs could be uttered as true contenders and were oh so close to getting a cup.

If you think the team is bad now, then there is no way you can honestly say the 09-11 teams were any good. Objectively and subjectively those teams were just flat out worse. MB being an idiot or a genius, the best GM or the worst GM will not change the fact that from 09-11 the habs were not a good team, did not have a good roster and no one seriously thought they were heading in the right direction. The only positives from that era are Max/PK/Price which probably gave the fans a glimmer of hope.

If I said MB sucks and is the worst GM in hockey would that make you tell the truth and finally admit that the habs weren't very good during that time frame?

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:19 PM
  #108
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Not really. Montreal's xGF was middle of the pack and so was their GF. And talent to shoot, deflect, tip, or bang the puck past the goalie wasn't the big problem. It was creating separation and/or confusion from defenders and forcing opposing goalies into uncomfortable positions. They were short on playmakers. They still are too.
I agree we're in desperate need of playmakers to create those high-danger setups, which is exactly why we're obsessing over centers... or at least wingers who can play like centers. But lots of goals are still scored from close up and around the crease, which depend on shooting skill and stick control. Small sample size, I admit, but the NYR didn't outplay us, they scored most of its goals thanks to better shots from guys like Zuccarello and Nash.

It's not an either-or question, obviously, because both are complementary skill sets. The greatest systems and setups fail if nobody can shoot straight. And vice-versa, naturally.

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The bolded is a good point. The habs were not good at finishing the chances they got. They also were not particularly good at getting them either. 20th in SCF60, 12th in HDCF60. But they were absolutely brutal at finishing whatever few chances they could get.

25th in HDSH%, and 14th in SCSH%.
Ironic that even while the possession stats have improved, the actual GF has remained mediocre, and worse in the playoffs. It's like highway driving in a Porsche with bicycle tires.

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07-13-2017, 06:19 PM
  #109
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Didn't Rutherford walk into the Pens 2 years ago (or was that Shero always get em mixed up)? Lou walked into a TOR team that was amassing top 5/10 picks for years and managed to land a number 1 pick. Same thing with PC in EDM. So walking onto a contending team like WASH/PENS or a Bottom feeder like TOR/EDM is a better situation than walking onto a middle of the pack team with few high picks and bad contracts.



Jesus I am not even defending MB. I keep saying in my posts I am not talking about how much credit MB should or shouldn't get.

Before MB came on board the habs were a bottom half team that struggled to make the playoffs. Thats worse then being a bottom feeder because you don't get high picks. And worse then being a top contender because you don't have those superstar players.

Are you seriously trying to say that from 09-11, the habs team lead by guys like Gomez/Cammy/Gio/Spacek/Gill etc... were contenders and a great team that had a bright future? Really? I am not talking about MB improving this team or not. The team he came onto was not a good team, was lead by small/weak players and had bad contracts. MB got lucky with the lockout + buyouts + Price/PK/Max maturing at the same time. But he didn't walk into a Pens or Washington with a team that was considered a contender or a step or 2 away from the cup.

I bet if you were posting back then in 09/10/11 you probably thought the hab sucked and were going nowhere. Lets not forget this was a team that was being lead at Center by Scott Gomez!
I even said Gomez had 59 points as a second line center. Yes many of us thought we could go places with THAT team. Hell some of us were likely dilusional. Halak looked like a world beater. And if we were wrong, how wrong are people now about a team with a 2nd C that had 28 points and a first C with 40 points.

Do you get why this team looks horrid. Even if we agree with hindsight that the 2010 team wasn't that great(with hindsight remember) it is still night and day better than our current roster, so what does that say about NOW. Is it any wonder many of us hate the way this team is built. If we know we were wrong about our optimism back then, how are we suppose to be optimistic with this dumpster fire?

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07-13-2017, 06:20 PM
  #110
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This is where I stop discussing with you. Losing to Boston was heart breaking. I was very upset that night. With Subban tying game 7 in the dying seconds, I thought the Habs had all the momentum. This was an amazing back and forth series.

You are comparing Boston in 10-11 to the Rangers in 16-17? Well if that wasn't your intention, you did. Boston went on to win the Cup, Rangers were stifled by the Sens in 6 games, where the MVP of the previous series, didn't even look Lundqvist good, he looked down right bad in half of those games.

If you think for a second that this team was their regular season record... you are just pushing your silly division title argument.

Even worse, you think Max Pacioretty, a player on fire before his injury, would have had no effect on this series? He played the Bruins so well that year, 4g and 6pts in 3 games against them.

You refuse to see what actually happened with the Habs team and insert your own "standings" narrative. Worst of all you value these standings in thinking that MB is doing a good job, progress right? Well the players on this roster aren't progressing, regardless of the standings.

Keep paying homage to the standings, I will actually watch the hockey games and see why the team is performing well or struggling.
We can go our seperate ways but I am very surprised that you are sticking to your narrative. You are very analytical usually but I find it shocking that you still think that the team from 09-11 was a strong team headed in the right direction.

They had 3 good young pieces that gave us all hope, but the rest of the team was not very good. Barely a playoff team. Big deal they lost in 7 to Boston. Habs lost in 6 to TB that made a cup final and in 6 to the Rags that made a cup final as well (2014) does that mean that those teams MB built were super awesome too?

Maybe this team is getting worse and maybe you are right. And Maybe MB is a bad GM doing a bad job. Even if all that is true it won't change my opionion on this team from 09-11. There record was reflective of the roster. Building a team around Gomez/Gio/Cammy/Spacek/Gill is not building a contender. Even if the habs aren't better now and haven't progressed it doesn't retroactively make those teams better. I mean the Gainey teams before he let everyone go to UFA were better than those 09-11 teams! 09-11 was a bad period. Traded away a ton of picks and the drafting sucked. The roster sucked with bad UFA signings. Bad trades. Bad results. The only good thing to come out of that period was an ECF run +PRICE+MAX+PK.

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07-13-2017, 06:29 PM
  #111
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The 2011 Habs would crush the 2017 Habs in a playoff series.

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07-13-2017, 06:30 PM
  #112
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I even said Gomez had 59 points as a second line center. Yes many of us thought we could go places with THAT team. Hell some of us were likely dilusional. Halak looked like a world beater. And if we were wrong, how wrong are people now about a team with a 2nd C that had 28 points and a first C with 40 points.

Do you get why this team looks horrid. Even if we agree with hindsight that the 2010 team wasn't that great(with hindsight remember) it is still night and day better than our current roster, so what does that say about NOW. Is it any wonder many of us hate the way this team is built. If we know we were wrong about our optimism back then, how are we suppose to be optimistic with this dumpster fire?
Well I am not really trying to tell anyone to be optimistic now. If you think this team sucks today I am not going to debate that with you. How the team is today does not make it better or worse the 3/4/5 years before MB took over.

So with hindsight we can see a team lead by Gomez/Gio/Cammy/Halak/Gill/Spacek was going nowhere. Maybe some were fooled but today we can realize that it was a dead end.

If todays team is a dead end so be it. I wonder if in a few years posters are going to argue how great the habs were from 13-17 and how amazing they were like some are trying to argue the 09-11 teams were.

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07-13-2017, 06:32 PM
  #113
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The 2011 Habs would crush the 2017 Habs in a playoff series.
Easily.

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07-13-2017, 06:33 PM
  #114
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Well I am not really trying to tell anyone to be optimistic now. If you think this team sucks today I am not going to debate that with you. How the team is today does not make it better or worse the 3/4/5 years before MB took over.

So with hindsight we can see a team lead by Gomez/Gio/Cammy/Halak/Gill/Spacek was going nowhere. Maybe some were fooled but today we can realize that it was a dead end.

If todays team is a dead end so be it. I wonder if in a few years posters are going to argue how great the habs were from 13-17 and how amazing they were like some are trying to argue the 09-11 teams were.
Not a few years from now but today.

Bergevin inherited a great situation and failed to top it up properly.

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07-13-2017, 06:37 PM
  #115
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We can go our seperate ways but I am very surprised that you are sticking to your narrative. You are very analytical usually but I find it shocking that you still think that the team from 09-11 was a strong team headed in the right direction.

They had 3 good young pieces that gave us all hope, but the rest of the team was not very good. Barely a playoff team. Big deal they lost in 7 to Boston. Habs lost in 6 to TB that made a cup final and in 6 to the Rags that made a cup final as well (2014) does that mean that those teams MB built were super awesome too?

Maybe this team is getting worse and maybe you are right. And Maybe MB is a bad GM doing a bad job. Even if all that is true it won't change my opionion on this team from 09-11. There record was reflective of the roster. Building a team around Gomez/Gio/Cammy/Spacek/Gill is not building a contender. Even if the habs aren't better now and haven't progressed it doesn't retroactively make those teams better. I mean the Gainey teams before he let everyone go to UFA were better than those 09-11 teams! 09-11 was a bad period. Traded away a ton of picks and the drafting sucked. The roster sucked with bad UFA signings. Bad trades. Bad results. The only good thing to come out of that period was an ECF run +PRICE+MAX+PK.
I have no idea where you are coming from with this.

09-10 Forwards:
Plekanec - 27th among forwards in points, 47th in goals
Gomez - 55th among forwards
Cammalleri - 44th in goals (65 games)
Gionta - 31st in goals (61 games)
Pouliot - 24 pts in 36 games
Kostitsyn - 33 pts in 59 games

That's a decent top6. It did better than the top6 we had this year:

16-17 Forwards:
Pacioretty - 23rd among forwards in points, 8th in goals
Radulov - 63rd among forwards in points
Byron - 69th in goals
Galchenyuk - 54th in PPG

So I clearly have no idea where the facts are that the Habs teams from 09-11 are worse than they have been over the last 5 years. As Gomez faded, DD stood up and replaced his points for a few years. With Cammalleri traded, Pacioretty stepped up. Looks like the Habs this year won the division in spite of their terrible top6. Yet you want to argue standings matter...


Last edited by CrAzYNiNe: 07-13-2017 at 06:51 PM.
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07-13-2017, 06:40 PM
  #116
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Ironic that even while the possession stats have improved, the actual GF has remained mediocre, and worse in the playoffs. It's like highway driving in a Porsche with bicycle tires.
Nah, the area where we really improved in the last 2 years corsi wise is Shot suppression. The Habs CF improve from year-to-year, but its not as drastic as the decrease in CA.

YearCFCACF60CA60CF%
2012-13*2114133158.051.752.9
2013-143368384252.960.446.7
2014-153544376254.157.448.5
2015-163696347856.653.351.5
2016-173941356058.853.152.5

*:48 games

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07-13-2017, 06:40 PM
  #117
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Spot on and nailed it.

Narrative. It changes when reality does.
pshaw
What a load we are now true contenders for the corsi cup.
Many analysts can tell you where to shove corsi.
like every other stat devised by man to track stuff there no real refinement to make the stat worthwhile as it stands. Can we describe the Habs as having a very strong out of box or boxed out corsi?

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07-13-2017, 06:45 PM
  #118
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The 2011 Habs would crush the 2017 Habs in a playoff series.
Carey Price would exhaust himself playing both goalie positions.

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07-13-2017, 06:47 PM
  #119
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Didn't Rutherford walk into the Pens 2 years ago (or was that Shero always get em mixed up)? Lou walked into a TOR team that was amassing top 5/10 picks for years and managed to land a number 1 pick. Same thing with PC in EDM. So walking onto a contending team like WASH/PENS or a Bottom feeder like TOR/EDM is a better situation than walking onto a middle of the pack team with few high picks and bad contracts.



Jesus I am not even defending MB. I keep saying in my posts I am not talking about how much credit MB should or shouldn't get.

Before MB came on board the habs were a bottom half team that struggled to make the playoffs. Thats worse then being a bottom feeder because you don't get high picks. And worse then being a top contender because you don't have those superstar players.

Are you seriously trying to say that from 09-11, the habs team lead by guys like Gomez/Cammy/Gio/Spacek/Gill etc... were contenders and a great team that had a bright future? Really? I am not talking about MB improving this team or not. The team he came onto was not a good team, was lead by small/weak players and had bad contracts. MB got lucky with the lockout + buyouts + Price/PK/Max maturing at the same time. But he didn't walk into a Pens or Washington with a team that was considered a contender or a step or 2 away from the cup.

I bet if you were posting back then in 09/10/11 you probably thought the hab sucked and were going nowhere. Lets not forget this was a team that was being lead at Center by Scott Gomez!
5 years of MB : 3 PO series won, missed the PO once
5 years before MB : 3 PO series won, missed the PO once


and yeah, you are defending MB, that's all you do everybody knows it.

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07-13-2017, 06:48 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by scrubadam View Post
Well I am not really trying to tell anyone to be optimistic now. If you think this team sucks today I am not going to debate that with you. How the team is today does not make it better or worse the 3/4/5 years before MB took over.

So with hindsight we can see a team lead by Gomez/Gio/Cammy/Halak/Gill/Spacek was going nowhere. Maybe some were fooled but today we can realize that it was a dead end.

If todays team is a dead end so be it. I wonder if in a few years posters are going to argue how great the habs were from 13-17 and how amazing they were like some are trying to argue the 09-11 teams were.
During 2005-2011 the Northeast division was the most competitive division in the Eastern conference and one of the best in the league. The same cannot be said about the Atlantic division of 2012-2017.

And its something that can't be simply hand-waved here, since you're using the position in the standing as measuring stick, which mean quality of competition matter since they are who you are competing against for your final ranking.

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07-13-2017, 06:52 PM
  #121
CrAzYNiNe
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Originally Posted by OnTheRun View Post
During 2005-2011 the Northeast division was the most competitive division in the Eastern conference and one of the best in the league. The same cannot be said about the Atlantic division of 2012-2017.

And its something that can't be simply hand-waved here, since you're using the position in the standing as measuring stick, which mean quality of competition matter since they are who you are competing against for your final ranking.
That's another great reason why standings compared from one year to the next don't really capture any reality.

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:52 PM
  #122
Frozenice
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Not a few years from now but today.

Bergevin inherited a great situation and failed to top it up properly.
Why would you say that? We had 3 2nd round picks that year? The owner didn't publicly apologised for not winning the Cup that year - no wait, he apologised for the team being a complete embarrassment.

We've been a very run of the mill team and other then doing a ground up rebuild we probably aren't going to be anything much more then that. We have a few star players but that's what parity in the NHL is all about.

I've liked most of the things MB has done this summer, other then paying Price a stupid amount of money and trading Nate B for peanuts. I like the Drouin trade, he drafted the way I wanted him to and the rest I don't care about.

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:55 PM
  #123
Ozymandias
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Originally Posted by scrubadam View Post
Even if all that is true it won't change my opionion on this team from 09-11. There record was reflective of the roster.
Which was missing their mvp and #1 dman for most of that entire span.

Talk about pushing a narrative....


Last edited by Ozymandias: 07-13-2017 at 07:05 PM.
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Old
07-13-2017, 06:59 PM
  #124
Runner77
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
I admire your passion. And taking time to research...even if we disagree at times.
A compliment on HF directed at a fellow poster.

What's this (virtual) world coming to?

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Old
07-13-2017, 06:59 PM
  #125
HankyZetts
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
The 2011 Habs would crush the 2017 Habs in a playoff series.
I'd take that action.

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