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Are Oiler fans hurting their team's chances?

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Old
07-08-2006, 05:30 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
I didn't think you were bitter at the Flames or their fans. We had nothing to do with what went on in Edmonton. However, does the fact that the forwards backcheck clear the front of the net? Do the defensive forwards keep the opposing forwards to the outside and keep them off the goalies back? I would have to question anyone who thought you can end up with the best defensive record in the league without a little depth on defence. As a matter of fact, when you are talking about that 25 minute per game defenceman, the Flames didn't have any. Not one. One of the reasons for their success was because of that depth. I just take exception to having the teams defence written off. Even writing off Hamrlik shows that you have not seen much of the Flames play over the year. He has a lot to do with Phaneuf's success. I even think he gave up chances himself to help Phaneuf succeed. I am not worried about the Flames defensive depth at all. A talented and tough group. No superstars there, yet.
except when called upon Regehr and Leopold had that ability to play 25minutes... and Phaneuf is very close to being able to do that already too... but the depth does make it so none of the guys have to play 25 minutes... i like having 6 guys that can play 20+ minutes a night

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07-08-2006, 05:48 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by thalunatik1979 View Post
except when called upon Regehr and Leopold had that ability to play 25minutes... and Phaneuf is very close to being able to do that already too... but the depth does make it so none of the guys have to play 25 minutes... i like having 6 guys that can play 20+ minutes a night

Exactly......if there were weak defenders there, they would not have been playing for twenty minutes or more.

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Old
07-08-2006, 05:50 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by natural420 View Post
oiler fans should just suck it up and use pronger as an excuse for when they dont make the playoffs next year. with exception to the true oiler fans thats the game most of them play.
How is this not trolling???

Poke a stick at Oiler fans, then kick sand in their face when you get some feedback.

Atta boy, professor.

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07-08-2006, 05:51 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Oljase View Post
How is this not trolling???

Poke a stick at Oiler fans, then kick sand in their face when you get some feedback.

Atta boy, professor.

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Old
07-08-2006, 05:53 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
I didn't think you were bitter at the Flames or their fans. We had nothing to do with what went on in Edmonton. However, does the fact that the forwards backcheck clear the front of the net? Do the defensive forwards keep the opposing forwards to the outside and keep them off the goalies back? I would have to question anyone who thought you can end up with the best defensive record in the league without a little depth on defence. As a matter of fact, when you are talking about that 25 minute per game defenceman, the Flames didn't have any. Not one. One of the reasons for their success was because of that depth. I just take exception to having the teams defence written off. Even writing off Hamrlik shows that you have not seen much of the Flames play over the year. He has a lot to do with Phaneuf's success. I even think he gave up chances himself to help Phaneuf succeed. I am not worried about the Flames defensive depth at all. A talented and tough group. No superstars there, yet.
Im not writing them off at all. Im saying they are overrated because of the system they play in and the defensive commitment made by the forwards. No 25+ minute guys proves my point - they have defensive depth no doubt, but I think that the total team commitment to playing D is a bigger factor than the Flames defensive depth. There are other teams that had equally deep D-corps, but didnt have the same defensive record (Im assuming by best defensive record you mean goals against?). Ottawa is a good example - arguably a deeper D than Calgary, but their forwards showed a lot of holes in D and without Hasek, the D wasnt the same.

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Old
07-08-2006, 06:17 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by natural420 View Post
haha. jealous?? geez dont get personal your just proving my point. SOME of you guys whine the entire playoffs cause there was a flu going around or the refs dont like the oilers or rolosons hurt. blah blah blah. dont get all touchy. calgary has the best defence in the league which compliments the best goalie. give us another goalie (like roloson for example) we still have the best d in the league, and still should finnish ahead of edmonton in the northwest. so dont play that your nothing without kiprusoff game. its getting tired.
Here is today's lesson:

Pronger>>>Regehr
Niedemeyer>>>Phanuef
The rest of the Duck defense>>>The rest of the Flame defense

Yes, Calgary has a very good defense, in fact, I'll go as far as to say the best in the NW division by a mile. However, no way does anyone touch Anaheim right now.

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Old
07-08-2006, 06:36 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oljase View Post
Here is today's lesson:

Pronger>>>Regehr
Niedemeyer>>>Phanuef
The rest of the Duck defense>>>The rest of the Flame defense

Yes, Calgary has a very good defense, in fact, I'll go as far as to say the best in the NW division by a mile. However, no way does anyone touch Anaheim right now.

i said this a week or two before the pronger trade happened. before pronger even said he wanted out. so try again.

how is singling someone out not trolling?? i say i dont think edmonton will make the playoffs and iam trolling??. go cry somewhere else, you guys arent the same team without pronger, just as we wouldnt be the same without kiprusoff and i would probably predict calgary not making it without him too. its a friggin opinion. maybe i'll get proven wrong but iam sure its well over 50% of people that will agree with me.

nice try though "professor"

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Old
07-08-2006, 06:39 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Oljase View Post
Here is today's lesson:


The rest of the Duck defense>>>The rest of the Flame defense
.
just noticed this.
you say iam trolling and you pull this out of your a$$. come on now. think about that. put the 4 players on each side of a peice of paper and think about it. dont just type random things and think you have a point. if you were at all prepared to intellegantly attack me you wouldnt have said that. good call though. keep it comin

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Old
07-08-2006, 07:20 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natural420 View Post
just noticed this.
you say iam trolling and you pull this out of your a$$. come on now. think about that. put the 4 players on each side of a peice of paper and think about it. dont just type random things and think you have a point. if you were at all prepared to intellegantly attack me you wouldnt have said that. good call though. keep it comin

What, and waste 5 minutes on you that I'll never get back?

You do it, and get your 50%+ agreement and we'll talk.

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Old
07-08-2006, 07:39 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by 44prongs View Post
Im not writing them off at all. Im saying they are overrated because of the system they play in and the defensive commitment made by the forwards. No 25+ minute guys proves my point - they have defensive depth no doubt, but I think that the total team commitment to playing D is a bigger factor than the Flames defensive depth. There are other teams that had equally deep D-corps, but didnt have the same defensive record (Im assuming by best defensive record you mean goals against?). Ottawa is a good example - arguably a deeper D than Calgary, but their forwards showed a lot of holes in D and without Hasek, the D wasnt the same.
What you are saying, is that the Flames defence is not good - and that if it wasn't for the forwards and goalies, the Flames would have been waxed on a regular basis. Your belief is and has been contradicted by just about anyone with a lick of hockey sense. Consistently, the Flames defence is recognized as one of, if not the best in the league. Are they the best paid and get the most press in the league? No, they just go about their business, getting the job done.

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Old
07-08-2006, 10:01 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
What you are saying, is that the Flames defence is not good - and that if it wasn't for the forwards and goalies, the Flames would have been waxed on a regular basis. Your belief is and has been contradicted by just about anyone with a lick of hockey sense. Consistently, the Flames defence is recognized as one of, if not the best in the league. Are they the best paid and get the most press in the league? No, they just go about their business, getting the job done.
Never did I say the Flames D is "not good". Read my posts, show me where Ive said that OR implied it. Ive said that they are overrated - they were not, IMO, the best D in the league last year. That doesnt mean they arent good - Ive flat out said Reghr and Phaneuf are studs.

Kipper definately kept them in a ton of games. The Flames inability to score last year is no secret - had Kipper been less than Vezina worthy, its hard to argue that the Flames would have won as many games as they did. Ive given the Flames a lot of credit in the posts Ive made in this thread - even gone as far as calling them Cup favourites this year. Stop trolling on your own teams board.

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Old
07-08-2006, 10:25 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by 44prongs View Post
Never did I say the Flames D is "not good". Read my posts, show me where Ive said that OR implied it. Ive said that they are overrated - they were not, IMO, the best D in the league last year. That doesnt mean they arent good - Ive flat out said Reghr and Phaneuf are studs.

Kipper definately kept them in a ton of games. The Flames inability to score last year is no secret - had Kipper been less than Vezina worthy, its hard to argue that the Flames would have won as many games as they did. Ive given the Flames a lot of credit in the posts Ive made in this thread - even gone as far as calling them Cup favourites this year. Stop trolling on your own teams board.

Actually, you have called the Flames defense overrated and you call that giving gthem credit? You come onto a another teams board and say the teams defence overrated, and you accuse me of trolling? Get serious. Your comments have been backhanded swipes at the Flames defence on a Flames board. If you don't expect anyone to question your "wisdom", then why post it on a Flames board?

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Old
07-08-2006, 10:41 PM
  #38
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No matter what you say the Flames had less goals against and won more games when their top six defensemen were healthy. I remember one stat that came up around Feb (on Sportsnet, one of the few things that station is good for), out of 19 games with a full defensive roster, Calgary only lost 4. I think Warrener/Hamrlik missed the rest of the regular season from that point. Don't let me kid you, I'd love it if Leopold was actually "overrated", then our defensive game wouldn't have taken a hit for big gains on offense. Unfortunately, players have a bigger impact on the game than you suggest.

As for the backup situation, if you didn't watch any of the games they played you don't have a right to comment. First game Boucher plays in Red he lets in FIVE questionable goals, which isn't too much of a shock for a goaltender who plays less than 15 games and lets in over 50 goals (Phoenix and Calgary). While Sauve, who's stats were marginally better, had one good game, one terrible game, some mediocre preformances and didn't show up in practice. According to TSN he fared far worse in the Coyotes uniform than he did in the Flames'.

Obviously the Flames don't have the best defensive roster in the NHL anymore, but minor sacrifices were made with big gains in other areas. This team is stronger than they were last year, that's all that counts.

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Old
07-08-2006, 10:58 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
Actually, you have called the Flames defense overrated and you call that giving gthem credit? You come onto a another teams board and say the teams defence overrated, and you accuse me of trolling? Get serious. Your comments have been backhanded swipes at the Flames defence on a Flames board. If you don't expect anyone to question your "wisdom", then why post it on a Flames board?
Some like to say the Flames have the best D in the league. Id say this is overrating them. Are they top 10? For sure. Top 5? Arguably. 1? No.

You start a thread called "Are Oiler fans hurting their chances?", you're probably going to get some Oiler fans showing up. I havent taken shots that the Flames at all. Ive expressed an opinion on the Flames D - and Ive given the Flames a lot of credit and praise. You think Im wrong. Fine. But dont discount my opinion and state your own as fact.

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07-08-2006, 11:04 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by 44prongs View Post
Some like to say the Flames have the best D in the league. Id say this is overrating them. Are they top 10? For sure. Top 5? Arguably. 1? No.

You start a thread called "Are Oiler fans hurting their chances?", you're probably going to get some Oiler fans showing up. I havent taken shots that the Flames at all. Ive expressed an opinion on the Flames D - and Ive given the Flames a lot of credit and praise. You think Im wrong. Fine. But dont discount my opinion and state your own as fact.
Hey, you're the guy that said the only time you watched the Flames was when they played the Oilers, not me. And if that is true, where is your truth coming out of, your ***?

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07-08-2006, 11:04 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by TaraLeone View Post

Obviously the Flames don't have the best defensive roster in the NHL anymore, but minor sacrifices were made with big gains in other areas. This team is stronger than they were last year, that's all that counts.
You're right, the Flames are stronger than they were last year. Adding scoring depth in the way of Tanguay is a scary thought to the fan of any other team - especially divisional opponents. The Flames D is weaker without Leopold, but I dont think it will be that significant. They added Zyuzin to an already respectable D. They dont have the best defensive roster, but I dont think they did before hand. That is all.

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Old
07-08-2006, 11:10 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
Hey, you're the guy that said the only time you watched the Flames was when they played the Oilers, not me. And if that is true, where is your truth coming out of, your ***?


I suppose you're implying that I havent watched enough of the Flames to say that they dont have the best D in the league. And I suppose you've watched enough of every other team in the league to say that they are the best. Where is your truth coming from?

Ive tried to have a civil debate about it. You just want to talk smack so I won't waste my time any more

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Old
07-08-2006, 11:16 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by 44prongs View Post


I suppose you're implying that I havent watched enough of the Flames to say that they dont have the best D in the league. And I suppose you've watched enough of every other team in the league to say that they are the best. Where is your truth coming from?

Ive tried to have a civil debate about it. You just want to talk smack so I won't waste my time any more
That is pretty much what I am saying, you have not watched the Flames enough. I don't watch all of the other teams, you are right, but then again, how many of the others have the third worst scoring team in the league, and end up with more than 100 points and win their division? You may say it is because of their forwards but I didn't see that turn Minnesota into a division winner and I think they have a pretty defensive system there too.

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Old
07-08-2006, 11:26 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Danny__K View Post
With this Pronger frenzy, I am wondering how much the Oiler fans are hurting their chances of landing any big name UFAs anymore.

You look at how in the last year they have publically attacked players on their own team. Cross, Ulanov, Markannen, Morrison, Conklin, Peca all come to mind.

Now Pronger wants out of Edmonton and the fans are riping into him and his wife so bad that libel lawsuits have been threatened against the oilers for comments made on their message boards.

Simple question, is Oiler fans fanaticism going to hurt their teams chances in the future?

*edit* whoops forgot the obligatory.

Discuss!

and flame fans do not live and die with their team?

been to cowtown a few times and flame fans are just as "****in' nuts when it comes to their team" as oiler fans are

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Old
07-09-2006, 03:48 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Oljase View Post
Here is today's lesson:

Pronger>>>Regehr
Niedemeyer>>>Phanuef
The rest of the Duck defense>>>The rest of the Flame defense

Yes, Calgary has a very good defense, in fact, I'll go as far as to say the best in the NW division by a mile. However, no way does anyone touch Anaheim right now.

keep on topic or keep out of the thread.

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Old
07-09-2006, 07:33 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Oljase View Post

You do it, and get your 50%+ agreement and we'll talk.



http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=266563

you wanted it. here it is. my 50% agreement that the oilers will NOT make the playoffs. and unless i missed a post or two, i wasted 5 mins of my life i will never get back and counted em up.

13 say they are IN
13 say they are OUT
and 2 people had them as bubble teams.

so considering you guys were one game away from the cup and now are predicted (by some) to not even make the playoffs, thats gotta hurt.
so i guess its a flip of the coin. but there you go. now stop this stupid argument. theres a difference between a debate and an arguement and i dont wanna waste my time argueing with you, i've made my point

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