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Old
06-09-2006, 07:54 AM
  #1
1865
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Ok, so you're in charge

You're allowed to make 3 (realistic) trades. Who would you bring in and why?

sorry if done before...

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06-09-2006, 08:50 AM
  #2
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Unfortunately, this is a very broad, open-ended question. The Flyers don't appear to be dealing away youth, which will make it much harder to deal away veterans for anything of significant value. Given the new philosophical approach, I'd like to see the following, with the qualifier that they would have to add one free agent to the mix to cover for any obvious gap which would remain, post hypothetical trades.

1. Let UFAs walk. Brashear, Johnsson (if he doesn't accept the rumored one year deal), Desjardins (anything more than league minimum to platoon = let him walk), and Savage.

2. Buyout Turner Stevenson.

3. Re-sign Peter Forsberg to an extension for 3 years/15-18 million with a club option for the fourth year.

Then...

Trade #1:

Flyers send Derian Hatcher, Robert Esche, Randy Jones, and a 2nd Round pick to Chicago for Jim Vandermeer and Nikolai Khabibulin.

REASONING:
Flyers send out Hatcher's contract for Khabibulin's contract (EVEN). Flyers get Vandermeer while the Hawks get Esche (EVEN). Hawks get Jones and 2nd for making the deal (HAWKS). Flyers get rid of the Hatcher contract clear up the goaltending situation (Niittymaki starter and platoon with Khabibulin) and take the Khabibulin contract off the Hawks. This deal would appear to be mostly even.

Trade #2:

Flyers send Michal Handzus, Branko Radivojevic, and a second round pick in 06 to the Penguins for Ryan Malone. Penguins add a veteran center who can allow Crosby and Malkin to develop. Handzus gives the Pens a defensive center who can anchor the second/third lines and even play on the first line. Flyers get Malone who would add to the youth movement and size up front. The addition of Radivojevic gives the Pens a top PK tandem with Handzus and the second rounder gives them the value-added portion of the deal. Both teams get value. The Pens get value now, while the Flyers get value for the future. Nedved assumes Handzus' role on the Flyers.

Trade #3:

Flyers send Niko Dimitrakos and a fourth round pick to the Boston Bruins for Wayne Primeau. This gives the Bruins a young winger to develop and the Flyers unite the Primeau brothers. The Flyers get a true fourth line center with size to add to the depth and replace Handzus as a penalty killer while uniting the Primeaus (gives shot in the arm to Keith). This also prevents Hitchcock from wasting guys like Potulny, Downie, and Bellamy on the fourth line. Bruins get young wing who is developing, while re-uniting him with his former teammates from San Jose. (EVEN)


Flyers post-trades and hypothetical moves, when healthy:

Gagne - Forsberg - Knuble
Umberger - Richards - Carter
Malone - K. Primeau - Kapanen
Nedved - W. Primeau - Eager
Extras: Potulny/Ruzicka/Ellison

Pitkanen - Rathje
Vandermeer - FREE AGENT
Meyer - Gauthier
Extras: Picard/Desjardins/Printz

Niittymaki - Khabibulin

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06-09-2006, 09:06 AM
  #3
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i do not want a 6 mil backup goalie....

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06-09-2006, 09:17 AM
  #4
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Originally Posted by hovercraft
i do not want a 6 mil backup goalie....
SIX MILLION DOLLAR BACKUP GOALIE????!!!!!!!!

I agree with hovercraft one thousand percent!!!!! The two current goalies barely make a third of that put together!

Question: Can you pay your players signing bonuses, performance bonuses, etc. without it going against your salary cap?

Susanna


Last edited by Susanna: 06-09-2006 at 09:39 AM.
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06-09-2006, 09:27 AM
  #5
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I do agree with the Primeau deal and the hatcher one is alright also- personally I don't like Khabby so here I go.

1. Handzus Picard and a 1St for louongo. Sign him to a multi year deal and consider him Richards, Carter, Umburger Poltuny Downie, Gagne, Pitkanen the core the rest are for sale.

2. Let Foppa go after this. He is great but huge money should be spent on a long term deal not a two or three year thing- ie Louongo.

3. Knuble and esche to Nashville for a young d-man like Shea Webber, I would love Suter or hamhuis but lets be honest they are too good for so little.

I really feel that we are not a cup team over the next year or so but with the right DEVELOPMENTAL deal we could be. With the Hatcher Rathje and Forsberg restraints we just don't have the means to win. In the old NHL we would be great but no so any more.

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Old
06-09-2006, 09:35 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by facts
I do agree with the Primeau deal and the hatcher one is alright also- personally I don't like Khabby so here I go.

1. Handzus Picard and a 1St for louongo. Sign him to a multi year deal and consider him Richards, Carter, Umburger Poltuny Downie, Gagne, Pitkanen the core the rest are for sale.
I would let Downie or Potulny go long before I'd give up Picard. Picard is one of the very few defensemen in the cupboard. I do want to see them keep the core group together though.

I'd love to see Shea Weber here, but I don't think you're going to get him from Nashville easily.

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06-09-2006, 10:36 AM
  #7
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Originally Posted by steinie77
Unfortunately, this is a very broad, open-ended question. The Flyers don't appear to be dealing away youth, which will make it much harder to deal away veterans for anything of significant value. Given the new philosophical approach, I'd like to see the following, with the qualifier that they would have to add one free agent to the mix to cover for any obvious gap which would remain, post hypothetical trades.

1. Let UFAs walk. Brashear, Johnsson (if he doesn't accept the rumored one year deal), Desjardins (anything more than league minimum to platoon = let him walk), and Savage.

2. Buyout Turner Stevenson.

3. Re-sign Peter Forsberg to an extension for 3 years/15-18 million with a club option for the fourth year.

Then...

Trade #1:

Flyers send Derian Hatcher, Robert Esche, Randy Jones, and a 2nd Round pick to Chicago for Jim Vandermeer and Nikolai Khabibulin.

REASONING:
Flyers send out Hatcher's contract for Khabibulin's contract (EVEN). Flyers get Vandermeer while the Hawks get Esche (EVEN). Hawks get Jones and 2nd for making the deal (HAWKS). Flyers get rid of the Hatcher contract clear up the goaltending situation (Niittymaki starter and platoon with Khabibulin) and take the Khabibulin contract off the Hawks. This deal would appear to be mostly even.

Trade #2:

Flyers send Michal Handzus, Branko Radivojevic, and a second round pick in 06 to the Penguins for Ryan Malone. Penguins add a veteran center who can allow Crosby and Malkin to develop. Handzus gives the Pens a defensive center who can anchor the second/third lines and even play on the first line. Flyers get Malone who would add to the youth movement and size up front. The addition of Radivojevic gives the Pens a top PK tandem with Handzus and the second rounder gives them the value-added portion of the deal. Both teams get value. The Pens get value now, while the Flyers get value for the future. Nedved assumes Handzus' role on the Flyers.

Trade #3:

Flyers send Niko Dimitrakos and a fourth round pick to the Boston Bruins for Wayne Primeau. This gives the Bruins a young winger to develop and the Flyers unite the Primeau brothers. The Flyers get a true fourth line center with size to add to the depth and replace Handzus as a penalty killer while uniting the Primeaus (gives shot in the arm to Keith). This also prevents Hitchcock from wasting guys like Potulny, Downie, and Bellamy on the fourth line. Bruins get young wing who is developing, while re-uniting him with his former teammates from San Jose. (EVEN)


Flyers post-trades and hypothetical moves, when healthy:

Gagne - Forsberg - Knuble
Umberger - Richards - Carter
Malone - K. Primeau - Kapanen
Nedved - W. Primeau - Eager
Extras: Potulny/Ruzicka/Ellison

Pitkanen - Rathje
Vandermeer - FREE AGENT
Meyer - Gauthier
Extras: Picard/Desjardins/Printz

Niittymaki - Khabibulin
Trade #2, what are you smoking? Way overpayment. Radio and a pick yes doubtful Pens do that though. Zeus has more value than Ryan malone who isn't all that young 27 or 28 I think.
#3 is also an overpayment. Guys like Wayne are a dime a dozen and can be had for a pick or sign a free agent.
#1 if you trade for bulin he is your #1 goalie period. Then you would have to trade Nitty to get solid palyer and sign a backup.

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Old
06-09-2006, 10:39 AM
  #8
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NAME 2006/2007
Antero Niittymaki --$1,000,000.00
Robert Esche--------$1,000,000.00

Kim Johnsson $2,200,000.00
Joni Pitkanen $1,500,000.00
Denis Gauthier $2,000,000.00
Freddy Meyer $800,000.00
Mike Rathje $3,500,000.00
Randy Jones $800,000.00


Peter Forsberg $5,000,000.00
Keith Primeau $3,040,000.00
Michal Handzus $2,128,000.00
Mike Knuble $1,520,000.00
Jeff Carter $942,400.00
Mike Richards $942,400.00
Nicholas Dimitrakos $625,000.00
Sami Kapanen $1,520,000.00
Ben Eager $500,000.00
Simon Gagne $4,000,000.00
R.J. Umberger $1,500,000.00
Ryan Potulny $835,000.00

Branko Radivojevic UFA (buh bye)
Eric Desjardins UFA (We'll miss you!, buh bye)

Turner Stevenson $1,254,000.00 WAIVED No need to buy him out, the Flyers can afford to pay the $ and have him in the minors.
Petr Nedved $2,204,000.00 TRADED for a bag of pucks
Derian Hatcher $3,500,000.00 TRADED/WAIVED for whatever you can get.

$35,352,800.00 TOTAL SALARY (+/-) CALL IT 36,500,000.00 because we're guessing on some salarys.

Cap @ 43.5 (+/-)

The Flyers now have approximatly $7,000,000.00 for free agency. If Johnsson dosen't resign, 9.2m for 1, 2 or 3 free agents.

Without anymore moves

Gagne'-Forsberg-Knuble-----Scoring line 1
Umberger-Richards-Carter---Scoring line 2
Handzus-Primeau-Kapanen--Scoring/Shutdown line
Eager-Potulny-Dimitrakos----Energy line

Pitkanen-Rathje
Johnsson-Gauthier
Meyer-Jones

Esche-Niittymaki

Add one or two FA Dmen and a winger... (Kuba, Kubina, Langenbruner etc.) and you've got the makikngs of a pretty good team.
Roles move around while Forsberg is out, like Primeau moving to the top line and Handzus centering the 3rd.

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Old
06-09-2006, 10:58 AM
  #9
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Does anyone here think that Hatcher at 4 million isn't going to cost you a contract coming back? Hatcher for Khabibulin is the nuts and bolts of deal #1 with Vandermeer and Esche being the pieces that swap value for the Contract vs Contract swap. Khabibulin gives the Flyers the Cup-winning goalie to groom Niittymaki for the near to mid-term future. Anyone who thinks that dumping Hatcher in a trade to bring back anything more than "future considerations" unless you take back a contract is misinformed (see the Roenick dump). Both the Hawks and Flyers get value in the deal. The value to the Flyers is three-fold: 1. Stanley Cup winning goalie who can start most of the year and groom Niittymaki; 2. The addition by subtraction of Vandermeer for Hatcher; 3. Clarity on the goalie situation for the future with Niittymaki at the helm.

Deal #2 with the Pens eliminates Handzus' salary and makes the room for the difference between Hatcher and Khabibulin's money. Malone was coveted by Clarke and co. at the deadline as was rumored. The kid, see link, http://msn.foxsports.com/nhl/player?statsId=3011, is only 26 and is in the Umberger/Knuble mold. He would give the Flyers options for the second/third line and give the Flyers a developing power forward. Giving up Handzus clears the room for the future with guys like Primeau getting healthy, who here would take Handzus over Primeau on the Flyers. That is the choice before us. With Richards, Carter, Potulny, Downie, Umberger, etc. in the fold, Handzus will be the odd man out eventually, so why not get a young power forward with upside now when it is both plausible and cost-effective to make the other puzzle pieces fit?

Deal #3 is a dime-a-dozen player. W. Primeau was part of the Thornton trade and does have value. Moving Dimitrakos may not need to happen to get it done, fine, I'll concede that point, but it would likely take at least a third to then get it done. Adding Primeau gives the Flyers a legitimate cohesive fourth unit once everyone gets healthy. Primeau and Eager would be nasty together, IMO. That gives the Flyers the flexibility and adds the fourth line center who knows his role while not wasting someone like Potulny on the fourth line. Even so, Dimitrakos, when everyone is healthy would likely have to platoon for his spot in the lineup where he can give some of the veterans a game or two off, like Kapanen, Nedved, and even Eager where the game calls for it.

$6 Million for a goalie who has won a Stanley Cup and has the horse to go significant games in Niittymaki makes all the other moves fall into place. If not for Niittymaki and his eventual development into the franchise goalie we all see him as, then the flexibility of moving Esche is obviously misaligned. I still feel that Niittymaki is the future in net and moving Hatcher is going to cost the Flyers taking back another "contract," so it makes as much sense as I have read here so far.

If the Flyers could make the moves I mentioned in the previous post, but keep Dimitrakos...

Before Foppa's return:
Gagne - Richards - Knuble
Umberger - Carter - Malone
Kapanen - K. Primeau - Dimitrakos
Nedved - W. Primeau - Eager

After Foppa's return:
Gagne - Forsberg - Knuble
Umberger - Carter - Malone
Richards/K. Primeau - K. Primeau/Richards - Kapanen
Nedved/Dimitrakos - W. Primeau - Eager


Last edited by steinie77: 06-09-2006 at 11:07 AM.
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Old
06-09-2006, 11:23 AM
  #10
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Guys, this is Bob Clarke we're talking about.

He's simply gonna sign Sakic to a 1 year contract. Foppa and Sakic down the center again. Hell, if it worked for COL why not for us.

Of course you all know I'm kidding but imagine the forward lines if that really did happen...

Gagne-Forsberg-Knuble
Umberger-Sakic-Carter
Handzus-Richards-Kapanen
Eager/Putolny-Premeau-Dimitrakos

Ugh, gives me the chills.

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Old
06-09-2006, 06:29 PM
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seanaynay
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IMO, I dont think Carter will do much in Philly, I have nothing to back that up with, just my big gut, but I just dont think he will amount to anything that he was scouted for. 60 pt player

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Old
06-09-2006, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanaynay
IMO, I dont think Carter will do much in Philly, I have nothing to back that up with, just my big gut, but I just dont think he will amount to anything that he was scouted for. 60 pt player

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06-09-2006, 06:46 PM
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Steinie, you are giving up insanely too much for Ryan Malone, especially for making a trade within the division

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06-09-2006, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by seanaynay
IMO, I dont think Carter will do much in Philly, I have nothing to back that up with, just my big gut, but I just dont think he will amount to anything that he was scouted for. 60 pt player
You should see his wrist shot.

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06-09-2006, 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted by seanaynay
IMO, I dont think Carter will do much in Philly, I have nothing to back that up with, just my big gut, but I just dont think he will amount to anything that he was scouted for. 60 pt player
I suggest you watch him play because he'll be leading the Flyers in goals in 2 years. His wrist shot is already one of the best in the game and has the ability to be a future Richard trophy contender with the right players around him. The kid can finish.

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06-09-2006, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by seanaynay
IMO, I dont think Carter will do much in Philly, I have nothing to back that up with, just my big gut, but I just dont think he will amount to anything that he was scouted for. 60 pt player
Ya and Ovechkin and that Crosby kid will never make it either - I think 60 pts is reachable next year if given some TOI and that is just the start.

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06-09-2006, 07:52 PM
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You should see his wrist shot.

His shot is certainly capable of being compared with legends like Sakic and Modano. More importantly, is that he is accurate and isn't afraid to shoot.

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06-09-2006, 08:27 PM
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KJ, the Handzus to the Pens move is the question here. Wasn't the rumor of Malone for Umberger kicked around at the deadline? Perhaps it may be overpayment, but looking at Malone as a potential top line power forward, then there comes the value in the deal. Handzus is actually a salary move for the Flyers in my suggested trade. Khabibulin coming in would cause the Flyers the need to move some money out to keep everything in line. Any suggestions on what value would land Malone as an alternative in your opinion?

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06-09-2006, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by steinie77
KJ, the Handzus to the Pens move is the question here. Wasn't the rumor of Malone for Umberger kicked around at the deadline? Perhaps it may be overpayment, but looking at Malone as a potential top line power forward, then there comes the value in the deal. Handzus is actually a salary move for the Flyers in my suggested trade. Khabibulin coming in would cause the Flyers the need to move some money out to keep everything in line. Any suggestions on what value would land Malone as an alternative in your opinion?

There was a reason Umberger wasn't traded for Malone. And it wasn't because Umberger wasn't good enough

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06-09-2006, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by steinie77
KJ, the Handzus to the Pens move is the question here. Wasn't the rumor of Malone for Umberger kicked around at the deadline? Perhaps it may be overpayment, but looking at Malone as a potential top line power forward, then there comes the value in the deal. Handzus is actually a salary move for the Flyers in my suggested trade. Khabibulin coming in would cause the Flyers the need to move some money out to keep everything in line. Any suggestions on what value would land Malone as an alternative in your opinion?
Malone is not and will not be a top line power forward. don't think the Pens will move him. The envision him as their 3rd line center I believe. He is a decent player and doesn't make a lot of money. They need dman we don't have any to spare. Just not a good trading partner

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06-09-2006, 10:28 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by steinie77
KJ, the Handzus to the Pens move is the question here. Wasn't the rumor of Malone for Umberger kicked around at the deadline? Perhaps it may be overpayment, but looking at Malone as a potential top line power forward, then there comes the value in the deal. Handzus is actually a salary move for the Flyers in my suggested trade. Khabibulin coming in would cause the Flyers the need to move some money out to keep everything in line. Any suggestions on what value would land Malone as an alternative in your opinion?
The "rumor" was from Muir, I believe, who is not a great source and how is losing 2 mill really going to change anything. Handzus is fairly paid which is not always the case in sports. Malone has yet to prove anything and we could/should do much better if deciding to deal him - maybe Erat from Nash??

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06-09-2006, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Susanna
SIX MILLION DOLLAR BACKUP GOALIE????!!!!!!!!

I=Question: Can you pay your players signing bonuses, performance bonuses, etc. without it going against your salary cap?

Susanna
every cent goes toward the cap

if they didn't--teams like NYR and Detoit would be doing end runs around the cap

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06-10-2006, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Rex88
The "rumor" was from Muir, I believe, who is not a great source and how is losing 2 mill really going to change anything. Handzus is fairly paid which is not always the case in sports. Malone has yet to prove anything and we could/should do much better if deciding to deal him - maybe Erat from Nash??
I like that speedy player with hands on the wing for Carter and Umberger. The two have shown a willingness to muck it up at times so physicality, strength and size should be no issue regardless of who plays with them. One of Erat, Hemsky, or Zetterberg would compliment Carter and Umberger very well.

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06-10-2006, 01:16 AM
  #24
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Originally Posted by seanaynay
IMO, I dont think Carter will do much in Philly, I have nothing to back that up with, just my big gut, but I just dont think he will amount to anything that he was scouted for. 60 pt player

Carter will be better then anything currently on the Bruins right now, or anything they bring up from Providence, and he will be better then anything the Bruins will draft this season. Its the Bruins they will screw it up, and if they dont screw it up and they draft a good prospect they will trade him.

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Old
06-10-2006, 08:15 AM
  #25
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Carter will be better then anything currently on the Bruins right now, or anything they bring up from Providence, and he will be better then anything the Bruins will draft this season. Its the Bruins they will screw it up, and if they dont screw it up and they draft a good prospect they will trade him.
Patrice Bergeron?

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