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BEGIN Vs KOIVU

View Poll Results: Most important player for the Habs is...
Saku Koivu 170 91.40%
Steve Begin 16 8.60%
Voters: 186. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:08 PM
  #1
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BEGIN Vs KOIVU

first.. dont tell me its a stupid thread / poll cuz i kinda already know

I just want to have your OPINION about this.. who is the most important for the Habs ? And we talk about ALL. Leadership, skill, determination, desire to win, all, all, all...

Keep in mind that Bégin played with Downey, Sundstrom, Bonk... most of the year.

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05-26-2006, 07:12 PM
  #2
Le Maroons
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Captain. To me Begin is not a good enough player to be the most important player. He plays harder than anyone, makes for a great fourth line.

Bouillon vs. Markov?

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:13 PM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirktondan
Captain. To me Begin is not a good enough player to be the most important player. He plays harder than anyone, makes for a great fourth line.

Bouillon vs. Markov?
Markov in a second.
I LOVE Bouillon determination and all.. but he is not the half of what Markov hes... i want to keep him in the habs uniform for ever though (as well as markov )

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:14 PM
  #4
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Koivu and it's not even close ...

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:15 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gars59
Koivu and it's not even close ...
I agree. My mind was already done that it was Saku but I just want to see by HOW FAR Saku own Bégin.. cuz some of fan (if we can call that a fan ) are just blind becuz Saku have a big salary and becuz he dont speak french...

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05-26-2006, 07:17 PM
  #6
Beatnik
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Koivu by far.


I don't understand this thread. You can't compare the 2 really, it's why we must pay Koivu 5M and Begin 600k (would deserve around 1,5).

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:17 PM
  #7
Shabutie
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If it was Kovalev vs Begin....Different story.

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:18 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatnik
Koivu by far.


I don't understand this thread. You can't compare the 2 really, it's why we must pay Koivu 5M and Begin 600k (would deserve around 1,5).
It's hard to compare, I know, but if u had to keep one player to build ur franchise around. Who it would be ?? I repeat that I know what will be the answer of most of you but i need a statistical proof...

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:19 PM
  #9
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I prefer Begin.

I've got no good argument tyo support myself.

I just like him better and think he gives the spirit to the team when sometimes Koivu didn't during the regular season.

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:19 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
If it was Kovalev vs Begin....Different story.
You would pick Begin as most important player ?

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:20 PM
  #11
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meh tell u the truth
i dont care *** he does outside the ice, he can speak japanse only i don t care....as long as he does something on the ice and he justify his salary
does markov speak french?? no and no one cares, he s good that s all i wanna know...

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:21 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sthabs
meh tell u the truth
i dont care *** he does outside the ice, he can speak japanse only i don t care....as long as he does something on the ice and he justify his salary
does markov speak french?? no and no one cares, he s good that s all i wanna know...

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:23 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markov#79
You would pick Begin as most important player ?
Than Kovalev, yep. He's consistent. Gives 110% on every shift, bleeds habs. He's great at what he does and imo fires up the guys more than Kovalev.

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:26 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
Than Kovalev, yep. He's consistent. Gives 110% on every shift, bleeds habs. He's great at what he does and imo fires up the guys more than Kovalev.
I agree that I dont would like to be the guy who would need to choose between the 2 players

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:33 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptCrunch
I've got no good argument tyo support myself.
obvious...

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:40 PM
  #16
HCH
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Why does it have to be Koivu vs. Begin.... I want both of them on my team. There are others that I would drop before either one of these two guys.

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:40 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markov#79
I agree that I dont would like to be the guy who would need to choose between the 2 players
depend for what situation...

My only hope is that we get a real 2nd line C that plays with Kovy
Begin will be just fine with bonk and murray
I love begin but if i remeber good, he s better when he doesn t play more than +/-15 min a game, same as Bonk.

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05-26-2006, 07:47 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
Than Kovalev, yep. He's consistent. Gives 110% on every shift, bleeds habs. He's great at what he does and imo fires up the guys more than Kovalev.
Man... you got a total thing against Kovy huh?
There's times when Kovalev takes the game over, and is very vital to our team... Begin doesnt produce enough to be considered more valuable.... Yes I love Begin's heart as well, but lets be real here...

Kovalev wins games by himself some nights... (good example is the night he returned from that knee injury earlier this year)
IMO he'll be even more valuable next year...
Timely hits CAN fire up the guys... However dominating the offensive zone can do just as much (which is what Kovy does when he's on).
You are overlooking the value of a Kovalev cause he wasnt stellar this year... Yet he's the guy on the team that can turn the motors when NOTHING's working... For example, when nothing was going in against Ward... WHO was the only guy who was a threat in Game 4? That's right... Kovalev.

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Old
05-26-2006, 07:49 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sthabs
depend for what situation...

My only hope is that we get a real 2nd line C that plays with Kovy
Begin will be just fine with bonk and murray
I love begin but if i remeber good, he s better when he doesn t play more than +/-15 min a game, same as Bonk.
Well more than 15 mins, would mean an offensive role. Obviously that's not his job and it never will be. I don't think a center is the answer for Kovalev, I think maybe he just has to be happy with his linemates to do his best. He said he was content with Ribeiro on a few occasions, but the linemates were always the problem if we keep these two together. I thought the line worked best when Ribs was making the plays than Kovalev, cuz obviously Ribs has better vision and Kovalev has better finish. I guess we'll have to wait till next year and see, but I think if that line is going to work, either Lats will have to play LW or Kost, Perez will have to come up big on the wing. Truthfully though, I prefered the Ribs + Ryder duo.

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05-26-2006, 07:52 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost # 1
You are overlooking the value of a Kovalev cause he wasnt stellar this year... Yet he's the guy on the team that can turn the motors when NOTHING's working... For example, when nothing was going in against Ward... WHO was the only guy who was a threat in Game 4? That's right... Kovalev.
That's cuz our team sucks. Imo, Begin does far more to fire up the guys than Kovalev. And is also a much better example of work ethic for the young kids. I guarantee you Kovalev would be traded before Begin.

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Old
05-26-2006, 08:03 PM
  #21
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Come on, Begin is a role player

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05-26-2006, 08:03 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatnik
Koivu by far.


I don't understand this thread. You can't compare the 2 really, it's why we must pay Koivu 5M and Begin 600k (would deserve around 1,5).
I agree these two cannot be compared. Two different styles with completely different roles on the team.

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Old
05-26-2006, 08:07 PM
  #23
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Ok yea more like 10 minutes,
If Kovy has to wait for his linemates to be better, we re gonna wait for a while and kovy will be gone lol....
In other words, u can t have one superstar playing with 2 nowheres to create something, If you re gonna be placing ribs, kovy and kost or lats on the same line, you better have your best D s on the ice, because if kovy doesn t show we re in trouble.
yes i loved how Ribs played at the end of the season
But just like zed i hate player that do that
If you take the koivu lines well we all know what koivu does, higgins is a great hustler and garbage goal scorer, and Ryder is an awesome sniper
Kovy creates thing but i tought that he needed help and it was pretty obvious to me ,
As a result, some night he tried to do everything by himself, some night it worked, sometimes no
Of course he prefered playing with Ribs than Zed because Ribs has some vision as you said
and as far as i remember, Ryder also sucked when he was playing with Ribs, (This year)
but i still think the way Ribs has played this season, it s still ot enough
it s not enough to have 2 real scoring first lines
but , i like Ribs, even if he looks like a rat, the kid has a lot of skills , great vision, awesome hands, etc
but if we can t fit him on the 2nd, where are we gonna fit him ?
he also has some important downsides, the most important thing for a center is to create room for himself and he can t due to his size, and ...him being slow.(unlike Koivu... )
lol sorry after re reading my post i find it a bit...mixed up lol


Last edited by Sthabs: 05-26-2006 at 08:13 PM.
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Old
05-26-2006, 08:07 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
Begin does far more to fire up the guys than Kovalev. And is also a much better example of work ethic for the young kids.
And Darcy Tucker fires up his team more than Sundin. Big deal. The question is who is more important. Kovalev is paid more and plays more minutes because he's more important. If Begin was more important, he'd be paid more and played more. It's a simple black-and-white situation in this case.

It's true that Begin plays above and beyond his role; that he adds a dimension to the team from a position where a new dimension isn't expected. But he's in a journeyman, depth-player role, and you need to keep that in mind when rating Begin.

It's a lot easier to go out and find willing & able fourth liners who'll seemingly put their life on the line for a 'minimum wage' NHL-contract than it is to find an enormously gifted offensive star, as Calgary's proven.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shabutie
I guarantee you Kovalev would be traded before Begin.
That's nonsense. There's no way you could guarantee such a thing.

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Old
05-26-2006, 08:14 PM
  #25
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Koivu is the hearth of the team IMO .

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