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Why Can't Obvious Penalties That Are Missed Be Reviewed?

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Old
11-07-2003, 09:14 PM
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hackey
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Why Can't Obvious Penalty's That Are Missed Be Reviewed?

If a goal is scored and a goal is not signaled right away because it was not obvious, at the next time stopage, it is immediately reviewed . If it is in fact a goal, they count it as a goal after they go upstairs and review it on camera.
Why can't obvious penalties - like the Weight mauling on Sedin - be reviewed and if a penalty is warranted, a penalty should be assigned. Any one seeing the replay on the Weight hit agreed that he should have go a 5 minute intent to injure penalty. He got squat because all 4? referees missed it.
If a player (Sedin) is injured and hurt, the play would stop anyways, and if there is any misconduct, they should go upstairs to review the play (just like a goal) and the penalty should be called at that time.

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11-07-2003, 09:18 PM
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Because we don't want to end up with five hour games.

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11-08-2003, 12:00 AM
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Video goal judges are trained to call and disallow goals....they are not trained to call penalties.

The only people trained to call penalties are the two guys wearing the orange bands on the ice, and in certain situations, the two linesmen as well. If they don't see the infraction, tough luck.

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11-08-2003, 12:04 AM
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what about an official that sits off ice with a whistle, and his job is to only call blatant/bad penalties missed by the official..

ooo.. a wee kooky idea

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Old
11-08-2003, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andora's box
what about an official that sits off ice with a whistle, and his job is to only call blatant/bad penalties missed by the official..
As a referee, I don't want another guy sitting in the stands with the same power that I have. The game is meant to be called from the ice. We already have supervisors at every game from junior hockey and up. If we miss something, that is who we hear from at the end of the game.

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11-08-2003, 12:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Van
As a referee, I don't want another guy sitting in the stands with the same power that I have. The game is meant to be called from the ice. We already have supervisors at every game from junior hockey and up. If we miss something, that is who we hear from at the end of the game.

And that sure as hell have made the quality of the refs being sky high nowadays. Plse there is just too many games where the standard of officiating is just plain awful.

Clearly a change is needed so a review can be used to assign penaltys if the refs on the ice have missed it.

Same way football got the challenge the call video review it to stop the blatant wrong doings of the on field/ice refs

Hockey needs to find a similar way to deal with blatantly bad refs that miss stuff on the ice

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11-08-2003, 12:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swedish Bolt Fan
And that sure as hell have made the quality of the refs being sky high nowadays. Plse there is just too many games where the standard of officiating is just plain awful.

Clearly a change is needed so a review can be used to assign penaltys if the refs on the ice have missed it.

Same way football got the challenge the call video review it to stop the blatant wrong doings of the on field/ice refs

Hockey needs to find a similar way to deal with blatantly bad refs that miss stuff on the ice
Here is the problem right here...people who immediately associate a referee missing an infraction with being a bad official.

Guess what...officials miss infractions. It has been that way since the 1800s, and that is the way it always will be. That does not for one second mean they cannot do the job.

As for the NFL-style replay rule...the structure of the game allows that replay to be viewed....That, and their officials work part-time. They don't get near the game experience that NHL referees do.

In hockey, there is a rule where after each stoppage in play, the puck needs to be dropped to start play again within 15 seconds. Having such a replay rule would make that rule essentially useless.

Bottom line, NHL referees have been trained for at least 1-2 decades on how to do their jobs. They don't need technology taking over their judgment.

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11-08-2003, 12:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Van
Here is the problem right here...people who immediately associate a referee missing an infraction with being a bad official.

Guess what...officials miss infractions. It has been that way since the 1800s, and that is the way it always will be. That does not for one second mean they cannot do the job.

As for the NFL-style replay rule...the structure of the game allows that replay to be viewed....That, and their officials work part-time. They don't get near the game experience that NHL referees do.

In hockey, there is a rule where after each stoppage in play, the puck needs to be dropped to start play again within 15 seconds. Having such a replay rule would make that rule essentially useless.

Bottom line, NHL referees have been trained for at least 1-2 decades on how to do their jobs. They don't need technology taking over their judgment.

Football has a play clock and you must get it in before next play starts so no difference there

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11-08-2003, 12:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swedish Bolt Fan
Football has a play clock and you must get it in before next play starts so no difference there
There is a difference.

The NFL has not been on a crusade for the last 3-4 years to make the game faster. The NHL has.

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11-08-2003, 07:34 AM
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I kinda wish they would take one of the refs off the ice. Sit him with a good vantage point and when he sees a penalty, he hits a button that signals a light for a penalty. I guess there would have to be 2 different lights to tell which team. That way there is a ref who can watch the big picture.

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11-08-2003, 08:28 AM
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Id hate to see if this was a playoff game....

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11-08-2003, 08:46 AM
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It happened, they missed the call, it's over. Weight got his suspension, the league has done what they can. Let it go already.

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11-08-2003, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Van
Here is the problem right here...people who immediately associate a referee missing an infraction with being a bad official....
Van, for what it's worth (not much :p ), I'm in your corner 100% about refs. The amount of time and handwringing devoted here to "this missed call" or "that lousy call" is so absurdly disproportionate. It's no wonder we are now getting equally off-the-wall recommendations for "improving" the quality of the officiating.

Hockey is a fast, aggressive, often ill-spirited sport that is played over a rather large ice surface. Am yet to meet anyone who plays the game, from weekend warrior to pro athlete, who doesn't accept the fact that the game goes on, despite the fact that every single infraction is not, cannot and should not be called.

Except perhaps here.

As stated elsewhere in this thread, get over it. IMO, Peca was cheapshotted by Tucker two playoff seasons ago. His injury affected the player and team throughout last season and perhaps up to this very day. Was angered (as were folks on both sides) at the time, but you move on. It comes with the territory. Wouldn't want it any other way.

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Old
11-08-2003, 09:50 AM
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I agree with Van as well
I can't see them radically changing the referee system like that

It's the same idea with the whole "god's eye view" idea of military action, sure it all looks plain and clear to us from above, but down on the ice it's a different story

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11-08-2003, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
As a referee, I don't want another guy sitting in the stands with the same power that I have. The game is meant to be called from the ice. We already have supervisors at every game from junior hockey and up. If we miss something, that is who we hear from at the end of the game.
Boy, I'm sure convinced. You dont want a guy sitting in the stands to have the same power.

Who says thats the way it was "meant" to be? A lot more can be seen from above. If a call is close, obviously a guy standing near will be able to see in greater detail, but the ref on the ice isn't going to be nearly as accurate as someone who can see it from several angles and in slow motion.

Poor refereeing is really helping to kill the appeal of the NHL, since so much is missed on such a regular basis. Every season at least a dozen games are ruined because of it. If the game was called better, no one would be calling for change.

Having supervisors at games is a start. Accountability is good. I want more of it.

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Old
11-08-2003, 11:45 AM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andora's box
what about an official that sits off ice with a whistle, and his job is to only call blatant/bad penalties missed by the official..

ooo.. a wee kooky idea
That would not be in the tradition of the game?

I have wondered this same thing for a long time... and why aren't there off-ice officials to call offsides & icing. Why do there have to be linesmen ON the ice for this?

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Old
11-08-2003, 11:55 AM
  #17
Kevin Forbes
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with the offsides and icing
where would you put the guy then?
high above in the pressbox? up there the red line looks no thicker then a pencil mark, how can you tell if a puck went fully over the line...

down in the stands? and take out 3 or 4 seats to fit this guy? also, how will he see over the boards if the play is right along the boards

I still think that on the ice is the best place for referees and linesmen to be to see the play

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Old
11-08-2003, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MojoJojo
A lot more can be seen from above. If a call is close, obviously a guy standing near will be able to see in greater detail, but the ref on the ice isn't going to be nearly as accurate as someone who can see it from several angles and in slow motion.
Another huge reason I am 110% against this is because for a referee to have a true feel for the game, he needs to be on the ice. If I am on the ice, and I do see a borderline infraction and decide to let it go, I have a guy sitting in the stands who can overrule me? I don't think so. And on the other side of the coin, if I am the one in the stands, I probably don't call half of what I see that isn't called on the ice, because the referee on the ice likely had his reason for not calling it.

Then there is tradition. The game has always, and forever should be officiated from on the playing surface. Where do we limit ourselves with incorporating technology into this beautiful game?


Quote:
Originally Posted by MojoJojo
Having supervisors at games is a start. Accountability is good. I want more of it.
What do you mean "a start"? There has always been supervision.

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Old
11-08-2003, 01:26 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swedish Bolt Fan
Same way football got the challenge the call video review it to stop the blatant wrong doings of the on field/ice refs
In the NFL, you can't challenge a penalty call or non-call.

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Old
11-08-2003, 05:05 PM
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the nhl should adopt the nfl rule the coach can challenge a call. and this is a very good idea. the coach should be able to challenge 1 or 2 calls a game. i think it would be good.

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