HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Washington Capitals
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Anyone want to trade Olie now?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-04-2003, 05:38 PM
  #1
st_roland
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: BUSH CONTRY-Frederick, MD
Posts: 1,469
vCash: 500
Anyone want to trade Olie now?

MAN what a game by Olie, if he didn't get first star tonight, its a sure sign that armageddon is upon us. I'm hoping he keeps up his great play!

st_roland is offline  
Old
11-04-2003, 05:48 PM
  #2
Marshall
The OMalley Sellouts
 
Marshall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Old Town Alexandria
Posts: 11,965
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by st_roland
MAN what a game by Olie, if he didn't get first star tonight, its a sure sign that armageddon is upon us. I'm hoping he keeps up his great play!
NHL.com's box score shows Olie as the game's #1 star.

And trading Olie would be a very bad idea by the Caps.

Marshall is offline  
Old
11-05-2003, 09:20 AM
  #3
Tinordi24*
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,697
vCash: 500
YES! Even more so now!!

His stock is higher and the better he plays the more we should want to trade him.

This team is not winning the Cup anytime soon and needs to rebuild. By then Kolzig will be way past his prime and Oullet rotting on the bench.

It makes no sense NOT to trade Kolzig unless the offers are pathetic.

Tinordi24* is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 08:45 AM
  #4
CNote
Get 'er done
 
CNote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Toronto, ON.
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,650
vCash: 500
IMHO Kolzig's not going anywhere....and that's the least of your problems. Semin's lookin' good though!...must mean it's time for Cassidy to bench him...lol.

later,
dutch

CNote is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 09:50 AM
  #5
txpd
Registered User
 
txpd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 41,910
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinordi24
YES! Even more so now!!

His stock is higher and the better he plays the more we should want to trade him.

This team is not winning the Cup anytime soon and needs to rebuild. By then Kolzig will be way past his prime and Oullet rotting on the bench.

It makes no sense NOT to trade Kolzig unless the offers are pathetic.

evolution is the way to success, not revolution. tearing your team down to start from scratch and losing for 3 seasons(best case scenario)
just doesn't happen anymore. Teams like Buffalo, Florida, Calgary, Chicago can build and rebuild for a decade and get no where. How many solid, above average playoff teams have stripped to the bone and rebuilt successfully? hm? The good teams never do. Detroit, Dallas, NJ, Colorado, Philly all just add the pieces that they need to keep growing. They have a bad year now and then and might even miss the playoffs, but how long has it been since they missed more than once in a row?
You also are not taking into account the reaction by the ticket buyers to throwing in the towel. The season ticket base fell from 14k to 10k just from losing in the playoffs. What will it be like if they settle for a last place season? Trade Kolzig and you say loud and clear that there is no season this year. We already know there may not be a season next year. IF Ted lets them throw in the towel, he will lose more money to lost short and long term revenue than he will save by cutting the salary. He can trade Jagr or Lang and be able to say that they are trying to make the playoffs. Trade Kolzig and they can't.
Ted Leonsis does not want to encourage attendance figures in the 5k a night range. Thats what he will get if they trade Kolzig. Its the reality of doing business.

txpd is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 11:12 AM
  #6
Puckfittsburgh
Registered User
 
Puckfittsburgh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Davidsonville, MD
Country: United States
Posts: 341
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Puckfittsburgh
ummmm

Detroit, Dallas, NJ, Colorado

All had to re-build and stink for a bunch of years before they were good.

Detroit got Yzerman that way. Colorado got Sakic and Forsberg that way. Dallas got Modano that way.

Puckfittsburgh is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 11:42 AM
  #7
txpd
Registered User
 
txpd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 41,910
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckfittsburgh
ummmm

Detroit, Dallas, NJ, Colorado

All had to re-build and stink for a bunch of years before they were good.

Detroit got Yzerman that way. Colorado got Sakic and Forsberg that way. Dallas got Modano that way.
HA...ok. That was SOOOOO long ago that it predates the current CBA.
Dallas has not rebuilt since going to Dallas. Colorado has not rebuilt since being in Quebec City. Detroit hasn't rebuilt in a REAL long time.
When was the last time the Devils broke it down to the foundation and started over and missed the playoffs more than one year?

Detroit got Yzerman how long ago? he is 40 isnt he? Sakic and Forsberg were acquired by Quebec. Modano played in Minnesota, too.

You make my point for me. Since the last CBA with more free agency and movement of players, good teams don't rebuild. they evolve. what was the last cup team to miss the playoffs two years in a row at any point after winning the cup?
i think its montreal...thats a LONG TIME AGO.

txpd is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 12:06 PM
  #8
me2
Seahawks 43
 
me2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Broncos 8
Country: Wallis & Futuna
Posts: 19,354
vCash: 1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd
HA...ok. That was SOOOOO long ago that it predates the current CBA.
Dallas has not rebuilt since going to Dallas. Colorado has not rebuilt since being in Quebec City. Detroit hasn't rebuilt in a REAL long time.
When was the last time the Devils broke it down to the foundation and started over and missed the playoffs more than one year?

Detroit got Yzerman how long ago? he is 40 isnt he? Sakic and Forsberg were acquired by Quebec. Modano played in Minnesota, too.

You make my point for me. Since the last CBA with more free agency and movement of players, good teams don't rebuild. they evolve. what was the last cup team to miss the playoffs two years in a row at any point after winning the cup?
i think its montreal...thats a LONG TIME AGO.
I think Puckfittsburgh is more correct than you. A team can go 10 years on built up player capital and a few UFAs, which is what teams like Detroit, NJ & Avs have done.

The Quebec-pre-Avs aquired Forsberg and others when they traded their #1 overall pick Lindros. You get the #1 overall pick by sucking. Quebec sucked, they built up a very strong bases of picks and prospects. Those picks and prospects went on to become the core of the Avs but they only aquired them because they had the depth and stink factor to do so. They also bought wisely and expensively, Borque, Blake etc. Avs are aging and running out of depth.

The core of the wings was build in the 80s and 90s. Yzerman, Fedorov, Lidstrom where 80s or early 90s picks. They struggled for years, but eventually the aquired enough good players. Since then they have been adding lots of players through UFA to keep an aging ship propped up. They look to be aging fast and will have to rebuild again soon.

NJ stank for years, and aquired its depth and many of its best players from that time. They also have great scouting and a few smart pickups.

Look at the Rangers as a team that built entirely through UFAs. It stinks. Unless your team can afford a huge payroll (Wings, Avs, Philly etc) you can't take the UFA route to continually prop up an aging team, and you need to go into a rebuild cycle. You can rebuild successfully through the draft. Avs, NJ & Wings did originally. Nucks and Ottawa are doing it now. Tampa is looking better. Florida will eventually get its act together.

me2 is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 12:31 PM
  #9
txpd
Registered User
 
txpd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 41,910
vCash: 500
again, you make my point for me. no one has rebuilt a challenger in the last 10 years. You are left to point to Tampa. They sucked long enough that the franchise is teetering. Yea...they look better. Part of the problem with the NHL is that the same 5 or 6 teams are on the top every year, year after year. there is no rebuilding or turning over of those top teams. No team rebuilding and joining the club. How many Red Wings from the Mike Vernon Wings/Cup team are on the current team? Lots of major parts of the Vernon team are not on the Hasek team. its called evolution. How many current Dallas Stars were on the cup team?

txpd is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 02:51 PM
  #10
tom_servo
Registered User
 
tom_servo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 11,080
vCash: 500
txpd - teams who want to spend the money can "evolve." No, those team will probably never have to suffer a rebuilding phase in the classic sense because they're the perennial high bidders for players on the market.

If what Leonsis says is any indication, the Caps will not be one of those teams.

Quote:
no one has rebuilt a challenger in the last 10 years.
Ottawa, for one. Vancouver. Tampa Bay is getting up there. Atlanta's on that path.

Better than perennial mediocrity, anyway.

tom_servo is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 04:20 PM
  #11
txpd
Registered User
 
txpd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 41,910
vCash: 500
Vancouver is the closest thing to a rebuild job. the others are building from expansion or just loser status.

rebuilding from a contending team to loser to another contending team is rare. You have found one team. out of all the teams in the nhl.
I am not talking about building a good team from a bad team thru the draft. I am talking about taking an established team. Blowing off the all the top players and starting over. you can go back ten years and you give me one vancouver team. that is an endorsement for the process.

sometimes I get the feeling that some of you are so into rebuilding because you are tired of the same old players like you are tired of the same ole songs on the radio. you want something fresh, progressive and alternative. you don't care if they lose, you don't care if most people wouldn't want to watch it. Much like people that would rather listen to the butthole surfers than U2.

txpd is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 05:31 PM
  #12
tom_servo
Registered User
 
tom_servo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 11,080
vCash: 500
You would think that a team with as many valuable players on the roster would be in a better rebuilding position than the expansion teams like Ottawa that started from the bottom.

tom_servo is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 05:45 PM
  #13
Mystery
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 41
vCash: 500
George McPhee would have rocks in his head to trade Olaf Kolzig. Money issues aside, trading Kolzig is the best way to cause the club to fold and drop out of the playoff race into years of rebuilding. With Kolzig around, even a rebuilding effort would provide some decent results. Teams cannot afford to give up elite goaltenders of Kolzig's status easily and if they chose to move him, they would need to get significant assets in return to justify the move. If it comes to pure salary dumping, then Bondra and the Penguins contingent (Jagr, Lang, and Miller) are better options to make a dramatic saving on the books without hurting the teams on ice performance too drastically.

Mystery is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 06:25 PM
  #14
Weary
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,068
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystery
Money issues aside, trading Kolzig is the best way to cause the club to fold and drop out of the playoff race into years of rebuilding.
The Caps are in the playoff race? That's a good one.

Weary is offline  
Old
11-06-2003, 07:10 PM
  #15
txpd
Registered User
 
txpd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 41,910
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Weary
The Caps are in the playoff race? That's a good one.
The Caps have just finished a run of 13 games, 9 on the road, 11 against teams above .500, Philly, St. Louis, Tampa bay/Atlanta tied, Dallas, are all leading their divisions. Toronto is 2nd in its division by 1 pts. that's 8 games. Only the Atlanta games where played in Washington. This is not an excuse. Its a reality. They 13 game stretch of schedule they just played are probably 8 or 9 loses under any circumstances.

Now...they start a long stretch of games where they mostly play at home against teams that are not the leagues elite. I think we will have a better idea of what kind of hockey team there is here by thanksgiving.

I think its easy to overlook how brutal the Caps schedule has been just likes its easy to miss how easy Tampa's schedule has been. 10 games,
8 at home, 3 against teams over .500. only one of those on the road.

Just some perspective and food for thought.

txpd is offline  
Old
11-07-2003, 05:26 AM
  #16
Puckfittsburgh
Registered User
 
Puckfittsburgh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Davidsonville, MD
Country: United States
Posts: 341
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Puckfittsburgh
You make MY point for me.

The reason nobody has rebuilt in the last 10 years is BECAUSE of Expansion. They were getting all the high picks not the bad teams.

Take a look at Florida. Who has been horrible since their cup run. They have added a bunch of great prospects that will gem here in about 2 years.

Ottawa is a perfect example of a team that has re-built recently and they are one of the strongest teams in the NHL. Maybe even ready for a Cup this year.

To be a good team in the NHL you have to be bad for a while. Not barely missing the playoffs bad but top 5 pick bad. Pretty much every cup winning team has done it at some point. The teams right in the Middle all the time like St Louis and Washington are doomed to in the Middle all the time.

If you are happy with the maybe playoffs every year but no shot at a Cup then I can see you saying do not re-build. If you want the Caps to win the Cup you are going to have to watch them be one of the worst teams for a few years. It is the only way to build a long cup running team like Colorado, New Jersey, and Detroit have right now. The only way.

It is why the Caps have never had a true 1st line center. Which is one of the most important things in making a cup run. Oates was close but not really. Either way it took a high draft pick in Allison to get him.

Puckfittsburgh is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:41 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.