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Lundqvist/Luongo, Richter/Belfour

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Old
06-21-2006, 12:29 PM
  #1
frozenrubber
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Lundqvist/Luongo, Richter/Belfour

Taking all of the smaller (and nonetheless important) pieces needed, would you flip Henrik Lundqvist for Roberto Luongo? I'm not talking about what other people would be involved, just a simple question.

I would compare this to if we traded Mike Richter for Eddy Belfour in the early nineties. While Mike Richter was home grown, Eddy was more established and 2-3 years older. In the grand scheme of things, would you of traded what ended up to be a Ranger for life for an established upgrade.

Now many are going to opine that Lundqvist will surpass Luongo and set the world ablaze. Nonetheless, Luongo is MORE established in the NHL. If the moons aligned tomorrow, would you trade Lundqvist for Luongo straight up. Home Grown vs. Heralded SuperStar.

*Please don't post "they'll never do it"; this isn't the spirit of the thread*

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Old
06-21-2006, 12:34 PM
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BigCanada77
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I think Henke has struck a chord with this city, and I think you have to add that to his attributes. It makes the team better, which makes the fans happier, which in turn makes the team better. I wouldn't do it. Henke has shown that his is really good already, but I think he's gonna get better.

This is not discrediting anything Luongo is, I just wouldn't do it.

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06-21-2006, 12:36 PM
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It's hard to chose any goalie over Henrik after getting to see him much more this year and getting to know what kind of personality he brings to the team.

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06-21-2006, 12:39 PM
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Levitate
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I think Luongo has more outright skill, but bringing players into NYC makes me wary about whether they'll continue to perform up to their level.

NYC seems to be a good fit for Lundqvist and he excelled here last year. He might not technically be a better goalie than Luongo, but this might be a better situation for him than it would be for Luongo.

So I guess I'm saying I'd pass...but I could be completely rationalizing because of how much I enjoyed Lundqvist's good season

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06-21-2006, 12:40 PM
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frozenrubber
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Side Question

And in my side question, in 1992, would you of traded a 24 yr. Richter for a 27 yr. old Belfour?

Homegrown or established?

I love Lundqvist just as much as anyone...but I wonder if our admiration clouds our vision.

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06-21-2006, 12:40 PM
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Luongo is an amazing, Franchise type goaltender... However, with a salary cap in place and when you take into consideration the salary differences at this point in their careers, the choice is a no-brainer.

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06-21-2006, 12:53 PM
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For me it would be keeping the homegrown in Richter and then now in Lundqvist.

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06-21-2006, 12:59 PM
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DutchShamrock
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levitate
I think Luongo has more outright skill, but bringing players into NYC makes me wary about whether they'll continue to perform up to their level.

NYC seems to be a good fit for Lundqvist and he excelled here last year. He might not technically be a better goalie than Luongo, but this might be a better situation for him than it would be for Luongo.

So I guess I'm saying I'd pass...but I could be completely rationalizing because of how much I enjoyed Lundqvist's good season
This is probably the best road to take to not sound like a homer, and I will cause I'm sticking with Lundqvist. Right now Luongo is better and it is impossible to predict just who will be better at the end of the their careers. But this game isn't just about winning and I'll sacrifice some wins (not necessarily cups) for a homegrown kid, and one that is personable and a star in a big city. Roberto is in the grey area right now with the way these contract negotiations are going.

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Old
06-21-2006, 01:37 PM
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Did anyone read Rodent's "Bang For Your Buck" rant a couple of days ago. I think he was spot on, and that theory is perfectly applicable here. Henke is a better goalie $ for $ right now, and when you add in the intangibles and the fact that he is home grown I dont really think there is a debate.

As for the side question, if you can get any Ranger fan to say that they think it would have been a good idea to trade Mike Richter I would consider it a small miracle. As hard as it is to overlook homerism when it comes to Lundqvist, it is even that much more difficult when one tries to consider a player who brought the Cup to the Garden and has his number hanging in the rafters.

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06-21-2006, 03:02 PM
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Never.

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Old
06-21-2006, 03:05 PM
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B.D. Gallof
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Came over to read the thread. Its a good thread with an interesting point...however, the question, in lieu of the CBA, is simply: Cost. Do you wrap up 6 mill a year on what is, IMHO, a great goalie...or stick with what is working...a rookie who was a godsend that will only get better.

Seems pretty easy to me. Spend some cash and upgrade your backup if you want insurance..but even then, its less than Luongo. NYR is alot of chemistry and team unity...better to stick to what works.

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06-21-2006, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooch
Came over to read the thread. Its a good thread with an interesting point...however, the question, in lieu of the CBA, is simply: Cost. Do you wrap up 6 mill a year on what is, IMHO, a great goalie...or stick with what is working...a rookie who was a godsend that will only get better.

Seems pretty easy to me. Spend some cash and upgrade your backup if you want insurance..but even then, its less than Luongo. NYR is alot of chemistry and team unity...better to stick to what works.

Very well said.

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Old
06-21-2006, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frozenrubber
Taking all of the smaller (and nonetheless important) pieces needed, would you flip Henrik Lundqvist for Roberto Luongo? I'm not talking about what other people would be involved, just a simple question.

I would compare this to if we traded Mike Richter for Eddy Belfour in the early nineties. While Mike Richter was home grown, Eddy was more established and 2-3 years older. In the grand scheme of things, would you of traded what ended up to be a Ranger for life for an established upgrade.

Now many are going to opine that Lundqvist will surpass Luongo and set the world ablaze. Nonetheless, Luongo is MORE established in the NHL. If the moons aligned tomorrow, would you trade Lundqvist for Luongo straight up. Home Grown vs. Heralded SuperStar.

*Please don't post "they'll never do it"; this isn't the spirit of the thread*
I would trade Lundqvist for Luongo in heartbeat. Lundqvist had a good first season but I doubt he'll keep that up once the league catches up with him, much like the Devils did in the playoffs. I wasn't impressed with King Henrik at all and if you can get Luongo for a guy who struggles when the playoffs come around I would do it.

I also think you guys would have to give up more than just Lundqvist. Good luck with draft guys.

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Old
06-21-2006, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilsin4
I would trade Lundqvist for Luongo in heartbeat. Lundqvist had a good first season but I doubt he'll keep that up once the league catches up with him, much like the Devils did in the playoffs. I wasn't impressed with King Henrik at all and if you can get Luongo for a guy who struggles when the playoffs come around I would do it.

I also think you guys would have to give up more than just Lundqvist. Good luck with draft guys.
Sorry kid, but I guess you weren't watching the whole season. It was one playoff series and he was hurt. I wouldn't start calling Henke a playoff bust based on that.

Did the league catch up with Kipprasoff?? Cause he lost in the first round as well.

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Old
06-21-2006, 03:23 PM
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Stephen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frozenrubber
And in my side question, in 1992, would you of traded a 24 yr. Richter for a 27 yr. old Belfour?

Homegrown or established?

I love Lundqvist just as much as anyone...but I wonder if our admiration clouds our vision.
I would have traded for Belfour in a heartbeat. Richter was splitting time with Beezer, and he was already 26. Belfour was only a year older at 27 and he was winning Vezinas, Jennings, Calders all over the place, playing 70+ games and coming off an appearance in the finals. I definitely would have picked the superstar as he was a clear cut upgrade on Richter.

I would also trade for Luongo in a non cap world, though the age difference is greater.

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Old
06-21-2006, 03:25 PM
  #16
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Devils...

the opposite could be true, too. He may improve, which at his age, is quite possible, considering last year was his first year playing hockey in North America. Further, I believe that in the SEL he improved every year. The kid works hard to get to where he needs to be.

As for Lundqvist/Luongo - it's tough to be objective for a couple reasons. Gooch aptly pointed out the cost issue. Second, after watching Lundqvist this season, I want to see him hit his ceiling with the Rangers, not againt the Rangers. We know what Luongo can do, and it's pretty fabulous. We don't know what Lundqvist will do. I'll take the uncertainty that comes with some knowledge, combined with the cost, and remain status quo.

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06-21-2006, 03:27 PM
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I wouldn't do it. Anytime you mentiona goalie witht he skill of Luongo its gonna make people think, but as a whole, I would like to avoid trades of our youg talent across the board as much as possible. We just watched a team that was picked to finish dead last in the entire league make the pleyoffs. If we didn't sustain such key injuries near the end we would have made it a better showing. Plus Henrik didnt play for 2 weeks going intot he playoffs and met a team that was hot as could be. I don;t think we got a true taste of what Henrik can do come playoff time.

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06-21-2006, 03:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devilsin4
I would trade Lundqvist for Luongo in heartbeat. Lundqvist had a good first season but I doubt he'll keep that up once the league catches up with him, much like the Devils did in the playoffs. I wasn't impressed with King Henrik at all and if you can get Luongo for a guy who struggles when the playoffs come around I would do it.

I also think you guys would have to give up more than just Lundqvist. Good luck with draft guys.
This deserves my biggest


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Old
06-21-2006, 03:55 PM
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I thought i'd get away with just a little bit of antagonizing since I started your birfday thread

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06-21-2006, 04:38 PM
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if this was a fantasy team hell yeah but it's not necessary, i'll keep Lundqvist because he's good enough

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06-21-2006, 05:27 PM
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I'd like to see Luongo in a different defense atmosphere before trading away someone such as Lundqvist. Florida's D is horrendous, and Luongo faces what, 40/50 shots per night on average?

The Rangers D isn't legendary, but they certainly don't give up 45 shots day in and day out. It would be interesting to see if Luongo is as effective when he's only facing, say, 25 shots versus 45. I've only seen him play a few times but he seems like the type of keeper who needs a lot of action in order to stay on top of his game.

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Old
06-21-2006, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frozenrubber
Taking all of the smaller (and nonetheless important) pieces needed, would you flip Henrik Lundqvist for Roberto Luongo? I'm not talking about what other people would be involved, just a simple question.

I would compare this to if we traded Mike Richter for Eddy Belfour in the early nineties. While Mike Richter was home grown, Eddy was more established and 2-3 years older. In the grand scheme of things, would you of traded what ended up to be a Ranger for life for an established upgrade.

Now many are going to opine that Lundqvist will surpass Luongo and set the world ablaze. Nonetheless, Luongo is MORE established in the NHL. If the moons aligned tomorrow, would you trade Lundqvist for Luongo straight up. Home Grown vs. Heralded SuperStar.

*Please don't post "they'll never do it"; this isn't the spirit of the thread*
Nothing at all against Luongo but I would rather stick with Lundqvist I like the idea of him being home grown and I believe in time he will be one of the great ones.

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Old
06-21-2006, 06:25 PM
  #23
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No way

1) $$$ we need to use that cap money elsewhere

2) the Garden has been waiting for a homegrown to adopt and love for so long now. I wouldn't want to trade the biggest homegrown talent we've had in some time away. Henrik Henrik Henrik! or Lundqvist Lundqvist Lundqvist! has that better chanting rhytmn than Roberto Roberto Roberto! or Luongo Luongo Luongo!

3) http://www.hockeyrodent.com/R1549.HTM (read all three parts)

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Old
06-21-2006, 07:19 PM
  #24
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You keep Lundqvist, and Richter

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Old
06-21-2006, 07:45 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen
I would have traded for Belfour in a heartbeat. Richter was splitting time with Beezer, and he was already 26. Belfour was only a year older at 27 and he was winning Vezinas, Jennings, Calders all over the place, playing 70+ games and coming off an appearance in the finals. I definitely would have picked the superstar as he was a clear cut upgrade on Richter.

I would also trade for Luongo in a non cap world, though the age difference is greater.
funny you mention Belfour. At his age, he's not able to be a full time #1 anymore. This season proved it. But, when healthy, he's still capable of being a top goaltender. He's also a UFA.

Anybody else think that for one year, while Montoya develops, Eagle would be a fantastic backup to Lundqvist?

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